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On March 17 2011 09:10 Gentso wrote:This thread reminded me of this discussion that Carefoot once had with Chea, the GSL organizer and commentator. http://www.justin.tv/nickcarefoot/b/278796498Chea says that the only reason foreigners don't do well is because there are no team houses, and that laddering simply isn't enough to be the best in the world. He's so inviting of foreigners, and admits to knowing a great deal about the foreign scene. Obviously, they want foreigners to succeed! They made a team house for foreigners for crying out loud. How disrespectful would it be to deny Korean participation simply because foreigners refuse to train seriously (team houses)? This is an e-sport, is it not? It's time for teams to get down to business and make some houses, play the Koreans, and have this thing take off. Koreans into the NASL is an amazing opportunity to either motivate foreigners to make team houses, or force them by getting whooped.Denying Koreans would be detrimental to the foreign SC2 scene and e-sports in general, because doing so would result in tournaments filled with basement dwelling ladder players instead of serious e-sport teams. I think the app. videos are good evidence of this.
The bolded paragraph is so full of truth. Also in a sense that team houses don't have to be houses you live in, but practice houses you can commute to from your home, if you value your privacy and comfort greatly and/or have a family. So you would have to move to another city or country perhaps ? Thats not too unreasonable in a lot other occupations either, everyone has to make some sort of sacrifices for their job. The new "ROOT house" is a great example of this and I hope they will flourish.
After watching most of the interviews from foreigner players after SC2 release, the general theme is they are really talented, but don't play enough of have good enough practice partners. Great players like Tarson, WhiteRa, Ret, qxc have said they have had lack of practice for a short period of time. Also Fruitdealer said he had focused more on having fun after GSL1 victory and that may or may not have affected his performance lately.
I think NASL is a really great opportunity to motivate the foreigner scene enough to step up their practice venue/routine and help raise the level of skill. Also NASL team will most likely settle for a compromise of 5-15 koreans just to spice things up, raise the level of competition and keep all the spectators happy.
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On March 17 2011 09:23 Angra wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 09:18 Gentso wrote:On March 17 2011 09:16 Redox wrote:On March 17 2011 09:10 Techno wrote:
Invite the best.
It's our only chance to ever beat them. Lol in that case it would be 45 koreans and 5 foreigners. Yeah I am pretty sure the 5 have a very high chance of beating them then. Losing to Koreans is healthy because it would force Foreigners to get on their level. Afterwards, it wouldn't be lopsided. There's no point in having these huge tournaments restricted only to foreigners because e-sports won't progress without motivation/]forceful circumstances. Getting destroyed by Koreans in a tournament isn't going to magically make players improve. The only way that is going to happen is in a very specific practice environment such as the one that Korean player houses have, and that method and intensity of training is next to impossible to achieve outside of Korea because of many factors. Also, I agree with Daigomi's points.
Getting destroyed would only force foreigners to overcome that, would it not? 'Very specific practice environments' aren't going to happen if home ladder players can win 100k against other home ladder players.
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I have to steal this quote from the other thread because I love this attitude coming from a player:
On March 16 2011 05:36 meRz wrote:This all really boils down to that the anti-koreans are shitting in their pants thinking about koreans coming in because they feel they are simply too good and cannot beat them. Why this attitude? Let them come! I'd love to play vs the top koreans, I don't care if they're in it to "steal my money", I really don't want the whole BW-attitude back again where it's the "newbie foreigners" doing their own thing while korea is the real deal and lightyears ahead of everyone else. We have all the means necessary (NASL!! Big teams, sponsors, players devoting all their time to this game) what says we cannot compete with the koreans? I feel like people have already "given up" on competing against the koreans, and it makes me really sad  .
Suddenly I'm rooting for Merz to get a spot.
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On March 17 2011 08:28 MYM.ClouD wrote:
I give up at trying to explain hard work alone isn't going to take western players on par with koreans unless they go live and practice there. I wouldn't mind having a second GSL but remember, it would become a korean event and not a western event anymore. There's just too much difference, they don't speak english, don't interact with any foreign top player, have a structure that makes it possible for them to have the absolute best possible practice you can get without having the need to look outside their own country and speak with other players that are not koreans. Korean and western esports in Starcraft have always been divided and if you take them in the same place one succumbs to the other, they don't mix.
