A Shuttle that fires Scarabs… This illusion would describe just how fast Zileas was able to move a Reaver in and out of a Shuttle, firing the massive war machine's payload almost without the Reaver being seen.

Hyperionnn

Turkey4968 Posts

March 15 2011 15:54 GMT

#282

On March 16 2011 00:49 gngfn wrote:

Show nested quote +

http://classic.battle.net/scc/br/final1.shtml

Show nested quote +

22 minute pvp with no expansion and scouts

id love that lol

Ansinjunger

United States2451 Posts

March 15 2011 15:57 GMT

#283

I think vikings and how they basically rule the air vs anything protoss, including warp prisms and except phoenixes (and they are still pretty good against phoenixes, if not in a straight up engagement where colossi are roasting your bio), shut down protoss options just as much as the strength of the colossus deathball is seen as a powerful option in itself.

Add the fact that protoss upgrades all ground units' attacks with one upgrade, and it makes switching to air just a little more clumsy. Carriers could also really use an armor buff. If sentry with Gshield and carrier beats mass marine, who cares?

USApwn

United States81 Posts

March 15 2011 16:04 GMT

#284

until protoss aren't forced going into robo every game, we'll see the colossus being used. I find the unit to still be fun and exciting, because I know once I have it out on the field I feel much safer and allows me to go into other tech paths after the fact of its creation.

If we're talking about a nerf, then we must talk about buffs; gateway units.

My answer to "fixing" brotoss is to make warpgate research go to the twilight council. That way stalkers can get the buff they need and 4 gate wont be an issue for the early game. It also makes the protoss have to decide on 2 different tech paths, instead of gradually always going into one. If we see gate way unit buffs across the board, then and only then can we see a colossus nerf, because simply put, we need colossus to survive and win if the game lasts longer than 8 minutes.

andrewlt

United States7702 Posts

March 15 2011 16:07 GMT

#285

On March 16 2011 00:09 jgelling wrote:
Again, Zerg and Terran players proposing to remove the unit entirely or nerf it significantly without any bright ideas to replace it shouldn't even be posting in this thread. That'd be like removing roaches or MM from the game entirely, i.e. the giant band-aid DPS dealer of the Protoss army.

The colossus is a crutch that can't be removed without the entire SC2 balance imploding. Horribly.

Your second sentence sums up the problem with SC2. MM, roaches and colossus are a-move units but SC2 currently revolves around these units. In BW, barracks play can't function late-game without a science vessel cloud. Against terran and protoss, mech is preferred.

Blizzard shifted the power of terran from the more skill-based and exciting mech units to the a-move barracks units. They removed lurkers in favor of roaches and reavers in favor of colossi.

Blizzard needs to rebalance the game so that each race revolves around units that require positioning, active use of abilities and risk vs reward decision making. Right now, the most crucial units for each race are a-move units with no decision making involved in microing them.

risk.nuke

Sweden2825 Posts

March 15 2011 16:09 GMT

#286

Completely agrees with you guys who prefered reaver > collosi, I remember seeing my first reaver drop on youtube and hearing the korean commentators go crazy <3
Collosi alongs with marauders are imo the most boring units to watch.

behold the birth of the collosi :p
Warpin --> Weak Gateway Units
Weak Gateway Units --> Collosi

Corvi

Germany1406 Posts

March 15 2011 16:21 GMT

#287

reavers would be too strong, just like any aoe/splash is uber strong in sc2. stupid units clump as if they wanna make love.

i very much agree, the protoss death ball is boring, but reavers, at least as they were in sc1, are not the solution.

pezit

Sweden302 Posts

March 15 2011 16:24 GMT

#288

On March 16 2011 01:09 goldfishs wrote:
Completely agrees with you guys who prefered reaver > collosi, I remember seeing my first reaver drop on youtube and hearing the korean commentators go crazy <3
Collosi alongs with marauders are imo the most boring units to watch.

behold the birth of the collosi :p
Warpin --> Weak Gateway Units
Weak Gateway Units --> Collosi

I'd like to add roach to your list of most boring units to watch.

Honeybadger

United States821 Posts

March 15 2011 16:26 GMT

#289

Roaches used to be fascinating with the burrow regen :<

Markwerf

Netherlands3728 Posts

March 15 2011 16:27 GMT

#290

Bleh colossi are indeed not as flashy as reavers but reavers sucked as well because their damage was too random.
Having a scarab bug out in a topmatch sucks as well.

There are still plenty of flashy things left in sc2 many of which sc1 didnt have. For example sentry ff's are flashy, put them 1 tile wrong and they don't work often. Ht are still in the game. Tons of other stuff.

