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On March 02 2011 03:37 PrinceXizor wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2011 03:35 QTIP. wrote:On March 02 2011 03:21 Gaius Baltar wrote:
To be frank, I'm very disappointed with GSL 5 so far. It's not that I don't like upsets, just that so many of these games have been just that--disappointing. For example:
--You get a player like Ret, fresh from a win at Assembly, show some extremely high level play in his round of 32 in Code A but get 2-0'd. Lot's of people think he might leave Korea now.
--The next day you get a player like Tester, who hasn't impressed anybody since beta, cruise through to the round of 16 of Code S in two quick games with uninspiring 1 base play. He'll be sticking around for another two seasons at the very least.
To be fair, he had to play 2 PVP's. It's all one-base play in Korea for that matchup. yeah i mean he played PvP, it's not like he has only one real build ( FE 2 base collosus) in other matchups as well. :/ tester is by far overrated.
Lol ease off the SKS hate, and don't worry - I agree with you. He's a very overrated player these days, but he did make top 8 last GSL (knocked out by the soon-to-be champ) and he's into the round of 16 again. Let's see if he can live up to his reputation.
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I would just like to point out that the title is a spoiler for anyone who is smart enough to look at previous games and assume what will happen with the most recent games.
I have not watched last nights games but I was able to assume what the title meant. I personally do not care as I had a feeling this would happen anyways but I would like to see the title changed to just GSL 5: Spoilers. (The Season of... leaves a blank that is too easily filled with common sense.) so anyone that is like myself is not spoiled.
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The BO1 play between players in a group is retarded.
Now you have the majority of best players in the up and down matches. Please explain to me what they are going to do with 3 previous GSL Champions, a 2x runner up in the up and down matches.
I wonder what the koreans are saying on the "play...?" website.
Maybe Idra should have finished this season =P?
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surprised at the results tbh i think most of the top names like fruitdealer, genius, rainbow are all brand names considering their recent results in comparison to how they did in the early seasons. The skill has evolved and I don't know where I could place any of those guys in the new talent nowadays. Surprising losses were mostly MKP, MVP, and NesTea imo, everyone else was kind of a shoe-in for up and downs eventually
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On March 02 2011 03:40 QTIP. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2011 03:37 PrinceXizor wrote:On March 02 2011 03:35 QTIP. wrote:On March 02 2011 03:21 Gaius Baltar wrote:
To be frank, I'm very disappointed with GSL 5 so far. It's not that I don't like upsets, just that so many of these games have been just that--disappointing. For example:
--You get a player like Ret, fresh from a win at Assembly, show some extremely high level play in his round of 32 in Code A but get 2-0'd. Lot's of people think he might leave Korea now.
--The next day you get a player like Tester, who hasn't impressed anybody since beta, cruise through to the round of 16 of Code S in two quick games with uninspiring 1 base play. He'll be sticking around for another two seasons at the very least.
To be fair, he had to play 2 PVP's. It's all one-base play in Korea for that matchup. yeah i mean he played PvP, it's not like he has only one real build ( FE 2 base collosus) in other matchups as well. :/ tester is by far overrated. Lol ease off the SKS hate, and don't worry - I agree with you. He's a very overrated player these days, but he did make top 8 last GSL (knocked out by the soon-to-be champ) and he's into the round of 16 again. Let's see if he can live up to his reputation.
he's a strong but extremely predictable player, which results in him doing well vs bad players and having no shot vs good players. so he's stuck in this limbo.
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i think the only true upset is mvp's departure. that guy is really really good and is probly the race to be if you dont want to get flaked out by cheese.
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On March 02 2011 03:01 Rabiator wrote:Personally I got surprised - in a negative sense - by most of the disappointingly one-sided "Zerg losses" so far. - Players stick to producing really weak "throw away" Zerglings and Banelings in massive numbers just to run into lines of sieged tanks or a maxed Protoss death ball over and over again.
- People are building ONE Spine Crawler at the top of their ramp and the commentators call that "safe" against harass and dont even bother to correct themselves when there are 4-5 blue flame Hellions simply running past while roasting all the "awesome" Speedlings at that choke. [*1]
Both seem kinda illogical to me. MMM is bound to be less effective - except in the form of drop harrass - on the large GSL maps compared to the smaller Blizzard maps and thus a change of emphasis for Terrans was to be expected. The bio army is only extremely mobile due to STIMPACK and that doesnt work for Marathons or even without Medivacs (i.e. early in the game). In short: Expect either very aggressive drop play or bio-supported mech? Some players really need to learn to think beyond their race and their usual methods. This is true for all races but Zerg have to adapt the most. [*1] My "common sense logic" here: If the map is bigger you could just wait with the Hellion harrass until you have blue flame and enough Hellions to do a crushing attack (also: the longer you wait the more workers there are to bunch up). In that case making more than a few Zerglings to scout is wasted larvae and a few Spine Crawlers and an extra Queen should provide a better cost efficiency to provide defense in addition to leaveing more larvae for Drones. Maybe even the "constant Queen production" from Day[9]'s funday monday would be a nice way to start because you can block chokes nicely with 2-4 Queens. Thoughts? I just apply my common sense, but maybe I am wrong.