I entirely understand your point, but why does it have to be like this? Look at Jinro and Huk (and TL) for example. Two foreign players in a best of 32 in the world by these standards. Yes, you can argue that they have the "Korean environment", and yet, it was them (and all the ppl with them foreign or not) who made it happen. Why can't ppl outside Korea build a same kind of structure for training etc..?
I know it's hard and takes a lot of time, but saying "it's not possible" eventually makes it not possible..
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On March 17 2011 09:24 dookudooku wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 09:11 MYM.ClouD wrote:On March 17 2011 09:07 baoluvboa wrote:On March 17 2011 09:05 MYM.ClouD wrote:On March 17 2011 08:57 dookudooku wrote:
MYM.Cloud,
You say that it's imposible to get the same quality of play on the European servers. But have you considered the GomTV house then?
It sounds like what you're really saying is:
1) I don't want to relocate to Korea to improve my game, to get it to the same level as the top Koreans.
2) I want to exclude top Koreans from NASL because there's no way I can compete with them unless I relocate to Korea.
Serious question:
If the community contributed enough money for you to buy a round-trip ticket to Korea and live in the GomTV house, would you do it?
If yes, then I have mad respect for you. If no, then complaining about Koreans is just makes you look like someone who doesn't want to work hard for achievements. It seems like you hope that NASL is a quick and easy way to get money, and doesn't require competing against top Koreans, unlike GSL. Moving to SK makes no sense for two reasons: 1) there's only GSL there, while western esports have so much more ways to prove yourself and make money out of it 2) North Korea These are the main reasons you don't see a lot of progamers or teams moving to SK. Would be a great practice experience but moving to a different country only to compete in GSL is ridicolous. If you fail to qualify (which is totally possible even if you are the best player in the world) there won't be a concrete meaning to be there. Look at Ret for example who had to move back to Europe or look at some players in code A who are much worse than some who are not even qualified. It just doesn't make much sense. Such is the risk of being in a competitive yet minor clique of business. You just admitted yourself, there is a way to improve and play with the best of the best but it comes with a high risk. Why punish these Korean players who are undertaking that risks to get better and be competitive when you aren't willing to? They are not moving to a different country with the impossibility to speak with anyone cause no one knows english. It's totally different. Not a great argument. You'll still be playing SC2, a game that transcends language barriers. You think all the players living in Europe's best soccer leagues don't have language barriers also?
Plus there are how many foreigners in Korea playing now. Huk and Jinro don't seem to be having a problem. Everything Cloud has been saying just seems like he doesn't want to put in the work to do it.
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I don't think the koreans are necessarily unbeatable. There's a handful of foreigners that could still do very well in the tournament if not win it.
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On March 17 2011 09:28 Darksteel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 09:10 Gentso wrote:This thread reminded me of this discussion that Carefoot once had with Chea, the GSL organizer and commentator. http://www.justin.tv/nickcarefoot/b/278796498Chea says that the only reason foreigners don't do well is because there are no team houses, and that laddering simply isn't enough to be the best in the world. He's so inviting of foreigners, and admits to knowing a great deal about the foreign scene. Obviously, they want foreigners to succeed! They made a team house for foreigners for crying out loud. How disrespectful would it be to deny Korean participation simply because foreigners refuse to train seriously (team houses)? This is an e-sport, is it not? It's time for teams to get down to business and make some houses, play the Koreans, and have this thing take off. Koreans into the NASL is an amazing opportunity to either motivate foreigners to make team houses, or force them by getting whooped.Denying Koreans would be detrimental to the foreign SC2 scene and e-sports in general, because doing so would result in tournaments filled with basement dwelling ladder players instead of serious e-sport teams. I think the app. videos are good evidence of this. The bolded paragraph is so full of truth. Also in a sense that team houses don't have to be houses you live in, but practice houses you can commute to from your home, if you value your privacy and comfort greatly and/or have a family. So you would have to move to another city or country perhaps ? Thats not too unreasonable in a lot other occupations either, everyone has to make some sort of sacrifices for their job. The new "ROOT house" is a great example of this and I hope they will flourish. After watching most of the interviews from foreigner players after SC2 release, the general theme is they are really talented, but don't play enough of have good enough practice partners. Great players like Tarson, WhiteRa, Ret, qxc have said they have had lack of practice for a short period of time. Also Fruitdealer said he had focused more on having fun after GSL1 victory and that may or may not have affected his performance lately. I think NASL is a really great opportunity to motivate the foreigner scene enough to step up their practice venue/routine and help raise the level of skill. Also NASL team will most likely settle for a compromise of 5-15 koreans just to spice things up, raise the level of competition and keep all the spectators happy.
