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On April 15 2011 06:13 Zinthar wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2011 05:18 To3-Knee wrote:
Not really fair to July for waking up at 4am to wait for the tourny. Yes, you can shuffle things around, but at the end of the day, it's a tournament and has a set schedule. As much as I want to see July Vs White-Ra and I'd be routing for White-Ra, it doesn't change the fact that July deserves the by on this one. Actually, it's not a tournament (tournaments don't last for over 3 months). Dreamhack is a tournament, though. And aside from Huk & Jinro, everyone at Dreamhack could have found themselves in the same position that Sjow and WhiteRa were in if NASL had foolishly scheduled a league game simultaneously with Dreamhack. It's not like Dreamhack was a long tournament at all, so it would have been easy to schedule around well in advance in order to prevent any of the 6 NASL participants from being put in a position to go find a random place to play in order to avoid a forfeit. I also can't believe people are suggesting that a pro player should have to choose between Dreamhack & NASL -- frankly, if NASL wants people to choose, pros are going to choose tournaments with relatively high prize pools per time invested and NASL will lose out every time! The actual schedule for NASL dating all the way into June is currently posted. That seems like a major mistake to me, as it's going to ensure that there will be future conflicts with live tournaments. It would make more sense if NASL would choose the matchups to be played each week in advance, and then schedule the days and times based on player availability 2 weeks in advance or so. Real sports leagues set dates well in advance because they're played & broadcasted live in front of an audience. NASL doesn't and thus has the ability to more flexibly schedule. Pros aren't going to turn down live tournaments with decent prize pools in the future to accommodate a 3 month long league with an uncertain future. Additionally, some of the best players in the world chose not to join NASL in its initial season (HuK, Jinro, NesTea, & Mvp just to name a few). The league is only going to get the best players by making participation as pain-free as possible. Also, for a much easier suggestion to implement: NASL should take a cue from the UFC and make the most anticipated match of each night the final one that's broadcasted. On some nights (like tonight) that might be difficult to determine (I'd say probably DDE-Nada), but it will get easier as the weeks go on and you have clear division leaders in the standings.
They DID schedule around Dreamhack. There WAS time and means for WhiteRA to play, as evidenced by SjoW being able to play despite attending the event. They waited four hours. He just didn't respond to them! Just saying he didn't have to choose between the two at all.
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In real sports (oh hell yes i am going there!) if a team or individual does not show up, their opponnent is awarded the win.
There is not much else to discuss here, i wanted to see this match badly but it did not happen.
I know NASL has made some..questionable decisions (who hasent?) but i think people are trying a bit too hard to make everything they do "bad". Basically nothing they have done is okay, everything is under a microscope and i am getting this vibe that people want NASL to fail, not because they dont support esports or SC2, but because they might want Geoff Robinson personally to fail.
No i am not trying to derail the thread, NASL made the right decision, not much else to add.
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Wow, this thread needs to be locked asap. The constant trolling of either "NASL's fault" or "WhiteRA's fault, he was partying!!!@#!@" is stupid, contrived and meaningless. NASL went out of their way to extend the time and after that extension the match was called. This is due process and it is what needs to happen in the event of a conflict. I love WhiteRA, I love the NASL, the communication didn't happen so it was called, end of story.
