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LuciferSC
Canada535 Posts
The 'contract' was not signed. They made demands for NASL to make change to the accommodation they are willing to provide. SC2guy took the words out of NASL's own statement - if anything it's NASL's fault for continuing on with the tourney w/o negotiating. | ||
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HolyArrow
United States7116 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:27 theBizness wrote: Alas, the Code A qualifier is probably a harder tournament than NASL. Probably? You have PuMa, the guy who won NASL, not even able to get through the Code A qualifier as far as I know. | ||
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jmbthirteen
United States10734 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:21 figq wrote: Some people claimed it can go as low as 1.2k, which +500 is less than 2k. On the other hand, if NASL expects world's top SC2 players to spend ~3 months on event that could end up as a potential financial loss, due to the traveling costs, gl with that. The fact that Boxer made the same decision beforehand shows it's not just some Korean player organization at fault. In the end, all this is fine. Just the ambitions of NASL to be a global event are a bit reduced now. It would still be an interesting event to follow, regardless, of course. Similarly, there are some European events with quite high prizes that are not very global, but still quite fun. It's good to have variety. Oh give me a break. Its one best of three per week. Its not that fucking hard. And plane tickets are like $1200. Add in hotel and food and shuttle and your at around $1650 like NASL said earlier in this thread. NASL can't afford to cover all of that. They can afford to cover $1000 of that. Then they redistributed the prize pool so the bottom 8 each get $1000. This allows players to walk away, even if they lose right away, with about $350. There isn't a financial loss. This doesn't even factor in the exposure they gain by playing in NASL. Of course it is fine for Korean teams to not play in this, but one I think that should be a team decision, not sc2cons. Especially with some teams having deals with foreign teams (SK-oGs). And two they should have done this way long ago. Don't wait until the season has started. | ||
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Volvograd12
Russian Federation19 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:26 lacho_u wrote: I feel that NASL is making everthing possible, good price pools trael accomodations and so on, koreans seems too greedy for me, so they can stay at code B and play for 50 $ best of luck to them  This reeks of arrogance. The dollar sign goes before the '50'. Yeah you're right, the Koreans are too greedy. 1/16 chance to win imaginary money? How long does it take to mail a check from America to Korea? 60 days right? User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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HeIios
Sweden2523 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:28 HolyArrow wrote: NASL suing them would perhaps be the dumbest move I have seen in SC2 history. Such hilarious american mentality on display though. | ||
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asperger
Sweden1310 Posts
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figq
12519 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:24 Slider954 wrote: That's irrelevant to the problem that most of the top Korean players are unable to participate in NASLs, under the current conditions. I'm optimistic though, that these issues would be resolved by NASL 3.The difference with Boxer is he didn't wait till the league started to pull out. He hadn't made a commitment yet, while the teams pulling out now, by having their players qualify did make one. | ||
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whateverpeeps
United States214 Posts
[QUOTE]On August 12 2011 16:18 jellyjello wrote: Not trying to spread rumors, but I wouldn't be surprised to find out if this isn't just about the expense involving the trip to the US. I'm sure the tight budget of each Korean team did play some role in it, but it's also got to do with everything involving NASL (long season, bad playing hours for Koreans, and plus that EG-PuMa-TSL fiasco). In the end, it looks like they felt that NASL isn't just worth the effort. [/QUOTE] Well if it isn't about the travel expenses, perhaps somewhere during the negotiations the committee should have made that clear? You don't ask for money if you want hours changed or lag eliminated...you ask for different times and Korean servers, both of which Xeris said might be happening in Season 2. Also, remember that you are making a big assumption that players agree with the decision. It seems that many do not. MC is trying to find his way back into the league. I've heard many others would like to participate but can't find a way around the ban. Not to mention, many actively fought to qualify in season 2. Does that sound like someone who doesn't think NASL worth it? Many of the Koreans are new, so it's not like they would even have a basis to judge from. Boxers chose not to return, but is on good terms with NASL. He never released an official statement about his lack of returning, so any claim otherwise is just speculation. And if the committee holds NASL responsible for the EG fiasco, which wasn't even a fiasco, then there is something really wrong with the people who run it. | ||
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Slider954
United States342 Posts
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theBizness
United States696 Posts
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Ocedic
United States1808 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:26 lacho_u wrote: I feel that NASL is making everthing possible, good price pools trael accomodations and so on, koreans seems too greedy for me, so they can stay at code B and play for 50 $ best of luck to them That's probably because you only hear one side of the story. Do you even live on your own? If you did, you know that security deposits are not 'free.' Especially when one doesn't pay the first one back before demanding the second one from you. Not to mention it was increased arbitrarily. | ||
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tripper688
