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TheNihilist
United States178 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:29 eNtitY~ wrote: I may have missed why, but why did he choose ITG over SotG? They didnt say but the assumption is that it is because ITG is an EG partnered program. Whether this is true or not, you'll have to be the judge. | ||
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Charger
United States2405 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:27 djWHEAT wrote: This could be the most hilarious comment I've ever read on TeamLiquid (and I mean that in the worst way possible). I have to almost assume that you are under 18 and have a hard time finding things to occupy your time with. File this comment away... wait a few years... get a job... maybe start a family... and then open this back and and we'll both chuckle together at how absolutely fucking ridiculous your comment is(was). I am 25 with a great IT job full time with a fiance. I am perpetually busy with work and outside of work. I have no idea how this is such a ridiculous statement, perhaps I phrased it wrong or you misunderstood. But if I wanted to 'refocus' on something and make more time for activity X to be the best at X as I possibly could, I wouldn't start with something I really enjoy doing that doesn't take up much of my time. I would work on finding things that take up huge chunks of time that is also not conducive to my goal of being the best at activity X. Perhaps you can also explain what is so ridiculous about my statement and provide your thoughts on it. | ||
NonY
8748 Posts
On May 26 2011 02:34 1Eris1 wrote: Anyone else find HuK's comment about zerg players learning to use infestors really stupid? Zergs didn't figure out how to use them...they got buffed. Really kinda sad these guys are starting to cry imba after just a couple of weeks (where zerg has won one tournament) when they have been dominating zergs for the past 2 months, and zerg players were just "bad and didn't know how to micro". Pretty hypocritical tbh. They got buffed and then zergs figured out how to use them. It's not easy to integrate new things. Infestors weren't being used in situations that they're being used in now. When a buff makes a unit good in situations that it was never used before then there's a delay between the change to the unit and players winning more because of the change. The delay is because players have to learn to use the unit in new situations. If stalker damage gets buffed, then I'm going to immediately start winning more games without having to change anything, since I've already been getting stalkers often and I don't have to do anything new to benefit from their extra damage. If carrier damage gets buffed, then I have a long grueling task ahead of me of figuring out when and how I'm going to integrate carriers into my play. For ZvP, infestor changes have been much more similar to a carrier buff than a stalker buff. No one was crying imba. One person said he thought one unit might be imbalanced. Outspoken players before us have set the stage for any discussion about the game to be viewed in the perspective you're now viewing it. It's a terrible perspective. Why aren't you interested in learning why we think the PvZ tables are turning? Or why are you more interested in seeing us proven wrong or hypocritical in some trivial respect? You are wrong if you think that any of us thinks the game is unfair or that a change is needed right now. The more accurate thing to say is that zerg is beginning to collectively outplay protoss. There's no frustration or ill feeling or whining or crying or anything from us like that about it. That you expect such feelings in this situation is indicative of how poorly so many outspoken people have handled these issues in the past. It's possible to share things with each other and learn things from each other without all that bullshit. By the way, I think calling someone out on being hypocritical when time has passed is worthless. Hypocrisy happens all at once. Hypocrisy is saying one thing and doing something contrary at about the same time or supporting two contrary things simultaneously. Keeping a record of every attitude and opinion and position about everything, and then calling someone a hypocrite every time you note a change is a waste of time. People evolve. If someone isn't changing opinions, they're likely lying or just don't have anything of value to add anymore. | ||
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Pekkz
Norway1505 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:29 eNtitY~ wrote: I may have missed why, but why did he choose ITG over SotG? Its not much of a choice since ITG is a EG sponsored show. | ||
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LagT_T
Argentina535 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:40 Charger wrote: I am 25 with a great IT job full time with a fiance. I am perpetually busy with work and outside of work. I have no idea how this is such a ridiculous statement, perhaps I phrased it wrong or you misunderstood. But if I wanted to 'refocus' on something and make more time for activity X to be the best at X as I possibly could, I wouldn't start with something I really enjoy doing that doesn't take up much of my time. I would work on finding things that take up huge chunks of time that is also not conducive to my goal of being the best at activity X. I too don't understand djwheat's post, but I understand Incontrol's position. He's running out of free time and he has to start sacrificing projects, and the easiest of them to sacrifice are those that produce no income. | ||
