EPTPossibly worst thread on TL of 2011? Some REALLY bad posts and balance whine from bronze leaguers here.
Another Neural Parasite Change. - Page 43
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S2Lunar
1051 Posts
Possibly worst thread on TL of 2011? Some REALLY bad posts and balance whine from bronze leaguers here. | ||
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dooraven
Australia2820 Posts
On September 16 2011 12:20 Dommk wrote: a 50% movespeed snare would be just as bad as a Root. Protoss units are slow, you can't exactly micro a unit that has been reduced to the speed of a High Templar. I.E See Concussive shell vs Protoss Yep, but at least this makes Pheonix harssment somewhat viable and not chain fungaled to death. | ||
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Nerski
United States1095 Posts
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Heavenly
2172 Posts
On September 16 2011 12:06 Soulriser wrote: so the other 2 times hes won GSL Code S he has never had good opponents either? thats really crazy. and here i thought NesTea was arguably the best player in the world. i didnt think anyone else had won 3 GSL Code S's or all-killed GSL Code S before. ill keep going then, no one, ever uses hydras against Terran. the problem with having a 'niche' unit, is that theres no point to having it if there is another unit that fills the roll just as well, and can also do other things. i.e., the infestor. the only really good thing that corrupters do is corruption, and make brood lords. and how easy is it to snipe a broodlord? did i mention how slow they were? terran and Protoss win games as well. 20 terrans in gsl code s? there might be a reason for that. sure, zerg can swarm, but who says their units have to be shit? i dont think ive ever seen blizzard say "well, zergs have larvae and therefore their units have to be subpar". and ive seen many terran and protoss players macro extremely well. The other two times he won GSL had nothing to do with you saying he all-killed the GSL, and MVP has won three times. And beat Nestea. And many other terrans have beat Nestea. And yeah it is arguable that NesTea is the best player in the world, because his vT isn't as good as many terran's vZ. MVP is like what, 8-1 against him? Yes, no one uses hydras against terran. Good random fact there. The carrier and mothership fit a niche role as well. The phoenix does as well though it's used much more often. Boohoo I can't use them in every game in every matchup, game is broken. The point is that the infestor fills the role too well while the other unit fills the role satisfactorily---feel free to disagree but you're kind of a biased mid-level zerg and Blizzard is kind of the people who make the game, are unbiased, and have all statistics at their fingertips. The only really good thing that phoenixes are good for is anti-air and they can lift one unit. The only thing a DT can do is some damage if there is no detection (HT is much better for archons). The only thing a stalker can do versus terran is be anti-air and kind of blink around being annoying. See, I can list unit weaknesses too! Yeah, good to hear that they win games, I was aware. I'm also discussing primarily from a protoss viewpoint, and in the August GSL protoss was 25% vZ, and has been lagging behind in the matchup internationally since April. And the description of zerg by Blizzard: "Left unchecked, the zerg multiply at an alarming rate and spawn large armies quickly. Individual zerg units may not be as strong or as hardy as the other races’ forces, but that doesn’t matter when you’re facing an endless stream of them." However, I think we can agree that terran is a bit ridiculous. | ||
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antikk555
85 Posts
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FlamingTurd
United States1059 Posts
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-_-
United States7081 Posts
On September 16 2011 11:21 coL.CatZ wrote: this change is just as bad unfortunately. Its like saying, since most people can't micro or target fire, we'll make it easy for them and ridiculously easy for actual good players Blizzard has stated in the past that they do take into account non-professional players when balancing the game, but aren't you in favor of this policy? If not, what do you think about the players in Korea who smile sardonically at the difficulties a North American Grandmasters Zerg player has? Infestor heavy play is not in vogue in Korea. Perhaps Korean Protoss players are so skilled, they can perfectly target down the Infestor who is siphoning the Colossus, making the prospective neural parasite change moot. In Korea, Neural Parasite in Starcraft 2 could be the equivalent of Medic's Restore in Starcraft Broodwar. If this is the case, are you in favor of a spell being imbalanced when players can't exercise enough control, and unusable when they can? Or maybe you're just not skilled enough to comment on the balance of Starcraft 2, and thus don't understand why the change was necessary. Whenever North American players deride the balance opinions of less skilled players, I'm compelled to wonder how they ignore the cognitive dissonance which must occur when they consider where they rank on the Great Cross-Realm Starcraft 2 Ladder which exists only in our hopeful minds. I'm not saying you shouldn't discuss balance unless you're one of the top players in the world, or that you're one of the people I'm describing. In fact, I greatly enjoyed reading the quoted post by you, even thought it was rather short. But I do think you should be careful when you imply that Neural Parasite is perfectly balanced if Protoss players would simply learn how to control their units. Korean Zergs control their units more precisely and hit their queen injects more regularly than you. Maybe Zerg against Protoss would be a simple matchup for Zerg if you could simply do the same? | ||