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On April 15 2011 06:50 JinDesu wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2011 06:43 BigJoe wrote:On April 15 2011 06:22 Daozzt wrote:On April 15 2011 05:47 BigJoe wrote:On April 15 2011 03:20 Sein wrote:On April 15 2011 02:22 BigJoe wrote:On April 15 2011 01:02 stk01001 wrote:On April 15 2011 00:46 BigJoe wrote:On April 15 2011 00:34 Ocedic wrote:On April 14 2011 23:36 BigJoe wrote:
[quote]
I agree it was a pretty poor choice of NASL to give the choice to July, but if he was really willing to wait that long why not just reschedule? The matches are not even aired live, they are rebroadcast... so it would be easy to play the match and then air it on a different date. White-Ra should have been more responsible and prepared for this but sometimes people find themselves in a situation where it is not possible to reply. July got an easy win from a hard opponent, guess he doesnt care to win a tournament and not earn it. He did earn it by showing up. The fact that you are blaming the player who showed up is rather ludicrous. Yeah let me play a 1v4 against MC, MKP, MVP, and JULY then them not show up. automatic win. i should then get sponsored and have my own progaming team because im so gosu. You dont earn wins just by showing up... I didnt blame anybody, it was poor decision making by everyone and July took an easy out. I can rage about it. wow.. I guess people like you are the reason there's a 33 page long about this... lol.. it was single unfortunate incident and the way it was handled was totally reasonable. Shit happens, it's unfortunate, end of story. White_Ra I'm sure is perfectly fine with the decision... to actually "rage" at July as if he did something wrong is completely ridiculous.. I mean I can't even wrap my head around how someone would actually be pissed at July for this... makes no logical sense whatsoever.. poor decision making by everyone? WTF are you talking about? so what exactly would you have done in their place? please enlighten us as to what the proper course of action would have been since your such a genius... First of all I never thought of myself as a genius, but thanks I guess I kinda am? Please read previous posts before trolling. Poor Decision from NASL for not following their rules they initially set in placed, giving July the choice after 4 hours and for not figuring out what to do ahead of time in case this sort of thing happened. Poor decision by July because he didnt take the win after 45 minutes, so he has no reason to complain about staying up till 8am. Poor decision making by White-Ra? Maybe not so much since nobody really heard from him. Nobody knows if he didnt get his messages or just got caught up in his tournament. If I was in July's place I would have played one way or the other, that's just me. I'm sorry if I like to deserve wins. So, White-Ra is the only good guy here for not showing up and because nobody really heard from him since then, he's innocent. He's a poor victim of the incompetent NASL and cowardly July who cheated White-Ra by showing up on time and waiting according to NASL's wishes... Dude you got it exactly... How can anybody come to that conclusion? I have been saying this entire time that NASL changed their rules to give the win to July after 45m by waiting 4 hours instead. July should not have had to wait and its really sad that he did because he shouldn't have had to. Knowing in advance there would have been a conflict with White-Ra being in dreamhack should have triggered some kind of preparation but what resulted was a giant waste of time. If NASL is already bending the rules by giving the choice to July, then they should also be able to bend the rules for White-Ra to reschedule. They never heard from him and cant confirm if there was some kind of emergency or if White-Ra accepts the forfeit. White-Ra is not innocent but that doesnt mean I would call him guilty. All I wanted to say is that July took an easy win and didnt deserve it. Ok, if July doesn't deserve to win, then tell me why Whitera deserves a reschedule. After all, he went partying while NASL and July were sitting there clueless wondering where the fuck he was the entire night. Source please? ![[image loading]](http://s.sk-gaming.com/image/album/361683/4a6e01dd5aa40efc.jpg)
Lol i cracked up xD
Source plz? Then BAM
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On April 15 2011 09:02 Tyree wrote:
In real sports (oh hell yes i am going there!) if a team or individual does not show up, their opponnent is awarded the win.
There is not much else to discuss here, i wanted to see this match badly but it did not happen.
I know NASL has made some..questionable decisions (who hasent?) but i think people are trying a bit too hard to make everything they do "bad". Basically nothing they have done is okay, everything is under a microscope and i am getting this vibe that people want NASL to fail, not because they dont support esports or SC2, but because they might want Geoff Robinson personally to fail.
No i am not trying to derail the thread, NASL made the right decision, not much else to add.
They've done everything wrong except having Diggity, apparently.
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Shows the guys at NASL really are reasonable people and change/fix things when problems occur. Great call.
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It's a shame, but understandable.
I can't imagine getting up at 4am to play sc2...man's got stamina.
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Lame, but its understandable for NASL to do this.
Just go undefeated in the rest of it White Ra.
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I think it's amazing that things got handled as smoothly as they did given how new an organization the NASL is. The kind of process maturity it takes to handle these situations well usually takes years of work and refinement.
To that end, I wanted to ask a question and checked the thread to see if it had already been posed. IWhilst people have brought up the valid point that they really shouldn't have put the decision to July to either take the win or reschedule, I have a specific point to raise regarding that situation:
Taken from the NASL statement, my emphasis added:
...We discussed postponing it, but that is something we really can’t do with such an aggressive broadcast schedule...
...After two emails and a phone call to White-Ra, I heard no response.
After four hours of waiting, we gave July the choice to take a free win or reschedule...
Given that postponing/rescheduling was something that really couldn't be done, why did NASL give the option of a reschedule to July? I'm not asking from the perspective that it puts pressure on July as a player; that has been discussed and I think it's generally accepted that the league should take responsibility for such decisions.
But if a reschedule was never an option, why was it presented to July as one? What happens if July had have said "Yes, I'd like to reschedule the game"?
