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The Problem with Korea

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Xeris
Profile Blog Joined July 2005
Iran17695 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-17 20:42:47
May 17 2011 19:56 GMT
#1
I'll shed some light on the situation, from the perspective of a team leader for a major team, and I'm sure many other teams/organizations/players outside of Korea share the same thought. This article is in response to the GSL Super Tournament Thread, and the PlayXP article about Needing More Foreigners in Korea:

The "Korean" Problem


I'll start off by saying that the title may not be appropriate, but I couldn't think of a better name for it.

The GSL Super Tournament was recently announced, and it was to the community's dismay that only two non Korean players will be participating. This is by choice, there were many foreign players who were invited -- but they all chose not to go. There are several reasons for this, which I will explain. Next, I will go into a bit of detail as to what I believe is the problem, and potentially, how it can be fixed.

GSL Super Tournament

The Super Tournament is a one month long affair. It begins the week of MLG Columbus. This in itself presents a problem, and GOM tried to fix it by saying "we'll let you play your first round match, then play in MLG, then continue the tournament." The caveat is, GOM does not pay for any of the flights. So think about it: any non Korean's flight cost to Korea is $1,200 - $1,800 most likely. You need a ticket to Korea, then to MLG, and then back to Korea. That's almost $3,000 in flight cost, not to count the massive amount of jet lag that will result and more than likely lead to poor enough play to have anyone who would dare to go through that journey be eliminated early from both tournaments.

The second problem is that foreign players were notified of the tournament just about a week and a half ago. Moving to Korea is no small task, there are a LOT of things a team needs to do in order to make a trip to Korea. Funding this trip isn't a simple task, letters and proposals need to be written to sponsors in order to secure extra funding, flights and possibly VISAS need to be arranged, and a plan needs to be planned and executed. The fact that GOM notified foreign players basically three weeks before they would need to actually go to Korea leaves teams and organizations a VERY limited time to make accommodations. Personally, this is why Fnatic decided not to send its players -- we didn't receive enough advance notice to get everything ready.

The same thing happened for the GSL World Championships. Everything was so rushed and felt "last minute," and we didn't get enough out of the trip.

Sure it's amazing to see foreigners in Korea, and everyone loved all the footage of the pros at the GOM house practicing and having fun, but spectators don't get to see or know about the behind the scenes organizational stuff that makes working with GOM and getting people to Korea really difficult.

What can GOM do to help?

Notify teams/players far in advance, for starters. If today I got an email from GOM saying that they wanted to include some non Korean teams in the July/August version of the GSTL, it would be really easy for Fnatic to send a team of 4-5 people. Since going to Korea is such a huge move, teams really need more than a few weeks of notice. If we are given 1, 2, or even 3 months of advance notice, I can almost guarantee you'd be seeing more foreign players in the GSL Super Tournament and other future events.

Why are the foreigners leaving Korea

It's way too difficult to live the Korean life unless you are in Code S. The journey to qualify for Code S is not worth the time and energy it would take to have players live there. Yes, GOM has a "foreign" house, so players wouldn't have to worry about housing, but there are so many other factors to consider: acclimating to culture, time zone, and most importantly, practice. A player who doesn't have good practice partners or schedules will not be successful in Korea. The GOM house doesn't provide this. The house is made available, and then players are left to their own devices to practice.

Most of the Korean pro houses are full -- I know because when discussing sending Fnatic players to Korea, the major problem was where/how would the players get good training. We looked into moving into pro houses, but most are full. Spending a lot of money to send people to live in Korea just to practice on the Korean ladder is not productive.

