• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 21:38
CEST 03:38
KST 10:38
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall10HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy6
Community News
Firefly given lifetime ban by ESIC following match-fixing investigation12$25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced6Weekly Cups (June 30 - July 6): Classic Doubles6[BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China9Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL66
StarCraft 2
General
Firefly given lifetime ban by ESIC following match-fixing investigation The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation TL Team Map Contest #4: Winners Weekly Cups (June 30 - July 6): Classic Doubles The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings
Tourneys
$25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series WardiTV Mondays
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome Mutation # 478 Instant Karma
Brood War
General
[G] Progamer Settings BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ ASL20 Preliminary Maps [ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall SC uni coach streams logging into betting site
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China [BSL20] Grand Finals - Sunday 20:00 CET CSL Xiamen International Invitational
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile What do you want from future RTS games? Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Positive Thoughts on Setting Up a Dual-Caliber FX
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Summer Games Done Quick 2025! Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread NBA General Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
Culture Clash in Video Games…
TrAiDoS
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 544 users

[Trick] Early Game +7% Mineral Boost - Page 29

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 27 28 29 30 31 53 Next
ploy
Profile Joined January 2006
United States416 Posts
September 13 2010 05:51 GMT
#561
Is this the same website that used to hate MBS and infinite unit selection? I can honestly hardly tell from this thread.
LittLeD
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden7973 Posts
September 13 2010 05:51 GMT
#562
I have to say im very suprised this hasnt been noticed earlier. Since coming from a wc3 background I took it as a certainty that this would exist in sc2 as well. I think I found out about this somewhere in the beta and was 100 % sure most people knew about it,
☆Grubby ☆| Tod|DeMusliM|ThorZaiN|SaSe|Moon|Mana| ☆HerO ☆
FlamingTurd
Profile Joined April 2010
United States1059 Posts
September 13 2010 05:53 GMT
#563
lol pretty cool find
Nerf MMMT!!! Liquid`Ret Hwaiting!!!
Sylvr
Profile Joined May 2010
United States524 Posts
September 13 2010 05:56 GMT
#564
On September 13 2010 14:48 DevaB wrote:
It takes almost exactly 11/12 trips for 1 boosted worker to do 1 extra trip ( 5 minerals ) then a normal worker. A action queue can take up to 30 actions, depending on your spamming skills, you can fill that queue in 1/2 return trips for every worker.
Tested this by putting 2 workers mining at the same distance on a different patch then boosting 1 worker and just counting the trips. I tested on far patches so it took 12, and even patches that look to have the same distance still have a marginal distance different from the main. So you can slash maybe 1 trip.

This seems to be more viable during the first 8 workers, since after that if there is already a worker there he goes to a different patch anyways then on his queue back goes to that first patch...

So saying you queue all 6 + 2/4 extra workers during the start you will gain a whole 6/10 trips (30/50 minerals)

It is really obvious that the dude goes faster when boosted but the results do not seem to show a 7% gain at all.

This is is no way game breaking! Those you utilize this get a marginal advantage good for them, no reason to qq if you do not want to use it.


/twitch @ bolded part. Please don't even use that combination of words again.
Ketara
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States15065 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-13 06:00:00
September 13 2010 05:58 GMT
#565
Trying this out on my SCVs from the start of a game until my 15 orbital command a bunch of times, I was unable to get the OC out any faster (2:42 every time), but depending on how well I executed this trick had 10-20 extra minerals at 2:42 when the OC started.

I think people are seeing the 7% figure and reading that in a way they shouldn't be. 7% is apparently a theoretical threshold gain on a small number of workers mine rate in the first couple minutes of the game. It is extremely hard or even impossible to get all the workers queued up within the first couple trips. I can only do 1, sometimes 2 workers per trip.

I would love to see some more indepth analysis though, figuring out at what worker point exactly this stops producing a benefit, exactly how much of a benefit you can get from it, etc.


One funny thing that I noticed was that in one attempt, I was focusing so hard on doing this that I forgot to change my rally point to a new node every time I built a worker, and ended up having 5 fewer extra minerals at 2:42 than normal.
http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-general/502075-patch-61-league-of-legends-general-discussion?page=25#498
DevaB
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada2 Posts
September 13 2010 06:01 GMT
#566
On September 13 2010 14:56 Sylvr wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2010 14:48 DevaB wrote:
It takes almost exactly 11/12 trips for 1 boosted worker to do 1 extra trip ( 5 minerals ) then a normal worker. A action queue can take up to 30 actions, depending on your spamming skills, you can fill that queue in 1/2 return trips for every worker.
Tested this by putting 2 workers mining at the same distance on a different patch then boosting 1 worker and just counting the trips. I tested on far patches so it took 12, and even patches that look to have the same distance still have a marginal distance different from the main. So you can slash maybe 1 trip.

This seems to be more viable during the first 8 workers, since after that if there is already a worker there he goes to a different patch anyways then on his queue back goes to that first patch...

So saying you queue all 6 + 2/4 extra workers during the start you will gain a whole 6/10 trips (30/50 minerals)

It is really obvious that the dude goes faster when boosted but the results do not seem to show a 7% gain at all.

