EPTIron Lady Player Spotlight: DaSakura - Page 5
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aXa
France748 Posts
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ROOTFayth
Canada3351 Posts
boys and girls aren't equals in everything they do | ||
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aXa
France748 Posts
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ROOTFayth
Canada3351 Posts
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Mordiford
4448 Posts
On August 19 2011 04:03 aXa wrote: I think sexism should be banhammered on TL. What do you think about people picking up females on teams to further women in the scene? What about women only tournaments? Technically, I'd call these sexist, but the more important part is whether or not they're actually good for the scene. It's not quite simple, if women can compete with the top males, they should compete with the top males. We won't know until we see it happen. | ||
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aXa
France748 Posts
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Laneir
United States1160 Posts
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CCa1ss1e
Canada3231 Posts
On August 19 2011 03:39 Mordiford wrote: So does no woman who has played the game so far have the right attitude? Or are we going to blame it on the community? It might very well be the former, but I hope you don't try and blame it on the latter. I look forward to seeing the day when women can compete, but I want it to be on their own merit and I'm not sure if it'll ever be as large a group as it's male counterpart. Not BLAMING it on anyone or anything.. I'm saying a positive mental attitude is key in all areas of life.. saying that guys will always be better than girls because of her raging is just nonsense.. matter of fact, now that I'm thinking about it.. that makes even LESS sense.. how will boys always be better at this type of game? what exactly is she saying is the key that men have that women do not? women's brains are equally capable of learning new skills and abilities.. learning an RTS game and using a mouse/keyboard is no different.. just sayin' is all. XD | ||
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pHaRSiDE
United States752 Posts
On August 19 2011 03:47 IronManSC wrote: Honestly i've checked out this iron lady business and basically every girl has this "quote" attached to them and they all say they're the best, or that they have potential to be better, or that they've always been in a high league, or that they've always been good. It sounds like a lot of arrogance right off the spot if you ask me. Don't get me wrong, I have a girlfriend, a mother, 2 sisters and a sister-in-law, and I love them all dearly, and I have the utmost respect for women in general, but it doesn't really set the right image or tone when they all step in and say they're the best, or always have been really great at the game when we've never even heard of 95% of them before. However I do look forward to seeing the female side of e-sports grow. One day we may see girl vs boy! Whaaat? which girl has ever sounded arrogant in Iron Lady?? o.O Is it your opinion that them saying the tournament makes them want to get better at the game is making them sound arrogant? | ||
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DaSakura
Canada63 Posts
On August 19 2011 04:14 cca1ss1e wrote: Not BLAMING it on anyone or anything.. I'm saying a positive mental attitude is key in all areas of life.. saying that guys will always be better than girls because of her raging is just nonsense.. matter of fact, now that I'm thinking about it.. that makes even LESS sense.. how will boys always be better at this type of game? what exactly is she saying is the key that men have that women do not? women's brains are equally capable of learning new skills and abilities.. learning an RTS game and using a mouse/keyboard is no different.. just sayin' is all. XD Emotion control, that's the key. | ||
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Mordiford
4448 Posts
On August 19 2011 04:14 cca1ss1e wrote: Not BLAMING it on anyone or anything.. I'm saying a positive mental attitude is key in all areas of life.. saying that guys will always be better than girls because of her raging is just nonsense.. matter of fact, now that I'm thinking about it.. that makes even LESS sense.. how will boys always be better at this type of game? what exactly is she saying is the key that men have that women do not? women's brains are equally capable of learning new skills and abilities.. learning an RTS game and using a mouse/keyboard is no different.. just sayin' is all. XD She specified in this thread that she was referring to herself and apologized for generalizing. Questioning women's abilities to compete may be "sexist", but no more so than segregating themselves from competition. I find her stance somewhat consistent, if you're justifying women's tournaments, that's a perfectly fine stance to have as long as it's consistent. But, if women can compete with men in Starcraft then they should compete. If they segregate and hold their own exclusive tournaments, then follow up by claiming there is no reason they can't compete, I find that pretty strange. You don't let men compete in the tournaments where you wish to showcase women's skill, simultaneously no women are really winning non-exclusive tournaments. At this point the best showcase would be for a woman to prove that women can compete based on her own merit, until then, I don't think there's much wrong with being skeptical. | ||
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CCa1ss1e
Canada3231 Posts