The next big problem is that you have to make a lot of sacrifices by living in Korea. In order to play in any foreign events, you have to wake up at 3-4am to participate, unless you play in the few that make crazy schedule allowances for players in Korea. When you factor in: the amount of time it takes getting used to being in Korea and the lack of good practice, prospects look grim. Why sacrifice playing in almost every European/NA event for working through several months to have a shot at getting to Code S? Think of Haypro for example (this is purely speculative about his actual mindset/decisionmaking): he could probably win a majority of the weekly cups on EU/NA -- which could net him probably $500 per week if he was really proactive (or more, just look at the Tournament Wrap Up Threads). That looks pretty appealing to me rather than continuously trying to go through Code A, which is insanely difficult to win.

Why don't foreign players come to Korea?

The reasons are very similar to what I listed above. Even the GSL/MLG "exchange" program is not going to work. Assuming that non Korean players actually win MLG now, very few of them would actually volunteer to go to Korea as evidenced by the most recent State of the Game episode. Again: giving up playing in European and American events, living in a house of people you don't know and a brand new culture, and needing at least 2-3 GSL events to even be in good enough shape to have a shot at Code S (you're looking at a 6 month commitment to have a realistic shot at doing well in any Korean event)... why would anyone but the most die-hard, such as Jinro and HuK, make that decision. They wouldn't.

What can GOM do to help?

In my opinion there are two potential solutions here.

1) Make Code A an online tournament. If it was online, foreign participation would increase dramatically. It doesn't even need to be an open system, it could be done entirely on application and GOM could accept only the best/most qualified foreigners who apply. It could also be done during Korean hours and on the Korean server; this could be somewhat of a bittersweet revenge for Koreans, let the foreigners play at 3-4am for a change! This would work because foreigners would only have to worry about going to Korea if they qualified for Code S.

2) Invite foreigners directly into Code S. A good exchange program would be to invite a first placed foreign player at MLG to Code S. This way there is a huge incentive now for a foreigner to actually go to Korea. In fact, as mentioned on State of the Game, a direct Code S invite does appeal a lot more to foreign pros than a Code A invite. This way, you actually get foreigners to Korea -- if they lose in Code S, they might be more tempted to stick around to play through Code A to qualify again for Code S. Getting them directly into Code S is sort of like a "foot in the door" method and might increase the chances of foreigner retention in Korea.

What else?

Korea is amazing. I've watched all the GSL final events, and love them. The foreign fans love the Korean tournaments. If the GSL wants to become truly global however, more concessions need to be made to make the highest echelons more accessible to foreign players. It can't be a one way street. So far, no Korean has ever had to qualify for a foreign event, but every single foreign has had to qualify for a Korean event. This is a big problem!

If Koreans are continuously invited to foreign events and don't have to qualify, there will be no real incentive for Koreans to give any concessions to foreign players. I'm in no position to gauge the attitude or mindset of the people being GOM/GSL's decisionmaking, but I truly believe that by opening up their tournament format and making it more friendly to foreign players, the GSL will truly achieve its mission statement and be THE global Starcraft 2 tournament.

They have made strides by opening up a foreign house, helping to cover costs for the GOM World Championships, and with the idea of the exchange program, but more needs to be done. I think with enough feedback, commentary, and communication with GOM, we can help bridge the gap between Korea and the World, not just in terms of skill, but also in terms of events.
twitter.com/xerislight -- follow me~~
CecilSunkure
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States2829 Posts
May 17 2011 20:01 GMT
#2
Korea has always sounded too distant and exclusive ;;
newHABIT
Profile Joined January 2005
Sweden112 Posts
May 17 2011 20:03 GMT
#3
HI XeriS <3

I think they perhaps should put some more effort into the foreign house or start some collaboration so that foreigners could get into the correct and more challenging practise conditions.

Anyways, I agree on most you wrote.
JinDesu
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States3990 Posts
May 17 2011 20:03 GMT
#4
I'll highly agree with the online tourney (especially doing it on their turf and times :D), but it may raise a huge outcry on legitimacy by some groups.

