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Active: 2096 users

In HOTS, low pylons no longer power high ground - Page 20

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 18 19 20 21 22 52 Next
TutsiRebel
Profile Joined August 2011
United States172 Posts
October 24 2011 18:17 GMT
#381
good idea, it was completely retarded that ever worked in the first place.
I can bhop irl
Wrathsc2
Profile Joined March 2011
United States2025 Posts
October 24 2011 18:24 GMT
#382
This is a good change. Now hopefully more toss players will build a nexus instead of gimmicky warp ins to get quick wins
A marine walks into a bar and asks, "Wheres the counter?"
Callynn
Profile Joined December 2010
Netherlands917 Posts
October 24 2011 18:26 GMT
#383
This is also a nerf against noobs who can only beat an insane AI with low-ground cannon rush
Comparing BW with SCII is like comparing a beautiful three-master sailing ship with a modern battlecruiser. Both are beautiful in their own way, both perform the same task, but they are worlds apart in how they are built and how they are steered.
Gladiator6
Profile Joined June 2010
Sweden7024 Posts
October 24 2011 18:29 GMT
#384
Thanks, this is much appreciated David Kim!

+ Show Spoiler +
Wow, Blizzard really hates Protoss. First the HotS units then this. >.<
Flying, sOs, free, Light, Soulkey & ZerO
VirgilSC2
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States6151 Posts
October 24 2011 18:30 GMT
#385
This is clearly a nerf against mid-low tier players that will also affect high level play.

That is the wrong way to go about balancing the game.

We should also make it so siege tanks can't fire from Low > High ground while we're at it.
Clarity Gaming #1 Fan | Avid MTG Grinder | @VirgilSC2
SoraLimit
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada747 Posts
October 24 2011 18:39 GMT
#386
I think in compensation for this though is that the plyon radius should go back to its original form. I mean the radius nerf was meant to snipe the low ground pylon in a rush.
Devolved
Profile Joined April 2008
United States2753 Posts
October 24 2011 18:44 GMT
#387
I think it removes the strongest 4 gate attack that's used a lot in PvP, which is warping in Zealots on the high ground while you attack at the ramp as well. They tried to do fix that with the pylon power range nerf, but it didn't really fix it so now they're doing this. I imagine it will work, but it will also take away a lot of the cutesy strats that Protoss can pull off, which makes the game/race more boring overall.
$♥$
jinorazi
Profile Joined October 2004
Korea (South)4948 Posts
October 24 2011 18:45 GMT
#388
this is a horrible change, horrendous, enough to make me puke. another protoss uniqueness thrown out the door just like KA because of the fucking problematic warpgate.

its actually quite sad how much they're changing this game, for the worse to long time players, better for the new pool of players.
age: 84 | location: california | sex: 잘함
BeMannerDuPenner
Profile Blog Joined April 2004
Germany5638 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-24 18:50:58
October 24 2011 18:46 GMT
#389
great change. warpgates are still problematic in many many occasions and this specific thing was used mostly for "hurr durr cheese" anyways.

also it really doesnt make sense that such a cheap, powerful mechanic also gets used to ignore terrain. glad they do it

On October 25 2011 03:30 VirgilSC2 wrote:
This is clearly a nerf against mid-low tier players that will also affect high level play.

That is the wrong way to go about balancing the game.

We should also make it so siege tanks can't fire from Low > High ground while we're at it.


this post makes so little sense i dont even know what to answer. balance threads sure are always entertaining.

On October 25 2011 03:45 jinorazi wrote:
this is a horrible change, horrendous, enough to make me puke. another protoss uniqueness thrown out the door just like KA because of the fucking problematic warpgate.

its actually quite sad how much they're changing this game, for the worse to long time players, better for the new pool of players.


