EPTSeems like the average t in na is lagging behind in exploiting timings and drops against p so far.
Blizzard releases latest Win Percentages - Page 3
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bigjenk
United States1543 Posts
Seems like the average t in na is lagging behind in exploiting timings and drops against p so far. | ||
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Noterist
13 Posts
I agree with nearly everyone else though, we can't gather anything from these statistics alone. We'd need the entire suite of numbers and tools available to blizzard to get a good idea of how the game looks. Also, I'm betting that without a patch those numbers will still change quite drastically from simple shifts in the metagame. | ||
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Weavel
Finland9224 Posts
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Koh
United Kingdom111 Posts
On November 07 2010 18:05 TheRabidDeer wrote: I dislike these stats purely because some matchups just have dramatic balance swings DURING the game. ie: PvT Protoss initially has a slight advantage Then terran gets their key upgrades and becomes very strong Then protoss gets storm and/or colossus and the balance switches again to (imo) a slight protoss advantage. The only valid criticism of these statistics so far is this one. However, the differences in area results may just highlight the prevalence of superior tactics in that region, and not basic game unfairness. What Blizzard has on its hands is international diplomacy... with each party being from a different planet and each party feeling that they have an unfair disadvantage. | ||
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Sniffy
Australia290 Posts
The stats are meaningless, why release them and encourage more balance whining. God damnit blizzard  I am mid diamond and I am not good and neither is anyone at my skill level. dont balance the game around diamond, balance around masters/grand masters leagues. | ||
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5unrise
New Zealand646 Posts
On November 07 2010 18:33 Sniffy wrote: Why do they do this -.- The stats are meaningless, why release them and encourage more balance whining. God damnit blizzard I think it will shut the whining up to be honest... since the game is pretty well balanced at around 50% | ||
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Sniffy
Australia290 Posts
On November 07 2010 18:34 5unrise wrote: I think it will shut the whining up to be honest... since the game is pretty well balanced at around 50% I hope you are right  | ||
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Elwar
953 Posts
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heishe
Germany2284 Posts
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QuantumTheory
New Zealand188 Posts
On November 07 2010 18:28 5unrise wrote: I disagree, since there are are progaming teams very much everywhere for sc2, there is no reason to put greater weight on Korea. It's not like this is bw where Korea just dominates. There really isn't much of skill gap between Korea and Europe, for example. Just because toss is doing well in Korea doesnt mean toss is UP, since clearly European and NA players have different experiences, and my ladder experiences tell me that toss is very strong if the player makes good decisions. If anything toss should be watched carefully since they are too strong in lower level leagues. Statistics overall show that protoss is fine, Terran is at more of a disadvantage. Disclaimer: I play zerg I disagree. Korea should have more weight seeing how, and this is just about universally accepted: Korea has a higher skill level. It is like bw wher Korea dominates there is a skill gap between Europe and Korea for example DIFFERENT winrates. You know why there's different winrates? The higherskilled players (Koreans, generally) find out most strats first and push races to the limit. Why is there such varying winrates from Korea to, for example SEA or NA? Because the metagame is completely different. I did not say protoss is UP and yes, overall Protoss maybe doing fine but are they doing fine where it counts? | ||
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stroggos
New Zealand1543 Posts
Clearly the better strategy atm is to go for all in aggressive builds and beat the protoss before they can get to mid game. oh yeah and roaches are insanely cheap for how much they rape protoss ground armies. | ||
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AyJay
1515 Posts
On November 07 2010 18:18 5unrise wrote: I think these stats are fine, maybe Terran could use a little buff (e.g. removes depot before rax requirement), but all matchups are pretty well balanced Removing rax be4 depot will fuck up ZvT and TvT. | ||
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DImported
Australia149 Posts
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NicolBolas
United States1388 Posts
On November 07 2010 17:42 fdsdfg wrote: it says it's all from diamond. That said, these numbers have almost nothing to do with game balance. I think it's absurd that they release it to try to prove anything. But... they didn't use it to prove anything. They just said, "here's some stats" and then gave us some stats. They didn't tell us what conclusions they draw from it, nor did they tell us what they were planning to do about any of these numbers. They just gave us some stats. | ||
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5unrise
