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On October 22 2011 13:39 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 13:34 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:32 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:25 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:21 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:16 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:08 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:00 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 12:55 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 12:49 Active.815 wrote:
[quote]
Are hydras a siege unit?
Also, you'd have to be extremely retarded to not understand how fundamentally broken a pull/melee only cloud ability would be in TvZ. Seriously. Melee range marines/tanks versus ling/bling? Have fun! Trying to run away? nuh-uh, fungal growth! No infestors? who cares, lings are still fucking ninjas *facepalm* the only "siege unit" zerg has really is broodlord. the "swarm host" launches locusts and its the LOCUSTS that atk and do actual damage and there melee, so they will activate the shredders. and die. god forbid blizz makes a unit that makes the terran actually micro. Yeah. Brood lords. So what? It's not like you're going to see shredders replace siege tanks. and LOL. Make the terran micro? Let's see -Marine splits -Siege/unsiege -Make sure no tanks get sniped -Pre-emptive spread for fungal -Ghosts to EMP infestors -Make sure no lings get into any of your bases, because you need to have no more than 2 down on the zerg to stay in the game, hardly staying even Versus -1a with lings/blings -focus tanks with mutas while marines are running away from the near-instagibbage -do a runby with like 8 cracklings -Make like a toss and spam the F button you are insanely biased. siege/unsieging is micro to u? ok then.... so you dont consider spreading your infestors micro? you dont consider muta harass and magic boxing thors to lessen splash dmg micro? you dont consider splitting your banelings in order to lessen splash damage from tanks micro? and how is it you consider EMPing infestors to be micro, but spamming fungal growth or using the vipers abilities isnt? seriously, just stop with your nonsensical whine. wasn't addressing the viper. Spamming fungal =/=EMP because it isn't fatal if you miss it, you probably have like 8 or 9 infestors because fuck yes 4 bases and spawn larva and macro hatches, you can split banes preemptively and not have anything to worry about, and banes do damage when they die anyway. The only time i really see someone magic box is when they're harassing and you have a thor in your main, and it's not like losing 4 mutas is going to kill you~you made them build thors/turrets/leave marines behind. lol emp has a large AOE. how can ANYONE miss with it? and as for the rest of your post i honestly have no idea what you are trying to prove. splitting banelings take just as much micro as splitting marines. a thor usually always out to counter mutas so your always going to be magic boxing. and turrets are not that expensive seeing has u have like 3-4 orbitals all spamming mules. also loosing 4 mutas is a big deal. thats 400 minerals and 400 gas that have done nothing. Overseers+zerg army>Ghost 400 mins/400 gas to force thors, turrets, and T leaving marines at home. Yeah, how lame! Predone splits=/=Having to run away in the heat of the moment 1 thor vs 20 mutas->fly around And ofc, no scans going down because who would want to clear creep? wtf? terrans always split there units while slow pushing before an engagement..... so your telling me thats not a predone split? also 1 thor is 300 minerals 200 gas. 20 mutas is 2k minerals 2k gas. wth is wrong with you? you seriously think making 1 or 2 thors is going to harm u seeing as flocks of mutas avoid 1 thor like the plague if there supported with turrets/marines? And how often have you seen a pre-split marine army still run away? 300/200+~4-500 in turrets gives you exactly one mobile hardcounter to mutas that moves really slow, and is pretty much useless against the rest of zerg's army while mutas can just fly around and pick off reinforcements, outlying buildings, force attention away from armies.... bro, im sorry to dissapoint you but pressing stim then clicking on the opposite side of the map in order to run from banes =/= micro.
Until stim runs out and the banelings are still alive because you chose to run instead of microing and attempting to kill them.
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Northern Ireland25648 Posts
The Protoss units are certainly interesting in how they're going to work, and I personally like the ideas behind them on a purely lore-related basis. The Protoss are dwindling in number and so more and more of their units are advanced machinery, the replicant fits in perfectly with this ethos.
Not really going to judge how everything all meshes together until there are proper hands-on playtests of course
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I really think viper hook abilities is completely broken, the dark swarm like thing is quite awesome, but hooking is really broken. I hope blizzard starts balancing the new ideas. I think they are trying to be creative, but are ignoring the straight forward solution.
