EPTNo replays released from Anaheim - Page 17
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Integra
Sweden5626 Posts
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Wherewolf
United States353 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On July 30 2011 07:42 Exarl25 wrote: They said they would no longer be releasing replays during the event, this is the first we have heard of the possibility that we would be deprived of them completely. And get off your high horse, paying customers have a right to criticise. You were paying for the replays? | ||
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Knutzi
Norway664 Posts
hope there are some smart people in charge who can listen to what people are saying and understand that releasing the repalys after the event does nothing but good for them and if they dont it will cause this shitstorm we're having right now. | ||
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Exarl25
1887 Posts
I would be willing to. And nice job on completely sidestepping all the cases of people pointing out the many inaccuracies in your posts. | ||
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SKC
Brazil18828 Posts
On July 30 2011 07:38 Plansix wrote: Well I'm annoyed at entitled esports fans get enraged over every little thing and acting like drama queens. This information was out MONTHS ago. MGL said on SotG(it could have been another show) that they would not be releasing replays any more because of the chat spamming and harassment. And if they don't want to release them at all, that is their choice. Its a free service and they aren't providing it any more. If you don't like it, don't watch MGL and boycott them. Or don't pay for the HQ stream. Or continue to whine about it in this thread. But don't act like they are some evil, deceptive corporation bent on lying to you and milking you for every penny. Is is that hard to understand that most people are discussing the reasoning behind their action, specially since it doesn't seem like it will even work, and not dissing the company? Noone here is saying that they are evil, that there is no reason why they should do that. They released a statement that has quite a bit of holes in it and people are disscussing it. I couldn't care less if they did the same thing but gave a better reasoning behind it, like I said before. If there in anyone overreacting here, it's you, regarding the intention of most of us. | ||
MLG_Lee
279 Posts
1) Releasing replays exposes the event to risk that we're not comfortable with. Happy to debate the level of relative risk, but it's there. If I can remove ANY risk from the event, I'm going to. Do any of you really think I or anyone else at MLG want to repeat Dallas? 2) This has nothing to do with GSL or Korean players wanting to be protected on the replays. That was a point of discussion and all LXP players understand that MLG has the right to release the replays anytime we want to. 3) Modifying replay files (not reading them) is a violation of Blizzard's ToS. I maybe could get permission to do it, but there's a lot of legal issues tied up in that. We already know how to do it. But we'd have to check them all before releasing them. 4) The issues around this are not just technical, they're also rules based. Yes, we could require in the rules that every player sets busy (already the case) and opens six chats. But then what do you do if someone forgets and lags? Is it fair to allow a restart? or should we call them on a technical? We don't make these decisions lightly. 5) Releasing the replays to casters that we work with and trust is the least risky way to get SOME of this content out. I know it's not everything that everyone wants. At the end of the day though, we can fund events because we can monetize content. Keep in mind that we lose a tremendous amount of money every event. Our productions are not cheap. Sat trucks alone are a solid six figure number. 6) Not going to discuss in a public forum how you can get to the chat name. That's like teaching people how to break your own event ;p R1CH, love to chat with you about it some offline/inpriv. This step is being taken to protect the operations of the event. Replays are not going to be released at this event. When we have some more time to consider things and think through ALL the issues, we'll re-evaluate. But this is not a decision that we'll revisit here. We know how valuable this is to the community and we definitively listen to the community, I think we've proven that. I appreciate constructive criticism and the satire is worth a good laugh too. Bear in mind that at GotFrag (of which I was a founder and prez), we hosted .dem (replays for Counter-Strike) for every match we could find at every event. They're still available there. I know exactly how much we all love having access to the replays. And I know this is an unpopular decision with much of the community. But see above for the straight scoop on why we're doing this. EDIT: DDOS is a poor choice of words in our release. Chat spam on the game clients which lags the game is what was meant. EDIT: And yes, I know you can find other ways to get to the same information. But I can't stop those. I can reduce risk on things I can control. Not taking those steps is negligent. | ||
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On July 30 2011 07:46 MLG_Lee wrote: A couple points of clarification: 1) Releasing replays exposes the event to risk that we're not comfortable with. Happy to debate the level of relative risk, but it's there. If I can remove ANY risk from the event, I'm going to. Do any of you really think I or anyone else at MLG want to repeat Dallas? 2) This has nothing to do with GSL or Korean players wanting to be protected on the replays. That was a point of discussion and all LXP players understand that MLG has the right to release the replays anytime we want to. 3) Modifying replay files (not reading them) is a violation of Blizzard's ToS. I maybe could get permission to do it, but there's a lot of legal issues tied up in that. We already know how to do it. But we'd have to check them all before releasing them. 4) The issues around this are not just technical, they're also rules based. Yes, we could require in the rules that every player sets busy (already the case) and opens six chats. But then what do you do if someone forgets and lags? Is it fair to allow a restart? or should we call them on a technical? We don't make these decisions lightly. 5) Releasing the replays to casters that we work with and trust is the least risky way to get SOME of this content out. I know it's not everything that everyone wants. At the end of the day though, we can fund events because we can monetize content. Keep in mind that we lose a tremendous amount of money every event. Our productions are not cheap. Sat trucks alone are a solid six figure number. 