United States569 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:11 HolyArrow wrote: The point about inviting a top class player to raise a tournament's value and reputation is a good one, though it might be an uncomfortable truth for some people. The fact is that Koreans are superior players to foreigners means that their participation indeed carries an additional value factor in terms of how a tournament is perceived by many spectators. Foreigners in the GSL is "giving foreigners a chance to compete with the Koreans", while Koreans in the NASL and at MLG is "Adding to the value and reputation of the tournaments with absolute top-class players". This distinction is born solely from the fact that Koreans are simply better than foreigners overall. I guess you get what you pay for? A lot of people don't want to agree with what you wrote, despite the fact that it's true. On August 12 2011 16:13 jmbthirteen wrote: It wasn't low. It was pretty ridiculous actually. There shouldn't be any walk overs. They arent treated as criminals at all. They just want to prevent this from happening again and they should as walk overs look terrible. They get the damn deposit back too. A lot of walkovers were from scheduling issues due to NASL conflicting with other events in that 3 month span or were from time zone issues. Again that goes back to what I've been saying for a while now. It's not about paying for a 3 day trip for a chance at a $100,000 prize pool. It's the 3 month commitment to playing against what you can say is a stacked tourney (given the latency and scheduling issues for the Koreans) as well as having it interfere with other events. On August 12 2011 16:13 ThatGuy89 wrote: does this mean ill actually be able to watch a SC2 tournament that isnt ruined by korean terrans coming an dominating it? this'll be great, we'll get a chance to see just how well the NA and EU players do against each other Way to be that guy to post something borderline racist and completely inane. As for your question of how well NA and EU does against each other...Aside from IdrA and Sheth, EU has the advantage almost everywhere else. Not to mention Sen who can take games off of just about anyone. Including some Koreans. I lol'd. And I agree. On August 12 2011 16:18 Firkraag8 wrote: Comments like this is very sad to read, maybe now with the Koreans out the remaining players will feel extra motivated to do their best since they got a higher chance to get to the finals and ultimately win. I watched every game last season, not just the ones with Koreans in them and I must say that the vast majority of them was very entertaining either way. You don't need Koreans to keep a high level and entertaining league, and this might even help it become better you never know. You don't need Koreans to have a back and forth and entertaining league/season. You do need them for high level (read: Korean level) play. It's kind of sad to see that people advocate the removal of competition as a way of motivating players to get better. Like I said before, most who have decided to embrace competing with the Koreans and learning from them (ie making an effort to train in Korea) have improved their game. Most who have decided to shy away from it (ie left Korea or never bothered with it) have either regressed or stagnated. On August 12 2011 16:18 jellyjello wrote: Not trying to spread rumors, but I wouldn't be surprised to find out if this isn't just about the expense involving the trip to the US. I'm sure the tight budget of each Korean team did play some role in it, but it's also got to do with everything involving NASL (long season, bad playing hours for Koreans, and plus that EG-PuMa-TSL fiasco). In the end, it looks like they felt that NASL isn't just worth the effort. I'm 99% sure this is what it basically amounts to and I honestly can't blame them. It sucks but it is what it is. | ||
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forgottendreams
United States1771 Posts
It's not about EG-Puma It's not about "greedy Koreans" (as some people are ridiculously putting it) It's not about travel expenses It's about a hedgemony protecting their interests and remaining the two most important organizations. The GSL in Korea, the MLG in America which both are partnered by SC2Con who are doing the negotiations. Wake up... | ||
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Nayl
Canada413 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:30 Volvograd12 wrote: This reeks of arrogance. The dollar sign goes before the '50'. Yeah you're right, the Koreans are too greedy. 1/16 chance to win imaginary money? How long does it take to mail a check from America to Korea? 60 days right? Give me a break, you must be working for Thisisgame or something. A lot of Koreans disapprove of this decision as well. The "cheque" thing is a business procedure, and has nothing to do with how long it takes to mail a cheque from US to Korea. I am 99.9% sure they WILL get paid. | ||
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LuciferSC
Canada535 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:27 PHILtheTANK wrote: You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. In season 1 the travel stipend was 500 dollars and the prize money for qualifying for the finals was also 500 dollars. NASL bought the tickets for the korean players, removing the ticket price(plus hotel/food/travel) of ~1650 dollars from the combined stipend and their prize winnings. This means that if you lost out in the first round players received 0 dollars, and NASL lost 650 dollars(which only happened with zenio). With the increased stipend and redistributed prize pool in season 2 players would be guaranteed 350 dollars after travel, just for making it there, while in season 1 no money was guaranteed for the players they bought tickets for. In what world is 350<0? Please do some research, or at least learn simple math before posting nonsense. How are we (or u for that matter) that NASL didn't charge Zenio to pay for that $650? And it is $1000, not $2000. Half of that $2000 constitutes their tournament winning. | ||
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jmbthirteen
United States10734 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:32 theBizness wrote: It's kind of sad, $350 over the time invested is much worse than minimum wage. Then again, they're playing a game. its kinda lame that their teams can't afford $650 to send their players to compete in the finals. Quite frankly, they got a lot of work to do over there. | ||
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Makotoo
Finland159 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:30 Volvograd12 wrote: This reeks of arrogance. The dollar sign goes before the '50'. Yeah you're right, the Koreans are too greedy. 1/16 chance to win imaginary money? How long does it take to mail a check from America to Korea? 60 days right? Wow, you are stupid, 60 days is a SHORT time for a tournament. It was also explicitly written in the contract they signed before playing in the first season so I have no idea how they can whine about it now. Also it takes time for sponsor money to move often times, ESL for example sometimes needs a year to pay out because of slow sponsors that have other shit to do. It's not that simple | ||
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VillageBC
322 Posts
On August 12 2011 16:25 NHY wrote: Prize comes after tax. Different teams handle things differently, but I believe in most cases players take all prizes and their team covers the travel cost. Edit: and security deposit. Security deposit is a legit reason. Lag, insane hours, 3 months long, etcetera are reasons to not want to participate. But the prize money differentiation just seems like shuffling deck chairs. It doesn't really matter. And in this case, NASL was willing to modify the entire prize distribution (which screws or helps everyone depending on your POV) to make sure they could travel at what looks like would be cost free. On the surface, without knowing more it looks like SC2Con is being unreasonable. I'm not even certain I see why they should be involved and have left it to the individual players, teams and sponsors to decide on. Obviously players want to compete, they spent the time and effort to qualify after all. | ||
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ThaTiger
Denmark55 Posts
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Firkraag8
Sweden1006 Posts
Hope the delay isn't too long. | ||
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