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Official State of the Game Podcast Thread - Page 38

Forum Index > SC2 General
54608 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 36 37 38 39 40 2731 Next
ChewbroCColi
Profile Joined July 2009
Denmark108 Posts
September 28 2010 23:06 GMT
#741
Incoltrol is hilarious. xD More with this guy plz!
Martylang
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands40 Posts
September 28 2010 23:16 GMT
#742
Great! 2 hours of goodness Thanks Jp.

Downloading from filefront went pretty smooth for me.
zemiron
Profile Joined August 2010
United States481 Posts
September 28 2010 23:35 GMT
#743
I wish you would have idrA on more. It was fun having his brutally honest voice on the air.
"Fractal alligators. Like a normal alligator, but instead of arms, there are more alligators." -Day9
Impaler
Profile Joined September 2010
United States11 Posts
September 28 2010 23:53 GMT
#744
Very nice PodCast, I will be listening to this regularly from now on.

I'll also be taking some of their thoughts into account in my Mod, a lot of Day9's wishes for the game are very close to my own thoughts.
Shakes
Profile Joined April 2010
Australia557 Posts
September 28 2010 23:59 GMT
#745
Psy was worth having on the podcast for his "Who is Artosis?" question alone.
MrEaux
Profile Joined June 2010
United States165 Posts
September 29 2010 00:15 GMT
#746
Another great podcast, kudos to JP. You're hosting has really improved over the past few episodes, keep up the good work! This one had a much better flow to the different segments and a lot fewer awkward pauses.
Brainsurgeon
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Sweden359 Posts
September 29 2010 00:24 GMT
#747
Yeah, you should have IdrA on regularly, he's as awesome as I hoped he'd be. ALMOST perfect cast right now. Just need Artosis.
Say no to drugs. Say yes to hugs!
darkgray
Profile Joined September 2010
Sweden11 Posts
September 29 2010 00:30 GMT
#748
Let me open this with some praise. I love the podcast. It satisfies my curiosity when it comes to how pros think about things, giving a glimpse of the mysterious "inside". In addition to being informative and insightful, it's also utterly hilarious -- in particular the contrast created by Incontrol and Nony.

As much as I love it, however, I still think it could be improved. In fact, I'm sure it will improve naturally, as the participants become (even more) comfortable with each other; with the various segments; with how to interact without stepping on each other's toes. In a few months, SotG should be a superb production.

For now, I have some suggestions:

1) The length is really pushing the limit for a podcast, as most people don't often have a 2-hour slot open in their daily lives. Streamlining the content is probably a good idea. If you feel some segments didn't work out all that well, consider cutting them out before release. I'd imagine this is a difficult choice, since there'll be listeners who think any Idra time is gold, but I'd probably have been happier never knowing about the lightning quiz, as an example. Quality over quantity, if you don't mind.

2) Don't invite more than one guest at a time. It's fun to hear different opinions, but it starts getting tedious cycling through 6 people for every single question. It also affects listening comprehension, when you accidentally get so many people talking at once. I think 4 members is ideal, but I appreciate the weekly guest, and it's not like I want you to cut out a regular. Just... try to stick to a singular guest. Keep it focused, and give your special guest some love.

3) Plan out the format more carefully ahead of time, so you can cut down on awkward pauses and overly meandering discussions. Specifically, be more forceful with guiding the conversation, and I think you should find a visual aid to help you (silently) "point out" speakers, so you can avoid breaks where people try to figure out if it's their turn yet.

4) Fix the sound issues ASAP. You don't need every member present to make sure they can be heard properly ahead of recording. It's usually very hard to hear what Incontrol is saying, because his voice will suddenly drop into a whisper, which is sad when he's so witty. If he needs a new microphone that doesn't suck, I'm sure listeners wouldn't mind donating a dollar or two. (And next time, ask Idra not to puff straight into the mic, just move it out of the way of his breathing path.)

5) Stop reading entire patch note paragraphs out loud. Everyone's seen them and know what you're talking about. Just condense them into short bullet points before recording, so you can move through them more quickly.