what long time players are you talking about? afaik almost evryone plays it just since 1.5 years. and really tell me a reason whats so "unique" about this? that you can do your proxy inbase allin without really having to proxy? a little change that mostly affects stupid builds to begin with and you call doomsday? interesting...
life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery
Ettick
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States2434 Posts
October 24 2011 18:48 GMT
#390
I guess that it is time to switch to zerg...
Shiladie
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Canada1631 Posts
October 24 2011 18:49 GMT
#391
As others are saying, this only affects cheesy strats. If anyone can bring forward a situation where they NEED their pylon to have high-ground warp-in when they aren't doing some kind of cheese or all-in then I'll reconsider. This helps reduce the ability of protoss to remove defensive advantage, which is a good thing in almost all cases.
I like how they are putting it in the expansion and not a balance patch though, as the balance will be changing a lot anyways, so people can't complain "this will break protoss" when there are far too many other factors that can/will change the balance by far more.
VirgilSC2
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States6151 Posts
October 24 2011 18:50 GMT
#392
On October 25 2011 03:46 BeMannerDuPenner wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 03:30 VirgilSC2 wrote:
This is clearly a nerf against mid-low tier players that will also affect high level play.

That is the wrong way to go about balancing the game.

We should also make it so siege tanks can't fire from Low > High ground while we're at it.


this post makes so little sense i dont even know what to answer. balance threads sure are always entertaining.

What? I shouldn't have to scout my base to protect from problems on the low ground, especially on ladder maps like Nerazim Crypts.

Clarity Gaming #1 Fan | Avid MTG Grinder | @VirgilSC2
On_Slaught
Profile Joined August 2008
United States12190 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-24 18:56:19
October 24 2011 18:52 GMT
#393
All this does is eliminate early game cheesy stuff. Later in the game you can do the same strats with Warp Prisms (which may make people use them more which is good).

Fine with the change.

However I agree they should bring back the old pylon range now as a result. If the purpose of decreasing it was to weaken these strats in the first place, and they are now not even available, then we should get back old pylons.
VirgilSC2
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States6151 Posts
October 24 2011 18:52 GMT
#394
On October 25 2011 03:49 Shiladie wrote:
As others are saying, this only affects cheesy strats. If anyone can bring forward a situation where they NEED their pylon to have high-ground warp-in when they aren't doing some kind of cheese or all-in then I'll reconsider. This helps reduce the ability of protoss to remove defensive advantage, which is a good thing in almost all cases.
I like how they are putting it in the expansion and not a balance patch though, as the balance will be changing a lot anyways, so people can't complain "this will break protoss" when there are far too many other factors that can/will change the balance by far more.

It's not the fact that you need it, it's the fact that it's there as a harassment option.

Without it, that's one less thing Protoss can do to harass, when we're already the race with the least harassment options.
Clarity Gaming #1 Fan | Avid MTG Grinder | @VirgilSC2
robopork
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States511 Posts
October 24 2011 18:53 GMT
#395
I really don't mind. It takes 4gate PvP down yet another notch, and nothing has less flavor left in this game than two protoss 4gating each other.

And if you're attacking in the mid-lategame, just bring a warp prism. 100min for a pylon +lost mining time you're getting close to a wash on the cost, and it has more utility. Hell, put a probe in the warp prism and while your warping on the high ground + Show Spoiler +
build a pylon up there too =O


but @SoraLimit, I agree that the radius change could get reversed, but another benefit of that is that it slows down cannon rushes that need to "crawl" forward. It would be nice to wall off on antiga shipyard with 1 pylon's radius, but ffe on that map is the only time I can think of where it makes an ounce of difference if you're not cheesing.
“This left me alone to solve the coffee problem - a sort of catch-22, as in order to think straight I need caffeine, and in order to make that happen I need to think straight.”
BeMannerDuPenner
Profile Blog Joined April 2004
Germany5638 Posts
October 24 2011 18:54 GMT
#396
On October 25 2011 03:50 VirgilSC2 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 03:46 BeMannerDuPenner wrote:
On October 25 2011 03:30 VirgilSC2 wrote:
This is clearly a nerf against mid-low tier players that will also affect high level play.

That is the wrong way to go about balancing the game.

We should also make it so siege tanks can't fire from Low > High ground while we're at it.


this post makes so little sense i dont even know what to answer. balance threads sure are always entertaining.

