Grandmaster League Info Thread - Page 32

On April 19 2011 00:19 bLah. wrote:


Erm, not sure how you intend to "merge" those leagues when transfering people from master into grandmaster is the same as with diamond -> master.
People who get into grandmaster get some amount of points. If you take a look at sc2ranks you can see that some people had their points reduced from 1100 to 320, while some other people had their points increased from 60 to 220 etc. basically everyone got about 330 points depending on their bonus pool I guess.

On April 18 2011 23:46 Mendelfist wrote:

My understanding differs from yours. To be eligible for GM you must have less than 90 remaining bonus pool. To drop out you must have more than 180 remaining bonus pool. The difference is 90 points, ie exactly one week. This means that someone who barely got in GM with 90 bonus at the start would drop out one week later if he doesn't play at all.

However, we don't know if the 180 point limit applies to reserved spots. If it does, you will lose it after a week. If it doesn't, you will lose it immediately when your remaining bonus goes over 90.

The only reason I can see for the two empty spots is that those who have them reserved haven't won any games yet. Otherwise pieces of the puzzle are missing or my understanding is wrong.

On April 18 2011 13:31 ChrysaliS_ wrote:
Excalibur, any idea why some people who seemingly SHOULD be in GM got snubbed? Such as vileHashe who was something like top 40 by points on the 12th and laddered some that day?

On April 19 2011 01:17 Max_Muller wrote:


Good point and actually i was thinking the same, i got in GM with 255 and i had 850 in master league while a friend of mine got in GM with 250 with 1000+ in master league. And honestly to me it just looks like this SDream is just bitching on the system because he didn't got in...

I mean he shows the record of one player and cries that the system is broken, but if you take a look at the current GM top 50 (im talking about EU btw) it represents the top players of EU as we have seen in the past couple of months in the weekly top 200 with the exception of a few which can be found lower in GM simply because they just have not been active lately. The only player i really miss is TheMusliM but i think he just have not been playing in the qualifier period.

If i look at the rest of the GM league, almost all player names are familiar to me because they have been in and out the top 200. There are maybe 10 players i don't recognize and sure maybe some of those players don't belong in the GM but that doesn't mean that the entire GM system is broken.

And for those who didn't get in, stop crying about the system and start realizing that either you are just not good enough or you didn't take proper action when needed to get into the GM league. All the information on how to get in was released long before the GM release and if you had the time and dedication to get at the skill level needed for GM i'm sure you could have just played between one or five games before going to work/college to make sure you get promoted.

Besides remember that players like http://eu.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/827507/1/Maryland/ladder/grandmaster will get a hard time spending their bonuspool because if they don't belong in GM they will lose a lot of games and earn less points.

On April 19 2011 01:35 Excalibur_Z wrote:


SDream is just an analyst like me, he's a newbie at this game =) He's not complaining that he didn't get in, there are just some really unexpected results.

On April 19 2011 02:04 Max_Muller wrote:


In that case what i just don't get is why he says things like ''I won't even consider GM league as a league anymore, it's just a random thing that happens to random players for random reasons'' when the majority of the qualified players seem to make sense. Honestly saying this stuff based on a minority ''some really unexpected results'' just makes you look like a bad analyst in my opinion.

On April 19 2011 02:18 Excalibur_Z wrote:


Because in most cases, the expected GM players would correlate to players who have been consistently in the Top 200 weekly blog rankings. When you have players like Jinro who didn't get in, that's surprising. It wouldn't be surprising if we could see and track MMR and MMR history, but we can't do that.

On April 19 2011 02:58 Max_Muller wrote:
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Isn't that just a matter of professionalism instead of a system flaw? Just like any other sport if you don't play the qualifier u won't get qualified! No matter how good you are! As for Jinro i think he was not able to play because he was at a tournament? Either way if you are a professional and you KNOW when you the Grand Master League is open, it's not a matter of ''having time to play'' but ''making time to play'' you leave nothing to chance or assumption. As for not being able to play because you are at a tournament that's unfortunate but thats also a part of professionalism, do i choice to participate at this tournament or do i make sure i get into the Grand Master League?