Ultimately, this is something NASL will need to figure out on their own. They have their rules regarding no-shows, and it was dangerous to abandon those rules because those rules should have been planned out to provide reasonable and fair opportunities to the players. If someone made the call to give July the option of a reschedule when it would destabilize the season schedule, that's a really huge blunder and they should be thanking their lucky stars July took the win.
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On April 14 2011 05:14 On_Slaught wrote:
I thought all these big tournies were going to go out of their way to not step on eachothers toes?
I could be wrong, but I've always been under the impression that DH has always been outside the general SC2 community... kind of its own entity.
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On April 15 2011 00:46 BigJoe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2011 00:34 Ocedic wrote:On April 14 2011 23:36 BigJoe wrote:On April 14 2011 22:50 Ocedic wrote:On April 14 2011 21:07 BigJoe wrote:
rofl July scared to play White-Ra Yeah that's why July waited 4 hours even though he could've taken the win at 45 minutes. Scared silly. Why is everyone ostracizing someone for the sake of it? Here's a breakdown: July: He was ready for his match, waited for 4 hours when he technically only had to wait 45 minutes. It was a poor choice to give the decision to July, because it makes him look like the bad guy when he is probably the least responsible party here. NASL: They tried to contact White Ra and couldn't. For those saying they should've rescheduled, shut the fuck up. This is a league on a tight schedule with many participants. It's not their job to schedule around 50 people. It is not their fault their participants sign up for conflicting or narrowly conflicting tournaments. The only thing NASL did wrong was putting the burden of choice on JulyZerg instead of just putting their foot down and giving White Ra and automatic forfeit. That was a cop out, but otherwise they did nothing wrong. White Ra: People are judging White Ra way too harshly. Hypothetical worst case scenario: He knew about his match, had ample opportunity to play it, and just blew it off to party. So what? He just got out of a harrowing series with MC. He wants to relax and enjoy his time in Sweden. The only semi dick move is not responding to Xeris' communications, as it left everyone in the dark and made July had to wait. But it's certainly not worth making a huge deal over. It's like you people just want to create mountains out of anthills and make drama out of nowhere. Shit happens, get over it. I agree it was a pretty poor choice of NASL to give the choice to July, but if he was really willing to wait that long why not just reschedule? The matches are not even aired live, they are rebroadcast... so it would be easy to play the match and then air it on a different date. White-Ra should have been more responsible and prepared for this but sometimes people find themselves in a situation where it is not possible to reply. July got an easy win from a hard opponent, guess he doesnt care to win a tournament and not earn it. He did earn it by showing up. The fact that you are blaming the player who showed up is rather ludicrous. Yeah let me play a 1v4 against MC, MKP, MVP, and JULY then them not show up. automatic win. i should then get sponsored and have my own progaming team because im so gosu. You dont earn wins just by showing up... I didnt blame anybody, it was poor decision making by everyone and July took an easy out. I can rage about it.
You can rage about anything you want. Doesn't make you right in the slightest.
Also, White Ra is an adult. He doesn't need Internet white knights like you trying to make up excuses for everything he does. If anything, you're actually embarrassing him and I'm almost certain White Ra would prefer if people like you didn't call yourselves 'White Ra Fans.'
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On April 15 2011 06:13 Zinthar wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2011 05:18 To3-Knee wrote:
Not really fair to July for waking up at 4am to wait for the tourny. Yes, you can shuffle things around, but at the end of the day, it's a tournament and has a set schedule. As much as I want to see July Vs White-Ra and I'd be routing for White-Ra, it doesn't change the fact that July deserves the by on this one. Actually, it's not a tournament (tournaments don't last for over 3 months).
I don't think you know what "tournament" means. How long it takes is not part of the definition.
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No organization at MLG, people complain.
NASL stays organized and keeps to their schedule, people complain.
Seriously people, stop QQing.
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Oh well. It would have been an amazing series to watch, but there's nothing you can do.
At least they informed us. So thanks to them. <3 <3
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"After two emails and a phone call to White-Ra, I heard no response."
Wow that's a lot of effort looking for someone important(sarcastic of cause : P )
sorry, i just read the topic and reply, havent read the whole threat yet.
Has Whitera said anything respond to this, i am pretty sure there must be some misunderstanding.
Why would not he play ? no reason not playing imo.
