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On July 30 2011 07:15 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2011 07:08 Exarl25 wrote:On July 30 2011 07:05 Plansix wrote:On July 30 2011 07:01 Icekommander wrote:On July 30 2011 06:53 Plansix wrote:
I demand instant gratification on everything. I want the VODs, the replays and interviews all released as they happen. Really, I don't know why they don't let us be observers in the games too. First come, first served. And if the casters can't get in because the game is full, too bad. I'm a Team Liquid forum member and part of the community. Everything should be available to me at all times.
Seriously MGL, why don't you have every player go in, set to busy and open 6 chat channels every game. I don't care if you have to log out each players between sets, this is what needs to happen for me to get what I want. Sure, setting up the players takes time and you are focused on keeping the stream going. But that doesn't matter, I want my replays and you should force every pro to do this so I can have what I want.
And this DDoS crap. I have been to some hacking websites on the internet, you may have heard of it. Let me tell you, from the 20 minutes of research I have done and my knowledge from building one PC from parts I ordered off Newegg, that excuse is total crap. You can't DDoS someone from a replay. Sure it gives you their battle.net account information and then you can message them, that's it. There is no possible way in the world that you can DDoS someone once you know their account info and that they are logged into battle.net. So stop giving us this crap and release the replays. We demand it and its way more important that all of the other crap you are doing. -Setting to busy is standard tournament procedure. Opening six chat channels would take all of ten seconds. -R1ch (the guy quoted in the OP), from my understanding, is basically the official tech support/ trouble shooter for the teamliquid website. If someone reputable should know about what would and wouldn't allow DDOS attempts, it would be him. R1ch may be correct about the DDoS thing, but my sarcastic statement above still holds true. People are acting entitled and dumb. MLG has way more important things to worry as live events are hard as hell to run. I'm sure they would love to release replays, but the harassment through battle.net doesn't make it worth it. How on earth does that prevent them from simply releasing the replays after the event is over? I don't think many people would have a problem with that. It's the fact that we are being deprived of access to replays altogether and possibly under a false pretense that is getting people annoyed. They said they will release replay packs later. Maybe they will release all of them, who knows? Or maybe they will release none, like the GSL and NASL. Maybe they will make your pay for them if you want them. Maybe they will destroy all the replays and ship you the parts of the burn thumb drives out of spite. "How dare you take away the thing that was free before!!!! I demand a valid reason why you are taking away the thing that I got for free before. I will decide if the reason is valid, not you!!! If I don't like the reason, I will call you a liar and demand a reason I will accept! What, your taking it away because you don't want to deal with the issues it created and had a negative affect on your product people are paying for??? That's BS!!!! I demand you provide me with a better reason now!!!! Or I will continue to post in this thread about how angry I am!"
No, they said they would release the replays for particular casters to cast, not to the public. A lot of people prefer looking the replays themselfs than needing to watch the youtube video of a caster they may not like.
And your "irony" is starting to get annoying, specially since basically all your posts had wrong info in them.
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On July 30 2011 07:16 Excalibur_Z wrote:
Okay so this still doesn't sidestep the "chat spam" issue. That's not going away just because they're not releasing replays. We've already discussed the whole "you can't get character codes from replays" thing (and the ones where you could do this via replayfu, they're not actually derived from replays IIRC, they're derived from back when the Battle.net Web profiles displayed the character codes, and that information can be referenced later).
What probably happened before and will no doubt happen again is that the character name will be displayed on the stream, and people (I'm pretty sure who) will just guess 1000 character codes until they get the right one, then it gets posted, then mass spamming occurs again. This is a fundamental Battle.net issue regarding how chat during Busy status is handled and not a replay issue.
Another note, if you're watching either of the 2 'featured' games (the ones that aren't on the mainstage but have Plasma screens above the players' heads), there are times in between games when they send the RealID numbers to other players and it's visible on the screen. Obviously a dick move, but still possible.
Your idea also works and is more plausible. In summary, you're right, there's not a ton that can be done about the chat spam.
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This is actually really sad. I mean Blizzard gain from the advancement of eSports more so with Starcraft 2 but yet they wont include a simple DND mode. How hard is it to do that?
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On July 30 2011 07:15 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2011 07:08 Exarl25 wrote:On July 30 2011 07:05 Plansix wrote:On July 30 2011 07:01 Icekommander wrote:On July 30 2011 06:53 Plansix wrote:
I demand instant gratification on everything. I want the VODs, the replays and interviews all released as they happen. Really, I don't know why they don't let us be observers in the games too. First come, first served. And if the casters can't get in because the game is full, too bad. I'm a Team Liquid forum member and part of the community. Everything should be available to me at all times.
