EPTOn February 12 2011 11:48 Ludwigvan wrote:
Btw, do you know, why Lucifron stopped playing SC2?
+ Show Spoiler +
Btw, do you know, why Lucifron stopped playing SC2?
+ Show Spoiler +
I assume it's due to university.
Grubby is impressive - Page 4
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Zechs
United Kingdom321 Posts
I assume it's due to university. | ||
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rasers
Sweden691 Posts
On February 12 2011 11:44 Zechs wrote: There is quite a laundry list of players who were better than Grubby at various periods. I'd love to see Fly100% move to SC2, but his amazing micro doesn't really have much of a home in this game. His macro often let him down, even in WC3. Also, Lucifron was another top-level orc who beat Grubby numerous times - he posted some great results in the beta/early days of SC2 but succumbed to University in recent months. The point is, Grubby was not some kind of undisputed king of WC3 like some people seem to be insinuating. He wasn't even the best orc, because orc mirror is too random (i hate that word, but it's kinda true) to really pick one. so u started following Wc3 when? 2007 2008ish? grubby was THE Orc after his first WCG win in 2004 together with Zacard he made Orc what it is. so yes he was the best orc. and with ur logic we never have a best player for 1 race. Flash is not the best T because he lost sometimes vs fantasy or MVP. i also wonder how he wasnt the king of wc3 with moon? they got him 2 or 3 times over 2 korea just to play 1!! bo5 against moon for like 10k$ or something. wonder why this never happened to Fly , Lyn and hahaha Lucifron.. There was a time when he was THE one. not in the last 2 3 years but yeah in the start of his career. on topic. his games were suprising good and i doubt we will find many people that play that good after 3 weeks. (playing some games in beta for fun or 2n2 with his GF u rlly think that means something?) | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
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NeoSlicerZ
Ireland470 Posts
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A.J.
United States209 Posts
hurhurhur | ||
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hmunkey
United Kingdom1973 Posts
Do you honestly not see him becoming a top 25-ish Western player by the end of the year assuming he dedicates his time to SC2? And if that's the case, why? I'm actually genuinely curious, especially seeing the success of other former WC3 players in SC2. | ||
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R0YAL
United States1768 Posts
The best example for this is IdrA (who I've, mind you, watched almost all tournament & stream games of). He almost always attacks his opponent head-on and if you study his losses you will find that almost all of them can be attributed to some stupid attack in an unfavorable position and off-creep (which is apparently synonymous to IMBALANCE to him). Ehh isn't this true about the vast majority of all games played? | ||
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crms
United States11933 Posts
I'm worried Grubby will continue to split his time and not go full time sc2 for another year or two. I understand why he still makes boatloads from War3. As a FAN I want him to go to the new big game but we will see. People are stupid as shit to think with full sc2 dedication he couldn't be a top25 player in the next 6months or so. | ||
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Spinfusor
Australia410 Posts
On February 12 2011 12:19 hmunkey wrote: Do you honestly not see him becoming a top 25-ish Western player by the end of the year assuming he dedicates his time to SC2? And if that's the case, why? I'm actually genuinely curious, especially seeing the success of other former WC3 players in SC2. I would imagine his interpretation of "one of the best in the world" may have a higher standard than one of the 25ish best Western players. | ||
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ggrrg
Bulgaria2716 Posts
Grubby's got talent, dedication and experience. He'll certainly be able to catch up with the best soon. For everybody who is not familiar with Grubby's wc3 success: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manuel_Schenkhuizen Mind you that tons of small tourney and weekly cup wins are not listed there. | ||
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Acritter
Syria7637 Posts
/bias | ||
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Zechs
United Kingdom321 Posts