6) Not going to discuss in a public forum how you can get to the chat name. That's like teaching people how to break your own event ;p R1CH, love to chat with you about it some offline/inpriv. This step is being taken to protect the operations of the event. Replays are not going to be released at this event. When we have some more time to consider things and think through ALL the issues, we'll re-evaluate. But this is not a decision that we'll revisit here. We know how valuable this is to the community and we definitively listen to the community, I think we've proven that. I appreciate constructive criticism and the satire is worth a good laugh too. Bear in mind that at GotFrag (of which I was a founder and prez), we hosted .dem (replays for Counter-Strike) for every match we could find at every event. They're still available there. I know exactly how much we all love having access to the replays. And I know this is an unpopular decision with much of the community. But see above for the straight scoop on why we're doing this. I still don't see any comments on why you don't want too release them after the event? EDIT: Or is it about the monetizing point? | ||
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TofuFox
374 Posts
On July 30 2011 07:38 Plansix wrote: Well I'm annoyed at entitled esports fans get enraged over every little thing and acting like drama queens. This information was out MONTHS ago. MGL said on SotG(it could have been another show) that they would not be releasing replays any more because of the chat spamming and harassment. And if they don't want to release them at all, that is their choice. Its a free service and they aren't providing it any more. If you don't like it, don't watch MGL and boycott them. Or don't pay for the HQ stream. Or continue to whine about it in this thread. But don't act like they are some evil, deceptive corporation bent on lying to you and milking you for every penny. You've been acting like a bigger Drama Queen than anyone else in this thread. The SoTG they mentioned not releasing replays during the event, and that's it to the best of my recollection. No-one's saying it's not their choice. The only accusations of lying are from people who do not believe their stated reason is accurate, a contention you have not even argued with, though it's a bit premature. MLG wants to build a business on fan support. For me at least, replays were a big part of this because it allowed me to step through the vast number of games that aren't being casted and take closer looks at games that I was interested in. That's no longer possible and I have less reason to support them. | ||
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Navichi
49 Posts
The only personal information in the replay files is the profile ID. This allows you to check out someone's profile on www.battle.net. That's it. Where is there ANY risk if the replays get released after the fact? | ||
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Horse...falcon
United States1851 Posts
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atmuh
United States246 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On July 30 2011 07:49 Numy wrote: I still don't see any comments on why you don't want too release them after the event? EDIT: Or is it about the monetizing point? 5) Releasing the replays to casters that we work with and trust is the least risky way to get SOME of this content out. I know it's not everything that everyone wants. At the end of the day though, we can fund events because we can monetize content. Keep in mind that we lose a tremendous amount of money every event. Our productions are not cheap. Sat trucks alone are a solid six figure number. Yes is was this section, the part where sat trucks cost a solid 6 figure number. That amount may be more than the house you are sitting in right now(depending on where you live). | ||
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aristarchus
United States652 Posts
On July 30 2011 07:46 MLG_Lee wrote: A couple points of clarification: 1) Releasing replays exposes the event to risk that we're not comfortable with. Happy to debate the level of relative risk, but it's there. If I can remove ANY risk from the event, I'm going to. Do any of you really think I or anyone else at MLG want to repeat Dallas? 2) This has nothing to do with GSL or Korean players wanting to be protected on the replays. That was a point of discussion and all LXP players understand that MLG has the right to release the replays anytime we want to. 3) Modifying replay files (not reading them) is a violation of Blizzard's ToS. I maybe could get permission to do it, but there's a lot of legal issues tied up in that. We already know how to do it. But we'd have to check them all before releasing them. 4) The issues around this are not just technical, they're also rules based. Yes, we could require in the rules that every player sets busy (already the case) and opens six chats. But then what do you do if someone forgets and lags? Is it fair to allow a restart? or should we call them on a technical? We don't make these decisions lightly. 5) Releasing the replays to casters that we work with and trust is the least risky way to get SOME of this content out. I know it's not everything that everyone wants. At the end of the day though, we can fund events because we can monetize content. Keep in mind that we lose a tremendous amount of money every event. Our productions are not cheap. Sat trucks alone are a solid six figure number. 6) Not going to discuss in a public forum how you can get to the chat name. That's like teaching people how to break your own event ;p R1CH, love to chat with you about it some offline/inpriv. This step is being taken to protect the operations of the event. Replays are not going to be released at this event. When we have some more time to consider things and think through ALL the issues, we'll re-evaluate. But this is not a decision that we'll revisit here. We know how valuable this is to the community and we definitively listen to the community, I think we've proven that. I appreciate constructive criticism and the satire is worth a good laugh too. Bear in mind that at GotFrag (of which I was a founder and prez), we hosted .dem (replays for Counter-Strike) for every match we could find at every event. They're still available there. I know exactly how much we all love having access to the replays. And I know this is an unpopular decision with much of the community. But see above for the straight scoop on why we're doing this. I have no problem with this if it's really about #5 (i.e. "monetizing content"), but that should really just be an upfront reason given. Also, MLG "lose[s] a tremendous amount of money every event"? Really? Either you're investing a ton of money into this every year for a very, very long time in the hope of being positioned well when things finally "take off", or this is just not true. | ||