i think that the "house" isn't even necessary but rather teammates / practice partners who are dedicated enough to say "eight hours i am playing with these five people non stop". oGsNada and boxer live on their own rather than team houses and yet remain involved in with their team regiment / practice sessions. I see InControl or Tyler laddering and saying they're "practicing" with the randoms when the koreans consider the ladder to be trash. I watch the EG / Root "organized practices" when they stream and its two guys playing while ten people sit and watch and talk and laugh and stuff. this mentality of "we can compete without playing a lot like sc brood war" is really disheartening.
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On March 17 2011 09:10 Gentso wrote:This thread reminded me of this discussion that Carefoot once had with Chea, the GSL organizer and commentator. http://www.justin.tv/nickcarefoot/b/278796498Chea says that the only reason foreigners don't do well is because there are no team houses, and that laddering simply isn't enough to be the best in the world. He's so inviting of foreigners, and admits to knowing a great deal about the foreign scene. Obviously, they want foreigners to succeed! They made a team house for foreigners for crying out loud. How disrespectful would it be to deny Korean participation simply because foreigners refuse to train seriously (team houses)? This is an e-sport, is it not? It's time for teams to get down to business and make some houses, play the Koreans, and have this thing take off. Koreans into the NASL is an amazing opportunity to either motivate foreigners to make team houses, or force them by getting whooped. Denying Koreans would be detrimental to the foreign SC2 scene and e-sports in general, because doing so would result in tournaments filled with basement dwelling ladder players instead of serious e-sport teams. I think the app. videos are good evidence of this.
Not trying to spit on what GOM is trying to do for foreigners, but it's been a couple months and the foreigner house never did get computers for them to actually practice on.
I agree that foreigners need team houses and regular training to become successful like pro players in Korea, but this wasn't actually the best example.
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always need a good amount of koreans. im not saying it should be the majority. HUk , jinro, idra, tlo prove that they can compete with the koreans. I dont get why some people dont want them and being so scared of them. i want to see how the top NA/EU players stack up against them.
it would be very entertaining to have MC and JULy( they applyed!!! everybody vote for them!!!!) the finalist of the gsl match up against these top NA/EU players.
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On March 17 2011 09:34 Vehemus wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 09:10 Gentso wrote:This thread reminded me of this discussion that Carefoot once had with Chea, the GSL organizer and commentator. http://www.justin.tv/nickcarefoot/b/278796498Chea says that the only reason foreigners don't do well is because there are no team houses, and that laddering simply isn't enough to be the best in the world. He's so inviting of foreigners, and admits to knowing a great deal about the foreign scene. Obviously, they want foreigners to succeed! They made a team house for foreigners for crying out loud. How disrespectful would it be to deny Korean participation simply because foreigners refuse to train seriously (team houses)? This is an e-sport, is it not? It's time for teams to get down to business and make some houses, play the Koreans, and have this thing take off. Koreans into the NASL is an amazing opportunity to either motivate foreigners to make team houses, or force them by getting whooped. Denying Koreans would be detrimental to the foreign SC2 scene and e-sports in general, because doing so would result in tournaments filled with basement dwelling ladder players instead of serious e-sport teams. I think the app. videos are good evidence of this. Not trying to spit on what GOM is trying to do for foreigners, but it's been a couple months and the foreigner house never did get computers for them to actually practice on. I agree that foreigners need team houses and regular training to become successful like pro players in Korea, but this wasn't actually the best example.
