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dimfish
United States663 Posts
But... I really enjoyed reading your post! I liked the diplomacy aspects you pointed out, I've never chatted or observed chatter in FFA. Your musings make me want to play it out and try that angle! Also, void rays seem to pop up in >2player games to devastating effect, so good when they power up. I play Zerg 1v1 but maybe I'll FFA as toss | ||
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lololol
5198 Posts
On March 16 2011 03:44 Chill wrote: Really interesting. Thank you for writing this up. I'm always interested in hearing about different aspects of the game that I don't myself experience. I agree that FFA should be ranked. There's no reason (except maybe not being able to get a consistent algorithm?) for it not to be ranked. The most likely reasons are that it's not as popular and it has potential for abuse by teaming. Remember what happened if you were in a top 2v2 team in beta? You would often win 0 points per game, because it can't find suitable opponents to match you with and players got really frustrated with that. | ||
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Bergys
Sweden337 Posts
On March 16 2011 06:15 MuTT wrote: interesting how you say that terran lategame > protoss lategame as i would get laughed at if i said that. 12 ravens is a ton of gas but terran has map control in standard pvt and the trend could turn towards terran getting a death ball instead of protoss. It is not unusual to see a zerg player with 24 mutas lategame tvz and thats the same amount of gas. I don't know why people are under the assumption that terrans late-game is weak. It's weak if you go MMM vs 200 pop colossus stalker deathball but then again you have a whole lot of other units which most terrans seem to neglect. | ||
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Apolo
Portugal1259 Posts
Since i want to make this more competitive, i'll give away some more tips, even though it's basically impossible to win 100% even if you are the best player all the time, because sometimes, you'll get double teamed: 1) Go 1v1 with the one closest and ignore the rest for now. Try to win it as fast as possible, you'll see why. People will usually attack whoever is closest, because they pose the most threat. 2) Having won the first 1v1, and assuming no one else lost yet besides the one you took out, you should immediately scout what the other 2 are doing, if you haven't done so, but winning the 1st 1v1 faster takes precedence over scouting them anyway. Scouting with phoenix hallucinations is good specially on large maps, have the xelnagas with zerglings, and see their army composition and who do you think will win based on what they have. Make an army to counter it. 3) As soon as one of the others leave, just go win the game. Don't engage them before that. Just let your army idle on your base, and try to go under the radar as much as possible, scout as little as possible so they don't think too much about you, yet get all the information you need. Don't attack them. After a battle, the winner of the other two is in no condition to win a 2ª battle with someone that has basically been macro for some time, and that's more true the sooner you won your closest opponent, hence why it's important to win it fast. If you get to 200/200 you might want to make lots more military buildings, keep upgrades going, and if necessary sacrifice some weaker units, to have the strongest 200/200 you can aggainst the one you think will win, or a composition good aggainst both if possible - if you can't predict the outcome. 4) If one of them (far away opponent) loses first, it's not good for you. You can try to kill the winner right away, but that leaves you vulnerable to the closest opponent. One thing you can do is go to your opponent and try to bait him into the winner's base, try to force a confrontation between the two. I've won some times because of that. One time, it was very late game and i had been unlucky. One had mass voids and the other carriers. The carrier one went to me, my blink stalkers + colossus weren't enough so i went in direction to the void ray guy. I had colossus and stalkers because i had just won a zerg, and needed that composition. This is one of those situations, where there's not much you can do. Still, reaching his base i turned south, and his carriers on attack move, attacked some of void ray guy buildings, he came to defend and killed all his carriers. I liked how the carrier guy even said "wp" to me after he lost haha ^^ Well, I then killed the leftover void rays and won the game. Another thing you can do in that situation is playing so defensive, that the closest will be discouraged to attack you, and will try to win the other one first. One problem this has is that the farthest one may also decide to attack you with a overwhelming army, because he has been left alone since he won his closest. Still if they do attack each other as they see you are too well defended with cannons, AA turrets, spines, the farthest one will probably win for the same reason, and that's who you should think of when making your army composition. 5) Taking the gold base is risky, because sometimes even further away opponents will get agressive to stop you from taking that great advantage, and impossible to win later on. It will be less risky if the the further away opponents are still busy with each other. Nonetheless, generally go for non-gold expansions, unless your closest opponent left, and you already have a good advantage over each of the other two. | ||