You're generalizing for all women, just because YOU don't have "emotion control", doesn't mean the next woman doesn't.. same goes for men.. there's idra and jinro then there's MC and july, for example.  | ||
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CCa1ss1e
Canada3231 Posts
On August 19 2011 04:23 Mordiford wrote: She specified in this thread that she was referring to herself and apologized for generalizing. Questioning women's abilities to compete may be "sexist", but no more so than segregating themselves from competition. I find her stance somewhat consistent, if you're justifying women's tournaments, that's a perfectly fine stance to have as long as it's consistent. But, if women can compete with men in Starcraft then they should compete. If they segregate and hold their own exclusive tournaments, then follow up by claiming there is no reason they can't compete, I find that pretty strange. You don't let men compete in the tournaments where you wish to showcase women's skill, simultaneously no women are really winning non-exclusive tournaments. At this point the best showcase would be for a woman to prove that women can compete based on her own merit, until then, I don't think there's much wrong with being skeptical. I know what you mean, maybe I missed her "apology for generalizing." I'm talking mainly about this: DaSakura: Personally, I don’t think that girls can be as good as boys in Starcraft.. ..boys will always be better at this kind of game. All I'm saying is that anyone can be as good as MC or NesTea or (insert fav progamer). thaz it. | ||
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carloselcoco
United States2302 Posts
On August 17 2011 10:33 CCalms wrote: ^What is the point of quoting the entire OP when posting in the thread @_@ If I'm a girl do I get an interview? I can't believe that you are jealous of girls! xD | ||
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pHaRSiDE
United States752 Posts
On August 19 2011 04:23 Mordiford wrote: She specified in this thread that she was referring to herself and apologized for generalizing. Questioning women's abilities to compete may be "sexist", but no more so than segregating themselves from competition. I find her stance somewhat consistent, if you're justifying women's tournaments, that's a perfectly fine stance to have as long as it's consistent. But, if women can compete with men in Starcraft then they should compete. If they segregate and hold their own exclusive tournaments, then follow up by claiming there is no reason they can't compete, I find that pretty strange. You don't let men compete in the tournaments where you wish to showcase women's skill, simultaneously no women are really winning non-exclusive tournaments. At this point the best showcase would be for a woman to prove that women can compete based on her own merit, until then, I don't think there's much wrong with being skeptical. Well let me explain why this women tournament exist. I can't speak for all, but this is why iron lady exist. Immediately when you are on a multiplayer game, you want to find people who similar to you so that you can enjoy the game. When you have people in your circle who are like you and enjoy the game a lot and want to get better, it makes you want to get better with them. The point of Iron Lady , is to bring all the people with a big commonality together and encourage each other to get better. You may not see girls winning open tournaments yet, but that is what we are helping to change. If we can engrave the competitive attitude and the will to get better you will see that change. I believe it starts with girls finding other girls who are competitive so they can inspire each other to get better and better. This is not about sexism or restrictions, this has a very positive purpose behind it. As far as spotlighting goes, we do that to let the scene know that they are there, and there are really good girl players out there. This further helps the girls who are disconnected from all the other girls in the scene to see that hey, it is possible, and that it is not all talk when people say girls can be as good as guys. We are providing the proof to the world.If you don't care for the spotlights, its because you are not the target audience for it. Its that simple :D | ||
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D_K_night
Canada615 Posts
On August 19 2011 03:49 aXa wrote: Placing in higher league except GM is not that hard. I consider myself as an average player, mid master, not laddering too much, and i placed S1 Diamond (which was the highest at the time), S2 Master S3 Master. What is so crazy about it ? That's arrogant. Not just anyone can place masters, and the way the leagues are divided, proves this. There is no way that you can say that anyone, anywhere, can fit into the top 2% of all players in a region. | ||
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Mordiford
4448 Posts
On August 19 2011 04:29 pHaRSiDE wrote: Well let me explain why this women tournament exist. I can't speak for all, but this is why iron lady exist. Immediately when you are on a multiplayer game, you want to find people who similar to you so that you can enjoy the game. When you have people in your circle who are like you and enjoy the game a whole like and want to get better, it makes you want to get better with them. The point of Iron Lady , is to bring all the people with a big commonality together and encourage each other to get better. You may not see girls winning open tournaments yet, but that is what we are helping to change. If we can engrave the competitive attitude and the will to get better you will see that change. I believe it starts with girls finding other girls who are competitive so they can inspire each other to get better and better. This is not about sexism or