I think it's not a bad thing that GOM hasn't done everything yet. It's been 5 months into the year, about 8 months after the GSL was created, and GOM has done so much. And the korean internet groups appear to be clamoring for foreign participation of their own players, and foreign participation in the GSL. So what I am saying is that I believe it will come in time.
Yargh
Yaotzin
Profile Joined August 2010
South Africa4280 Posts
May 17 2011 20:04 GMT
#5

2) Invite foreigners directly into Code S. A good exchange program would be to invite a first placed foreign player at MLG to Code S. This way there is a huge incentive now for a foreigner to actually go to Korea. In fact, as mentioned on State of the Game, a direct Code S invite does appeal a lot more to foreign pros than a Code A invite. This way, you actually get foreigners to Korea -- if they lose in Code S, they might be more tempted to stick around to play through Code A to qualify again for Code S. Getting them directly into Code S is sort of like a "foot in the door" method and might increase the chances of foreigner retention in Korea.

Dunno bout the rest but isn't this happening? Future MLG winners go straight to code S?
Xeris
Profile Blog Joined July 2005
Iran17695 Posts
May 17 2011 20:09 GMT
#6
It's a Code A invite, unless I'm horribly mistaken...

Hey Habit!!
twitter.com/xerislight -- follow me~~
blackone
Profile Joined November 2010
Germany1314 Posts
May 17 2011 20:09 GMT
#7
Oh my god, please, no.
I'd really like the GSL to become more "Global", but not at the price of quality. A big part of the awesomeness of GSL is due to the factor that it is not online (yea blabla no LAN mode, you know what I mean), and I don't want people to be seeded into Code S because if you're not able to qualify for it, you don't belong there.
ilbh
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Brazil1606 Posts
May 17 2011 20:10 GMT
#8
good read.

What can GOM do to help?

what if they drasticaly increase the Code A prize pool? would it motivate foreigners to move there?
Part of the inhumanity of the computer is that, once it is competently programmed and working smoothly, it is completely honest.
Jetaap
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France4814 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-17 20:11:28
May 17 2011 20:10 GMT
#9
Thanks for the insight about the supertournament , it was really hard for me to understand why no player wanted to go. Concerning the invites , their is 1 code S spot for the winner of MLG , and 4 code A spots for the top4 non korean.
Yaotzin
Profile Joined August 2010
South Africa4280 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-17 20:10:47
May 17 2011 20:10 GMT
#10
On May 18 2011 05:09 Xeris wrote:
It's a Code A invite, unless I'm horribly mistaken...

Hey Habit!!

My understanding is that this MLG is only like 3 Code A invites, but future MLGs will be winner gets Code S + a few Code As.

Can someone clarify?
odder
Profile Joined April 2010
United States405 Posts
May 17 2011 20:12 GMT
#11
After Columbus, MLG winners get Code S slot.
homer001
Profile Joined October 2010
493 Posts
May 17 2011 20:13 GMT
#12
the problem is there arent other tournaments apart from gsl in korea
so if a player is knocked out early they hav to wait for the next gsl which is usually in a months time
Antoine
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States7481 Posts
May 17 2011 20:13 GMT
#13
On May 18 2011 05:10 Yaotzin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 18 2011 05:09 Xeris wrote:
It's a Code A invite, unless I'm horribly mistaken...

Hey Habit!!

My understanding is that this MLG is only like 3 Code A invites, but future MLGs will be winner gets Code S + a few Code As.

Can someone clarify?

yes, that's correct. for MLGs after columbus, 1st place will go into code S. the next 3 players if 1st place is non-korean or next 4 players is 1st place is korean will have a spot in code A.

nice writeup xeris, i'd send this to torch/junkka,/chae jungwon if i were you. while it helps us to understand, it would help them to improve.
ModeratorFlash Sea Action Snow Midas | TheStC Ret Tyler MC | RIP 우정호
StarStruck
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
25339 Posts
May 17 2011 20:13 GMT
#14
Yes, only the winners will be sent to Code S. Xeris, I thought everything you said was blatantly obvious yet GOM doesn't seem to understand this. We know their intentions are good, but there are many reasons why many of the top foreigners will continue to pass on GOM's opportunities.
Crais
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Canada2136 Posts
May 17 2011 20:14 GMT
#15
Thanks for the insight Xeris. I would love more crossover between both leagues. Good read.
RIP MBC Game Hero
Senx
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Sweden5901 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-17 20:16:26
May 17 2011 20:14 GMT
#16
I can definantly understand players and teams perspective when they look at korea vs non-korean tournaments.

