EPTThat being said, it's wrong. The system will never get fixed if players continue to circumvent it instead of protesting vocally.
Should "Deal Making" be illegal? - Page 4
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aksfjh
United States4853 Posts
That being said, it's wrong. The system will never get fixed if players continue to circumvent it instead of protesting vocally. | ||
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Utinni
Canada1196 Posts
On September 02 2011 07:57 pksens wrote: When the money given to you is directly tied into spectators WANTING to watch your game, I can't understand how selfish you sound right now. In any thing? How about a GSL finals? TSL3 finals? Both go 6pool vs 1base carrier? You shit on the people that tune in, pay money in the instances of Gom/NASL/MLG, just to watch a farce? Give me a break. You are on a pro team, I really hope this isn't something you all agree with over on in Reign. You riled me up, grats. and people dislike being shit on. | ||
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devilcry
Bulgaria53 Posts
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scorch-
United States816 Posts
On September 02 2011 07:53 sh4w wrote: Clearly they lost their passion years ago.. Seriously though at first I was like 'not a big deal', but now that I think about it, it's kind of stupid. I would rather see 2 people competing their hardest to win rather than just taking it easy. But how can you stop this? You can''t really, so I fail to see where this discussion will lead. There's a difference between incentive and what tournaments do now. They pay like 50k$ difference between first and second prize in some tournaments decided by 7 games. The variance there is ENORMOUS. Between 2 top players, what % of the time is the better player going to win a best of 7? His EV is going to be like 27-30k over the base, but a tournament is a sample size of 1, all or nothing. | ||
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ROOTFayth
Canada3351 Posts
On September 02 2011 07:57 pksens wrote: When the money given to you is directly tied into spectators WANTING to watch your game, I can't understand how selfish you sound right now. In any thing? How about a GSL finals? TSL3 finals? Both go 6pool vs 1base carrier? You shit on the people that tune in, pay money in the instances of Gom/NASL/MLG, just to watch a farce? Give me a break. You are on a pro team, I really hope this isn't something you all agree with over on in Reign. You riled me up, grats. get ready to hate on every fucking pro gamer out there, have fun | ||
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Utinni
Canada1196 Posts
On September 02 2011 07:58 devilcry wrote: I dont understand what makes you guys think this is up to you to decide?The players must have free will to do anything they want with the profits.Not even a specific rule can stop that since the 2 finalists can easily meet somewhere secret and split the money without you even knowing.And im pretty sure a lot of the progamers care more for the money than for the spectators(as stated from a few of them in the wellplayed 30 minute interview) so that is pretty much their business. Dude, They go hand in hand. | ||
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Yaki
France4234 Posts
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MagicGunner
United States78 Posts
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Rygar
Sweden28 Posts
On September 02 2011 07:51 piknic wrote: The analogy of magic the gathering, and for the most part poker, or even local lans do not ring true at all because the generated revenue from these tournmanets (and their industries in general) are generated usually from the players themsevles. MTG gets money primarly from players buying cards, poker from players playing for real money in casinos/online, local lans from buyins usually. The difference is that professional sc2 tournaments generate revenue almost solely because of viership. Your analogies are baseless in my opinion as the two formats can not be compared. Look at pro poker on the main stage TV, can they deal on that? (maybe? I am not sure but I doubt it). I would go so far as to say this deal making is unfair to the tournaments and fans that are the ONLY reason they get to play starcraft 2 for a living. Pro player magic gets money from the company that sells the product as a marketing tool. The same way LoL and DotA2 tournaments are sponsored by Riot/Vale, so I don't really buy your analogy to poker. And I think the most important thing to remember is how much a tournament win is worth i mlg/gsl points, fame, future sponsorships, fanbase and more. When MKP was the first player ever in three GSL finals, noone was impressed, because he never won. When Nestea won his third code S, people began speaking of him as a bonjwa. I think the players realise this and values a tournament win accordingly. So if they split the money, there is still incentives for playing to win. Hence, prize splitting in those situations won't hurt the competativeness of the finals. | ||
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Clog
United States950 Posts
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Warrice
United States565 Posts
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Synwave
United States2803 Posts
On September 02 2011 07:59 ReignFayth wrote: get ready to hate on every fucking pro gamer out there, have fun Really, care to back this up with any solid information? Although thanks for the heads up, won't be cheering Reign on in anything going forward. | ||
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Fugue
Australia253 Posts
Discouraging this sort of behaviour comes down to mitigating that risk and adding non-transferable incentives to victory. This could be handled in a number of ways: 1. Player contracts I've never seen any player contracts so I don't know the standard terms and conditions on them, but I would assume the team is taking a reasonable cut of tournament winnings in return for providing a salary and all the other benefits. The player must have an incentive to win, but tehre's no reason for that to be the prize pool of the tournament itself. Performance bonuses coming from the team give control of the money supply to the team, which some might seem as unfair to players, but if they're getting rewarded for their performance with more money, then is it so important if it's going directly from the tournament organisers to their account, or from the team? 2. Prize pool distribution Obviously the Prize pool can't be equal for 1st and 2nd place, but lowering the difference can bring some level of comfort to players that they have a "guaranteed" payday. 3. Added incentives (outside of monetary gain) MLG rank points come to mind. Tournaments that are discrete events can't offer much in the way of added incentives the way a regular season of events can, and players who are entering just one event won't be swayed, but it is another tool to ensure that more is on the line than just money. These are just a few ideas off the top of my head. But I think it's difficult to police this sort of thing, especially for players who aren't attached to a team. | ||
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Desti
Germany138 Posts
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babylon
8765 Posts
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Robonord
United States311 Posts
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dgwow
Canada1024 Posts
On September 02 2011 07:59 ReignFayth wrote: get ready to hate on every fucking pro gamer out there, have fun No offense but splitting the pot is NOT PROFESSIONAL every player should have as a goal to win a tournament, just the thought of splitting the pot before a final match to me cannot put the player in the right mindset to give his utmost. I don't think players who do this deserve to be called progamers. (My opinion) | ||
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Utinni
Canada1196 Posts
On September 02 2011 07:59 Yaki wrote: I don't mind players splitting the money as long as it doesn't affect the quality of the final. It already has... It's shitty knowing TT1 went 1 base carriers and lost. If he actually practiced a good strat or attempted one. He woulda earned his money. Now knowing that TT1 wasn't giving 100 percent kind of brings down the win. Knowing that apparently a lot of pro's do this kind of brings you down. | ||
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Dexerion
United States43 Posts
The fact that they hedge their bets and agree to split the money regardless shouldn't impact the play THAT much. Still, the fact that you are a champion should carry more weight as time goes on with sponsors and such. So losing on purpose or being too risky with your play could come back and hit you in the wallet later. Also, who wants to lose in front of everyone? | ||
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ROOTFayth
Canada3351 Posts
On September 02 2011 08:01 Synwave wrote: Really, care to back this up with any solid information? Although thanks for the heads up, won't be cheering Reign on in anything going forward. reign, eg, mouz, dignitas, slayers whatever man, just hate on people for trying to reduce variance in a lifestyle where money isn't abundant it's not like you really know what's going on, you won't even realize it, most pros will still play to win in the finals even if the prize has been split | ||
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