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On October 22 2011 13:40 StoLiVe wrote:
Do anyone know what cloud do on tank? do the tank don't have blind spot anymore ? do he can hit unit at melee range ? I WANT TO KNOW SOOOO BADLY :'(
I'm thinking tanks would retain their blind spot, making cloud REALLY powerful vs. T. I hope the Viper doesn't turn out too strong, because it really sounds like it. I like my tanks in the back of my army, not right next to the Zerg 
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Terrans.....
do you realize the shredder can be dropped behind an enemy mineral line and INSTANTLY destroy all workers? (some of the pros trying the units did just that)
and you don't like the new units? really? Including an upgrade for Hellions that will make zealots worthless, really?
for Protoss....way to address all our problems
nothing to help out early game
harass that is late, hyper expensive and does a fraction of the damage of hellions etc
and an anti-muta unit that will hardly be out in time to counter them when it matters
also, mr Kim/Browder, Trying to give races new strats? really?
and our new strat is copying enemy units with an overcosted one of our own? Really?
how much thought was actually put into those brilliant ideas?
the same amount of thought that was put into making the carrier playable? meaning none?
k, that's what I thought, sounds cool....
so when is protoss being removed from the game? oh, it already has? ok, thanks, no prob
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Terran the most micro-intensive race???? Lol, try playing protoss some time brohan. Terran = stim and a click.
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On October 22 2011 13:43 Dungaurd wrote:
Terran the most micro-intensive race???? Lol, try playing protoss some time brohan. Terran = stim and a click.
and toss is f + clic stfu plz each race have his subtility
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On October 22 2011 13:42 Lazerlike42 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 13:39 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:34 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:32 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:25 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:21 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:16 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:08 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:00 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 12:55 Ballistixz wrote:
[quote]
*facepalm*
the only "siege unit" zerg has really is broodlord. the "swarm host" launches locusts and its the LOCUSTS that atk and do actual damage and there melee, so they will activate the shredders. and die.
god forbid blizz makes a unit that makes the terran actually micro.
Yeah. Brood lords. So what? It's not like you're going to see shredders replace siege tanks. and LOL. Make the terran micro? Let's see -Marine splits -Siege/unsiege -Make sure no tanks get sniped -Pre-emptive spread for fungal -Ghosts to EMP infestors -Make sure no lings get into any of your bases, because you need to have no more than 2 down on the zerg to stay in the game, hardly staying even Versus -1a with lings/blings -focus tanks with mutas while marines are running away from the near-instagibbage -do a runby with like 8 cracklings -Make like a toss and spam the F button you are insanely biased. siege/unsieging is micro to u? ok then.... so you dont consider spreading your infestors micro? you dont consider muta harass and magic boxing thors to lessen splash dmg micro? you dont consider splitting your banelings in order to lessen splash damage from tanks micro? and how is it you consider EMPing infestors to be micro, but spamming fungal growth or using the vipers abilities isnt? seriously, just stop with your nonsensical whine. wasn't addressing the viper. Spamming fungal =/=EMP because it isn't fatal if you miss it, you probably have like 8 or 9 infestors because fuck yes 4 bases and spawn larva and macro hatches, you can split banes preemptively and not have anything to worry about, and banes do damage when they die anyway. The only time i really see someone magic box is when they're harassing and you have a thor in your main, and it's not like losing 4 mutas is going to kill you~you made them build thors/turrets/leave marines behind. lol emp has a large AOE. how can ANYONE miss with it? and as for the rest of your post i honestly have no idea what you are trying to prove. splitting banelings take just as much micro as splitting marines. a thor usually always out to counter mutas so your always going to be magic boxing. and turrets are not that expensive seeing has u have like 3-4 orbitals all spamming mules. also loosing 4 mutas is a big deal. thats 400 minerals and 400 gas that have done nothing. Overseers+zerg army>Ghost 400 mins/400 gas to force thors, turrets, and T leaving marines at home. Yeah, how lame! Predone splits=/=Having to run away in the heat of the moment 1 thor vs 20 mutas->fly around And ofc, no scans going down because who would want to clear creep? wtf? terrans always split there units while slow pushing before an engagement..... so your telling me thats not a predone split? also 1 thor is 300 minerals 200 gas. 20 mutas is 2k minerals 2k gas. wth is wrong with you? you seriously think making 1 or 2 thors is going to harm u seeing as flocks of mutas avoid 1 thor like the plague if there supported with turrets/marines? And how often have you seen a pre-split marine army still run away? 300/200+~4-500 in turrets gives you exactly one mobile hardcounter to mutas that moves really slow, and is pretty much useless against the rest of zerg's army while mutas can just fly around and pick off reinforcements, outlying buildings, force attention away from armies.... bro, im sorry to dissapoint you but pressing stim then clicking on the opposite side of the map in order to run from banes =/= micro. Until stim runs out and the banelings are still alive because you chose to run instead of microing and attempting to kill them.
which is why u target fire the banes with tanks.....?