Look, I'll give you this, clearly zergs have to do something more/else.
It's a huge open map, that feels like the perfect place for ultrafast speedlings... but your right, terrans fastest ground unit giggles at speedlings for the most part.
Sure the longer you wait the more damage your attack could do, however the more likely you're sc outed/the other player was enough eco to hold up a decent defence.
I have to admit that my personal common sense logic leans towards fast agressive speedlings not slow stuck in your base queens on massive maps, but again who am I heh
The GSL system is not pefect for the player, but it does give some epic epic matchs.
This crazy 3 bo1s, in no way assure the best player makes it though, yet the code s system gives a great advanatge to those at the top... it's interesting and perhaps not how I would have done it, but ever match is exciting in code S... there is no oh look round of 64 Awsomedude vs randomnonamenochance snorefests, because the impact of an upset is huge in the group stages.
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Apologies for being so down on Tester, the 2 PvPs wasn't the best example. Still, I picked on him because at this point I'd just honestly rather be watching somebody else in Code S.
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On March 02 2011 03:42 SniXSniPe wrote:
The BO1 play between players in a group is retarded.
Now you have the majority of best players in the up and down matches. Please explain to me what they are going to do with 3 previous GSL Champions, a 2x runner up in the up and down matches.
I wonder what the koreans are saying on the "play...?" website.
Maybe Idra should have finished this season =P?
The group play worked perfectly last season and has worked for OSL and MSL for eternity pretty much. Dunno what this complaint is about.
This season rules. Sure my beloved NesTea is out, but it's only so SanBonjwa can take his well deserved gold.
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On March 02 2011 03:48 Gaius Baltar wrote:
Apologies for being so down on Tester, the 2 PvPs wasn't the best example. Still, I picked on him because at this point I'd just honestly rather be watching somebody else in Code S.
Np, I get what your saying, the ideas behind your post made perfect sense.
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Well, at the very least, the up-and-down matches will be well worth watching.
Having just finished watching Group H, I'm sad to see Marine King go, but I'm not surprised he lost to Inca. MKP's TvP has never had the same flare as his other MUs.
But IMO GSTL > GSL. If only we could get OGS to put in Jinro now and then...
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On March 02 2011 03:44 PrinceXizor wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2011 03:40 QTIP. wrote:On March 02 2011 03:37 PrinceXizor wrote:On March 02 2011 03:35 QTIP. wrote:On March 02 2011 03:21 Gaius Baltar wrote:
To be frank, I'm very disappointed with GSL 5 so far. It's not that I don't like upsets, just that so many of these games have been just that--disappointing. For example:
--You get a player like Ret, fresh from a win at Assembly, show some extremely high level play in his round of 32 in Code A but get 2-0'd. Lot's of people think he might leave Korea now.
--The next day you get a player like Tester, who hasn't impressed anybody since beta, cruise through to the round of 16 of Code S in two quick games with uninspiring 1 base play. He'll be sticking around for another two seasons at the very least.
To be fair, he had to play 2 PVP's. It's all one-base play in Korea for that matchup. yeah i mean he played PvP, it's not like he has only one real build ( FE 2 base collosus) in other matchups as well. :/ tester is by far overrated. Lol ease off the SKS hate, and don't worry - I agree with you. He's a very overrated player these days, but he did make top 8 last GSL (knocked out by the soon-to-be champ) and he's into the round of 16 again. Let's see if he can live up to his reputation. he's a strong but extremely predictable player, which results in him doing well vs bad players and having no shot vs good players. so he's stuck in this limbo.
You pretty much nailed it... it always seems like people know exactly what he's doing. Artosis always praises him for his "safe macro" play, but in reality he loses doing just that.
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On March 02 2011 03:28 Turgid wrote:
DOES NaDa hardly practice anymore? Or are you just saying that?
Apparently he's been quite busy due to studying for university. I think it came up during the GSL pregame show for his group. Not entirely sure..
