EPTYour opinions about the BO1 format in GSL Code S - Page 4
| Forum Index > SC2 General |
|
Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
| ||
|
gNs.I-Jasa
United States211 Posts
a>b c>d a vs c winners play each other - the loser from here play in the last match b vs d losers play each other - the winner from here play the last match I think this way it will be easier to determine ranking because it will always go 2-0 2-1 1-2 0-2 instead of 2 people 2-0/ 0-2 ing the group stage and just fighting for ranking at the end | ||
|
Wazabo
Italy124 Posts
On April 26 2011 06:42 GhostFall wrote: its fine, much ado about nothing. The reason you see so many upsets is due to the newness of the game, not because of the format. there would be just as many upsets regardless of format because of this. also, what is this scrub attitude of a player not deserving to get out of their group. seriously, such a stupid stupid attitude. The group stage is seeded, with players allowed to choose their opponents. the better players have the advantage. If an upset happens, it is entirely their fault. They had the advantage, and still lost 2 games because of it. In a game where the best players have around 70% win ratios(talking about both BW and SC2) the format does make a lot of difference, cause if the 3 games that you lose out of 10 are these BO1 you're out. While Flash quality player can drop out of the tournament with this BO1 system, it will _never_ happen with the NASL group stage. It's the same with football(soccer) leagues in Europe, there are teams that never dropped into the second divisions over 100+ years. Cause the leagues are so long that the top teams will always prevail. Infact it's an upset when Barcelona or Real Madrid don't win the championship, not when they fall to the second division, cause even if they have a bad season getting a 60% win ratio instead of 70%, guess what, it's still better than most of the other teams. If they used this BO1 crap they would fail aswell soon or later, cause it's really random and losing 2 games in a row it's just normal even for the best player ever. | ||
|
Jerubaal
United States7684 Posts
We've seen this at least twice with Jinro and MC. | ||
|
omegan
76 Posts
On April 26 2011 07:11 Jerubaal wrote: I really don't like that a player can be eliminated from a 4 man group while only losing to one player. We've seen this at least twice with Jinro and MC. At least they had chances against 2 other players while in the "real" BO3 they only have chances against one player. I think this thread is the result of Jinro loosing to Nestea. | ||
|
Maetl
United States93 Posts
On April 26 2011 07:19 omegan wrote: At least they had chances against 2 other players while in the "real" BO3 they only have chances against one player. I think this thread is the result of Jinro loosing to Nestea. And that would be fine in a Bo3 involving two players, but a group stage is supposed to determine the best players among a group, and having one player get knocked out by losing to only one other player does not even sort of do that. It's better than single elimination the entire way, but not by all that much. | ||
|
rickybobby
United States405 Posts
| ||
|
robih
Austria1086 Posts
i think its quite exciting | ||
|
Derez
Netherlands6068 Posts
- MVP got booted out of code S by July, who absolutely dominated him at that point. MVP wasn't ready for it, and he paid the price. - MC got too cocky and didn't actually prepare for very basic terran timings. Again, outplayed by polt, who is a terribly mediocre terran. More games wouldn't have changed a thing. - Jinro has been in a slump for a while, got a win over san with a cutesy tactic, but then wasn't ready to face nestea. Got outplayed as a result. You need to have a high turnover rate in players this early in a game, for the simple reason that half of code S are players that shouldn't be in there. Ofc this is going to mean that 'favorites' will be at risk of dropping out, or actually dropping out to code A, but if you're good enough you're gonna make it back into code S. The only alternative is a system like NASL, where what, 8 players get dropped end of season? Combine that with the simple fact that half of the NASL doesn't represent the top, and we'll be stuck with a 2 tiered league in a while, with a huge skill difference between the people that deserve to be there and the rest that's only there because not enough people drop per season. | ||
|
zyzq
United States3123 Posts
On April 26 2011 07:50 Derez wrote: To be honest, most of the 'upsets' we have seen were completely deserved, and these players playing more games on those days wouldn't have changed a thing. - MVP got booted out of code S by July, who absolutely dominated him at that point. MVP wasn't ready for it, and he paid the price. - MC got too cocky and didn't actually prepare for very basic terran timings. Again, outplayed by polt, who is a terribly mediocre terran. More games wouldn't have changed a thing. - Jinro has been in a slump for a while, got a win over san with a cutesy tactic, but then wasn't ready to face nestea. Got outplayed as a result. You need to have a high turnover rate in players this early in a game, for the simple reason that half of code S are players that shouldn't be in there. Ofc this is