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On October 22 2011 13:43 Dungaurd wrote:
Terran the most micro-intensive race???? Lol, try playing protoss some time brohan. Terran = stim and a click.
Try playing terran sometime, and you'll find they take the most micro. I think emps, kiting, and focus firing is not just amove. TvZ is especially micro intesive, focus firing banes with tanks, and running marines from banes. The only time protoss has to micro is in the earlygame with forcefields. Then amove with deathball and win.
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On October 22 2011 13:26 sc2holar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 13:21 Active.815 wrote:
From reddit's sc2 breakdown thread
Q1: What direction are you trying to go with the multiplay, and which unit do you think is going to be the most game changing?
We're trying to add more strategies to the game - as always. As diverse matchups as possible.
Dustin: I'm most nervous about the Replicant. It's a lot of fun, but I'm afraid of it being broken. I'm afraid that terrans will stop making siege tanks because they're afraid of the Replicant copying it, and thus resulting in removing units from the game - not adding.
Kim: I'm most scared of the Viper. Because terran players rely on tanks for defence, and if you can shut that down - it's scary. Same for protoss and colossus.
so what is toss going to do when vipers take out your colossus instantly and your gateway army gets rolled over by the new fast hydralisks?
make replicated vipers and suck those colossi right back to your death ball
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On October 22 2011 13:43 niteowl wrote:
Terrans.....
do you realize the shredder can be dropped behind an enemy mineral line and INSTANTLY destroy all workers? (some of the pros trying the units did just that)
You cannot do that. The Shredders have to deploy, much like a burrowing spine crawler. Some reports have the deploy time as high as 8 seconds, but whatever the value really is, it's far, far less of a threat than storm drops, which are instantaneous. By the time you've noticed the blip on your minimap, its too late to save your workers from storm. If you notice the blip from a dropping Shredder, you have plenty of time to get away.
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I think the new units are going to increase the skill ceiling fo sho.
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On October 22 2011 13:43 niteowl wrote:
Terrans.....
do you realize the shredder can be dropped behind an enemy mineral line and INSTANTLY destroy all workers?
"INSTANTLY"? It takes time to drop it and deploy it, then it takes time for it to actually kill all the workers (it does 10 DPS). If you're paying attention to the minimap, you can move your workers away without any losses.
Also:
Q11: Question about the shredder as a harassment unit. Earlier today when I played a guy dropped a shredder in my mineral line and I wasn't quick enough to react. I think this is going to be a problem for a lot of lower-league players who don't watch the minimap all the time, nor have the APM to react in time. What's your thoughts on that?
I'm sorry. Haha. But yes, we are concerned about that. We have some tools to adjust that, more specifically deploy time is something we can adjust. We could also try to add distinctive sounds to it, so players are able to react. If it gets to the point that from bronze to gold you build shredders and drop them - and thats what you do, we'll do something about it. We'll definitely keep an eye on that.
http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/lkmi0/full_breakdown_of_the_sc2_multiplayer_panel/c2tgfkx
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On October 22 2011 13:46 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 13:42 Lazerlike42 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:39 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:34 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:32 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:25 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:21 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:16 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:08 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:00 Active.815 wrote:
[quote]
Yeah. Brood lords. So what? It's not like you're going to see shredders replace siege tanks.