What? I shouldn't have to scout my base to protect from problems on the low ground, especially on ladder maps like Nerazim Crypts.



now i dont even know if you are against or for this change. i mean.. what?

On October 25 2011 03:48 Ettick wrote:
I guess that it is time to switch to zerg...


so you change race cause either you allin without warping into the enemy base from lowground or have to use a warp prism in your allins. that sure sounds like a legit reason!
life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery
Bleak
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Turkey3059 Posts
October 24 2011 18:55 GMT
#397
On October 25 2011 02:44 Trowabarton756 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 02:43 Altar wrote:
This is good for PvP, other matchups don't use this as much so its fine.


Youre ignroant, people use this all the time in ALL match ups.


Build a Warp Prism instead? It costs only twice of a pylon, can fly, you can retreat not to lose it, and after the buff it's quite beefy. Plus, it can't be hit by melee units, making it much stronger versus Zerg in early game.
"I am a beacon of knowledge blazing out across a black sea of ignorance. "
VirgilSC2
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States6151 Posts
October 24 2011 18:59 GMT
#398
On October 25 2011 03:54 BeMannerDuPenner wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 03:50 VirgilSC2 wrote:
On October 25 2011 03:46 BeMannerDuPenner wrote:
On October 25 2011 03:30 VirgilSC2 wrote:
This is clearly a nerf against mid-low tier players that will also affect high level play.

That is the wrong way to go about balancing the game.

We should also make it so siege tanks can't fire from Low > High ground while we're at it.


this post makes so little sense i dont even know what to answer. balance threads sure are always entertaining.

What? I shouldn't have to scout my base to protect from problems on the low ground, especially on ladder maps like Nerazim Crypts.



now i dont even know if you are against or for this change. i mean.. what?

If Terrans and Zergs shouldn't have to scout around for Pylons, why should I have to scout around for Siege tanks, or Proxy Rax, etc?
Clarity Gaming #1 Fan | Avid MTG Grinder | @VirgilSC2
jinorazi
Profile Joined October 2004
Korea (South)4948 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-24 19:06:12
October 24 2011 19:01 GMT
#399
On October 25 2011 03:46 BeMannerDuPenner wrote:
great change. warpgates are still problematic in many many occasions and this specific thing was used mostly for "hurr durr cheese" anyways.

also it really doesnt make sense that such a cheap, powerful mechanic also gets used to ignore terrain. glad they do it

Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 03:30 VirgilSC2 wrote:
This is clearly a nerf against mid-low tier players that will also affect high level play.

That is the wrong way to go about balancing the game.

We should also make it so siege tanks can't fire from Low > High ground while we're at it.


this post makes so little sense i dont even know what to answer. balance threads sure are always entertaining.

Show nested quote +
On October 25 2011 03:45 jinorazi wrote:
this is a horrible change, horrendous, enough to make me puke. another protoss uniqueness thrown out the door just like KA because of the fucking problematic warpgate.

its actually quite sad how much they're changing this game, for the worse to long time players, better for the new pool of players.


what long time players are you talking about? afaik almost evryone plays it just since 1.5 years. and really tell me a reason whats so "unique" about this? that you can do your proxy inbase allin without really having to proxy? a little change that mostly affects stupid builds to begin with and you call doomsday? interesting...


i'm just a grumpy guy who's loved bw so much and all the reasons why i loved bw so much are starting to disappear one by one, especially with HOTS it seems. "its a different game" they say, it sure is, even more apparent with hots.

why the fuck are people complaining about building up cliff, shits been happening for 10 years, why now? that obviously isn't the issue, the issue is the ability to warp up cliff, again, warpgate causing changes.

and what stupid builds are YOU talking about? i mentioned no builds, nor i dislike any builds.
age: 84 | location: california | sex: 잘함
Newtype2k6
Profile Joined September 2010
United States88 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-24 19:06:44
October 24 2011 19:02 GMT
#400
The picture in the OP clearly shows just one pylon on the low ground not supplying power to a high ground location.

However, some people in here seem convinced that the opposite (a high ground pylon not working on the low ground) is also being implemented. Does anyone have any proof of this?
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