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djWHEAT
United States925 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:29 blackone wrote: It's not as "fucking ridiculous" if you read the entirety of his posts, instead of picking one sentence and making fun of it. Yes it is. Anytime someone says, "2 hours is no big deal" when they have no idea about the schedule of the individual is making a "fucking ridiculous" statement. That's just disrespectful and selfish to think that way. I wasn't making fun of it, I was stating the cold hard facts that 2 hours to some people is priceless, and to have someone come in and say, "PFFFT, 2 hours isn't shit" is completely uncalled for. This goes for anyone who dedicates time to the community whether it's a player, a caster, a writer, etc. | ||
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Pekkz
Norway1505 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:44 LagT_T wrote: I too don't understand djwheat's post, but I understand Incontrol's position. He's running out of free time and he has to start sacrificing projects, and the easiest of them to sacrifice are those that produce no income. It produces goodwill though. Alot of the opportunities that incontrol has gotten, comes from him showing his hilarious personality on SotG. | ||
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Beef Noodles
United States937 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:41 Liquid`Tyler wrote: They got buffed and then zergs figured out how to use them. It's not easy to integrate new things. Infestors weren't being used in situations that they're being used in now. When a buff makes a unit good in situations that it was never used before then there's a delay between the change to the unit and players winning more because of the change. The delay is because players have to learn to use the unit in new situations. If stalker damage gets buffed, then I'm going to immediately start winning more games without having to change anything, since I've already been getting stalkers often and I don't have to do anything new to benefit from their extra damage. If carrier damage gets buffed, then I have a long grueling task ahead of me of figuring out when and how I'm going to integrate carriers into my play. For ZvP, infestor changes have been much more similar to a carrier buff than a stalker buff. No one was crying imba. One person said he thought one unit might be imbalanced. Outspoken players before us have set the stage for any discussion about the game to be viewed in the perspective you're now viewing it. It's a terrible perspective. Why aren't you interested in learning why we think the PvZ tables are turning? Or why are you more interested in seeing us proven wrong or hypocritical in some trivial respect? You are wrong if you think that any of us thinks the game is unfair or that a change is needed right now. The more accurate thing to say is that zerg is beginning to collectively outplay protoss. There's no frustration or ill feeling or whining or crying or anything from us like that about it. That you expect such feelings in this situation is indicative of how poorly so many outspoken people have handled these issues in the past. It's possible to share things with each other and learn things from each other without all that bullshit. By the way, I think calling someone out on being hypocritical when time has passed is worthless. Hypocrisy happens all at once. Hypocrisy is saying one thing and doing something contrary at about the same time or supporting two contrary things simultaneously. Keeping a record of every attitude and opinion and position about everything, and then calling someone a hypocrite every time you note a change is a waste of time. People evolve. If someone isn't changing opinions, they're likely lying or just don't have anything of value to add anymore. Some of us are very interested in why you think the tables are turning. Is it because zergs are getting better at stopping midgame protoss attacks? I still see top players struggle against void ray collosus. How are the zergs you play against dealing with it? Is the increase in zerg aggression, all-ins, or drops helping turn the tables, or is it something else? Please tell us what you think! Some of us are really thankful to hear your opinions. | ||
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Kentakky
Sweden1272 Posts
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eNtitY~
United States1293 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:47 djWHEAT wrote: Yes it is. Anytime someone says, "2 hours is no big deal" when they have no idea about the schedule of the individual is making a "fucking ridiculous" statement. That's just disrespectful and selfish to think that way. I wasn't making fun of it, I was stating the cold hard facts that 2 hours to some people is priceless, and to have someone come in and say, "PFFFT, 2 hours isn't shit" is completely uncalled for. This goes for anyone who dedicates time to the community whether it's a player, a caster, a writer, etc. You are taking it to literal, the question derives from the notion that he could drop ITG instead of SotG. It becomes more obvious after realizing ITG is an EG sponsored show on why hes forced to drop SotG. It probably has MUCH less to do with time constraints as it does sponsor conflicts of interest. Which is half the reason why people are upset IMO. It's essentially like a major corporation coming in with money and closing down the Ma' and Pop shop down the road that you've loved for years. It sucks because that corporations food quality isn't better but they have the money to "buyout" the competition. | ||