and LOL. Make the terran micro? Let's see
-Marine splits
-Siege/unsiege
-Make sure no tanks get sniped
-Pre-emptive spread for fungal
-Ghosts to EMP infestors
-Make sure no lings get into any of your bases, because you need to have no more than 2 down on the zerg to stay in the game, hardly staying even
Versus
-1a with lings/blings
-focus tanks with mutas while marines are running away from the near-instagibbage
-do a runby with like 8 cracklings
-Make like a toss and spam the F button you are insanely biased. siege/unsieging is micro to u? ok then.... so you dont consider spreading your infestors micro? you dont consider muta harass and magic boxing thors to lessen splash dmg micro? you dont consider splitting your banelings in order to lessen splash damage from tanks micro? and how is it you consider EMPing infestors to be micro, but spamming fungal growth or using the vipers abilities isnt? seriously, just stop with your nonsensical whine. wasn't addressing the viper. Spamming fungal =/=EMP because it isn't fatal if you miss it, you probably have like 8 or 9 infestors because fuck yes 4 bases and spawn larva and macro hatches, you can split banes preemptively and not have anything to worry about, and banes do damage when they die anyway. The only time i really see someone magic box is when they're harassing and you have a thor in your main, and it's not like losing 4 mutas is going to kill you~you made them build thors/turrets/leave marines behind. lol emp has a large AOE. how can ANYONE miss with it? and as for the rest of your post i honestly have no idea what you are trying to prove. splitting banelings take just as much micro as splitting marines. a thor usually always out to counter mutas so your always going to be magic boxing. and turrets are not that expensive seeing has u have like 3-4 orbitals all spamming mules. also loosing 4 mutas is a big deal. thats 400 minerals and 400 gas that have done nothing. Overseers+zerg army>Ghost 400 mins/400 gas to force thors, turrets, and T leaving marines at home. Yeah, how lame! Predone splits=/=Having to run away in the heat of the moment 1 thor vs 20 mutas->fly around And ofc, no scans going down because who would want to clear creep? wtf? terrans always split there units while slow pushing before an engagement..... so your telling me thats not a predone split? also 1 thor is 300 minerals 200 gas. 20 mutas is 2k minerals 2k gas. wth is wrong with you? you seriously think making 1 or 2 thors is going to harm u seeing as flocks of mutas avoid 1 thor like the plague if there supported with turrets/marines? And how often have you seen a pre-split marine army still run away? 300/200+~4-500 in turrets gives you exactly one mobile hardcounter to mutas that moves really slow, and is pretty much useless against the rest of zerg's army while mutas can just fly around and pick off reinforcements, outlying buildings, force attention away from armies.... bro, im sorry to dissapoint you but pressing stim then clicking on the opposite side of the map in order to run from banes =/= micro. Until stim runs out and the banelings are still alive because you chose to run instead of microing and attempting to kill them. which is why u target fire the banes with tanks.....?
So, I guess target firing banelings with tanks isn't micro anymore?
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in all honesty, the new warhog.....is lame as fuck looking. i t looks like a shitty transformer. honestly, why cant blizzard just bring the golliath back????? i mean its basically the same shit and it looks WAY WAY WAY better.
and seriously whats up with this replicator crap. u can turn into any unit u want? awesome. not. thats fucking lame. so what advantage does any race have against it?
i feel like terran got shafted with this. and seriously for everyone crying about ghosts lol.....yea lets nerf ghosts, take away cloak, take away snipe, dress em up like barbies and make em dance. then u might think its balanced.
READ THIS BLIZZARD: CHANGE THE LOOK OF THE WARHOG OR BRING BACK THE GOLLIATH.
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@niteowl: takes 8 seconds to set up, 3 seconds to kill (2 for probes because of no regen/40hp), and blizz already said they were considering making a special sound (ala nuke)
Phoneix/blinkstalker already counters mutas, this just adds to anti-spireplay
Harass that won't die nearly as easily as hellions/shuts down static D/shuts down mining (less noticeable)...
I will admit the replicant is rather underwhelming, however :p
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On October 22 2011 13:46 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 13:42 Lazerlike42 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:39 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:34 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:32 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:25 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:21 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:16 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 13:08 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 13:00 Active.815 wrote:
[quote]
Yeah. Brood lords. So what? It's not like you're going to see shredders replace siege tanks.
