Why is Zerg played less? - Page 3

On August 11 2010 00:36 tacrats wrote:


Angry? Im actually laughing at the fact you think your 'statistics' prove anything at all. And the fact that you continue to link back to them as if they were actually informative at one point is hysterical.

You are ignorant to believe that the data you link to supports balance.

The only data that would prove balance is unavailable. But you dont seem to understand that.

On August 11 2010 00:39 kajeus wrote:

Would you like to debunk my arguments somewhere?

I have explained time and time again how this is very reliable evidence. Nothing is "proven".

Diamond-level win-ratios are equal across all races. Zergs are as well-represented in diamond as they are in the general population. What does this evidence seem to say to you?

On the other hand, there is absolutely no statistical evidence that zerg is underpowered.

On August 11 2010 00:36 tacrats wrote:


Angry? Im actually laughing at the fact you think your 'statistics' prove anything at all. And the fact that you continue to link back to them as if they were actually informative at one point is hysterical.

You are ignorant to believe that the data you link to supports balance.

The only data that would prove balance is unavailable. But you dont seem to understand that.

On August 11 2010 00:39 kajeus wrote:

Would you like to debunk my arguments somewhere?

I have explained time and time again how this is very reliable evidence. Nothing is "proven".

Diamond-level win-ratios are equal across all races. Zergs are as well-represented in diamond as they are in the general population. What does this evidence seem to say to you?

On the other hand, there is absolutely no statistical evidence that zerg is underpowered.

On August 11 2010 00:36 Drowsy wrote:



These reasons are frequently cited, but this is also observable in brood war, yet the discrepancy seems magnified in sc2.

On top of the factors you listed, I'd add terrible design, underpowered, "FOTMness", and most importantly the pace of play is different. Remember that a lot of sc2 players are former war3 players and wow players. In sc2, more so than in sc, zerg does better in long high econ games. Most players from those games aren't used to managing long high econ games and prefer to 4-gate and have the game decided in 10 minutes rather than deal with messy multitasking, positioning, and macro management. It also rewards the exact opposite skills as t and p, you need patience above all to play zerg and I can see why most people won't play the race just based on that. In sc one could play zerg with some aggression and have it pay off, so weaker and newer players weren't immediately put off. In sc2 you can't really do this and you're in a purely reactive position in every matchup early game.

They really just kind of dropped the ball on zerg design. They took out the most pivotal and interesting units from broodwar and the units they added are pretty lackluster. I think we'd be looking at a much different picture if there was a GOD DAMN LURKER.

On August 11 2010 00:43 teamsolid wrote:

People have debunked your arguments countless times, you just choose to ignore them so you can flaunt them in multiple threads like this one like an idiot. The ONLY thing equal win %'s mean is that the MM is doing its job and matching every player with an opponent near his skill level. Get that through your thick skull and stop trolling with your so called "statistics".

Also, statistics are not needed when there are plenty of high level Terran and Protoss players who agree that something needs to be changed in ZvT.

On August 11 2010 00:46 tacrats wrote:


You are so ignorant its amazing.

Sorry i cannot provide the statistical evidence required to prove it as i do not have access to blizzards servers.

Do you know how easy it is to get into diamond? Do you know how many diamond players play platinum players often? Do you know that within diamond there are noob diamonds and top diamond? Do you not understand how these things skew the data? I beat noob terrans all the time, but good ones i lose to almost all the time. But your 'data' would show i have a 50/50 win ratio which is perfect right? Which is exactly what we would expect right? Oh wait isnt that what matchmaking tries to do? Get me to 50% wins?

But wait, does that fuck up your argument as you cant rely on a statistic of my win ratios vs terran since bnet matches me against lower skilled people to compensate for losing against better players? But i am still in diamond? Yeah, i think it does.

Damn, you just dont get it do you? Do you even play this game? Do you see how matchmaking works? Do you know anything outside of your 'stats 101 divide this number by this number to get a percent' arguments?

On August 11 2010 00:43 teamsolid wrote:

People have debunked your arguments countless times, you just choose to ignore them so you can flaunt them in multiple threads like this one like an idiot. The ONLY thing equal win %'s mean is that the MM is doing its job and matching every player with an opponent near his skill level. Get that through your thick skull and stop trolling with your so called "statistics".

Also, statistics are not needed when there are plenty of high level Terran and Protoss players who agree that something needs to be changed in ZvT.

On August 11 2010 00:39 kajeus wrote:

Would you like to debunk my arguments somewhere?

I have explained time and time again how this is very reliable evidence. Nothing is "proven".

Diamond-level win-ratios are equal across all races. Zergs are as well-represented in diamond as they are in the general population. What does this evidence seem to say to you?

On the other hand, there is absolutely no statistical evidence that zerg is underpowered.

On August 11 2010 00:46 tacrats wrote:


You are so ignorant its amazing.

Sorry i cannot provide the statistical evidence required to prove it as i do not have access to blizzards servers.

Do you know how easy it is to get into diamond? Do you know how many diamond players play platinum players often? Do you know that within diamond there are noob diamonds and top diamond? Do you not understand how these things skew the data? I beat noob terrans all the time, but good ones i lose to almost all the time. But your 'data' would show i have a 50/50 win ratio which is perfect right? Which is exactly what we would expect right? Oh wait isnt that what matchmaking tries to do? Get me to 50% wins?

But wait, does that fuck up your argument as you cant rely on a statistic of my win ratios vs terran since bnet matches me against lower skilled people to compensate for losing against better players? But i am still in diamond? Yeah, i think it does.

Damn, you just dont get it do you? Do you even play this game? Do you see how matchmaking works? Do you know anything outside of your 'stats 101 divide this number by this number to get a percent' arguments?

On August 11 2010 00:47 OverTheUnder wrote:


ok, I guess I'm clueless. Where are all these threads/posts/interviews or w/e saying the ZvT is terribly imbalanced?

On August 11 2010 00:46 tacrats wrote:


You are so ignorant its amazing.

Sorry i cannot provide the statistical evidence required to prove it as i do not have access to blizzards servers.

Do you know how easy it is to get into diamond? Do you know how many diamond players play platinum players often? Do you know that within diamond there are noob diamonds and top diamond? Do you not understand how these things skew the data? I beat noob terrans all the time, but good ones i lose to almost all the time. But your 'data' would show i have a 50/50 win ratio which is perfect right? Which is exactly what we would expect right? Oh wait isnt that what matchmaking tries to do? Get me to 50% wins?

But wait, does that fuck up your argument as you cant rely on a statistic of my win ratios vs terran since bnet matches me against lower skilled people to compensate for losing against better players? But i am still in diamond? Yeah, i think it does.

Damn, you just dont get it do you? Do you even play this game? Do you see how matchmaking works? Do you know anything outside of your 'stats 101 divide this number by this number to get a percent' arguments?