Oh I agree having a place to live in foreign country that has a desk and internet isn't enough. Gom should make sure I have an Alienware to play on, someone to give me a pedicure and another to go fetch tea for me while I'm laddering/practicing.
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More koreans the better. If NA/euro/wherever players cant beat them they don't deserve it
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On March 17 2011 09:28 Darksteel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 09:10 Gentso wrote:This thread reminded me of this discussion that Carefoot once had with Chea, the GSL organizer and commentator. http://www.justin.tv/nickcarefoot/b/278796498Chea says that the only reason foreigners don't do well is because there are no team houses, and that laddering simply isn't enough to be the best in the world. He's so inviting of foreigners, and admits to knowing a great deal about the foreign scene. Obviously, they want foreigners to succeed! They made a team house for foreigners for crying out loud. How disrespectful would it be to deny Korean participation simply because foreigners refuse to train seriously (team houses)? This is an e-sport, is it not? It's time for teams to get down to business and make some houses, play the Koreans, and have this thing take off. Koreans into the NASL is an amazing opportunity to either motivate foreigners to make team houses, or force them by getting whooped.Denying Koreans would be detrimental to the foreign SC2 scene and e-sports in general, because doing so would result in tournaments filled with basement dwelling ladder players instead of serious e-sport teams. I think the app. videos are good evidence of this. The bolded paragraph is so full of truth. Also in a sense that team houses don't have to be houses you live in, but practice houses you can commute to from your home, if you value your privacy and comfort greatly and/or have a family. So you would have to move to another city or country perhaps ? Thats not too unreasonable in a lot other occupations either, everyone has to make some sort of sacrifices for their job. The new "ROOT house" is a great example of this and I hope they will flourish. After watching most of the interviews from foreigner players after SC2 release, the general theme is they are really talented, but don't play enough of have good enough practice partners. Great players like Tarson, WhiteRa, Ret, qxc have said they have had lack of practice for a short period of time. Also Fruitdealer said he had focused more on having fun after GSL1 victory and that may or may not have affected his performance lately. I think NASL is a really great opportunity to motivate the foreigner scene enough to step up their practice venue/routine and help raise the level of skill. Also NASL team will most likely settle for a compromise of 5-15 koreans just to spice things up, raise the level of competition and keep all the spectators happy.
The problem is, in many countries outside of Korea, it's insanely difficult to just one day decide to have a practice house and dedicate your entire life to it. A huge amount of foreigners have jobs, school, and other commitments besides SC2. And a huge portion of those players with jobs and other commitments HAVE those commitments because it's the only thing allowing them to afford their living expenses to be able to play SC2 in the first place.
If someone wants to dump a bunch of money into a practice house where they pay for other players' living expenses, food, salary and whatnot, that would be really amazing. But the unfortunate truth is that it takes a lot of money to do that, and there's next to nothing that individual players can do about it, short of moving to Korea and joining one of their already established houses.
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I'm glad for the result of this poll, I think it should be about how good somebody is, not about where they're from. I want to see tournaments with the best players and I think the NASL should do like TSL and just invite the best.