This is is no way game breaking! Those you utilize this get a marginal advantage good for them, no reason to qq if you do not want to use it.


/twitch @ bolded part. Please don't even use that combination of words again.


haha yeah my bad I used that combination because some of my tests both drones arrived at exactly the same time on the 12th trip. Almost was for discrepancies xD
blackodd
Profile Joined April 2010
Sweden451 Posts
September 13 2010 06:03 GMT
#567
Gamebreaking!!!!!!!
For I am the Queen of Blades. And none shall ever dispute my rule, again...
Zerksys
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States569 Posts
September 13 2010 06:08 GMT
#568
On September 13 2010 14:58 Ketara wrote:
Trying this out on my SCVs from the start of a game until my 15 orbital command a bunch of times, I was unable to get the OC out any faster (2:42 every time), but depending on how well I executed this trick had 10-20 extra minerals at 2:42 when the OC started.

I think people are seeing the 7% figure and reading that in a way they shouldn't be. 7% is apparently a theoretical threshold gain on a small number of workers mine rate in the first couple minutes of the game. It is extremely hard or even impossible to get all the workers queued up within the first couple trips. I can only do 1, sometimes 2 workers per trip.

I would love to see some more indepth analysis though, figuring out at what worker point exactly this stops producing a benefit, exactly how much of a benefit you can get from it, etc.


One funny thing that I noticed was that in one attempt, I was focusing so hard on doing this that I forgot to change my rally point to a new node every time I built a worker, and ended up having 5 fewer extra minerals at 2:42 than normal.


Yeah I agree with the last part. I think for most players that don't have 200 apm it's not going to be that big of an issue. If anything it gives someone who is playing more things to concentrate on and more opportunities to screw up their build. At the pro level this could add a new dynamic to the situation. Awesome find.
What's that probe doing there? It's a scout. You mean one of those flying planes? No....
keV.
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
United States3214 Posts
September 13 2010 06:13 GMT
#569
Very neat find sockfolder. Also, folding should definitely be the name.

As for all the non-pros arguing for no reason; You are arguing for no reason. This is only going to make a difference for the very best at the game so save your breath. It's just exhausting to read.
"brevity is the soul of wit" - William Shakesman
Chaosvuistje
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands2581 Posts
September 13 2010 06:14 GMT
#570
Go to sleep, starcraft 2 forum relatively uninterresting.
Wake up, glance over it. See monstrous 550+ posts thread about a trick giving an extremely slight mineral advantage.

Oh TLers, I love how you all go batshit insane about this <3. Interresting trick though =) will definitely have to execute it.
Grobyc
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada18410 Posts
September 13 2010 06:14 GMT
#571
sweet, hahaha

thanks for sharing
If you watch Godzilla backwards it's about a benevolent lizard who helps rebuild a city and then moonwalks into the ocean.
Apollys
Profile Joined July 2010
United States278 Posts
September 13 2010 06:22 GMT
#572
I practiced this trick in a game with an insane AI as my opponent. Watching the replay, Mr. Insane AI still has a ridiculously faster income at the start of the game due to his perfect goddamn split. I guess my point is that although this is a very cool technique that has been discovered, there are about a million other aspects of your gameplay that are more important than mineral boosting. If you're korean, by all means perfect this technique, but for basically anyone besides the pro gamers, I don't think the difference would even be noticeable if you/your opponent "mineral boosts" or not.
When you're feeling down, I'll be there to feel you up!
Yurie
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
11810 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-13 06:27:36
September 13 2010 06:23 GMT
#573
On September 13 2010 14:35 smegged wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2010 14:19 Sylvr wrote:
On September 13 2010 14:14 smegged wrote:
Well this bug favours Terran and hurts zerg the most.

Zerg already require more APM for their start than any other race (pressing "s" before "d" is big when you're talking about needing to spam a few hundred actions in a few seconds) and have tighter timing windows.

Terran will gain advantages out of mules that would not otherwise exist.

This needs to be patched.


Zerg gets that all back as the game progresses and the other races have to select several unit producing structures to make their army whereas Zerg only has to select 1.


Early game advantages snowball much more than later game ones do.

And this is truly an APM test, nothing more. Having divided attention is far more costly in such a race. The fact is that zerg have the toughest/most unforgiving timings on their early worker construction due to being unable to queue, even for a fraction of a second. In a laggy internet environment (thanks for the lack of LAN play Blizzard > ) it is even more important for a zerg player to be early with their "d" spam.

We're talking a 7% advantage here, it's not minute. All of the pros will be doing it. If they do it for two minutes it may mean saving ten seconds on a rush. That timing window is massive.


Can't Z produce workers fastest of all races? Thus they get their fourth or some such faster than now. Leading to an early game lead.