Also he's there, just check his flight, check the airport, call other player "have you seen white ra"
Rule is Rule, i do not go against it, white ra did not show up, forfeit.
But did you really put that much effort finding him ?
2 mails 1 call and just chill, waiting for something to happen.
nah next time, just put more effort.
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They don't have to put effort to find him, he has to put effort to be in time.
Fixed schedule, minimum 2 weeks in advance for any need of reschedule. Match time, doesn't show -> wait X stipulated time, doesn't show yet? Free win.
It's not that difficult, really.
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On April 15 2011 20:22 samaNo4 wrote:
They don't have to put effort to find him, he has to put effort to be in time.
Fixed schedule, minimum 2 weeks in advance for any need of reschedule. Match time, doesn't show -> wait X stipulated time, doesn't show yet? Free win.
It's not that difficult, really.
They could have easily rescheduled the game in advance when White Ra notified them about the possible overlap if he reaches the finals. NASL left it up to chance.
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On April 15 2011 20:11 Jate wrote:
"After two emails and a phone call to White-Ra, I heard no response."
Wow that's a lot of effort looking for someone important(sarcastic of cause : P )
sorry, i just read the topic and reply, havent read the whole threat yet.
Has Whitera said anything respond to this, i am pretty sure there must be some misunderstanding.
Why would not he play ? no reason not playing imo.
Also he's there, just check his flight, check the airport, call other player "have you seen white ra"
Rule is Rule, i do not go against it, white ra did not show up, forfeit.
But did you really put that much effort finding him ?
2 mails 1 call and just chill, waiting for something to happen.
nah next time, just put more effort.
That's way more effort than a player deserves as he is perfectly aware when the match is supposed to be played. And Whitera did reply to their earlier emails.
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On April 15 2011 12:43 Ocedic wrote:Show nested quote +On April 15 2011 00:46 BigJoe wrote:On April 15 2011 00:34 Ocedic wrote:On April 14 2011 23:36 BigJoe wrote:On April 14 2011 22:50 Ocedic wrote:On April 14 2011 21:07 BigJoe wrote:
rofl July scared to play White-Ra Yeah that's why July waited 4 hours even though he could've taken the win at 45 minutes. Scared silly. Why is everyone ostracizing someone for the sake of it? Here's a breakdown: July: He was ready for his match, waited for 4 hours when he technically only had to wait 45 minutes. It was a poor choice to give the decision to July, because it makes him look like the bad guy when he is probably the least responsible party here. NASL: They tried to contact White Ra and couldn't. For those saying they should've rescheduled, shut the fuck up. This is a league on a tight schedule with many participants. It's not their job to schedule around 50 people. It is not their fault their participants sign up for conflicting or narrowly conflicting tournaments. The only thing NASL did wrong was putting the burden of choice on JulyZerg instead of just putting their foot down and giving White Ra and automatic forfeit. That was a cop out, but otherwise they did nothing wrong. White Ra: People are judging White Ra way too harshly. Hypothetical worst case scenario: He knew about his match, had ample opportunity to play it, and just blew it off to party. So what? He just got out of a harrowing series with MC. He wants to relax and enjoy his time in Sweden. The only semi dick move is not responding to Xeris' communications, as it left everyone in the dark and made July had to wait. But it's certainly not worth making a huge deal over. It's like you people just want to create mountains out of anthills and make drama out of nowhere. Shit happens, get over it. I agree it was a pretty poor choice of NASL to give the choice to July, but if he was really willing to wait that long why not just reschedule? The matches are not even aired live, they are rebroadcast... so it would be easy to play the match and then air it on a different date. White-Ra should have been more responsible and prepared for this but sometimes people find themselves in a situation where it is not possible to reply. July got an easy win from a hard opponent, guess he doesnt care to win a tournament and not earn it. He did earn it by showing up. The fact that you are blaming the player who showed up is rather ludicrous. Yeah let me play a 1v4 against MC, MKP, MVP, and JULY then them not show up. automatic win. i should then get sponsored and have my own progaming team because im so gosu. You dont earn wins just by showing up... I didnt blame anybody, it was poor decision making by everyone and July took an easy out. I can rage about it. You can rage about anything you want. Doesn't make you right in the slightest. Also, White Ra is an adult. He doesn't need Internet white knights like you trying to make up excuses for everything he does. If anything, you're actually embarrassing him and I'm almost certain White Ra would prefer if people like you didn't call yourselves 'White Ra Fans.'
I'm not a White-Ra fan lol
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EPT