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Aurdon
United States2007 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:49 Pekkz wrote: It produces goodwill though. Alot of the opportunities that incontrol has gotten, comes from him showing his hilarious personality on SotG. You could also argue the flip side of that. That SotG has been so successful because Incontrol took the time to be on the show. Incontrol has forever been one of the big personalities of the SC scene even before SC2 even came out of JP started up SotG. I think even without SotG Incontrol would have found the success and opportunities regardless. Incontrol just has that kind of drive and personality that creates his own success. | ||
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Aurdon
United States2007 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:51 eNtitY~ wrote: You are taking it to literal, the question derives from the notion that he could drop ITG instead of SotG. It becomes more obvious after realizing ITG is an EG sponsored show on why hes forced to drop SotG. It probably has MUCH less to do with time constraints as it does sponsor conflicts of interest. Which half the reason why people are upset IMO. It's essentially like a major corporation with money coming in and closing down the Ma' and Pop shop down the road that you've loved for years. It sucks because that corporations food quality isn't better but they have the money to "buyout" the competition. Why would a sponsor want LESS exposure for Incontrol, EG, and their brands. They basically get more exposure for sponsors if Incontrol does every project possible. If he could do both ITG and SotG, the sponsors would love it. More free mentions for them. More building of the Incontrol brand. It's time. Not some vast sponsor conspiracy. | ||
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Fingulfin
United States110 Posts
On May 26 2011 02:43 Tachion wrote: I'd have really loved to hear more from the Protoss hosts about infestors =\ They all agreed that they were super good, and borderline overpowered, but In what situations/unit compositions? I play a pretty basic roach/hydra/corruptor/drop style and I only manage to get like 2-3 infestors out when I'm nearing close to max, but now I feel like I'm playing the matchup completely wrong because I'm not utilizing infestors enough in my build. I have no idea where to start when it comes to changing it... Already been replied to, but the real answer is stop going Roach/Hydra/Corrupter. As soon as you hit lair tech, get that infestor tech going as quickly as (safely) possible. Quick mid game Infestors stop 6 gate, blink stalker shenanigans, DTs, Collossi pushes and weird voidray+gateway all ins. If your opponent goes Collossi, after you repel the first push (or if he turtles) get your spire going for some corrupter or muta action. Hydras are no longer part of the "core" ZvP build; they are used to punish a player who over-commits with stargate units (they allow you to allin and just roll him). If that is the case the game should end before infestors/deathballs become an issue. Standardish Z mid game builds are Infestor/Ling (which transitions into Infestor/Ling/Ultra), Roach/Infestor (which transitions into Roach/infestor/corrupter/brood lord) or Roach/Ling/Bling+Drops (with optional infestors for super effectiveness). If you are using a roach build and your opponent goes for immortals, research neural parasite. | ||
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djWHEAT
United States925 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:40 Charger wrote: I am 25 with a great IT job full time with a fiance. I am perpetually busy with work and outside of work. I have no idea how this is such a ridiculous statement, perhaps I phrased it wrong or you misunderstood. But if I wanted to 'refocus' on something and make more time for activity X to be the best at X as I possibly could, I wouldn't start with something I really enjoy doing that doesn't take up much of my time. I would work on finding things that take up huge chunks of time that is also not conducive to my goal of being the best at activity X. Perhaps you can also explain what is so ridiculous about my statement and provide your thoughts on it. I will try to explain. And let's go ahead and use Geoff as an example. Here is a player who is obviously extending himself beyond being a pro himself. He has involvement in NASL, he participates in several things related to EG (like special events, appearances, etc), he tries to maintain his pro-status (which most certainly involves heavy amounts of practice), he continues his role as a coach, and this doesn't even include anytime for him to spend with Anna, have freetime, etc. Here is a person who is obviously dealing with the heavy stress of time management. Without knowing the full details of his schedule, it's incredibly insulting to have someone say, "how can you not give up 2 hours?" Why? Because without having intimate knowledge of his/her schedule it's not fair to make that statement. How do you know that he isn't already giving up time in other things (in order to make room for everything else he is involved with)? How