6) Introduce people properly at the start of every episode, so new listeners know who's who. The group has a tendency to call each other by first name (Jeff, Sean, etc), but when I first heard the podcast, I had no clue that Jeff = Incontrol or Tyler = Nony. Keep the confusion to a minimum.

7) Consider splitting the podcast into biweekly episodes, so you can run 1-2 regulars + guest(s) and mix them up depending on who has time, etc. This may simplify things a lot. Might be hard to find the time, though. Still, it seems like you have plenty of things to talk about, especially during GSL season, so I doubt you'd run out of topics.

8) Force Day9 to retweet new episodes, so it reaches more people. He's been neglecting it lately! With his 7000+ followers it would bring in tons of new listeners.


Hope this doesn't come across as nagging, because I really, really enjoy the show. SotG fighting!
iNcontroL *
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
USA29055 Posts
September 29 2010 00:35 GMT
#749
all really good points and with some of them we are already working through them. But ty <3 that is a good example of helpful/constructive criticism we always appreciate it my man <3
Antisocialmunky
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States5912 Posts
September 29 2010 00:36 GMT
#750
I really like the idea of 2 one hour things maybe released Friday and Saturday when D[9] isn't on. However the logistics are probably pretty meeeeehhhhh.
[゚n゚] SSSSssssssSSsss ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Marine/Raven Guide:http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=163605
Tachion
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada8573 Posts
September 29 2010 00:58 GMT
#751
Having idra on the podcast was absolutely marvelous. It would be so awesome if he was a regular but I don't see him doing that He has great knowledge about whats going on in korea right now and can offer high level insight from a different point of view.
i was driving down the road this november eve and spotted a hitchhiker walking down the street. i pulled over and saw that it was only a tree. i uprooted it and put it in my trunk. do trees like marshmallow peeps? cause that's all i have and will have.
itmeJP
Profile Joined February 2010
United States1101 Posts
September 29 2010 01:11 GMT
#752
I've pulled a favor from a friend for some help with hosting. I'm in the process of moving everything over right now. Should all be done later tonight. Will update when it is. This should alleviate a lot of the issues with traffic.

Thanks to those of you who donated -- you are far too kind. Since I figured out the hosting issue, this money will be going towards purchasing a nice travel microphone for the four of us to use at MLG DC, BlizzCon, and MLG Dallas for some show(s) to bring you SotG from the events.
Twitter.com/itmeJP -- Twitch.tv/itmeJP -- YouTube.com/itmeJP
Artifice
Profile Joined May 2010
United States523 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-29 01:28:48
September 29 2010 01:16 GMT
#753
On September 29 2010 09:30 darkgray wrote:

+ Show Spoiler +
Let me open this with some praise. I love the podcast. It satisfies my curiosity when it comes to how pros think about things, giving a glimpse of the mysterious "inside". In addition to being informative and insightful, it's also utterly hilarious -- in particular the contrast created by Incontrol and Nony.

As much as I love it, however, I still think it could be improved. In fact, I'm sure it will improve naturally, as the participants become (even more) comfortable with each other; with the various segments; with how to interact without stepping on each other's toes. In a few months, SotG should be a superb production.

For now, I have some suggestions:

1) The length is really pushing the limit for a podcast, as most people don't often have a 2-hour slot open in their daily lives. Streamlining the content is probably a good idea. If you feel some segments didn't work out all that well, consider cutting them out before release. I'd imagine this is a difficult choice, since there'll be listeners who think any Idra time is gold, but I'd probably have been happier never knowing about the lightning quiz, as an example. Quality over quantity, if you don't mind.

2) Don't invite more than one guest at a time. It's fun to hear different opinions, but it starts getting tedious cycling through 6 people for every single question. It also affects listening comprehension, when you accidentally get so many people talking at once. I think 4 members is ideal, but I appreciate the weekly guest, and it's not like I want you to cut out a regular. Just... try to stick to a singular guest. Keep it focused, and give your special guest some love.

