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On April 24 2011 14:00 Smigi wrote:
Thanks artosis for the interviews.
as far as balance goes, I don't think their is necessarily a 'weakest' race right now.
However, I do believe their is a strongest race, which is Protoss.
I personally think Protoss's warpgate mechanic is stupid. The ability to make units wherever theres a powerfield is outrageous. Protoss have amazing mobility and their all-in timings are able to be reinforced almost instantly with warpgate. I had the same opinion of warpgate since phase 1 of the beta, and I have the same one now. Once again, I'm not a game designer or on the balance team.. but this is my opinion.
Aside from the warpgate mechanic, I don't think theres anything that stands out as a HUGE issue. Although forcefields and collusi are getting a lot of heat lately.
Protoss would have no early to mid-game timing attacks at all if not for warpgate due to the inefficiency of their units. P successful early aggression against Terran often leads to only a slight edge because SCVs + marines kill gateway units so well. Early heavy sentry FF use being the only exception here... and heavy sentry is a very specific build that is scoutable. Not like you can warp in sentries at the last second and get any use out of them b/c they need full energy.
Early and mid-game Zerg can beat gateway units with any ground unit from zergling to hydra as long as he picks the one he can afford to build and starts building them soon enough. The exception being heavy sentry builds... again easily scoutable and nullified by burrow or overlord upgrades to pick up units. So the only real problem in the Zerg's case is knowing when to build the units and not overdrone. AKA, greedy Zergs aren't doing well against timings or all-ins. Protoss attacks that result in 50% unit loss is a guaranteed game loss if Zerg's econ survived. Flip side is Zerg all-ins are fairly easy to recover against due to the ability to pump drones after a semi-failure, with a high chance of getting back in the game.
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On April 25 2011 20:59 Blizzard_torments_me wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2011 20:45 Piski wrote:On April 25 2011 17:28 Jimbo77 wrote:They should boost the speed of Marines so they have the same speed as speedlings. By the way, zerglings speed available right from the Spawning Pool without Lair-required is as hilarious as if stim did not require techlab. Also speedlings speed at creep is just a joke in my opinion, how tremendous it is. Obviously there is someone in blizz that adore zerg. Have you actually ever tried to kill stalkers or marines that are controlled by a decent player? With even a decent stutter micro those marines just don't die no matter how many lings you make. Yeah,what you don't actually realize is how good that Terran needs to be. People don't realize how good the top Terrans actually are. MVP's multitasking is godlike ,and he actually needs it ,compared to Protoss players.Microing your drops while macroing in base ,while sending another drop ,while poking with your main army isn't really spamming W ,click and chronoboost, E.
 wow u cant be serius.. and ur saying zealot/stalker isnt hard to micro LOL!? what about forcedfeilds?...give protoss a try and ull find urself pushing ur multitask skillz to the limit. stop wining about balance cmon man
~Juanald
User was warned for this post
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On April 26 2011 00:54 Juanald wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2011 20:59 Blizzard_torments_me wrote:On April 25 2011 20:45 Piski wrote:On April 25 2011 17:28 Jimbo77 wrote:They should boost the speed of Marines so they have the same speed as speedlings. By the way, zerglings speed available right from the Spawning Pool without Lair-required is as hilarious as if stim did not require techlab. Also speedlings speed at creep is just a joke in my opinion, how tremendous it is. Obviously there is someone in blizz that adore zerg. Have you actually ever tried to kill stalkers or marines that are controlled by a decent player? With even a decent stutter micro those marines just don't die no matter how many lings you make. Yeah,what you don't actually realize is how good that Terran needs to be. People don't realize how good the top Terrans actually are. MVP's multitasking is godlike ,and he actually needs it ,compared to Protoss players.Microing your drops while macroing in base ,while sending another drop ,while poking with your main army isn't really spamming W ,click and chronoboost, E. wow u cant be serius.. and ur saying zealot/stalker isnt hard to micro LOL!? what about forcedfeilds?...give protoss a try and ull find urself pushing ur multitask skillz to the limit. stop wining about balance cmon man ~Juanald
MVP is the highest KeSPA ranked player to move to SC2. As far as mechanics goes, hes really a player who's multitasking ability cannot help him in SC2, which unfortunately was what made him a semi decent player at BroodWar. Pretty sure he could do all of his macro/micro with one hand.
Although a little exaggerated, what I stated above is exactly the problem MVP is having. He simply can't differentiate himself between slower players with multitasking/macro/micro.
Of course MKP seems like an exception but I do believe it has more to do with his starsense and aggression than his micro ability, he also only uses 1 group for buildings and 1 group for units which isn't optimal.
Then you look at Nestea who was a coach and 2v2 player, and MC who exploits key timing windows, yes he has good micro but then I think it is his starsense and flexibility that wins him games even if his forcefields are good.
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On April 24 2011 22:47 Vidoc wrote:
When is there a Tasteless/Artosis house tour lol? =D
Oh god yes, give me please!
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On April 25 2011 21:52 Ipp wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2011 17:41 Wolf wrote:On April 25 2011 17:28 Jimbo77 wrote:They should boost the speed of Marines so they have the same speed as speedlings. By the way, zerglings speed available right from the Spawning Pool without Lair-required is as hilarious as if stim did not require techlab. Also speedlings speed at creep is just a joke in my opinion, how tremendous it is. Obviously there is someone in blizz that adore zerg. How could zerg win anything if speed required lair? With halfdecent marine/stalker micro zerg would literally never be able to stop those early pressure attacks. Spanishwa went like 5-2 in grand master using the day9 monday funday of building no more than 12 lings, no hydras, no roaches, no mutas (I think those were all the stipulations). It's all about sim city using queens/spine crawlers as walls. They may not have a "burst" but with transfuse their sustained DPS can generally out last early attacks. That given all ins such as marine/scv will most likely demolish it, but lings have trouble with that aswell
Saw it. I haven't hit Spanishiwa on the ladder yet, but when I do, I'm going to have a lot of fun!