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On March 17 2011 09:45 Angra wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 09:28 Darksteel wrote:On March 17 2011 09:10 Gentso wrote:This thread reminded me of this discussion that Carefoot once had with Chea, the GSL organizer and commentator. http://www.justin.tv/nickcarefoot/b/278796498Chea says that the only reason foreigners don't do well is because there are no team houses, and that laddering simply isn't enough to be the best in the world. He's so inviting of foreigners, and admits to knowing a great deal about the foreign scene. Obviously, they want foreigners to succeed! They made a team house for foreigners for crying out loud. How disrespectful would it be to deny Korean participation simply because foreigners refuse to train seriously (team houses)? This is an e-sport, is it not? It's time for teams to get down to business and make some houses, play the Koreans, and have this thing take off. Koreans into the NASL is an amazing opportunity to either motivate foreigners to make team houses, or force them by getting whooped.Denying Koreans would be detrimental to the foreign SC2 scene and e-sports in general, because doing so would result in tournaments filled with basement dwelling ladder players instead of serious e-sport teams. I think the app. videos are good evidence of this. The bolded paragraph is so full of truth. Also in a sense that team houses don't have to be houses you live in, but practice houses you can commute to from your home, if you value your privacy and comfort greatly and/or have a family. So you would have to move to another city or country perhaps ? Thats not too unreasonable in a lot other occupations either, everyone has to make some sort of sacrifices for their job. The new "ROOT house" is a great example of this and I hope they will flourish. After watching most of the interviews from foreigner players after SC2 release, the general theme is they are really talented, but don't play enough of have good enough practice partners. Great players like Tarson, WhiteRa, Ret, qxc have said they have had lack of practice for a short period of time. Also Fruitdealer said he had focused more on having fun after GSL1 victory and that may or may not have affected his performance lately. I think NASL is a really great opportunity to motivate the foreigner scene enough to step up their practice venue/routine and help raise the level of skill. Also NASL team will most likely settle for a compromise of 5-15 koreans just to spice things up, raise the level of competition and keep all the spectators happy. The problem is, in many countries outside of Korea, it's insanely difficult to just one day decide to have a practice house and dedicate your entire life to it. A huge amount of foreigners have jobs, school, and other commitments besides SC2. And a huge portion of those players with jobs and other commitments HAVE those commitments because it's the only thing allowing them to afford their living expenses to be able to play SC2 in the first place. If someone wants to dump a bunch of money into a practice house where they pay for other players' living expenses, food, and salary, that would be really amazing. But the unfortunate truth is that it takes a lot of money to do that, and there's next to nothing that individual players can do about it, short of moving to Korea and joining one of their already established houses.
root, eg, fnatiic, can do it why cant others?
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On March 17 2011 09:46 blackone wrote:
I'm glad for the result of this poll, I think it should be about how good somebody is, not about where they're from. I want to see tournaments with the best players and I think the NASL should do like TSL and just invite the best.
GSL is available at www.gomtv.net
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On March 17 2011 09:34 Vehemus wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 09:10 Gentso wrote:This thread reminded me of this discussion that Carefoot once had with Chea, the GSL organizer and commentator. http://www.justin.tv/nickcarefoot/b/278796498Chea says that the only reason foreigners don't do well is because there are no team houses, and that laddering simply isn't enough to be the best in the world. He's so inviting of foreigners, and admits to knowing a great deal about the foreign scene. Obviously, they want foreigners to succeed! They made a team house for foreigners for crying out loud. How disrespectful would it be to deny Korean participation simply because foreigners refuse to train seriously (team houses)? This is an e-sport, is it not? It's time for teams to get down to business and make some houses, play the Koreans, and have this thing take off. Koreans into the NASL is an amazing opportunity to either motivate foreigners to make team houses, or force them by getting whooped. Denying Koreans would be detrimental to the foreign SC2 scene and e-sports in general, because doing so would result in tournaments filled with basement dwelling ladder players instead of serious e-sport teams. I think the app. videos are good evidence of this. Not trying to spit on what GOM is trying to do for foreigners, but it's been a couple months and the foreigner house never did get computers for them to actually practice on. I agree that foreigners need team houses and regular training to become successful like pro players in Korea, but this wasn't actually the best example.
If this isn't the best example, tell me a better one (about caring and supporting non-local scene).
If there is no better example, then I guess it is the best example. :-)
On March 17 2011 09:41 willigan wrote:
More koreans the better. If NA/euro/wherever players cant beat them they don't deserve it
Well, that's quite harsh but I do agree with it a little bit.
The koreans are the prime example, yet only few try to mimick it.
I admit, it is a hard and stony road, but... yeah...