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Vei
United States2845 Posts
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Vei
United States2845 Posts
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Quasimoto3000
United States471 Posts
As a terran player, i can see why you would think they are imba in FFA, turtling probably comes in very handy | ||
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Maskedsatyr
Singapore1245 Posts
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CanucksJC
Canada1241 Posts
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FadedJester
United States5 Posts
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Xswordy
United Kingdom425 Posts
I guess the reason FFA is not reanked it's so you don't play it with the thought of winning and getting promotion. It's something where you go with the thought of fun , no matter win or lose. | ||
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manicshock
Canada741 Posts
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hitman133
United States1425 Posts
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Felix_mk
85 Posts
It gets kinda boring. | ||
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itsben
435 Posts
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a4bisu
Australia86 Posts
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Ncinerate
172 Posts
On March 16 2011 10:08 a4bisu wrote: Can fungalgrowthed protoss units be recalled by the mothership? Yes. And it's really really nasty. Void rays + recall vs zerg is almost unstoppable late in an FFA, as he can just run from expo to expo slaughtering your things before your army can arrive to save it. Every zerg I've done this to immediately techs fungal growth thinking they are smarter than the average bear. Every one is a little disappointed when the entire fungaled void ray fleet disappears  .The only real option for zerg is to bring the fight to protoss, forcing a direct confrontation. Easier said than done. | ||
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Ironsights
United States196 Posts
Thanks for the motivation | ||
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Subversion
South Africa3627 Posts
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Xapti
Canada2473 Posts
On March 16 2011 03:01 Ncinerate wrote: While you might be have more concrete experience, I think a hell of a lot of people could say this themselves — at least I'd say I could. I hardly played any FFAs in SC2 but understand perfectly how they work from SC1.1: Zerg sucks in FFA. I feel uniquely qualified to say this Ever since beta I quite easily both theoretically found out that zerg are UP in FFAs, as well as in practice. The issue is a joke and partially stems from zergs overall underpoweredness, but also that hardly any units are good at attacking both air and ground, making their armies essentially 50% strength vs all-air or all-ground. On March 16 2011 05:00 infinity2k9 wrote: Zerg are probably disadvantaged in FFAs in SC1, but the difference in SC2 is huge.Zerg was always bad at this kind of thing in BW too, it's just not suited for them. One person mentioned for example, that maxed zerg air armies can't deal with another's maxed air army for instance (like corruptors vs VR or muta vs VR). So not only are their unique ground-only or air-only units a problem because of their effectiveness vs only air or only ground (or other specialization), but their armies are STILL weaker even if the opponents force is 100% air based or such, which makes their overall effectiveness even less than 50%. Zerg in SC1 had good abilities for FFA (or in general) like dark swarm, plague, ensnare, aside from the better units like hydralisk, lurker, ultralisk, and devourer. In SC2 all they have that's decent is fungal growth. ITs can just be run away from or splattered from a far with masses of units (siege tank, colossus, planetary). NP is a problem due to the sheer number of units one would need to control, as well as army you'd need to send along with the infestors to prevent the infestors from dying— of course that's also ignoring the insa-gib feedback or snipe/EMP does to infestors. Banelings are trash for FFA, or even vs non-FFA deathballs (storm, forcefield, hallucination, colossus, siege tank, hellion, seeker missile, auto turrets). Corruptors can't even deal with an equal investment of air units like void rays or viking-raven even though they can't attack ground at all, which is quite a sick joke on blizzard's part. | ||
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