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Puma leaves TSL for EG - Page 234

Forum Index > SC2 General
7189 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 232 233 234 235 236 360 Next
Al Bundy
Profile Joined April 2010
7257 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-21 21:18:40
July 21 2011 21:17 GMT
#4661
On July 22 2011 06:12 OPL3SA2 wrote:
It's funny because in the real world this is called business
in e-sports it's called drama

Real world is rotten to the core. I don't want esports to become like that.
Or maybe is it too late? Is that what you meant?
o choro é livre
Morrisson
Profile Joined May 2011
289 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-21 21:18:36
July 21 2011 21:17 GMT
#4662
This was already covered in the thread. Coach Lee said himself that there was no contract. If we consider that to just mean no written contract, and that there was some kind of informal oral contract, there certainly wasn't an end date to it. It would just be an agreement that could be interrupted at any time. "We will provide you food and lodging, in return you will play for us" Puma roughly said "I no longer wish to play for you, I do not need you to provide me food and lodging" well that's it, contract terminated.


I argue that TSL could say that usual business practice is not this one, and therefore a breach of contract.... which is EXACTLY what he said. There was a contract. It was breached. He just dont think going to court is worth it.

We're not restating the arguments, but in short, there was no contract that would provide TSL with any relief (due to the fact that an oral contract needed a definite trigger or time duration, of which there seems to be none). Go read up earlier on the thread for the analysis.So no there was not an actual contract, either verbal or written.


Trigger is easy, he played under TSL tag name.... Time duration, if not stated, would be infered from what the usual lenght in the industry is. Maybe one year in this case.

There was a contract.
SuitGuy
Profile Joined March 2011
United States186 Posts
July 21 2011 21:18 GMT
#4663
I love all the contract talk. It is hilarious.

Contracts don't really matter anyway even as much as people want them to. Fighting over any contract in esports would cost much much more than the contract is actually worth anyway. Not to even get started on the international law implications which make contracts overseas nearly impossible to enforce anyway.
Suitin' it up 24/7
SafeAsCheese
Profile Joined June 2011
United States4924 Posts
July 21 2011 21:18 GMT
#4664
On July 22 2011 06:17 AlBundy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 06:12 OPL3SA2 wrote:
It's funny because in the real world this is called business
in e-sports it's called drama

Real world is rotten to the core. I don't want esports to become like that.



1. Esports becomes like real world business
2. Esports dies

pick one
Shaetan
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States1175 Posts
July 21 2011 21:18 GMT
#4665
On July 22 2011 06:17 Morrisson wrote:
Show nested quote +
This was already covered in the thread. Coach Lee said himself that there was no contract. If we consider that to just mean no written contract, and that there was some kind of informal oral contract, there certainly wasn't an end date to it. It would just be an agreement that could be interrupted at any time. "We will provide you food and lodging, in return you will play for us" Puma roughly said "I no longer wish to play for you, I do not need you to provide me food and lodging" well that's it, contract terminated.


I argue that TSL could say that usual business practice is not this one, and therefore a breach of contract.... which is EXACTLY what he said. There was a contract. It was breached. He just dont think going to court is worth it.

Show nested quote +
We're not restating the arguments, but in short, there was no contract that would provide TSL with any relief (due to the fact that an oral contract needed a definite trigger or time duration, of which there seems to be none). Go read up earlier on the thread for the analysis.So no there was not an actual contract, either verbal or written.


Trigger is easy, he played under TSL tag name.... Time duration, if not stated, would be infered from what the usual lenght in the industry is. Maybe one year in this case.

There was a contract.


"It's not just TSL, but most Starcraft II teams right now run on trust and faith instead of contracts."

No there wasn't.

My Casts: www.youtube.com/Shaetan
Al Bundy
Profile Joined April 2010
7257 Posts
July 21 2011 21:19 GMT
#4666
On July 22 2011 06:18 SafeAsCheese wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 06:17 AlBundy wrote:
On July 22 2011 06:12 OPL3SA2 wrote:
It's funny because in the real world this is called business
in e-sports it's called drama

Real world is rotten to the core. I don't want esports to become like that.



1. Esports becomes like real world business
2. Esports dies

pick one

3. Esports does not become mainstream
o choro é livre
CluEleSs_UK
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United Kingdom583 Posts
July 21 2011 21:20 GMT
#4667
Woah. this could be the fastest growing thread in TL history. I think this is totally exciting for foreign e-sports, even if it IS a bit jack.
"If it turns out he is leaving the ESL to focus on cooking crystal meth I'll agree that it is somewhat disgraceful, but I'll hold off judgement until then."
MrDudeMan
Profile Joined April 2011
Canada973 Posts
July 21 2011 21:20 GMT
#4668
On July 22 2011 06:19 AlBundy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 06:18 SafeAsCheese wrote:
On July 22 2011 06:17 AlBundy wrote:
On July 22 2011 06:12 OPL3SA2 wrote:
It's funny because in the real world this is called business
in e-sports it's called drama

Real world is rotten to the core. I don't want esports to become like that.



1. Esports becomes like real world business
2. Esports dies

pick one

3. Esports does not become mainstream


And thus we embark on the slow painful road to 2.
felizuno
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States164 Posts
July 21 2011 21:22 GMT
#4669
On July 22 2011 06:10 Nethermind wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 05:57 djWHEAT wrote:
On July 22 2011 05:46 RQShatter wrote:
With that being said. Eg is even more shady forcing people to watch their terrible productions in order to hear an answer.


Then don't watch MY terrible production and wait for the fucking text recap. Problem fucking solved.