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On March 17 2011 09:47 Looky wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 09:45 Angra wrote:On March 17 2011 09:28 Darksteel wrote:On March 17 2011 09:10 Gentso wrote:This thread reminded me of this discussion that Carefoot once had with Chea, the GSL organizer and commentator. http://www.justin.tv/nickcarefoot/b/278796498Chea says that the only reason foreigners don't do well is because there are no team houses, and that laddering simply isn't enough to be the best in the world. He's so inviting of foreigners, and admits to knowing a great deal about the foreign scene. Obviously, they want foreigners to succeed! They made a team house for foreigners for crying out loud. How disrespectful would it be to deny Korean participation simply because foreigners refuse to train seriously (team houses)? This is an e-sport, is it not? It's time for teams to get down to business and make some houses, play the Koreans, and have this thing take off. Koreans into the NASL is an amazing opportunity to either motivate foreigners to make team houses, or force them by getting whooped.Denying Koreans would be detrimental to the foreign SC2 scene and e-sports in general, because doing so would result in tournaments filled with basement dwelling ladder players instead of serious e-sport teams. I think the app. videos are good evidence of this. The bolded paragraph is so full of truth. Also in a sense that team houses don't have to be houses you live in, but practice houses you can commute to from your home, if you value your privacy and comfort greatly and/or have a family. So you would have to move to another city or country perhaps ? Thats not too unreasonable in a lot other occupations either, everyone has to make some sort of sacrifices for their job. The new "ROOT house" is a great example of this and I hope they will flourish. After watching most of the interviews from foreigner players after SC2 release, the general theme is they are really talented, but don't play enough of have good enough practice partners. Great players like Tarson, WhiteRa, Ret, qxc have said they have had lack of practice for a short period of time. Also Fruitdealer said he had focused more on having fun after GSL1 victory and that may or may not have affected his performance lately. I think NASL is a really great opportunity to motivate the foreigner scene enough to step up their practice venue/routine and help raise the level of skill. Also NASL team will most likely settle for a compromise of 5-15 koreans just to spice things up, raise the level of competition and keep all the spectators happy. The problem is, in many countries outside of Korea, it's insanely difficult to just one day decide to have a practice house and dedicate your entire life to it. A huge amount of foreigners have jobs, school, and other commitments besides SC2. And a huge portion of those players with jobs and other commitments HAVE those commitments because it's the only thing allowing them to afford their living expenses to be able to play SC2 in the first place. If someone wants to dump a bunch of money into a practice house where they pay for other players' living expenses, food, and salary, that would be really amazing. But the unfortunate truth is that it takes a lot of money to do that, and there's next to nothing that individual players can do about it, short of moving to Korea and joining one of their already established houses. root, eg, fnatiic, can do it why cant others?
I'm not saying they can't, people or organizations with a lot of money can certainly go right ahead and do it - it would be great. I'm just saying it's a lot more difficult to do, and you can't blame the actual players that they aren't doing anything about it, because they really can't. I don't know if the situation has changed but earlier on I remember a lot of players in the EG house still had jobs to afford to live there, so that right there cuts significantly into practice time and kind of ruins the whole idea to begin with of having a house dedicated to practicing like the Koreans.
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Invite the best players. If e-sports is ever to succeed in the west as it has in Korea, then the west needs to not put itself inferior to Korea. Korea most definitely are superior as of now, but if other countries have the same environment (high prize tournaments, team houses etc) then they'll be able to compete as well. It just might be that koreans will win the first NASL seasons, but that is fine, if it is to become an established league then it needs to make sure it allows for the best players to win, not exclude them.
If NASL an other leagues/tournaments become as prestigious as GSL, and invite/make sure the tournament allows for the best players to participate, I have no doubt that we will see the skill-gap between Koreans and foreigners decrease, and in time cease to exist. TSL and even IEM is taking its part in letting foreigners get a bigger taste of Korean competition, NASL should do the same.