you spend and manage your time is yours... and you more than anyone know what you can and cannot do. So when someone comes in and makes a comment like that, it's really disrespectful to said individual because they may already be giving up precious time in order to accommodate everything they are already involved in. Geoff has said before that he wished he had more time to practice, maybe he just wants some more freetime to himself... only Geoff can answer that. But believe me, if Geoff ever came and said, "Hey man, I can't cast this night because of this..." I'm certainly not going to go, "Dude Geoff really? It's only 2 hours"... and maybe that's because as a guy who is also stretched thin with time, I can really respect and appreciate the fact that he donates ANY of his time to the community. You have a plan for how you manage your time, but that doesn't mean everyone has the same flexibility as you. I just want people to realize that the time in which players, coaches, event organizers, casters, etc give to this community is very valuable, and it hurts to see people belittle that. TL;DR - without any intimate knowledge of a person's personal schedule, you shouldn't be telling them how they should spend their time | ||
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Rmdy
23 Posts
but saving time for more practise is understandable and it's obvious, that he's not gonna stop doing ad-shoots, eg-casting and the like, so stepping back from sotg is the logical choice here i suppose. | ||
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mav451
United States1596 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:41 Liquid`Tyler wrote: By the way, I think calling someone out on being hypocritical when time has passed is worthless. Hypocrisy happens all at once. Hypocrisy is saying one thing and doing something contrary at about the same time or supporting two contrary things simultaneously. Keeping a record of every attitude and opinion and position about everything, and then calling someone a hypocrite every time you note a change is a waste of time. People evolve. If someone isn't changing opinions, they're likely lying or just don't have anything of value to add anymore. This is actually an incredibly wise statement. Not just in SC, but also in politics. Alot of people like to parrot stuff that they read on the internet - these guys are easy to identify. As Tyler said, however, people who allow their thinking to change and be fluid with updated information - those opinions actually matter. The parrots on the Internet will come and go, that's just life. That said, anything put out on the internet is forever, so even if a statement is >10 years ago, people will still continue to bring it up - even if it isn't relevant anymore. Sad? Yeah it is. The GIF that Tyler put on his Twitter mirrors my view about arguing on the Internet in general though. Usually it's a waste of time to argue. Doesn't mean it's not fun...but it's usually not fruitful. That's the difference. There's also a great line from a recent GoT episode, + Show Spoiler [Episode 7] + "a lion doesn't concern himself with the opinion of the sheep" | ||
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Stiver
Canada285 Posts
However, I also feel like ITG is a shorter show more focused on the strategic aspects of the game. SOTG is more a general discussion on all aspects of the community. IncontroL being on a show where He talks about different strategies is far more focused then talking about people being stupid over KellyMilkies or Totalbiscuit, etc. ITG is good for a player to be on consistently, talking and analyzing teh game. Between the two if I had limited time I'd say ITG is the better choice. Remember half the SOTG cast doesn't even play the game professionally (jp/Day9) and when Kennegit or hotbid are on the show the level of depth they can go into the game is extremely limited. That's my take on it. | ||
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eNtitY~
United States1293 Posts
On May 26 2011 03:55 Aurdon wrote: Why would a sponsor want LESS exposure for Incontrol, EG, and their brands. They basically get more exposure for sponsors if Incontrol does every project possible. If he could do both ITG and SotG, the sponsors would love it. More free mentions for them. More building of the Incontrol brand. It's time. Not some vast sponsor conspiracy. Conflicts of interest, EG would benefit more from getting thousands more viewers on their show than they would from iNcontroL mentioning them at the end of each SotG... | ||
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Noocta
France12578 Posts
On May 25 2011 20:34 chaokel wrote: Naniwa i hope, he was absolutely hillarious in the after game cast on huk's stream. (though i doubt it) Don't forget, SotG for european is at 5h30am. | ||
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freetgy
1720 Posts
i think its energy requirement should be a tad higher. i don't mind fungal on protoss, just spread better spread get more durable units. but being able to overtake colossus/immortal/archon while keeping the enemy locked with fungal is borderline...blink/charge feels almost useless these days. there is nothing to stop well microed infestors. While feedback is great, getting safely in range is almost impossible. (Ht beeing slower, and infestor beeing able to burrow) you also can't drop HTs to feedback cause fungal prevents the drop ability of warpprisms. | ||
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