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On April 25 2011 20:45 Piski wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2011 17:28 Jimbo77 wrote:They should boost the speed of Marines so they have the same speed as speedlings. By the way, zerglings speed available right from the Spawning Pool without Lair-required is as hilarious as if stim did not require techlab. Also speedlings speed at creep is just a joke in my opinion, how tremendous it is. Obviously there is someone in blizz that adore zerg. Have you actually ever tried to kill stalkers or marines that are controlled by a decent player? With even a decent stutter micro those marines just don't die no matter how many lings you make.
Zerglings do not kill decent stalker play, are you serious here? They really should? Try to use roach instead.
And again, speedlings speed on creep is just a joke. Neither ST nor Colossi have appropriate attack speed to be able to stop decent amount of zlings on creep - T1 unit.
Since you have no unit-select limit it's just -> select all zlings->aMove-> all the rest owns by muta...
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Thanks for watching follks.
haha I was trolling Greg cause we(Artosis, Tasteless, and I) always miss him in Korea. haha
well we will get more interviews for you guys thanks for comments as always.
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On April 26 2011 07:29 Hwanni wrote:
Thanks for watching follks.
haha I was trolling Greg cause we(Artosis, Tasteless, and I) always miss him in Korea. haha
well we will get more interviews for you guys thanks for comments as always.
Thanks for translating Hwanni!
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On April 26 2011 07:29 Hwanni wrote:
Thanks for watching follks.
haha I was trolling Greg cause we(Artosis, Tasteless, and I) always miss him in Korea. haha
well we will get more interviews for you guys thanks for comments as always.
Please do Slayers next!
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On April 26 2011 07:49 doihy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2011 07:29 Hwanni wrote:
Thanks for watching follks.
haha I was trolling Greg cause we(Artosis, Tasteless, and I) always miss him in Korea. haha
well we will get more interviews for you guys thanks for comments as always. Please do Slayers next!
Oh, please do! Who wouldn't love to see an Artosis interview with none other than Boxer? Makes me drool thinking about it.. 
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Its really the larger maps that give terran a hard time. But that makes it in a sense exciting to play. The larger the map the more skill you need as a terran player. MVP was just stating that since protoss units are so mobile and warp ins can occur almost anywhere map size does not impact them and of course zergs love big maps. So really the biggest nerf to terran wasn't all these units, productiosn whatever nerfs it was the larger maps. Had blizzard just listened to the players for once and made larger maps we wouldn't have this discussion.
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On April 26 2011 07:49 doihy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2011 07:29 Hwanni wrote:
Thanks for watching follks.
haha I was trolling Greg cause we(Artosis, Tasteless, and I) always miss him in Korea. haha
well we will get more interviews for you guys thanks for comments as always. Please do Slayers next!
Save the best for last IMO. Do Fou - TSL - oGs and THEN SlayerS 
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Australia8532 Posts
Thank you Artosis! This content is impressive - loving how the metagame keeps shifting hehe.
As mentioned above - cannot wait for SlayerS!
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Do a SlayerS house tour please!!!
Interviews of BOXER, Alicia, MMA, and Ryung would be awsome
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I will give you imaginary internet cookies if you do slayers house tour <3 The Emperor in his natural habitat xD
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To all you noobs getting mad about the MVP comment on Terran balance he is talking about GSL maps specifically. As we all the know the GSL maps are huge in comparison to the ladder maps and have easily defend able naturals and almost always force a macro game. Terran MUST HARASS or at least pressure to stay even and if u don't know this then u are a sad noob, especially against zerg. Unless u are relying on a 1 base all in or a GOODY style mech 2 base all in etc. u will lose most likely in a macro game. Protoss, the size of the map doesn't matter cause they can warp for early game pressure then fall back to form their death balls. Zerg obviously benefits from large maps with the open center that zergs love to fight in and the multiple expansions and the fact that they are safe from early game rushes and all ins especially with the stim nerf.
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On April 25 2011 08:05 Jimbo77 wrote:
Actually it's interesting, can someone remember how it was in Broodwar? Did map size affect the game balance of any of three races or it was absolutely even for all of three independently of map size?
If the last, well, it's one more evidence that BW is balanced game, contrary SC2 which is not.
...Maps were used as balance patches in BW
There were no patches, so new maps were made to even out the balance of the game. So yes I would say map design is incredibly important.
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Thank you so much for this artosis and hwanni. I love these they are so interesting to see how the pros live and how they practice and get their insight into the games. Were you guys in a room between a hallway and a bathroom or something? ALl those people seemed like they urgently needed to get into that room haha. I agree with the other posters. Slayers would be awesome to see. That or ogs :D
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IM doesen't have sponsors?! That's rough.
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i am fucking sick of every tournament being only terrans. it's always tvt semifinals. ALWAYS.
while i really like tvt and it's one of my favorite matchups it's starting to get old.
who really enjoys watching at least 3 tvt finals every day. where are the zergs and protosses? where? i see only terrans. fucking boring.
how can anyone honestly believe that terran is somehow the weakest race with shit like that going on every day. EVERY weekly cup EVERY day is almost always 4 terrans in semi finals and we see tvt tvt tvt tvt tvt
I
AM
FUCKING
SICK
OF
THIS
SHIT
honestly
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EPT
