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Gah.
I still don't understand why they're implementing this. The unit has direct paralells to the Infestor's Neural Parasite, and by adding this unit to the protoss arsenal, they're just replicating the difficulty in balance that we already see Neural Parasite have. Obviously, there are some core differences, but on the whole the mechanics are the same, meaning the balance of the replicant will be just as hard as balancing Neural Parasite has been.
That said, there are a whole lot of interesting/cool/confusing interactions that the replicant would allow, which raise all kinds of new questions, such as:
If the unit it takes over gains all tech upgrades for the unit controlled, will the timings work out that protoss could rush drops by getting a relatively quick replicant and using it to control an overlord? Would protoss units be allowed to load into this "protoss" unit? Same with medevacs, will we see medevac + zealot drops in the future?
Could protoss, in ZvP, clone a queen and spread vision-giving creep on the zerg's already spread creep? I guess the redundancy with observers would quickly come into play, but still...
How much space do they take up in a dropship? Could "one siege tank" and three zealots fit into a warp prism?
Will this thing make it strangely unsafe to get colossus before range in PvP, in case your opponent has replicants and repl...nevermind, Colossus are massive. My bad :D
In short, cool unit as far as interestingness goes, but glhf balancing it, blizzard. Learn from the (arguably) mistakes you've already made, broz.
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Can you replicate a replicant who'd replicated a tank? Cause I think tanks would compliment toss armies better than colossus.
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I've thought about this a bit over the past few days.
pvp. doesn't matter if they go either blink stalkers/ colossi/ cargelot archon but if they go immo you have a way to respond to it if its a surprise. not worth the investment personaly in this matchup.
pvt OH GOD YES! Seige tanks bansee's I WANT ghosts would be worth that 200/200 over and over again to emp their ghosts and to stack snipes which I want. Seige tanks with FF's? ? Bansee's (with cloak for free I'm pretty sure its actualy cost effective on the first one and have so much usefulness in a fight)
Pvz OH HELL YEAH! Fungel growth + Storm means a hell of a lot of dammage in the battle not mention colossi sweeps. Fungel storm onto coruptors? and all these wonderful things for 200/200? not too excited about having a viper or swarm lord but still no more infestors in the match up woot woot.
Can we replicate our own units or only the units of our opponent?
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This unit is so handsome. It could be used:
1) SCV -> OC in late game. I don't care what you say about "not being worth it". Drop 2 mules and it is worth it. Also potentially frees up supply in late game.
2) DT, if opponent Dt rushes you and you go robo
3) Raven, Dropping PDD against Mard is HUGE, or HSM against marine balls
4) Banshee would have cloak and provide nice harass.
5) Infestor
6) Ghost
The list goes on. Anyone who fails to see the potential of this unit has not quite wrapped his/her mind around it.
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No one has mentioned the supply of the replicant. What is it?
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On October 25 2011 06:12 XerrolAvengerII wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2011 06:06 Lurk wrote:On October 25 2011 05:48 Markwerf wrote:
lol some suggestions in this thread are so silly, like replicating a worker unit to get a CC / hive, that is just way too costly. You'd have to pay 200/200 for a worker and then still the 400 for the building to get what? Another tech tree you have to completely pay for still?? Not worth it at all...
THe only units worth replicating will have similar costs as the replicant and/or be crazy good against the person just having made the unit. For example:
- replicating a raven so you can HSM their marines
- replicating a ghost to try and EMP or snipe their ghosts, especially useful as it will have snipe.
- replicating a dark templar to harass a DT player back.
- replicating a infestor to fungal lings/roaches.
The only case replicating your own unit will be good is to get some quick void rays or maybe oracles I think. Robo + stargate could be used to get some critical amount of stargate units super quick and then already having the robo to tech up to colo if needed. I guess you could do quite a quick 3 voidray rush this style especially as the replicators can be moved out before the void is even complete. This would be even more interesting if you could replicate hallucinations but I don't think they'll allow that as hallucinate + robo would mean instant access to voidray/oracle or even a HT with storm. So you'd rather invest 200/200/4 into a replicator to get a ghost to be able to snipe other ghosts with 3 snipes (3 clicks) when you could just get a 50/150/2 high templar instead and accomplish the same with just 1 feedback (1 click) ? Thank you for your logic in this sea of madness... everyone's like OMG free snipes and free seeker missiles!!! those abilities suck, would rather have high templars than retard missiles or a ghost's squirt gun... i mean, 25 energy for 45 damage? that is sooo inefficient QQ Yamato cannon is 33% more efficient and even it sux... snipe should at least do 50 if not 55 damage (yamato would be 60 damage per 25 energy) an important consideration now that Terran no longer has 250mm strike cannons with which to kill immortals / ultras... my preference would be to make it an "armor piercing round" and be something like 45 +20 vs armored, then it would 2 shot marauders which would open ghost use in TvT, as well as make it a suitable replacement for thor cannons...