On February 12 2011 12:10 rasers wrote: so u started following Wc3 when? 2007 2008ish? grubby was THE Orc after his first WCG win in 2004 together with Zacard he made Orc what it is. so yes he was the best orc. and with ur logic we never have a best player for 1 race. Flash is not the best T because he lost sometimes vs fantasy or MVP. i also wonder how he wasnt the king of wc3 with moon? they got him 2 or 3 times over 2 korea just to play 1!! bo5 against moon for like 10k$ or something. wonder why this never happened to Fly , Lyn and hahaha Lucifron.. There was a time when he was THE one. not in the last 2 3 years but yeah in the start of his career. on topic. his games were suprising good and i doubt we will find many people that play that good after 3 weeks. (playing some games in beta for fun or 2n2 with his GF u rlly think that means something?) I don't usually reply to fanboys, but... are you for real? You claim that he was "THE ONE" while admitting in the exact same post that Zacard helped him to make orc what it is. Grubby was an excellent player, definitely one of the best, but THE best? Nope, sorry. Moon has more accomplishments and beat Grubby 1on1 many, many times. The reason that Lyn never flew to Korea to play in your fictional $10k series (any idea of what that was called or who sponsored it? No? Oh right, that's becuase you just fucking invented it... o_O) is because a) Lyn lives in Korea already... d'uh, and b) as i said, you just made that BO5 up - it's pretty funny. | ||
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LuckyFool
United States9015 Posts
On February 12 2011 12:19 hmunkey wrote: Do you honestly not see him becoming a top 25-ish Western player by the end of the year assuming he dedicates his time to SC2? And if that's the case, why? I'm actually genuinely curious, especially seeing the success of other former WC3 players in SC2. SC2 is a completely different game. He could very well become a top 25 foreigner. To expect and make claims for that to happen is an entire different ballgame. | ||
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thrawn2112
United States6918 Posts
On February 12 2011 12:19 hmunkey wrote: Do you honestly not see him becoming a top 25-ish Western player by the end of the year assuming he dedicates his time to SC2? And if that's the case, why? I'm actually genuinely curious, especially seeing the success of other former WC3 players in SC2. there's a difference between "top 25 western by the end of the year" and "one of the best in the world in a few months" so many bait n switch arguments in this thread | ||
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rasers
Sweden691 Posts
On February 12 2011 12:28 Zechs wrote: I don't usually reply to fanboys, but... are you for real? You claim that he was "THE ONE" while admitting in the exact same post that Zacard helped him to make orc what it is. Grubby was an excellent player, definitely one of the best, but THE best? Nope, sorry. Moon has more accomplishments and beat Grubby 1on1 many, many times. The reason that Lyn never flew to Korea to play in your fictional $10k series (any idea of what that was called or who sponsored it? No? Oh right, that's becuase you just fucking invented it... o_O) is because a) Lyn lives in Korea already... d'uh, and b) as i said, you just made that BO5 up - it's pretty funny. i just talk about orcs not about Moon... Moon and grubby are pretty much 50/50. Grubby was THE orc who won all that shit. Zacard was the one who gave orc the Blademaster. i make this up? Superfight was the name of the "tournament" and lyn wasnt also the one who got the invite 2 play against him it was moon. Lyn was a fucking scrub until 2007 so how on earth can u rate him higher then grubby? who was there from 2004 until now? and always on top EVERY year he won atleast 1 major tournament. iam not hist fanboy but i get sick when people dont give such guys enough credit. if u would talk so much bullshit about sky moon or whoever i would also write it. not my fault u dont know Wc3 before 2007/2008 but tha tdoesnt mean i make things up. oh look what i found http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=1229249 when people start talking about elfs they start talking about moon. when they start talking about a human player they talk about sky. when they start talking about a orc player they talk about Grubby.(for ud there was not really THE ONE) and u wonder why that is? because lyn and fly are so awesome that they won lately? | ||
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VenerableSpace
United States463 Posts
Grubby doesnt have the speed moon does, but he has the tactics and is a cerebral player. I think he could do very well in sc2 and he showed signs of that with his play so early in his sc2 career. | ||
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IndridCold
United States385 Posts
On February 12 2011 11:48 idonthinksobro wrote: yea cause 4 out of 5 tsl open qualifier champions are ex wc3 pros, playing against the best players trying to earn there spot at 35k prize money.....................I doubt that he will be a Top Tier SC player. Many Wc3 "pros" tried and almost all of them failed. He will most likely be able to win some small online tournaments but i dont see him winning gsl/mlg or any other major tournament in the near future. | ||
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Zechs