Mule gets better though, no argument against that. Perhaps remove the mule altogether, that way it is fixed.
Ketara
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States15065 Posts
September 13 2010 06:24 GMT
#574
On September 13 2010 15:22 Apollys wrote:
I practiced this trick in a game with an insane AI as my opponent. Watching the replay, Mr. Insane AI still has a ridiculously faster income at the start of the game due to his perfect goddamn split. I guess my point is that although this is a very cool technique that has been discovered, there are about a million other aspects of your gameplay that are more important than mineral boosting. If you're korean, by all means perfect this technique, but for basically anyone besides the pro gamers, I don't think the difference would even be noticeable if you/your opponent "mineral boosts" or not.


Insane AI workers also gather more minerals per trip, do it vs. a Very Hard.
http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-general/502075-patch-61-league-of-legends-general-discussion?page=25#498
Apollys
Profile Joined July 2010
United States278 Posts
September 13 2010 06:31 GMT
#575
On September 13 2010 15:24 Ketara wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2010 15:22 Apollys wrote:
I practiced this trick in a game with an insane AI as my opponent. Watching the replay, Mr. Insane AI still has a ridiculously faster income at the start of the game due to his perfect goddamn split. I guess my point is that although this is a very cool technique that has been discovered, there are about a million other aspects of your gameplay that are more important than mineral boosting. If you're korean, by all means perfect this technique, but for basically anyone besides the pro gamers, I don't think the difference would even be noticeable if you/your opponent "mineral boosts" or not.


Insane AI workers also gather more minerals per trip, do it vs. a Very Hard.


Oh thanks, I forgot about that hahaha what a noobly noob am I.
When you're feeling down, I'll be there to feel you up!
Moonling
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States987 Posts
September 13 2010 06:44 GMT
#576
As zerg this seems very hard to do while still scouting overlord placement and all that but it probably takes practice but on the other hand this is deff only on the pro level
1% of koreans control 99% of starcraft winnings. #occupykorea.
dlordtemplar
Profile Joined August 2010
United States7 Posts
September 13 2010 06:53 GMT
#577
this is a nice find. GJ OP. definitely worth the read.
TzTz
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Germany511 Posts
September 13 2010 07:00 GMT
#578
So how about adding every worker to a controlgroup and whenever you can free up apm you just select that group and spam return cargo. by having to add every worker as he spawns this would be similar to BW style telling everyworker to gather as he spawns.
Swede
Profile Joined June 2010
New Zealand853 Posts
September 13 2010 07:08 GMT
#579
This is only going to make a difference for the very best at the game so save your breath


Actually I would argue that is where there will be the least difference (once they're all doing it, and besides bronze players who won't use it at all). The biggest difference will be at the level where some people do it/some don't (mid - high diamond maybe?).

Which is why I think it's stupid. It will make zero difference to pro play, but it will fuck off more than half of the players where it DOES make a difference (half of TLers don't want it according to that poll, and this is TL). It's in Blizzard's best interest NOT to leave it in the game.
Jyxz
Profile Joined November 2009
United States117 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-13 07:15:12
September 13 2010 07:13 GMT
#580
On September 13 2010 09:25 Plutonium wrote:
I can guarantee you that Blizz knew about this ten minutes after the thread went up, and it will most likely be patched.

Their devs probably read TL more than their actual forums.

You would freaking hope so eh?

I think this should be considered an exploit like allied spider mines in the original and a bannable offense.
This is Jimmy
Prev 1 27 28 29 30 31 53 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
SEL Masters #4 - Day 1
CranKy Ducklings70
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft333
Nina 117
RuFF_SC2 76
ProTech61
Livibee 54
StarCraft: Brood War
Artosis 801
NaDa 93
sSak 41
LuMiX 3
Dota 2
monkeys_forever581
NeuroSwarm80
League of Legends
JimRising 820
Counter-Strike
fl0m1175
taco 885
Coldzera 187
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox596
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor77
Other Games
summit1g9171
C9.Mang0303
Maynarde200
ViBE184
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick42814
BasetradeTV111
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH182
• Hupsaiya 37
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• Migwel
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• IndyKCrew
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki5
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos2243
• masondota21268
Other Games
• Scarra1969
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
8h 23m
ByuN vs SHIN
Clem vs Reynor
OSC
11h 23m
Replay Cast
22h 23m
RSL Revival
1d 8h
Classic vs Cure
FEL
1d 14h
OSC
1d 18h
RSL Revival
2 days
FEL
2 days
FEL
2 days
CSO Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
2 days
Bonyth vs QiaoGege
Dewalt vs Fengzi
Hawk vs Zhanhun
Sziky vs Mihu
Mihu vs QiaoGege
Zhanhun vs Sziky
Fengzi vs Hawk
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
FEL
3 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
3 days
Bonyth vs Dewalt
QiaoGege vs Dewalt
Hawk vs Bonyth
Sziky vs Fengzi
Mihu vs Zhanhun
QiaoGege vs Zhanhun
Fengzi vs Mihu
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-07-07
HSC XXVII
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
Acropolis #3
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
Championship of Russia 2025
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025

Upcoming

2025 ACS Season 2: Qualifier
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSL Xiamen Invitational
CSL Xiamen Invitational: ShowMatche
2025 ACS Season 2
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
SEL Season 2 Championship
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
Underdog Cup #2
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.