going to mean that 'favorites' will be at risk of dropping out, or actually dropping out to code A, but if you're good enough you're gonna make it back into code S. The only alternative is a system like NASL, where what, 8 players get dropped end of season? Combine that with the simple fact that half of the NASL doesn't represent the top, and we'll be stuck with a 2 tiered league in a while, with a huge skill difference between the people that deserve to be there and the rest that's only there because not enough people drop per season. MC got greedy, yes. Jinro was outplayed, yes. But MVP got all-ined by Julyzerg, twice. I don't know how you consider that "dominated". In reply to the topic, I don't think BO1's are a good idea right now, especially when SC2 is in such a volatile state, where cheeses and all-ins are so rewarding, more so than in BW. Maybe in a year when the game becomes more stable it would be more exciting, but now, it's just too random. | ||
|
ilovesin
Germany92 Posts
I don't like the fact that it is Bo1 but my bigger problem with the format is the fact that you can get eliminated by just loosing to the same Players twice. + Show Spoiler [GSL RO32 Spoiler] + Jinro lost to Nestea twice but never played Clide I would prefer a system where every Player plays against everyone... Bo1 or Bo3 I feel that it would be a much better system.... And not the "winner vs looser" system... | ||
|
KneeDeeP
United States256 Posts
| ||
|
Falcor
Canada894 Posts
On April 26 2011 07:57 zyzq wrote: MC got greedy, yes. Jinro was outplayed, yes. But MVP got all-ined by Julyzerg, twice. I don't know how you consider that "dominated". In reply to the topic, I don't think BO1's are a good idea right now, especially when SC2 is in such a volatile state, where cheeses and all-ins are so rewarding, more so than in BW. Maybe in a year when the game becomes more stable it would be more exciting, but now, it's just too random. If it was a best of 3 for mvp and july, july woulda still won, he won twice mvp didnt win any. This format is fine. You still play a best of 3...but it actually rewards players who are all around good...not people who are good at prepping for 1 race and 1 play style edit: and for people like jinro who took a risk and only prepped for prot, it might have payed off beautifully if the bracket worked out how it should, but it didnt. So the risk he took kinda fucked him | ||
|
Logros
Netherlands9913 Posts
| ||
|
Itsmedudeman
United States19229 Posts
We still see upsets all the time what iwth nestea and MVP getting knocked out in the ro32 of TSL. Unless you want to play bo7s for every single game, it will happen in any format. | ||
|
Kazang
578 Posts
I don't mind upsets, but players being eliminated by just bad luck and the format feels lame. It's not a terrible format but it's just a little fragile and weird, not my cup of tea. | ||
|
JerKy
Korea (South)3013 Posts
Bo1's leave players susceptible to map abuse, cheese, etc However, to have an entire Bo3...it might end up being too long and time consuming. While Bo1 might not seem ideal, it still adds a bit of flavor to the GSL and creates player drama and excitement. | ||
|
red4ce
United States7313 Posts
| ||
|
pdd
Australia9933 Posts
Upsets? Let's talk about some of the major ones - MVP lost twice to July, MC lost twice to Polt. Same deal with a Bo3. Yeah there have been quite some upsets in which the player lost twice to different players, but how's it a fault of the format? They know they have to win twice, so they ought to play their best. Even then those who drop out still have the chance to stay in through Bo3 Up/Down matches Not having to play everyone else in the group? If you prefer a Bo3 Ro32 similiar to Code A, you only end up with 1 guy playing 1 guy. With a group format, at least you play other people. The reason the format limits the number of people you play against is because there may be ties which get time consuming to break. Either way, all you need to do is win twice to advance or lose twice to be eliminated. How's that different from a Bo3? | ||
|
GhostFall
United States830 Posts
On April 26 2011 07:08 Wazabo wrote: In a game where the best players have around 70% win ratios(talking about both BW and SC2) the format does make a lot of difference, cause if the 3 games that you lose out of 10 are these BO1 you're out. While Flash quality player can drop out of the tournament with this BO1 system, it will _never_ happen with the NASL group stage. It's the same with football(soccer) leagues in Europe, there are teams that never dropped into the second divisions over 100+ years. Cause the leagues are so long that the top teams will always prevail. Infact it's an upset when Barcelona or Real Madrid don't win the championship, not when they fall to the second division, cause even if they have a bad season getting a 60% win ratio instead of 70%, guess what, it's still better than most of the other teams. If they used this BO1 crap they would fail aswell soon or later, cause it's really random and losing 2 games in a row it's just normal even for the best player ever. I find it funny you think there is a flash quality player after the game has been out for under a year. i will reiterate, regardless of the format right now upsets will happen a lot right now. | ||
| ||
