Post 1.3 Infestors - Really Too Strong? - Page 17

On April 27 2011 08:56 PlaGuE_R wrote:
if you remove KA, you should remove pathogen glands and the ghost energy upgrade, and the raven energy upgrade. to make it all balanced

On April 27 2011 09:26 Jermstuddog wrote:


Wait, what?

Marines standing around with 0 control what-so-ever will kill Mutalisks 1-for-2. If you have enough sense to stim, it's basically 1-for-1.

Siege tanks require no micro what-so-ever, against the standard ling/bling/muta, every shot is a good shot. You are either taking out clumps of lings or clumps of banes, either one is totally worth-while and requires 0 micro.

Marines beat lings 1-to-1 straight up, and do much better with any applied micro at all, add to that, with stim + medivacs are basically unkillable without banes or fungals, if you have enough Marines, they eventually kill stuff so fast that banelings can't ever even get in range.

Even when it comes to engagements like banshees vs queens, banshees can stack, move faster, and actually have the option of running away from a losing engagement, unlike queens.

I'm not going to be as ignorant as you and claim that the burden of micro is on the Zerg player, but the benefits of micro are vastly different when you compare the two.

Zerg micros his units so they are somewhat effective against 1a Terrans.

Terran micros his units so he can make engagements unwinnable for Zerg.

On April 27 2011 09:45 TheTenthDoc wrote:
Are ghosts really a good answer to infestors? I am leery to try them considering how they guzzle gas and greatly delay the tech/upgrades you need to deal with the zerg army, especially if they decide to tech. Even if you get off an EMP, the infestors may still have energy to Fungal remaining thanks to the recent EMP nerf.

As for trying to snipe, can't they just fungal your ghosts and kill them off with you maybe getting one infestor kill?

I know, this sounds like I wouldn't use ghosts in TvP either, but the thing is templars are slower, EMP does useful damage to the zerg army with one shot unlike snipe which has to be manually targeted and thus struggles to hit fast Z units in a battle, and sending in ghosts solo versus Protoss isn't as much of a one-way trip. Also, HT come out very late so your tech is finished, while Infestors are a T2 unit; that makes the gas cost a bigger issue since it means cutting your tanks or upgrades a lot.

I'm honestly wondering what I'm missing here because of how many people say "go ghost." I haven't seen very many high level (Grandmaster) players respond with ghosts either.

On April 27 2011 09:47 nitdkim wrote:

ghosts are so powerful... emp them infestors then process to snipe broodlords.

On April 27 2011 09:48 TheTenthDoc wrote:


Don't the broodlings get in the way of pathing and obliterate the ghosts? Plus Broodlords have a bajillion health, it takes 6 snipes to kill one.

On April 27 2011 09:20 blade55555 wrote:
Does anyone have any links or something too a tournament where a good zerg vs a good terran/protoss used infestors and won? I mean I watch a lot of sc2 and I rarely see a top zerg player start out infestor (i see transition thats what I do too).

Only times I have seen so far infestors are ladder games watching sen/haypro on the korean server and the koreans once they got 3 bases were getting ghosts too EMP infestors.

The pvz counter I feel would be immortal/stalker/zealot/sentry with some HT's just for feedback. but thats assuming their going roach/infestor. Idk wish I could read top zergs minds into why they aren't starting out infestor. I know I personally don't do it as I just don't' like it, I don't feel its as strong as people think except the ones that clump alot of units and don't spread their units at all.

On April 27 2011 09:47 Jayrod wrote:

No im afraid this is terribly wrong and goes to show that you've never played terran at a level higher than im guessing platinum. You are correct though, if you fly your mutalisks over a group of marines they will die.

Look I know zergs not easy, but zerg players need to stop tricking themselves into thinking their race is the hardest in every category. Zergs get the greatest reward for the least amount of attention to their units of all the races... honestly ling run bys is enough evidence to put that argument to rest.

On April 27 2011 09:52 schmutttt wrote:
How can people compare the Khaydarin nerf to Pathogen glands and say it is unfair glands are still in the game?

Compare infestor build time to the time it takes you to warp in one HT and wait for enough energy for storm. I'm pretty sure the HT is able to storm before the infestor is made.

On April 27 2011 09:47 Jayrod wrote:
Look I know zergs not easy, but zerg players need to stop tricking themselves into thinking their race is the hardest in every category.

On April 27 2011 09:51 Soulous wrote:

Broolords only have 220 hp or something; that is very little for a tier 3 unit with its cost. Also snipe has pretty long range.

On April 27 2011 10:07 stlh2opolo wrote:
I'd just love to see fungal made into 6 second time, a median between the other two, and make it a missle, even as a zerg, I think it would make it much more fun and rewarding trying to land a great fungal, and it would bring back some of the "micro wars" i've seen people talk about from BW. (as in, things that can actually be dodged, unlike FF, or the current fungal, other than just spreading your units).

On April 26 2011 21:51 ooni wrote:
We should never state x unit is OP. Seriously guys, go to your search button and search Marauders and you will find so many threads telling you they are so OP (from just few months ago might want to add). Now days if someone says Marauder is OP people just laugh at you then point out how noob you are.
Let us wait and see how us players deal with infestors.

On April 27 2011 10:24 tdt wrote:
I love ppl saying HT's are answer. No they are not. Zerg is not running around with pure infestor, no he has fast lings way in front of them and to get your HT in range of infestor he is killed off by lings before getting it off. Ghost at least has cloaking but HT's are slow as molasses only have same range as infestor and if you're in back of army where HT's should be infestors can still fungel whole army due to area attack and HT still can't reach. IMO nerf should constitute a range nerf for all infestor spells. That's all.

Infestor still has
No dodge strom with lockdown better than FF
Born with mana to do it with upgrade
Born with Burrow & movement
Can kick out a squad of Marines
Can take over your best and expensive units from Thors to Motherships
Faster than HT or Ghost

Just ridiculous.

On April 27 2011 09:45 TheTenthDoc wrote:
Are ghosts really a good answer to infestors? I am leery to try them considering how they guzzle gas and greatly delay the tech/upgrades you need to deal with the zerg army, especially if they decide to tech. Even if you get off an EMP, the infestors may still have energy to Fungal remaining thanks to the recent EMP nerf.

As for trying to snipe, can't they just fungal your ghosts and kill them off with you maybe getting one infestor kill?

I know, this sounds like I wouldn't use ghosts in TvP either, but the thing is templars are slower, EMP does useful damage to the zerg army with one shot unlike snipe which has to be manually targeted and thus struggles to hit fast Z units in a battle, and sending in ghosts solo versus Protoss isn't as much of a one-way trip. Also, HT come out very late so your tech is finished, while Infestors are a T2 unit; that makes the gas cost a bigger issue since it means cutting your tanks or upgrades a lot.

I'm honestly wondering what I'm missing here because of how many people say "go ghost." I haven't seen very many high level (Grandmaster) players respond with ghosts either.

On April 27 2011 10:24 tdt wrote:
I love ppl saying HT's are answer. No they are not. Zerg is not running around with pure infestor, no he has fast lings way in front of them and to get your HT in range of infestor he is killed off by lings before getting it off. Ghost at least has cloaking but HT's are slow as molasses only have same range as infestor and if you're in back of army where HT's should be infestors can still fungel whole army due to area attack and HT still can't reach. IMO nerf should constitute a range nerf for all infestor spells.

On April 27 2011 10:24 tdt wrote:That's all.

On April 27 2011 08:56 PlaGuE_R wrote:
if you remove KA, you should remove pathogen glands and the ghost energy upgrade, and the raven energy upgrade. to make it all balanced

and templar warp in while we are at it