3) Plan out the format more carefully ahead of time, so you can cut down on awkward pauses and overly meandering discussions. Specifically, be more forceful with guiding the conversation, and I think you should find a visual aid to help you (silently) "point out" speakers, so you can avoid breaks where people try to figure out if it's their turn yet.

4) Fix the sound issues ASAP. You don't need every member present to make sure they can be heard properly ahead of recording. It's usually very hard to hear what Incontrol is saying, because his voice will suddenly drop into a whisper, which is sad when he's so witty. If he needs a new microphone that doesn't suck, I'm sure listeners wouldn't mind donating a dollar or two. (And next time, ask Idra not to puff straight into the mic, just move it out of the way of his breathing path.)

5) Stop reading entire patch note paragraphs out loud. Everyone's seen them and know what you're talking about. Just condense them into short bullet points before recording, so you can move through them more quickly.

6) Introduce people properly at the start of every episode, so new listeners know who's who. The group has a tendency to call each other by first name (Jeff, Sean, etc), but when I first heard the podcast, I had no clue that Jeff = Incontrol or Tyler = Nony. Keep the confusion to a minimum.

7) Consider splitting the podcast into biweekly episodes, so you can run 1-2 regulars + guest(s) and mix them up depending on who has time, etc. This may simplify things a lot. Might be hard to find the time, though. Still, it seems like you have plenty of things to talk about, especially during GSL season, so I doubt you'd run out of topics.

8) Force Day9 to retweet new episodes, so it reaches more people. He's been neglecting it lately! With his 7000+ followers it would bring in tons of new listeners.


Hope this doesn't come across as nagging, because I really, really enjoy the show. SotG fighting!


A lot of good points, but I don't really agree with #1, 2, and 7. The length is great because the content is there to support it. I've never gotten bored listening to a SotG podcast. Honestly I wouldn't even have a problem with them being longer. Its not like you absolutely have to listen to the whole thing in one sitting.

Multiple guests is fine, and it's been fine in the past. I'm assuming you're referencing Psy having very little speaking time, maybe I'm wrong, but multiple guests has been fine before, and I don't see any reason to specifically limit it to one. One thing to limit the cycling through many people for every question point you made, is to direct certain questions only at one or a few people, which JP already does occasionally.

I think #7 directly contradicts your #1, in that a bi-weekly podcast would mean it would be even longer, and it also means the topics are less up to date. Things that happened like 12-13 days ago would either be old news, or cut completely, and that is kinda lame. Also cutting it down to so few people would make it less entertaining as well I believe. Honestly point #7 just sounds like it'd water down the whole experience and make it not nearly as entertaining as it is now.

Also as far as #8, a shoutout on the daily would probably do much more than a retweet, if I had to guess.

Keep up the good work JP/everyone involved, if nothing else, this podcast is far and away the most hilarious Starcraft content out there. It's not often that I'm crying laughing from something SC related.
TheWoodLeagueAllstar
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United Kingdom617 Posts
September 29 2010 01:28 GMT
#754
Though i do love the length ill agree that keeping it sub 1:30, maybe even 1 hour would allow for a much more compact, concise and even show. There's no need to overreach, its already a weekly show so people will get their fill with an hour, its what we are all used to with other podcasts.

I think we should all take a step back though and say it is really good, and all of our constructive points come from a good place :D and we should also be mindful not to criticize too much, even if its what the casters are asking for. There has to be a level of autonomy in podcasting, a standard where viewer participation ends and the podcast is allowed to become what it is, which is something the viewers cant and shouldn't control all the way. Its admirable that you guys are after our views and after our opinions, but its a cycle, we want you guys to do a regular podcast each week and not hate doing it because we want the podcast to last, in order for this to be the case all 4 of you have to be happy and content with the formula which means our viewer opinions are in a sense moot after a certain point.