restrictions, this has a very positive purpose behind it. As far as spotlighting goes, we do that to let the scene know that they are there, and there are really good girl players out there. This further helps the girls who are disconnected from all the other girls in the scene to see that hey, it is possible, and that it is not all talk when people say girls can be as good as guys. We are providing the proof to the world. Do you also support segregation for foreigners and Koreans then? Just wondering, because the principle is similar, building up one scene so it can compete eventually. I feel it's a question of consistency, I'm more of the opinion that where you get above a certain level of money for a tournament, the best player should win and it should be a question of skill above all else. As for connecting women in Starcraft, that's all well and good but why is money involved then? If women are naturally interested in getting together and forming a community then there's shouldn't be any reason to add financial profit to the equation, once that enters it is a competition and then my earlier opinion on competition comes into play. All that said, at a community level I really don't care enough to bitch about these tournaments even if I may be against them on the principle of competition. At a certain prize pool level though, I believe they become problematic and I feel that we're reaching that level already. | ||
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pHaRSiDE
United States752 Posts
On August 19 2011 04:35 Mordiford wrote: Do you also support segregation for foreigners and Koreans then? Just wondering, because the principle is similar, building up one scene so it can compete eventually. I feel it's a question of consistency, I'm more of the opinion that where you get above a certain level of money for a tournament, the best player should win and it should be a question of skill above all else. As for connecting women in Starcraft, that's all well and good but why is money involved then? If women are naturally interested in getting together and forming a community then there's shouldn't be any reason to add financial profit to the equation, once that enters it is a competition and then my earlier opinion on competition comes into play. All that said, at a community level I really don't care enough to bitch about these tournaments even if I may be against them on the principle of competition. At a certain prize pool level though, I believe they become problematic and I feel that we're reaching that level already. The money is involved because it is a tournament. Its small scale for that very reason. We aren't making girl gamers rich. We offer very small scale tournaments because the focus isn't money, but instead the community. Just like every tournament out there, a prize is always fun...But you can't talk like its MLG $5000 girls only 1st place prize or something. $100 for first place is absolutely nothing in the world of large scale open tournaments. Keep in mind we have another tournament that offers a chocolate bunny as prize, and another tournament that offers a mousepad. Can you say with a straight face we are really all about the money? | ||
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soccerdude
United States54 Posts
lets say that 99/100 people in a pretend world are born with red hair, and teh other 1/100 is born with blue hair. It is far less liekly for a blue haired person to be at the top, just becuase of the sheer numbers of red haired people. Now take into consideration the blue haired person is not handicapped, just out numbered. So say there were 1000 people in this imaginay world, would it be likely that at the top, there were equall amounts of blue haired people and red haired people? No, most liekely it would be all red hairs, and mabye 1 blue hair in the top 100. the stats i used arent necesarilly mattching to boys:girls, but they show the general concept. And, in esports, there are alot more boys participating that girls, so the chance of a girl being at the tip top is unlikely. and please stop blaming women for being interviewed and getting unneeded or "undeserved" attention/interviews. its not there fault there being interviewed, if you wanna be mad blame the people interviewing them. Congratulate the person being interviewed for going out on a ledge and making themselves known. mabye not for yall, but for me i would just be mad at her out of jelousy. getting girls involved into esports needs to start at the community level. if in game and on websites, girls are getting called out or made feel unwelcoem, why woudl they come back? Just my 2 $ on the matter. | ||
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Mordiford
4448 Posts
On August 19 2011 04:42 pHaRSiDE wrote: The money is involved because it is a tournament. Its small scale for that very reason. We aren't making girl gamers rich. We offer very small scale tournaments because the focus isn't money, but instead the community. Just like every tournament out there, a prize is always fun...But you can't talk like its MLG $5000 girls only 1st place prize or something. $100 for first place is absolutely nothing in the world of large scale open tournaments. It's not very different from other weekly open tournaments, if the sole purpose was community, the financial benefit wouldn't be necessary. Like you said, it is a tournament so my opinions on competition stand, but it's small enough that I don't care too much. Once more though, I feel the key is consistency, if you're okay with this, you should be okay with any tournament exclusion(I referred specifically to foreigner/korean) as it is essentially the same thing. | ||
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