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PresenceSc2
Australia4032 Posts
Now we have to make coruptor to counter colosus. The unit the blizzard thinks is a peice of shit and shouldnt be in the game? Awesome | ||
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Morphs
Netherlands645 Posts
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CDMVR
United States92 Posts
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ForeverSleep
Canada920 Posts
On September 16 2011 12:25 Toppp wrote: this thread has become fucking horrible. Possibly worst thread on TL of 2011? Some REALLY bad posts and balance whine from bronze leaguers here. dunno man, almost all balance change thread turned to this anyways. | ||
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Flonomenalz
Nigeria3519 Posts
On September 16 2011 12:37 -_- wrote: Blizzard has stated in the past that they do take into account non-professional players when balancing the game, but aren't you in favor of this policy? If not, what do you think about the players in Korea who smile sardonically at the difficulties a North American Grandmasters Zerg player has? Infestor heavy play is not in vogue in Korea. Perhaps Korean Protoss players are so skilled, they can perfectly target down the Infestor who is siphoning the Colossus, making the prospective neural parasite change moot. In Korea, Neural Parasite in Starcraft 2 could be the equivalent of Medic's Restore in Starcraft Broodwar. If this is the case, are you in favor of a spell being imbalanced when players can't exercise enough control, and unusable when they can? Or maybe you're just not skilled enough to comment on the balance of Starcraft 2, and thus don't understand why the change was necessary. Whenever North American players deride the balance opinions of less skilled players, I'm compelled to wonder how they ignore the cognitive dissonance which must occur when they consider where they rank on the Great Cross-Realm Starcraft 2 Ladder which exists only in our hopeful minds. I'm not saying you shouldn't discuss balance unless you're one of the top players in the world, or that you're one of the people I'm describing. In fact, I greatly enjoyed reading the quoted post by you, even thought it was rather short. But I do think you should be careful when you imply that Neural Parasite is perfectly balanced if Protoss players would simply learn how to control their units. Korean Zergs control their units more precisely and hit their queen injects more regularly than you. Maybe Zerg against Protoss would be a simple matchup for Zerg if you could simply do the same? Ummm.... who are you? That's right, nobody. So why are you calling out Catz? NP IS perfectly balanced if Toss players would simply learn how to control their units (hence the less popularity of Infestor usage in Korea. They split against fungals, they have good cannon and obs placement for burrow harass, and they target NPing festors to make Infestors actually look like a BAD investment). Now NPs usage greatly decreases, it's probably not worth the use, might as well get the extra 2 fungals in. But hey, Toss players need the help, a-moving is hard. | ||
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BeeNu
615 Posts
On September 16 2011 12:49 Itallion wrote: good thing this is all on a ptr, so we can test this before it releases We don't need to test it, we already know from previous experience that 7 range makes NP unusable. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ | ||
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PeZuY
935 Posts
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Tyree
1508 Posts
This one is welcome | ||
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SCMothership
United States187 Posts
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Ruyguy
Canada988 Posts
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Elean
689 Posts
Being able to NP a colossus may be overpowered, but it's only because the colossus itself is overpowered. It's just another exemple of Blizzard refusing to adress the real issue with protoss. Nerf the damage of the superunit (colossus), and buff the damage of the basic units (gateway), and suddendly NP is completely fine without changing its range. This would also help in PvT, and enable protoss to harass in PvZ... Yeah you can buff the warp prism, but in the end the problem is that a handfull of gateway units just don't do enough damage. | ||
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SCMothership
United States187 Posts
On September 16 2011 12:58 BeeNu wrote: We don't need to test it, we already know from previous experience that 7 range makes NP unusable. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ then just fungal if you arent good at positioning your infestors | ||
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Trealador
United States207 Posts
On September 16 2011 13:19 Elean wrote: One day people will realize that the problem isn't NP. Being able to NP a colossus may be overpowered, but it's only because the colossus itself is overpowered. It's just another exemple of Blizzard refusing to adress the real issue with protoss. Nerf the damage of the superunit (colossus), and buff the damage of the basic units (gateway), and suddendly NP is completely fine without changing its range. This would also help in PvT, and enable protoss to harass in PvZ... Yeah you can buff the warp prism, but in the end the problem is that a handfull of gateway units just don't do enough damage. So you want to die to gateways instead of colossus? I love dying to 4 gate all ins as much as the next guy but...NOOOOOOOOO | ||
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