United Kingdom321 Posts
On February 12 2011 12:38 rasers wrote: i just talk about orcs not about Moon... Moon and grubby are pretty much 50/50. Grubby was THE orc who won all that shit. Zacard was the one who gave orc the Blademaster. i make this up? Superfight was the name of the "tournament" and lyn wasnt also the one who got the invite 2 play against him it was moon. Lyn was a fucking scrub until 2007 so how on earth can u rate him higher then grubby? who was there from 2004 until now? and always on top EVERY year he won atleast 1 major tournament. iam not hist fanboy but i get sick when people dont give such guys enough credit. if u would talk so much bullshit about sky moon or whoever i would also write it. not my fault u dont know Wc3 before 2007/2008 but tha tdoesnt mean i make things up. oh look what i found http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=1229249 when people start talking about elfs they start talking about moon. when they start talking about a human player they talk about sky. when they start talking about a orc player they talk about Grubby.(for ud there was not really THE ONE) and u wonder why that is? because lyn and fly are so awesome that they won lately? Fly disappeared into obscurity, i'm not talking about him. He was my favourite player just because of his entertaining playstyle, but his peak was very brief. Lyn hasn't won anything lately because, hello... he's been playing SC2 for the past 9 months or so. Even so, the last 10 games he played against Grubby gives him 6 wins (http://www.sk-gaming.com/match/37454). Again, i'm not trying to downtalk Grubby, i just think your fanboy-ism is making you blind to his flaws. He was inarguably one of the best WC3 players of all time but i stand by the point that he is not the one and only, as you said. As for your ludicrious statement about Lyn being a scrub... again, are you for real? By that logic, every footballer of the past 90 years is worse than the ones 100 years ago because they were scrubs before 1920? Wayne Rooney is worse than David Beckham because he has been playing for less time? What on earth are you blathering about? | ||
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Enervate
United States1769 Posts
I must say I am slightly disappointed. His play today certainly seemed amateurish. I wonder how many people challenged him to a game of SC2 and won. | ||
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daxile
Canada829 Posts
The best players in war3 were a mix of europeans, koreans and chinese, the skill gap between koreans and euros definitely wasn't as big as what you saw in BW. If we analyze respective regions we haven't seen any war3 players doing well in GSL because.. well there weren't many good war3 players inducted into gsl in the first place. Check is the only one and Maka was barely a semi-pro player ( he was a night elf known as townhall) and they've done decently for mid-tier war3 pros (in the shadow of many great players). The good europeans have done quite a bit in sc2, Kas, SjoW, Naniwa, thorzain, nightend, naama, hasuobs, lucifron, etc. they were all semi-pro and mid tier war3 players and they are orders above the rest of the world (except code s GSL koreans ofc). Now the NA server war3 players were good but there was a significant skill gap between the best NA player and the best EU/KR/CN player in war3. However KiWiKaKi/Cruncher/SeLeCT/Axslav/Strifecro etc. have had quite a lot of success in NA sc2, they didn't really do much of anything in the war3 scene except win a couple regional lans here and there, nothing major. In conclusion, war3 players can definitely hang in with BW players, one cannot say they aren't successful in sc2 or anything, also the worst statement is "bw players are better than war3 players", if we bring in the A-teamers of BW today, we can definitely say that they are much better mechanically speaking and would probably dominate over the rest, but so far the real cream of the crop in terms of bw have stayed in bw and haven't transitioned over yet. As for grubby's play today, I am thoroughly impressed, as a player who's played over 1k+ games of ladder and made it into mid-level masters, I definitely see the potential in his play, he's played like ~200 games and he held his own against a solid terran player and gave the rest of the group quite a fight. He obviously has a ton of holes in his game but he's inexperienced and has a fraction of the expeirence most of these players have in sc2. He's only 3 weeks in and he's a hybrid player so his priorities aren't focused on sc2.. give this guy some time, he'll eventually grow into a very formidable player for years to come i would predict. Just because he lost a lot of people will dismiss him saying that "he's nothing special" you have to look past the losses and really delve into his playstyle throughout the games | ||
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