Excalibur_Z
United States12236 Posts
On July 30 2011 07:46 MLG_Lee wrote: A couple points of clarification: 1) Releasing replays exposes the event to risk that we're not comfortable with. Happy to debate the level of relative risk, but it's there. If I can remove ANY risk from the event, I'm going to. Do any of you really think I or anyone else at MLG want to repeat Dallas? 2) This has nothing to do with GSL or Korean players wanting to be protected on the replays. That was a point of discussion and all LXP players understand that MLG has the right to release the replays anytime we want to. 3) Modifying replay files (not reading them) is a violation of Blizzard's ToS. I maybe could get permission to do it, but there's a lot of legal issues tied up in that. We already know how to do it. But we'd have to check them all before releasing them. 4) The issues around this are not just technical, they're also rules based. Yes, we could require in the rules that every player sets busy (already the case) and opens six chats. But then what do you do if someone forgets and lags? Is it fair to allow a restart? or should we call them on a technical? We don't make these decisions lightly. 5) Releasing the replays to casters that we work with and trust is the least risky way to get SOME of this content out. I know it's not everything that everyone wants. At the end of the day though, we can fund events because we can monetize content. Keep in mind that we lose a tremendous amount of money every event. Our productions are not cheap. Sat trucks alone are a solid six figure number. 6) Not going to discuss in a public forum how you can get to the chat name. That's like teaching people how to break your own event ;p R1CH, love to chat with you about it some offline/inpriv. This step is being taken to protect the operations of the event. Replays are not going to be released at this event. When we have some more time to consider things and think through ALL the issues, we'll re-evaluate. But this is not a decision that we'll revisit here. We know how valuable this is to the community and we definitively listen to the community, I think we've proven that. I appreciate constructive criticism and the satire is worth a good laugh too. Bear in mind that at GotFrag (of which I was a founder and prez), we hosted .dem (replays for Counter-Strike) for every match we could find at every event. They're still available there. I know exactly how much we all love having access to the replays. And I know this is an unpopular decision with much of the community. But see above for the straight scoop on why we're doing this. EDIT: DDOS is a poor choice of words in our release. Hi Lee, even if all that is accurate and correct, this isn't going to stop certain communities from just guessing character codes and spamming players anyway. I'm pretty sure this happened at Columbus and it's not outside the realm of possibility to expect it at Anaheim, much as I don't want that to happen. | ||
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red4ce
United States7313 Posts
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Mauldo
United States750 Posts
They're pulling a GSL, but saying it's because people are parsing info they can use to DDOS the players. Is R1CH sure they can't find anything even remotely like an IP Address or a character code from the replays? Even if MLG is overreacting and simply confronting the problem of people trolling players by getting rid of everything that might cause the problem, how can we be all that mad? Wasn't it Puma at NASL that paused his game because someone was whispering him what his opponent was doing? Maybe it was Losira. Can't quite remember. Either way, it was a player actually having to raise his hand and tell the refs that someone was whispering him and fucking with the game. How can you honestly be mad at MLG for trying to stop that? Sure, they can go Busy and six chat channels, but they're trying something. The problem will pop up if they force their players to go in as Busy and with the chat channels open. If they don't do that, then they honestly deserve every call of "Retarded" and "Are you fucking serious?" But seriously.....are you guys pissed off enough at losing a free service, which you never had to pay for before, to not watch the awesome games this weekend? It's not like when you clicked "Accept" on the HQ Pass screen that you thought you were paying for replays. Those have always been free, so it's honestly up to MLG if they even want to offer the service. And they chose not to. EDIT: Woooo, MLG_Lee! See, they knew it would suck for the community, but they did it as a way to protect the event. Not so EG-level evil, huh guys? | ||
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Terrafros
Netherlands194 Posts
On July 30 2011 07:51 Navichi wrote: Ok MLGLee. The only personal information in the replay files is the profile ID. This allows you to check out someone's profile on www.battle.net. That's it. Where is there ANY risk if the replays get released after the fact? It also allows you to bother the casters during a match, sending them messages if their Busy status resets again. I was cringing several times last time, when Tastosis kept having 4chan trolls spamming them messages. Though I do not see why replays cannot be put up after the event, I see their reasoning. | ||
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n0ise
3452 Posts
Also, the people considering that it's actually due to the SKs not wanting to reveal BOs - funny discussing this with people who probably hadn't had any contact with e-sports before SCII. Replaypacks for LANs are a must, everyone participating knows they are exposing their personal work, but they're doing it to actually succeed in the LAN. Not to mention that a) It's obvious that how good a player is has absolutely nothing to do with a shitty BO every goldy can execute and b) The SK's Build Orders are exposed to the high-level foreigners who they play against, which the only ones that could really take advantage of them anyway. somuchdrama.com | ||
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Nos-
Canada12016 Posts
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