What im trying to say is theres a point at which everyone can over-analyse the heck out of the thing and turn it into something designed by committee, and everyone who has done a project like that will tell you the vision is often always better than the deconstructed consensus. In short you cant please everyone, and its best to create a shwo you 4 like doing and take the audience who likes what you do with you, rather than change and change and change and hate doing it just to appease the masses. The best comparison i can give is from the tl.net streams section, many people stream to get viewers to get popular, to get known and to get a small slice of e-fame. In order to get this they twist and bend their streams to user demand, some cast tournaments despite the fact they hate doing it, some stream ladder despite hating ladder and what happens is that yes they get viewers, but they are so bored by what they are doing theres no point, more to the point their viewership is a viewership which likes something totally different to the content they produce. The streams which last are the streams which would exist regardless of the viewership, people who love playing ladder just streaming some ladder, if they werent streaming it they would be doing it anyway. So whereas the viewership is nice and to a sense the point, its also pointless if you hate what your doing.

So that being said i think the podcast would benefit from 2 things.

Keep it at you 4 + the occasional guest
Keep it under an hour

I think both of these will stop the potential big issues that have arisen and will arise, principally as we saw with last episode the issues with skype in general when you have people talking over each other and the issue with Psy where he was simply 1 of 6 people who were contributing and he sat in the background. The time issue will set a standard and eliminate what will be the biggest issue the podcast faces and that is having shit to talk about, we are lucky now we have patches and gsls and controversy etc etc but the future is months of no patches, decreasing numbers of tournaments and less controversy all round as the game space evens outs. I have 0 doubt with the quality of participants that you guys can fill an hour with good, entertaining and informative views on all things sc2 in the week, i think it would make the podcast sharp and focused. I do however think even with the best intentions a 2 hour a week podcast will begin to stretch issues, force more work on JP and in the end i think could cause the podcast to come to an early end when there is so much potential for the future.

That was long and rambling :D

I love the show btw <3
Bunker rushing is the way to a mans heart <3
PROJECTILE
Profile Joined April 2010
United States226 Posts
September 29 2010 01:30 GMT
#755
I don't usually praise these kinds of things, but I honestly thought the latest one was hilarious. Incontrol can be really funny (and a good foil to all the skinny nerds ), day9 has great comments, idra is brutally honest and brings a lot of legitimacy to everything he's talking about, and nony and psy are solid guys for most topics. Very well done. I like the mixing of light-heartedness and serious discussion.
darkgray
Profile Joined September 2010
Sweden11 Posts
September 29 2010 01:31 GMT
#756
On September 29 2010 10:16 Artifice wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
A lot of good points, but I don't really agree with #1, 2, and 7. The length is great because the content is there to support it. I've never gotten bored listening to a SotG podcast. Honestly I wouldn't even have a problem with them being longer. Its not like you absolutely have to listen to the whole thing in one sitting.

Multiple guests is fine, and it's been fine in the past. I'm assuming you're referencing Psy having very little speaking time, maybe I'm wrong, but multiple guests has been fine before, and I don't see any reason to specifically limit it to one. One thing to limit the cycling through many people for every question point you made, is to direct certain questions only at one or a few people, which JP already does occasionally.

I think #7 directly contradicts your #1, in that a bi-weekly podcast would mean it would be even longer, and it also means the topics are less up to date. Things that happened like 12-13 days ago would either be old news, or cut completely, and that is kinda lame. Also cutting it down to so few people would make it less entertaining as well I believe. Honestly point #7 just sounds like it'd water down the whole experience and make it not nearly as entertaining as it is now.

Also as far as #8, a shoutout on the daily would probably do much more than a retweet, if I had to guess.

Keep up the good work JP/everyone involved, if nothing else, this podcast is far and away the most hilarious starcraft content out there. I can't say I've ever cried laughing to anything else.

+ Show Spoiler +
Although Sean's "HUUUUK..... HUUUUUK.... BUTTFUUUUCK" during yesterday's daily was pretty close

Biweekly as in "twice a week". That's double the fun!

I totally understand your desire to hang out with these guys 24/7, but it's easier to convince friends to spend 45-60 minutes on a cool podcast than stuffing a 120 minute behemoth down their eardrums.
TheWoodLeagueAllstar
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United Kingdom617 Posts
September 29 2010 01:32 GMT
#757
Also its nice to see Tyler contribute more each week, he has a great understanding of the game and he seems to be getting alot more confident in his general smack talk with incontrol :D.
Bunker rushing is the way to a mans heart <3
chocopan
Profile Joined April 2010
Japan986 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-29 01:35:14
September 29 2010 01:34 GMT
#758
Great cast, thanks so much for all the work it no doubt takes!