Seriously MGL, why don't you have every player go in, set to busy and open 6 chat channels every game. I don't care if you have to log out each players between sets, this is what needs to happen for me to get what I want. Sure, setting up the players takes time and you are focused on keeping the stream going. But that doesn't matter, I want my replays and you should force every pro to do this so I can have what I want.
And this DDoS crap. I have been to some hacking websites on the internet, you may have heard of it. Let me tell you, from the 20 minutes of research I have done and my knowledge from building one PC from parts I ordered off Newegg, that excuse is total crap. You can't DDoS someone from a replay. Sure it gives you their battle.net account information and then you can message them, that's it. There is no possible way in the world that you can DDoS someone once you know their account info and that they are logged into battle.net. So stop giving us this crap and release the replays. We demand it and its way more important that all of the other crap you are doing. -Setting to busy is standard tournament procedure. Opening six chat channels would take all of ten seconds. -R1ch (the guy quoted in the OP), from my understanding, is basically the official tech support/ trouble shooter for the teamliquid website. If someone reputable should know about what would and wouldn't allow DDOS attempts, it would be him. R1ch may be correct about the DDoS thing, but my sarcastic statement above still holds true. People are acting entitled and dumb. MLG has way more important things to worry as live events are hard as hell to run. I'm sure they would love to release replays, but the harassment through battle.net doesn't make it worth it. How on earth does that prevent them from simply releasing the replays after the event is over? I don't think many people would have a problem with that. It's the fact that we are being deprived of access to replays altogether and possibly under a false pretense that is getting people annoyed. They said they will release replay packs later. Maybe they will release all of them, who knows? Or maybe they will release none, like the GSL and NASL. Maybe they will make your pay for them if you want them. Maybe they will destroy all the replays and ship you the parts of the burn thumb drives out of spite. "How dare you take away the thing that was free before!!!! I demand a valid reason why you are taking away the thing that I got for free before. I will decide if the reason is valid, not you!!! If I don't like the reason, I will call you a liar and demand a reason I will accept! What, your taking it away because you don't want to deal with the issues it created and had a negative affect on your product people are paying for??? That's BS!!!! I demand you provide me with a better reason now!!!! Or I will continue to post in this thread about how angry I am!"
Can you at least read the OP before spouting bullshit please?
They will not be releasing replays to the public, at all. Only a few select casters will be granted access to them.
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Imo this makes the tourney a LOT worse for the spectators. Also stupid excuse.
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On July 30 2011 07:15 Plansix wrote:
They said they will release replay packs later.
No, they didn't.
They explicitly said:
MLG will no longer be making replays of Tournament matches available to the public.
and
After MLG Anaheim, we will be sending replay packs out to selected groups of casters
No replays will go out to the general public, just "selected casters".
As for the rest of your post, grow up. MLG is a business, putting on an event for which they make money in advertising and subscriptions. Customer feedback is entirely legitimate.
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WArped Show nested quote +On July 30 2011 07:12 Bandino wrote:
Why does everyone feel entitled to copy people's build orders (which they probably put a lot of work into) and get these replays. Get over it there are going to be no replays. It seems this community has started to overreact for any little change. Sure it makes for interesting drama to read, but overall it just deteriorates the community and people's opinion of said community, I mean just look at how everyone perceives the DOTA community. There is an overreaction because their reason behind it is fucking stupid, it makes no sense at all. Maybe to protect the Korean guys build orders yes, but the DDoS thing seems so unrealistic. Everything can be worked around..
And if they came out and told the truth that they couldn't give out replays because they didn't want people copying build orders i bet you there still would be a bunch of folk on TL who would feel that they are entitled to those build orders. Overall I guess it's just how the internet works. Complain about everything.
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noooo this is horrible news... i rely on mlg replays to look at build orders and keep up to date on whats going on competitively! ahhh no good at all
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On July 30 2011 07:10 RndmGdNck wrote:
How can they think ppl are buying this? This a computer game community we are smarting then that.
This is awful.
This whole thread is devolving into yet another TL conspiracy witch-hunt.
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Real reason: More money via ads in the streams and vods, and possibly they will sell more hd passes,,,
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On July 30 2011 07:23 Dekker wrote:
Real reason: More money via ads in the streams and vods, and possibly they will sell more hd passes,,,
I'd pay extra for replays 
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I'd be able to swallow this better if they just came out and admit that Korean teams don't like releasing replays and it's part of the deal for the exchange program; but instead lying about the chat spam and misusing the term DDoS and ignoring alternatives such as releasing them after the event just makes me feel almost cheated for purchasing the HQ pass. Better yet, they might have gotten some guy who never touched SC2 before to write that announcement before even attempting to workaround the "DDoS" during Columbus. I gotta say, I'm getting a bad vibe from all this; between Husky & MrBitter, no HQ on both streams and now this happening.