I mean to be honest the number of big tournaments and the potential income you can get from playing non-korean tournaments far outweights the ONE small chance you have of placing high in the most stacked league in the world - GSL code S.

So yeah, there's really no reason to play in korea anymore - you're actually missing out on more than you gain from being there. Just mindlessly practicing on the korean ladder will only get you so far, its not enough of a reason to travel all the way over there. Lets not even talk about code A.

Foreign scene has never been this strong and its only getting stronger. Since GOM has exclusive rights to SC2 in korea for 2 years, it will be a few years before Korea can retake its position as the place to be for any player. Assuming OGN and MBC actually does something with SC2.

Dreamhack, MLG, TSL, IPL, NASL and ESL > GSL.
"trash micro but win - its marine" MC commentary during HSC 4
RmoteCntrld
Profile Joined June 2010
United States596 Posts
May 17 2011 20:15 GMT
#17
On May 18 2011 05:09 Xeris wrote:
It's a Code A invite, unless I'm horribly mistaken...

Hey Habit!!


All 3 foreign seeds get Code A for Columbus since Code S players are already set. After Columbus they will add the top foreigner directly into Code S.
Antoine
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States7481 Posts
May 17 2011 20:17 GMT
#18
On May 18 2011 05:15 RmoteCntrld wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 18 2011 05:09 Xeris wrote:
It's a Code A invite, unless I'm horribly mistaken...

Hey Habit!!


All 3 foreign seeds get Code A for Columbus since Code S players are already set. After Columbus they will add the top foreigner directly into Code S.

this isn't quite true. only the top finisher who is not already in code S gets a code S seed, regardless of whether that person is korean or a foreigner
ModeratorFlash Sea Action Snow Midas | TheStC Ret Tyler MC | RIP 우정호
Treemonkeys
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States2082 Posts
May 17 2011 20:17 GMT
#19
Online code A wouldn't be as good to watch, definitely would not be worth that. It wouldn't make sense to dump the show they have in favor of getting laggy games from people around the world. Also I think it is the winner of MLG who gets a code S spot.
http://shroomspiration.blogspot.com/
Xeris
Profile Blog Joined July 2005
Iran17695 Posts
May 17 2011 20:20 GMT
#20
On May 18 2011 05:13 Antoine wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 18 2011 05:10 Yaotzin wrote:
On May 18 2011 05:09 Xeris wrote:
It's a Code A invite, unless I'm horribly mistaken...

Hey Habit!!

My understanding is that this MLG is only like 3 Code A invites, but future MLGs will be winner gets Code S + a few Code As.

Can someone clarify?

yes, that's correct. for MLGs after columbus, 1st place will go into code S. the next 3 players if 1st place is non-korean or next 4 players is 1st place is korean will have a spot in code A.

nice writeup xeris, i'd send this to torch/junkka,/chae jungwon if i were you. while it helps us to understand, it would help them to improve.


Ah okay, I didn't know that 1st place (after Columbus) gets a Code S spot. BUT, I still don't think this is enough. After Columbus, you'll probably have 6-7 Koreans instead of 4. There is a high probability that a Korean will win MLG as long as Koreans are still attending. So the Code S spot could realistically go to a Korean every single season. Especially given that 1st gets into Code S, you could likely see a LOT of Koreans go just for the Code S chance (play for 1 month in Code A, or play for 3 days and get Code S).

twitter.com/xerislight -- follow me~~
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