New Zealand646 Posts
On November 07 2010 18:38 QuantumTheory wrote: I disagree. Korea should have more weight seeing how, and this is just about universally accepted: Korea has a higher skill level. It is like bw wher Korea dominates there is a skill gap between Europe and Korea for example DIFFERENT winrates. You know why there's different winrates? The higherskilled players (Koreans, generally) find out most strats first and push races to the limit. Why is there such varying winrates from Korea to, for example SEA or NA? Because the metagame is completely different. I did not say protoss is UP and yes, overall Protoss maybe doing fine but are they doing fine where it counts? If this was broodwar then it is universally accepted. At this point what you said has no empirical backing. Remember blizzcon winner was a Chinese, not a Korean. Higher skilled players can come from anywhere at this point, and so winrates from each region must be taken into account. In any case, even if you only compare Korea, which is a wrong approach, you will see that protoss winrate against other races are close to 50% to the extent that the differential is negligible. Toss is fine. | ||
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risa
Finland11 Posts
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StarDrive
90 Posts
On November 07 2010 18:42 5unrise wrote: If this was broodwar then it is universally accepted. At this point what you said has no empirical backing. Remember blizzcon winner was a Chinese, not a Korean. Higher skilled players can come from anywhere at this point, and so winrates from each region must be taken into account. In any case, even if you only compare Korea, which is a wrong approach, you will see that protoss winrate against other races are close to 50% to the extent that the differential is negligible. Toss is fine. At Blizzcon David Kim said they put more weight on Korea because it tends to be where new metagame changing strats emerge from and a leading indicator of balance. Also the skill level there is higher overall. | ||
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TheRabidDeer
United States3806 Posts
On November 07 2010 18:23 Dommk wrote: Heh,I beg to differ. At least the way the the Devs were pitching it at Blizzcon, Terran has the advantage until it gets late into the game where Protoss can tech to storm, but it is pretty difficult, even Dustin Browder was commenting on how hard it was for Protoss to get Storm when he was casting along side Day[9]. It is very difficult to get to the point of getting Storm, at least for me I only ever get to tech to storm once every 5-6 games. But then you have games like Socke vs Jinro on DO during MLG, where Toss went for Storm first but it didn't even seem like he had any advantage at all. 4 warpgate protoss has a very slight advantage over terran, which is why terran is forced to turtle in the early game. Once terran gets their upgrades and can move out is when protoss is forced to defend because of the terran advantage. This is when the struggle begins for protoss to just live until he gets colossus or storm. We are basically saying the same thing though... so I dont really see why you disagree with me (except at the end where you reference socke vs jinro). | ||
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QuantumTheory
New Zealand188 Posts
On November 07 2010 18:42 5unrise wrote: If this was broodwar then it is universally accepted. At this point what you said has no empirical backing. Remember blizzcon winner was a Chinese, not a Korean. Higher skilled players can come from anywhere at this point, and so winrates from each region must be taken into account. In any case, even if you only compare Korea, which is a wrong approach, you will see that protoss winrate against other races are close to 50% to the extent that the differential is negligible. Toss is fine. Last time I checked, NEXGenius was Korean.. I completely agree that higher skilled players can come from anywhere, but you are forgetting the ratio of higher skilled Koreans (I'm talking top 0.5%) in relation to foreigners. At the very least it's equal (It isn't) Meaning Koreans DO have more weight as far as statistics go. Toss is doing fine anywhere outside of Korea where the metagame is different, you must understand that given time the current strats will move over to the other servers and the current korean % will start looking like everyone elses. | ||
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TheRabidDeer
United States3806 Posts
On November 07 2010 18:42 5unrise wrote: If this was broodwar then it is universally accepted. At this point what you said has no empirical backing. Remember blizzcon winner was a Chinese, not a Korean. Higher skilled players can come from anywhere at this point, and so winrates from each region must be taken into account. In any case, even if you only compare Korea, which is a wrong approach, you will see that protoss winrate against other races are close to 50% to the extent that the differential is negligible. Toss is fine. I thought NEXGenius was korean and loner was the chinese? NEXGenius won blizzcon >.> EDIT: Koreans are better because they have a better environment to practice in. They have lots of people to talk about strategies in a 1 on 1 setting, they have coaches, they have more hours of training, they just have an overall better way to get better at the game. | ||
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