and LOL. Make the terran micro? Let's see
-Marine splits
-Siege/unsiege
-Make sure no tanks get sniped
-Pre-emptive spread for fungal
-Ghosts to EMP infestors
-Make sure no lings get into any of your bases, because you need to have no more than 2 down on the zerg to stay in the game, hardly staying even
Versus
-1a with lings/blings
-focus tanks with mutas while marines are running away from the near-instagibbage
-do a runby with like 8 cracklings
-Make like a toss and spam the F button you are insanely biased. siege/unsieging is micro to u? ok then.... so you dont consider spreading your infestors micro? you dont consider muta harass and magic boxing thors to lessen splash dmg micro? you dont consider splitting your banelings in order to lessen splash damage from tanks micro? and how is it you consider EMPing infestors to be micro, but spamming fungal growth or using the vipers abilities isnt? seriously, just stop with your nonsensical whine. wasn't addressing the viper. Spamming fungal =/=EMP because it isn't fatal if you miss it, you probably have like 8 or 9 infestors because fuck yes 4 bases and spawn larva and macro hatches, you can split banes preemptively and not have anything to worry about, and banes do damage when they die anyway. The only time i really see someone magic box is when they're harassing and you have a thor in your main, and it's not like losing 4 mutas is going to kill you~you made them build thors/turrets/leave marines behind. lol emp has a large AOE. how can ANYONE miss with it? and as for the rest of your post i honestly have no idea what you are trying to prove. splitting banelings take just as much micro as splitting marines. a thor usually always out to counter mutas so your always going to be magic boxing. and turrets are not that expensive seeing has u have like 3-4 orbitals all spamming mules. also loosing 4 mutas is a big deal. thats 400 minerals and 400 gas that have done nothing. Overseers+zerg army>Ghost 400 mins/400 gas to force thors, turrets, and T leaving marines at home. Yeah, how lame! Predone splits=/=Having to run away in the heat of the moment 1 thor vs 20 mutas->fly around And ofc, no scans going down because who would want to clear creep? wtf? terrans always split there units while slow pushing before an engagement..... so your telling me thats not a predone split? also 1 thor is 300 minerals 200 gas. 20 mutas is 2k minerals 2k gas. wth is wrong with you? you seriously think making 1 or 2 thors is going to harm u seeing as flocks of mutas avoid 1 thor like the plague if there supported with turrets/marines? And how often have you seen a pre-split marine army still run away? 300/200+~4-500 in turrets gives you exactly one mobile hardcounter to mutas that moves really slow, and is pretty much useless against the rest of zerg's army while mutas can just fly around and pick off reinforcements, outlying buildings, force attention away from armies.... bro, im sorry to dissapoint you but pressing stim then clicking on the opposite side of the map in order to run from banes =/= micro. Until stim runs out and the banelings are still alive because you chose to run instead of microing and attempting to kill them. which is why u target fire the banes with tanks.....?
Oh, you mean micro! 
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lol, this game is going to be so stupid. The new units are retarded. Will buy anyway for story.
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On October 22 2011 13:26 sc2holar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 13:21 Active.815 wrote:
From reddit's sc2 breakdown thread
Q1: What direction are you trying to go with the multiplay, and which unit do you think is going to be the most game changing?
We're trying to add more strategies to the game - as always. As diverse matchups as possible.
Dustin: I'm most nervous about the Replicant. It's a lot of fun, but I'm afraid of it being broken. I'm afraid that terrans will stop making siege tanks because they're afraid of the Replicant copying it, and thus resulting in removing units from the game - not adding.
Kim: I'm most scared of the Viper. Because terran players rely on tanks for defence, and if you can shut that down - it's scary. Same for protoss and colossus.
so what is toss going to do when vipers take out your colossus instantly and your gateway army gets rolled over by the new fast hydralisks?
Mass Recall the Colossus back and take a new defensive position?
All these new units add so much to the game, it is silly to just look at one instance of the new changes and how it might be OP, you have to look at how every change will effect the game as a whole
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On October 22 2011 13:46 kofman wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 13:43 Dungaurd wrote:
Terran the most micro-intensive race???? Lol, try playing protoss some time brohan. Terran = stim and a click. Try playing terran sometime, and you'll find they take the most micro. I think emps, kiting, and focus firing is not just amove. TvZ is especially micro intesive, focus firing banes with tanks, and running marines from banes. The only time protoss has to micro is in the earlygame with forcefields. Then amove with deathball and win.
I have played terran. Protoss kite, storm, and focus fire, as well as blink ect. I'm not saying terrans don't micro, I'm just saying that protoss micro more, and zerg the least.
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EPT