The problem is more that colossi are too good compared to the other strats. The counters to colossi could be a bit stronger and HT could be relatively better, 1.3 unfortunately is only making this worse..

I just can't stand the endless disquised BW was better topics. BW had a crapload of errors in it. Many bugs, way to macro focussed and very little strategic variety. I do agree sc2 misses some of the 'wow' moments but there are still 2 expansions coming.

Prinny-tai

United States71 Posts

March 15 2011 16:32 GMT

#291

On March 16 2011 01:27 Markwerf wrote:

There are still plenty of flashy things left in sc2 many of which sc1 didnt have. For example sentry ff's are flashy, put them 1 tile wrong and they don't work often. Ht are still in the game. Tons of other stuff.

Sentries aren't hype at all imo, FFs are pretty boring and not hard to use. The only time they can be entertaining is when people use weird hallucination pushes.

JiYan

United States3668 Posts

March 15 2011 16:34 GMT

#292

the damage increase and the speed nerf would have to go hand in hand. blizzard specifically made the colossus shoot faster but weaker to weaken kiting by colossus.

infinity2k9

United Kingdom2397 Posts

March 15 2011 16:34 GMT

#293

On March 15 2011 18:57 andrewwiggin wrote:
You know what's super boring to watch? Roaches.

Yeah it's so boring that blizzard should just nerf them to make things interesting.

Do you note my epic levels of sarcasm?
This is just a new way to cry over imbalance, disguised as 'entertainment value'.

If it wasn't entertaining enough to watch, sc2 would be getting smaller in viewership; and not bigger. And FYI colossi were what made me BUY sc2. And they're the first unit my non-sc2 friends go gaga over when we watch matches now and then.

So think about that.

Why do you keep posting bullshit, all 3 of your posts in this thread have been the total worst. YOU are the one bringing balance up. Colossus are boring as shit to watch, they are in most P games and take no skill. Almost everyone agrees.

On March 16 2011 01:27 Markwerf wrote:
I just can't stand the endless disquised BW was better topics. BW had a crapload of errors in it. Many bugs, way to macro focussed and very little strategic variety. I do agree sc2 misses some of the 'wow' moments but there are still 2 expansions coming.

You're a guy who joined in March 2010 claiming BW has little strategic variety. Wtf? If anything it's certainly got more choices than SC2. Just look at the liquipedia. Take a matchup like TvZ for example, the amount of variations is insane in depth. Every unit is viable in some way, almost every ability.

Teejing

Germany1360 Posts

March 15 2011 16:36 GMT

#294

I really hope collosus and maybe roaches get a redesign and become more exiting units.

Prinny-tai

United States71 Posts

March 15 2011 16:37 GMT

#295

The reason I stopped playing P is simply because Colossus are as boring to play as to watch

funk100

United Kingdom172 Posts

March 15 2011 16:38 GMT

#296

yeah, you could have the collosus charging on one unit then BOOM, giving a nice micro incentive for the other player to move that unit so it doesnt splash horribley to his own

Wegandi

United States2455 Posts

March 15 2011 16:39 GMT

#297

If they returned the reaver to the Protoss, they would need to get rid of the Immortal (or get rid of its shield ability). Terran would be at a severe disadvantage when Protoss have the two best hard counters to Terran's units. (Storm, Reavers, and Immortals...., that's just not right)

DarkPlasmaBall

United States45013 Posts

March 15 2011 16:41 GMT

#298

I agree that colossus aren't "hype" units, but keep in mind that players will get units that allow them to win- not just units that please the crowd.

I assume hype units are units like motherships, dark templar, a ghost going off to nuke, etc.

So I agree with the OP completely, but I also think that hype is created from the rarity of the use of a unit, so most units that are key in a unit composition (colossi, marauders, roaches, etc.), will simply not be that exciting to watch in a game. Backbone units don't really serve as thriller/ hype units, and I don't think they ever will.

...Unless perhaps unorthodox play starts to occur? I bet a warp prism drop with colossus that takes out a bunch of workers (like old school reaver harrass that has a golden scarab that takes out ten workers) would cause some hype. However, at this point in time, I don't see that happening very often, and that's more of a strategy-hype, not the very existence of colossus that causes the hype.

andrewlt

United States7702 Posts

March 15 2011 16:41 GMT

#299

On March 16 2011 01:24 pezit wrote:

Show nested quote +

I'd like to add roach to your list of most boring units to watch.

Add the marauder as well. Basically, the most powerful, most important unit of all 3 races in SC2 is also the most boring. Each one of them is a new unit as well.

Arcanne

United States1519 Posts

March 15 2011 16:41 GMT

#300

check ur definition of hype