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On March 17 2011 09:50 Angra wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2011 09:47 Looky wrote:On March 17 2011 09:45 Angra wrote:On March 17 2011 09:28 Darksteel wrote:On March 17 2011 09:10 Gentso wrote:This thread reminded me of this discussion that Carefoot once had with Chea, the GSL organizer and commentator. http://www.justin.tv/nickcarefoot/b/278796498Chea says that the only reason foreigners don't do well is because there are no team houses, and that laddering simply isn't enough to be the best in the world. He's so inviting of foreigners, and admits to knowing a great deal about the foreign scene. Obviously, they want foreigners to succeed! They made a team house for foreigners for crying out loud. How disrespectful would it be to deny Korean participation simply because foreigners refuse to train seriously (team houses)? This is an e-sport, is it not? It's time for teams to get down to business and make some houses, play the Koreans, and have this thing take off. Koreans into the NASL is an amazing opportunity to either motivate foreigners to make team houses, or force them by getting whooped.Denying Koreans would be detrimental to the foreign SC2 scene and e-sports in general, because doing so would result in tournaments filled with basement dwelling ladder players instead of serious e-sport teams. I think the app. videos are good evidence of this. The bolded paragraph is so full of truth. Also in a sense that team houses don't have to be houses you live in, but practice houses you can commute to from your home, if you value your privacy and comfort greatly and/or have a family. So you would have to move to another city or country perhaps ? Thats not too unreasonable in a lot other occupations either, everyone has to make some sort of sacrifices for their job. The new "ROOT house" is a great example of this and I hope they will flourish. After watching most of the interviews from foreigner players after SC2 release, the general theme is they are really talented, but don't play enough of have good enough practice partners. Great players like Tarson, WhiteRa, Ret, qxc have said they have had lack of practice for a short period of time. Also Fruitdealer said he had focused more on having fun after GSL1 victory and that may or may not have affected his performance lately. I think NASL is a really great opportunity to motivate the foreigner scene enough to step up their practice venue/routine and help raise the level of skill. Also NASL team will most likely settle for a compromise of 5-15 koreans just to spice things up, raise the level of competition and keep all the spectators happy. The problem is, in many countries outside of Korea, it's insanely difficult to just one day decide to have a practice house and dedicate your entire life to it. A huge amount of foreigners have jobs, school, and other commitments besides SC2. And a huge portion of those players with jobs and other commitments HAVE those commitments because it's the only thing allowing them to afford their living expenses to be able to play SC2 in the first place. If someone wants to dump a bunch of money into a practice house where they pay for other players' living expenses, food, and salary, that would be really amazing. But the unfortunate truth is that it takes a lot of money to do that, and there's next to nothing that individual players can do about it, short of moving to Korea and joining one of their already established houses. root, eg, fnatiic, can do it why cant others? I'm not saying they can't, people or organizations with a lot of money can certainly go right ahead and do it - it would be great. I'm just saying it's a lot more difficult to do, and you can't blame the actual players that they aren't doing anything about it, because they really can't. I don't know if the situation has changed but earlier on I remember a lot of players in the EG house still had jobs to afford to live there, so that right there cuts significantly into practice time and kind of ruins the whole idea to begin with of having a house dedicating to practicing like the Koreans.
you dont think the korean sacrifice alot to do what they do? look at lee nock hes 16 years old going to school still. even some of the progaming houses dont pay the players salary yet these players put their lives on the line for something they believe is gonna be big.
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basically what i'm hearing is. the koreans put forth the time, effort, and risk to make sc2 an e-sport, succeed, and now get to live out the dream that so many of us TL'ers think about. But those westerners who don't want koreans not only don't want to put for the time, but neither the effort, and especially not the risk, and thus want sc2 to be a shadow of the korean scene because they want to win some easy money now so they can do something else later. awesome.
you watch guys like nada, boxer, july, etc and you can see, they want to play sc2, for a living, they love the game, like they loved scbw, sure someday they know they'll have to retire, but that's not in the back of their heads when they're crushing through the tournament brackets, laying it all on the line trying to win, for themselves, for their fans, for the community.
Why do the koreans stomp inferior foreigners? because they love the game more than guys like ClouD or BluR or Pokebunny can even comprehend. Huk, IdrA, and Jinro know what it means to lay it all on the line, and be rewarded for their hard work and dedication. These other players don't want to earn their money, they want an easy road to 100k.
You think the pioneers of esports in korea didn't risk it all? Didn't you guys read any of the Final Edits about guys like BoxeR who did terribly in high school to pursue his dreams? Or of the 2v2 team who lived off of ramen (something the first generation of progamers ALL did) to pursue their dreams, just to have the glint of hope that someday, they'll be rewarded for doing what they love? Nope, in the world of western culture, they want to do as minimal as possible, to win as much as possible. That's fine, take that route, just don't get mad when the guy who works harder than you gets the promotion, drives the nice car, and wins the girl, while you sit and become his subordinate.
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EPT