It seems to me that you take negative feedback in any way far too personally Wheat. Chill out; don't respond etc. For the 5 people that bag your show without any constructive feedback, there are tons who are fine with it that don't say boo.

I can understand the sentiment however that EG have used this to promote the 'platform' they support (your shows). There is nothing wrong with EG doing that however; in fact it is the logical place to explain their position. In saying that, I feel that you need to accept that the connection of your shows to EG may inadvertently lead people to think of them (occasionally or consistently) as EG's productions, rather than your own.

As we all know, nerd chills are fine. Nerd rage isn't.


Thank you for joining TL, I don't know how djWHEAT's career survived all these years before APRIL 13TH, TWO MONTHS AGO when you came on the scene. Now that he has your expert advice he won't have to kill himself tonight.
Fundamentals are the crutch of the talentless
eggs
Profile Joined August 2010
1011 Posts
July 21 2011 21:22 GMT
#4670
On July 22 2011 06:19 AlBundy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 06:18 SafeAsCheese wrote:
On July 22 2011 06:17 AlBundy wrote:
On July 22 2011 06:12 OPL3SA2 wrote:
It's funny because in the real world this is called business
in e-sports it's called drama

Real world is rotten to the core. I don't want esports to become like that.



1. Esports becomes like real world business
2. Esports dies

pick one

3. Esports does not become mainstream


i was only into esports BEFORE usher made him a teen idol. i had esports fever before it was an epidemic.
zeru
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
8156 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-21 21:22:34
July 21 2011 21:22 GMT
#4671
--- Nuked ---
Deleted User 108965
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
1096 Posts
July 21 2011 21:22 GMT
#4672
i dont think most people mind at all that EG acquired puma from tsl. nobody is saying that's a problem, so it doesnt make sense to lose your cool and rage at people for criticizing EG for the way that they got him. it's a fair criticism as long as the facts aren't completely clear.
Disciple....Top 3 control in Clarion County
p1cKLes
Profile Joined November 2010
United States342 Posts
July 21 2011 21:22 GMT
#4673
Wow the maturity level has gone from here """""""" to here ____ in the last 20 pages.
Docmedical
Profile Joined November 2010
Libya75 Posts
July 21 2011 21:23 GMT
#4674
On July 22 2011 06:09 Darkong wrote:
"It's not just TSL, but most Starcraft II teams right now run on trust and faith instead of contracts."

I'm soory, I know this guy is really well liked and everything, but that is just, at best naive and, at worst, incredibly stupid. E-sports is not that tiny little amateur outfit it was years ago, there's now serious money involved and big businesses getting into it and the teams involved need to grow up and start acting less like typical internet clans and more like professional sports teams.

I feel for the guy in some ways because TSL has lost so many players recently and may not be around for all that long if they can't stop the bleeding, but if you're not having your players tied to some sort of deal to at least get compensation if they transfer to another team, you don't have grounds to complain when they up sticks and leave if they get a better offer from somewhere else.

It would be great if all sports could operate on trust and a gentlemens agreement, but as soon as money is involved that is no longer the case and SC2 teams need to get up to speed on this pronto or this won't be the last time there's such an incident.



Yeah bro, Esports just became professional when SC2 was released.

/sarcasm
derp
OPL3SA2
Profile Joined April 2011
United States378 Posts
July 21 2011 21:23 GMT
#4675
DjWheat is there any chance milikis will be on today's show?
Playoffs? You're talking about playoffs?
Fionn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States23455 Posts
July 21 2011 21:23 GMT
#4676
In the end, all this will spur is Korean teams or a higher power to start an organization that outlaws this. A lot of people didn't want a KESPA in SC2, but they've tried that and this shows that they need at least some sort of KESPA to stop things from happening. I hope that this is the only time something like this happens, but I wouldn't be shocked if EG tries to talk to someone like DongRaeGu when he comes to MLG. Hopefully the Korean teams don't see EG as every foreigner team in the world and aren't afraid to send their players until this new contract/SC2 Korea organization is created.
Writerhttps://twitter.com/FionnOnFire
Morrisson
Profile Joined May 2011
289 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-21 21:25:00
July 21 2011 21:24 GMT
#4677
On July 22 2011 06:18 Shaetan wrote:


"It's not just TSL, but most Starcraft II teams right now run on trust and faith instead of contracts."

No there wasn't.



... please, stop, you're embarassign yourself. Trust create contractual obligations, especially if you can provide proofs and shows this was a two-way relationship ( food/training on one side, wearing the TSL tag on the other is more than enough...) There more that 1 case where no contracts was ever written YET you can have breach of contracts, dol, etc....
yawnoC
Profile Joined December 2010
United States3704 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-21 21:24:16
July 21 2011 21:24 GMT
#4678
Ill be honest ...

I am not looking forward to listening to ChibSquad again ...
GG - UNiVeRsE is the best player in the WORLD
OPL3SA2
Profile Joined April 2011
United States378 Posts
July 21 2011 21:24 GMT
#4679
On July 22 2011 06:17 AlBundy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 06:12 OPL3SA2 wrote:
It's funny because in the real world this is called business
in e-sports it's called drama

Real world is rotten to the core. I don't want esports to become like that.
Or maybe is it too late? Is that what you meant?


Did you just say you didn't want e-sports to join the real world
Did i read that correctly <shrug>
Playoffs? You're talking about playoffs?
mango_destroyer
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada3914 Posts
July 21 2011 21:24 GMT
#4680
Well I am glad DJWheat is trying to make it fair. It would be painful to watch if it was only EG`s side presented.
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