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On July 30 2011 07:22 TheButtonmen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2011 07:10 RndmGdNck wrote:
How can they think ppl are buying this? This a computer game community we are smarting then that. This is awful. This whole thread is devolving into yet another TL conspiracy witch-hunt.
There is a reason for that. MLG's excuses for not releasing the replays are full of holes, this has been pointed out plenty of times in the thread already.
MLG are at best mistaken and at worst intentionally lying to us.
I'm not going to jump to any conclusions as to which is the case here but either way it's in MLG's best interests to release some clarification asap.
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This is a major disappointment and I'm hurt that MLG would choose to lie or be easily misinformed concerning the justification behind it. 
I don't know if they realized how people were interfering with the tournament, so I'm not going to jump on the conspiracy bandwagon and immediately believe this was part of the GOM partnership negotiation being delivered with a diversion.
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oh noes D; one of the few opportunities to get replays of the Koreans.
Will I never get to see what makes nestea tick >.>
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Wow, fuck. One of the best parts of the event cancelled.
They need to provide some solid technical proof, preferably in private to someone like Rich. If there really is a problem with the replay format, it needs to be reported to Blizzard so they can fix it for future events. Either way, from a technical standpoint, it should be easy to parse out or change any identifying information. If they've known about this flaw for a while, then it's entirely their fault for not having software to fix it.
I was considering buying a membership to help them reach the 100k goal, but if they refuse to release replays then that's not going to happen.
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You can nab a players Battle.net ID through replay.message.events file which is inside the SC2 Replay MPQ File. However, there are no stored information of the player(s) IP, for that information is not needed for any of the replay files and overall purpose of the replay. Ergo, you can not in any shape or form use a replay file to DDOS attack much less even get an IP address.
Even if you do nab the players B.net number, through other means since the B.net ID on the replay is NOT your Character code, the best you can do is spam the hell out of the said player, who in return, can block you. GG!
If there is anyway to actually get a hold of MLG's staff to tell them how impossible it is to grab a players IP from a replay, that would be great. Highly doubt it however.
Otherwise MLG has a 2nd reason to not give replays, which is more valid IMO; man power. They probably want to spend their manpower resource to other venue's than providing the community with over 1,000 replays from all the games that have been played over the weekend.
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On July 30 2011 07:24 Shaxe wrote:
I'd be able to swallow this better if they just came out and admit that Korean teams don't like releasing replays and it's part of the deal for the exchange program; but instead lying about the chat spam and misusing the term DDoS and ignoring alternatives such as releasing them after the event just makes me feel almost cheated for purchasing the HQ pass. Better yet, they might have gotten some guy who never touched SC2 before to write that announcement before even attempting to workaround the "DDoS" during Columbus. I gotta say, I'm getting a bad vibe from all this; between Husky & MrBitter, no HQ on both streams and now this happening.
Honestly, I could even accept it if they said they were doing it to increase the value of their VODs service. You could argue wether that is fair or not, but it would at least make sense.
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On July 30 2011 07:16 Excalibur_Z wrote:
Okay so this still doesn't sidestep the "chat spam" issue. That's not going away just because they're not releasing replays. We've already discussed the whole "you can't get character codes from replays" thing (and the ones where you could do this via replayfu, they're not actually derived from replays IIRC, they're derived from back when the Battle.net Web profiles displayed the character codes, and that information can be referenced later).
What probably happened before and will no doubt happen again is that the character name will be displayed on the stream, and people (I'm pretty sure who) will just guess 1000 character codes until they get the right one, then it gets posted, then mass spamming occurs again. This is a fundamental Battle.net issue regarding how chat during Busy status is handled and not a replay issue.
hopefully some players get spammed and lag again so mlg has to post the replays again LOL?
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On July 30 2011 07:21 Bandino wrote:Show nested quote +WArped On July 30 2011 07:12 Bandino wrote:
Why does everyone feel entitled to copy people's build orders (which they probably put a lot of work into) and get these replays. Get over it there are going to be no replays. It seems this community has started to overreact for any little change. Sure it makes for interesting drama to read, but overall it just deteriorates the community and people's opinion of said community, I mean just look at how everyone perceives the DOTA community. There is an overreaction because their reason behind it is fucking stupid, it makes no sense at all. Maybe to protect the Korean guys build orders yes, but the DDoS thing seems so unrealistic. Everything can be worked around.. And if they came out and told the truth that they couldn't give out replays because they didn't want people copying build orders i bet you there still would be a bunch of folk on TL who would feel that they are entitled to those build orders. Overall I guess it's just how the internet works. Complain about everything.
a ton of casters keep the production tab open which makes it very very easy to copy the build orders to a "T." All this does is slow down the process so players looking at the vod cant look at anything they want whenever they want.
Make no mistake about it, if a game gets casted that someone wants to steal the Build from, it will happen. Not releasing replays is not a way around that. in my opinion at least.
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EPT