I want to use a prev excellent post to make my comments.

The length is really pushing the limit for a podcast, as most people don't often have a 2-hour slot open in their daily lives. Streamlining the content is probably a good idea. If you feel some segments didn't work out all that well, consider cutting them out before release. I'd imagine this is a difficult choice, since there'll be listeners who think any Idra time is gold, but I'd probably have been happier never knowing about the lightning quiz, as an example. Quality over quantity, if you don't mind.


I actually like the length, but I appreciate diff people feel differently. There's nothing worse than having really knowledgable guests start a spiel on some interesting topic which they obviously have a strong opinion about, and then have the host cut them short to keep up to a timeplan. Given that you are one podcast lucky enough to be able to attract really top-tier guests, I'd be disappointed if you took the "we have a timelimit dammit" route. (Fair point re the lightning quiz though.)

...it starts getting tedious cycling through 6 people for every single question. It also affects listening comprehension, when you accidentally get so many people talking at once.


Strongly agree. There are probably good technical reasons but it seems like when one (or some) person(s) talk, other people automatically become muted, and that plus the audio quality means you can't really make much sense out of the sound once more than one person is talking excitedly. It's not like we can lip-read or anything. I tend to agree that a smaller panel would probably be the best solution, or just calming everyone down a bit in conversations (though this is somewhat against the freewheeling style of the 'cast, arguably).

Introduce people properly at the start of every episode, so new listeners know who's who.


This is actually a really good point. Since a lot of people have multiple names by which they are known, for new listeners it's probably a really good idea to make clear who is who even if it's only briefly. The host could do this in a few seconds at the start.

This podcast is a fantastic resource. There are a number of great casts out there now but this one is really alone in providing a forum/soapbox for the "sc2 royalty" as it were. (I can hear Day9 guffawing away already at that.) Thanks again for the work!
Dance those ultras
TheWoodLeagueAllstar
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United Kingdom617 Posts
September 29 2010 01:37 GMT
#759
Those mentioning the length have to look long term on this issue, i mentioned it above in my long ass ramble post but ill re-iterate it here. The issue isnt now, the issue is a few weeks from now, the mid to long term. The game is new now, there is lots to talk about, theres a patch, finals of the first gsl coming up, mlg, controversy and teams starting to take shape for the serious seasons to come. All this stuff will dim down into the new year, there will be tournaments, but not so many, there will be controversy, but not as much and the patches will come more sporadically. I think, from a personal point of view, its best to set the standard of expectation now, set the formula in motion so JP isnt thinking "well should we do a podcast this week? Theres not 2 hours of content to fill". There is no need to overreach and set unrealistic expectations during a period of sc2 where naturally there is so much to talk. I think a well structured hour long podcast with the 4 on show would be great personally, concise, easy to follow, no filler and no need to extend into areas, such as perhaps the lightning round, which while well intentioned were sort of....out of kilter with the idea of an sc2 show.
Bunker rushing is the way to a mans heart <3
TheWoodLeagueAllstar
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United Kingdom617 Posts
September 29 2010 01:42 GMT
#760
Also i had an idea for a new segment for the end of the show, its something which has been done on a very very popular uk sports show called "Fighting talk". Its called "defend the indefensible" and the concept is as it sounds, 2 people are pared up and have to defend a notion, even if they disagree with it and the host decides who wins. I think this would play well to the comedy of Incontrol, Day9 and Tyler where the have to defend a concept they dont agree with just to see if they can rationalise it.

For example

Incontrol you have 30 seconds to defend the notion "Warp Gate is imbalanced, it should be removed from the game"

Artosis you have 30 seconds to defend the notion "Zerglings are too powerful early game, they should be 1 supply per ling and speed boost should be hive tech"

Bunker rushing is the way to a mans heart <3
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