Are you seriously complaining about snipe?
Edit: in a bad way?
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On October 25 2011 07:30 RockIronrod wrote:
You guys don't realise the best thing about this.
Replicate SCV, build flying building, transform flying building into cannon, laugh at puny mortals from your death star.
LOL. I can see the next big thing. Flying mass barracks over the opponents mineral line.
By then you should have a natural and can save up enough energy for 4 cannon abilities. That is, if the ability isn't limited to protoss structures.
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Hum...in my opinion this unit won't make the final cut, apart from volatile, it will have probably few uses or very abussive ones, not middle on the road thing. I want them to make protoss a better race with protoss units.
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A question also, if you replicate a baneling will it have burrow?
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It would be awesome if replicated overlords added to supply. Then you could have a unit with drop-tech and speed upgrade that costs -4 supply. 200/200 doesn't seem too bad for that. Cheaper than getting a warp prism with speed.
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On October 25 2011 07:36 domovoi wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2011 07:34 LashLash wrote:
I skimmed through the thread, but does anyone have any idea if you get a new pop limit (like how it works now?) if you replicate an SCV or drone and start their tech tree? You have potentially a very late game 400 supply army in a 1v1! Or in a multiplayer game, 600 supply!?
I'm pretty sure if you NP a probe or SCV (chained NP) you get a new supply counter for the new race? You don't.
Yup it doesn't work anymore. It used to work many patches ago though, that's how I tested units :p
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On October 25 2011 07:37 Dox wrote:
One thing to keep in mind is that in PvT, you'd probably want your 3rd base (and so forth) to be an Orbital Command, especially considering a Probe can still return minerals to a Command Center, so it's not like you need to exclusively produce SCV's at your 3rd before you can saturate it.
Additionally, one can only begin to consider the implications of Reactor Marine production with Chrono Boost or mass SCV's with auto repair to heal your Stalkers and stuff. People need to think a lot more out of the box than they already are.
Actually everything you suggested has already been previously mentioned in this thread several times; you just didn't bother to read it.
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On October 25 2011 07:55 Dman wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2011 07:30 RockIronrod wrote:
You guys don't realise the best thing about this.
Replicate SCV, build flying building, transform flying building into cannon, laugh at puny mortals from your death star.
LOL. I can see the next big thing. Flying mass barracks over the opponents mineral line. By then you should have a natural and can save up enough energy for 4 cannon abilities. That is, if the ability isn't limited to protoss structures.
It's not, I cast an arc shield on a hatch just to try it out. I don't know if you can cast it on a floating building, but that would make for an interesting tactic. Arc shield is 5 damage, 20 damage against light.
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Clearly the best use is to fill a prism with ultras, drop them in their main, warp in a bunch more, and instantly have 15 ultras or siege tanks in the main.
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On October 25 2011 07:50 zmansman17 wrote:
No one has mentioned the supply of the replicant. What is it?
4..and yeah they said it at blizzcon and all over the thread
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Does a replicated ghost get a nuke?
If so...I love this unit.
Can you replicate a teammates unit?
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On October 25 2011 07:30 RockIronrod wrote:
You guys don't realise the best thing about this.
Replicate SCV, build flying building, transform flying building into cannon, laugh at puny mortals from your death star.
Ooh! Proxy PF with protoss deathrays, that would be awesome!
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On October 25 2011 07:57 WigginOut wrote:
It would be awesome if replicated overlords added to supply. Then you could have a unit with drop-tech and speed upgrade that costs -4 supply. 200/200 doesn't seem too bad for that. Cheaper than getting a warp prism with speed.
Well, warp prism is already faster than an upgraded overlord. It doesn't seem that worth it.
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On October 25 2011 06:14 Megatronn wrote:
200/200 replicator army turned into marines. Might as well take the best unit ^^
You want a 200/200 4 supply marine?
I guess targets could be spell casters, harass units and some air units.
What happens when you replicate a replicator? Lol
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you could replitcate a scv build a CC and repair your collosis and stalkers
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EPT