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Deceased:
+ Show Spoiler +
*idrA
wow that was probably the funniest thing i've seen this week, tyvm 
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The game is still too new to say anything definitive about the skills of the top players. the races are arguably still unbalanced (much like Terran at the start of SC1) and continuous patches are going to help that.
With the constant change, you have a lot of volatility in terms of the "skills" of top players. You have strong people like fruitdealer. gradually become weaker as the game (meta and actual) changes. And beasts such as GanZi is rapidly making their way up to the top.
At this under-developed stage, it is not logical to talk about whether a certain player is "strong". A "strong" player is one who have sharp and clean micro, impeccable macro (see Flash + Stork) and ingenious strategies. However, that cannot be contested with a "incomplete" version of the game.
To truly find a Flash or Stork of this game, time is needed for players to refine the general timings and tactics of the game, and for Blizzard to weed out any slight imbalances that can only be discovered by the masses.
Like the early days of SC1, you need a couple of years after the beta for the game to TRULY develop into a "complete" state, And only at that point would an oppurtunity for "true" champions to emerge.
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Sweden33719 Posts
I know you said not to start a debate about whats unexpected and whats expected, but I think you have enough of them wrong to mention it:
Zenio and Inca are definitely unexpected dropouts, especially Zenio who I think played far below his level that day. Julyzerg is DEFINITELY a HUGELY unexpected survivor. Like, thats easily the biggest upset this tournament, by far.
Clide is an upset I think, although I dont really know if Clide or Byun is stronger TvT so hard to say.
Lyn isnt REALLY that surprising in that group, it was a very strange group.
As for comments about group play being bad/the thing to blame for this... I dont really get it. Group play is something I personally prefer - at least it avoids two really strong players KOing eachother early, and means you have to be strong in more than 1 matchup (usually).
Id prefer full round robin over this system, but its still better than straight up bo3 from the start.
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So blaming the system and the players that advance will change anything?
To those who QQ about Tester's one base play..
Tester is not known for one base play, he always expand or tech and just defend anything that is throw at him early game. That what his opponents know and take advantage of it. Didn't he lose last season because of this style to MVP and maybe the reason why he failed to qualify 3 times in a row? You can say he improved and prepared for this. I mean it's the opponent's fault for relying to data alone but now is now and that is past.
His micro still the best no doubt about it
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On March 02 2011 03:57 QTIP. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2011 03:28 Turgid wrote:
DOES NaDa hardly practice anymore? Or are you just saying that? Apparently he's been quite busy due to studying for university. I think it came up during the GSL pregame show for his group. Not entirely sure..
Nada definitely studying a lot.
Q : How do you feel winning to the next rounds?
Nada : Feel little bit numb as I was not confident about today. I think I was lucky today
Q : Why were you not confident?
Nada : I could not get enough practices done. On top of that facing one of my team mate always worries me. Personally I would've thought going into the rounds of 16 with the second place in the group is still extremly well done.
...
Q : You are studying at the university while progaming. What's your goal for uni?
Nada : I did not get good grades last semester. So I will try hard studying as well and get my average weighted grades to 3
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On March 02 2011 04:02 Liquid`Jinro wrote:
I know you said not to start a debate about whats unexpected and whats expected, but I think you have enough of them wrong to mention it:
Zenio and Inca are definitely unexpected dropouts, especially Zenio who I think played far below his level that day. Julyzerg is DEFINITELY a HUGELY unexpected survivor. Like, thats easily the biggest upset this tournament, by far.
Clide is an upset I think, although I dont really know if Clide or Byun is stronger TvT so hard to say.
Lyn isnt REALLY that surprising in that group, it was a very strange group.
As for comments about group play being bad/the thing to blame for this... I dont really get it. Group play is something I personally prefer - at least it avoids two really strong players KOing eachother early, and means you have to be strong in more than 1 matchup (usually).
Id prefer full round robin over this system, but its still better than straight up bo3 from the start.
Hello, to be entirely honest with you I'm glad you posted some feedback.
Obviously, my views are subjective and limited to browsing these forums and watching the GSL through my computer. However, you train with these dudes everyday so I'll take your word for it.
Additionally, my reasoning for leaving Julyzerg unbolded was the firestorm I was going to receive for considering him lucky.
Thanks for the input.
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On March 02 2011 03:58 Vinx wrote:Deceased: + Show Spoiler + *idrA wow that was probably the funniest thing i've seen this week, tyvm
Haha glad you liked it. Can't take credit for it though, gotta give GOM props for putting together that hilarious video.
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EPT