I don't think the system is broken, where i think Blizzard is wrong is that they should be more transparent about how things work.

As for players like Jinro, i don't think he has to worry because 1. He doesn't need GM to get invited/qualify for (most of the) important events because we all know how awesome he is 2. If he keeps playing ladder and stays on top of the master league i'm sure he will be one of the first players replacing a dropping GM player.

On April 19 2011 02:18 Excalibur_Z wrote:


Because in most cases, the expected GM players would correlate to players who have been consistently in the Top 200 weekly blog rankings. When you have players like Jinro who didn't get in, that's surprising. It wouldn't be surprising if we could see and track MMR and MMR history, but we can't do that.

On April 20 2011 01:17 darmousseh wrote:


Exca, I had a theory which is that at the end of the last season, there were a certain # of players that were active in the top 200. Now lets assume that a sudden burst of newly active players (50) have a higher MMR than like the bottom 50 of the previously active top 200, however, because some players in those previously top 200 had already qualified, then the reserved spots for the top 200 would suddenly change. Jinro said he had a pretty late start right? Imagine if jinro was like #180, but #'s 1-169 and 181-200 already qualified and then 10 previously inactivate players decided to play and were rated higher than jinro (putting him at 190#), however, because some lower tier players made it into grandmaster, there is no more room for players 170-180. This could happen at any level and is probably happening at a mix of different ranks (jinro could be #50 and this can still happen). My guess is their algorithm looks at (currently active players not in grandmasters) + (current players in grandmasters) to determine if the current player should be promoted. The algorithm then says "Ok, there are 2 spots left in grandmasters, is the player i'm looking at in the top 2 of active players not in grandmasters?" rather than "Is the current player in the top 200 of all active players" It does NOT factor in MMR other than to rank active non-grandmasters players. If other players had a head start and a whole bunch of inactives suddenly became active, then there are probably several players who got shafted out of a spot.

On April 20 2011 04:55 Playguuu wrote:
It's kind of bad design though. As long as you play you can never get kicked out of gm? Yeah you'll lose a bunch, but eventually your mmr drops off to where you get matched vs masters people and can spend the bonus pool. So even if you are bottom of gm you're still feeding points to people higher than you. I think soon we'll see a very large drop off in skill between very top of GM and bottom of GM, despite it being such a small division.

I don't think I would have minded them doing a complete ladder reset or at least been more transparent about MMR. When I think best of the best, combatex doesn't come to mind

On April 20 2011 04:55 Playguuu wrote:
It's kind of bad design though. As long as you play you can never get kicked out of gm? Yeah you'll lose a bunch, but eventually your mmr drops off to where you get matched vs masters people and can spend the bonus pool. So even if you are bottom of gm you're still feeding points to people higher than you. I think soon we'll see a very large drop off in skill between very top of GM and bottom of GM, despite it being such a small division.

I don't think I would have minded them doing a complete ladder reset or at least been more transparent about MMR. When I think best of the best, combatex doesn't come to mind

On April 20 2011 04:41 Excalibur_Z wrote:


That is possible. I guess it would depend on how exactly it reserves players.

On April 20 2011 05:43 ChrysaliS_ wrote:


Another thing to consider-- suppose one of the Grandmasters lets his bonus pool go over 180. Is the system going to wait until the highest-MMR non-Grandmaster with less than 180 bonus plays a game to promote him, or will it be the first to play who's above a certain threshhold? Overall seems like a stupid system to me, they should just have it be a regular league but increase the buffers for promotion/demotion.

On April 20 2011 06:55 neo_sporin wrote:
So here's a question that I haven't seen though I've read about 2/3 of this thread. We know players will be removed when their bonus pool hits 180, however do we know if they have to play a game? Every other league the players must play a game to get moved up/down. Will GM change their division when they aren't even on? or only if they play a league match of any kind? This is what I personally will be watching for. As of last night the highest bonus pool I found was about 135 on the NA GM.

Note:I'm interested as i like to see how these systems work, not so much that I think i'll ever get in. wooo for low masters.