I agree, if only because Backwater doesn't lead to 100+ posts in the Live Report Thread about "wtf this gamma/glow is way too high fix it this is worse than MLG wtf." Plus we got to see that super-cute qxc reaper-medivac play.

HolyArrow

United States7116 Posts

April 14 2011 20:22 GMT

#22

I think the map change was detrimental, and makes it unnecessarily favor Protoss. Blizzard's map is fine.

United States1056 Posts

April 14 2011 20:22 GMT

#23

On April 15 2011 05:11 infinity21 wrote:
Although ensnare reacted poorly to inc's phoenix Colo composition (not enough Vikings and no ghosts), I think the changes definitely favour Protoss.

He had ghosts, but they came too late.

Cosmos

Belgium1077 Posts

April 14 2011 20:22 GMT

#24

On April 15 2011 05:18 Offhand wrote:

Show nested quote +

You're terran, that's why.

As a terran I don't have problems with crossfire in fact. It's just after that I saw darkforce vs cruncher or grubby vs moon on this map that I now find it EXTREMELY unbalanced for zergs vs protoss.

OnFire

324 Posts

April 14 2011 20:22 GMT

#25

What do you expect from a tournament run by iNcontrol?
Jokes aside... yes, it's terrible. Easy expansions to hold for both terran (siege tanks) and protoss (forcefield + collosi), impossible to hold for zerg.

chonkyfire

United States451 Posts

April 14 2011 20:23 GMT

#26

ensnare was way to passive on tal'darim, he also could of destroyed the gold rocks, in fact I was hoping he would. He just played bio completely wrong in every way. I kind of like the gold minerals in the middle personally, although I think they are only really useful for terran (mass mule), maybe zerg.

Barca

United States418 Posts

April 14 2011 20:27 GMT

#27

Didn't they also add a destructible rocks to the entrance to your main? Wouldn't that be anti-force field? 0_o

Natural ramp wasn't that small. Still needed 2-3 FF to deal with (iNc used 4 when Ensnare poked). That probably still favors Protoss, but keep in mind they're are 2 entrances to your natural. Ensnare only went up one. If he had done a dual pronged attack, iNcontrol would have been dead.

Adding all of those Gold bases doesn't really effect anyone, since you can only take the middle if you're ahead.

This map is not a joke, what a biased OP :/

Yamulo

United States2096 Posts

April 14 2011 20:30 GMT

#28

it wasn't the map... ensnare just didn't take advantage of his advantage if that makes sense.

Antoine

United States7481 Posts

April 14 2011 20:31 GMT

#29

it's not a new version, it's like the very original version LS made
if you go back and look at the 1st screeenshots or 1st games on Gisado, it's this map

vict1019

United States401 Posts

April 14 2011 20:32 GMT

#30

Why try and be fancy with their own mods, just use the Blizzard map which has undergone testing.

floor exercise

Canada5847 Posts

April 14 2011 20:32 GMT

#31

From what I could tell they added rocks at the main choke making it really tiny, rocks on every expansion except nats, and 4 gold expansions in the middle of the map.

It's really strange that they would just make their own version of the map like that.

On April 15 2011 05:31 Antoine wrote:
it's not a new version, it's like the very original version LS made
if you go back and look at the 1st screeenshots or 1st games on Gisado, it's this map

Oh ok then they just screwed up completely

Yamulo

United States2096 Posts

April 14 2011 20:32 GMT

#32

On April 15 2011 05:22 Cosmos wrote:

Show nested quote +

As a terran I don't have problems with crossfire in fact. It's just after that I saw darkforce vs cruncher or grubby vs moon on this map that I now find it EXTREMELY unbalanced for zergs vs protoss.

What? In either of those series did they utilize brood lords or infesters which are amazing on that map... no, well actually moon did and that is how he won. But really how does a terran comment about a match up he doesn't play? i mean seige tanks are just as good as forcefeilds and let me tell you this... fungal is amazing on that map....

butter

United States785 Posts

April 14 2011 20:38 GMT

#33

On April 15 2011 05:14 setzer wrote:
Sounds a lot like the original GSL tal'darim before it was heavily changed. If that is true, then I can't believe the NASL is using a map that was found to be heavily imbalanced through GSL's testing. Definitely the worse version, next to Blizzard's.

I don't understand why each tournament uses not only a different version, but an inferior version. This is a bad decision by NASL and it needs to be fixed asap.

Yeah, you can even see the blue honeycomb of the original Amoroso (which had become green by the time it was used in the Gom team league).

Baarn

United States2702 Posts

April 14 2011 20:40 GMT

#34

On April 15 2011 05:31 Antoine wrote:
it's not a new version, it's like the very original version LS made
if you go back and look at the 1st screeenshots or 1st games on Gisado, it's this map

Well the OP also thinks crossfire is imba for protoss against zerg.

Diamond

United States10796 Posts

April 14 2011 20:40 GMT

#35

Tournaments REALLY need to stop using old maps that have new versions. Old Tal Darim and Terminus Re are pretty imba.

funcmode

Australia720 Posts

April 14 2011 20:43 GMT

#36

They're using an old version of Crossfire too - though I think the differences are mostly aesthetic.

Asha

United Kingdom38255 Posts

April 14 2011 20:45 GMT

#37

It was an awful game, and that version of the map is...not so good.

floor exercise

Canada5847 Posts

April 14 2011 20:46 GMT

#38

It kinda seems like a huge oversight if they aren't using the right map versions. What do you suppose they do from here? I would think they have to switch them out, there are some significant differences

SnuggleZhenya

596 Posts

April 14 2011 20:47 GMT

#39

The real problem here is that Ensnare didn't play the map the way he should have. Maybe the map needs to change maybe it doesn't, but you have to play the map you're on at the time, and Ensnare just way over produced his marine/marauder army which was basically the worst possible composition for that situation.

Change the map if it needs to be changed, but it doesn't change the fact that there are a ton of things Ensnare could've done differently to win that game.

setzer

United States3284 Posts

April 14 2011 20:48 GMT

#40

On April 15 2011 05:40 iCCup.Diamond wrote:
Tournaments REALLY need to stop using old maps that have new versions. Old Tal Darim and Terminus Re are pretty imba.

Thanks for bringing up Terminus, I had forgot they are using the old version of that too.

This is making NASL look like a joke. They have had ample time to change their map pool to the more balanced versions. If I remember, Terminus RE was also found to be heavily imbalanced in favor of protoss. If NASL continues to use the outdated versions for the entire season (3 months!) then that will definitely factor into my decision to purchase a ticket for season 2.