• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 20:47
CEST 02:47
KST 09:47
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins Maestros of the Game 213ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7
Community News
MC vs IdrA, Boxer vs Nal_rA to be Legacy Matches @ BlizzCon315.0.16 Hotfix (June 30) - Balance + Bug Fixes36Weekly Cups (June 22-28): Zergs thrive in new patch5[TLMC] Summer 2026 Ladder Map Rotation05.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start)99
StarCraft 2
General
5.0.16 Hotfix (June 30) - Balance + Bug Fixes Serral wins Maestros of the Game 2 Weekly Cups (June 22-28): Zergs thrive in new patch MC vs IdrA, Boxer vs Nal_rA to be Legacy Matches @ BlizzCon HomeStory Cup In Early July
Tourneys
HomeStory Cup 29 Vespene Cup #1 — $300+ USD, July 10 Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28) Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery Mutation # 530 One For All
Brood War
General
FlaShFTW vs A.Alm Grudge Match Event BW General Discussion Farewell Beloved Starcraft (Youtube Videos) BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool
Tourneys
Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 The Casual Games of the Week Thread [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Grand Finals
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies Why doesn't anyone use restoration?
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Dawn of War IV Summer Games Done Quick 2026! ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance TL Mafia Community Thread TL Mafia Power Rank Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Men's Fashion Thread
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard? Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Listen To The Coaches!
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 22829 users

Patch 12 - Changes and Discussion - Page 9

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 7 8 9 10 11 79 Next
Jyvblamo
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
Canada13788 Posts
May 13 2010 18:04 GMT
#161
I think we'll be seeing a whole lot more speedlings/banelings in ZvT/Z now, but I'm not sure how Zs will respond to this change in ZvP. Maybe more spires?
Jdanzi
Profile Joined March 2010
England78 Posts
May 13 2010 18:04 GMT
#162
On May 14 2010 03:04 AssuredVacancy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2010 03:03 Jdanzi wrote:
On May 14 2010 03:02 FrozenArbiter wrote:
On May 14 2010 03:00 Jdanzi wrote:
wow, some zergs will have to do more than make 200 roaches to win games, might even have to unit mix. This encourages zergs to use their tech switching versatility to win games as opposed to overwhelming with sheer numbers of roaches.

Great, the race supposed to be all about overwhelming numbers will now have smaller armies than Terran.


My bad I forgot zerglings now cost 2 supply.


My bad I forgot zerglings are now GOOD.


now good? they've always been good lol.
Foreplay
Profile Joined May 2008
United States1154 Posts
May 13 2010 18:04 GMT
#163
srsly 2 supply for roach? does zerg have anymore 1 supply units left? they're zerg for christ sake.
Better than Pokebunny
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
May 13 2010 18:04 GMT
#164
On May 14 2010 03:01 lolaloc wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2010 02:59 Aberacht wrote:
[image loading]

I can't wait until Blizzard just makes it as small as a Goliath.

We are starting to get there. Take it as a bad sign if they actually start calling it a goliath. Name makes more sense for a big unit than thor anyway.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
kapriel
Profile Joined March 2010
Bulgaria15 Posts
May 13 2010 18:04 GMT
#165
I don't understand why is the Thor change considered a buff?
BigDatez
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada434 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-13 18:06:18
May 13 2010 18:04 GMT
#166
On May 14 2010 03:01 StarBrift wrote:
Roaches are still going to be a viable 2 base tank unit that takes the brunt of the damage. The only change is that you actually ahve to pop an overlord or two extra when massing them. Anyone who made roaches early game was going all in anyway.

How does this change affect ZvT at all? Speedling / spines into lair is what the standard build is. Going roaches early against terran has allways been a huge gamble because of the posibility of a marauder counter before your lair tech hits.

The roach is now fixed in its roll as a tanking unit.



Spire tech was a TERRIBLE choice vs T due to thors AOE AA attack, and broodlords are so lategame, that the T will just scan your puny army and crush you now that you can barely have nearly as many roaches.


I don't understand why is the Thor change considered a buff?


Much easier to manage, Now every unit for Z in ZvT is quite useless, mutas even more so.
Video games > sex (Proven fact)
Piy
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Scotland3152 Posts
May 13 2010 18:04 GMT
#167
Thank god no tank or void ray nerf. I was really worried they'd nerf one of them.
My. Copy. Is. Here.
Crissaegrim
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
2947 Posts
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#168
On May 14 2010 03:02 Nyxs wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2010 02:59 Crissaegrim wrote:
Protoss forge nerf - proving that blizz needs to nerf protoss in every patch...even if they dont know what else to nerf lol.

Zerg - Roach nerf...not too bad but I suppose they'll buff zerglings or...wait for it...ultralisks to compensate.

Terran - There was an article saying that terran is the strongest race...slowly agreeing to that now...


A fucking Ultralisk balancing out a t1 unit wait what ?

Seriously don't understand what to do with the Roaches now since they nerfed them to oblivion what's their function now ?


Aww c'mon...you should know how Blizz thinks or rather how dustin browder thinks right?
Attica
Profile Joined February 2010
United States277 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-13 18:06:14
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#169
Blizzard's Quote on roach change

"Roach - Supply count increased from 1 to 2.

Roaches are just too mighty to be a 1 supply unit. In 200 supply battles Roaches can be very difficult to deal with even with the correct counters in play by protoss or terran players. "

Might have been too good at 1 food but I feel like they are too weak to be 2 food. Should just make them 3 food and hatch 2 out of an egg.
Phlatline
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Croatia176 Posts
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#170
so dumb zerg nerf.
kickinhead
Profile Joined December 2008
Switzerland2069 Posts
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#171
On May 14 2010 03:02 FrozenArbiter wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2010 03:00 Jdanzi wrote:
wow, some zergs will have to do more than make 200 roaches to win games, might even have to unit mix. This encourages zergs to use their tech switching versatility to win games as opposed to overwhelming with sheer numbers of roaches.

Great, the race supposed to be all about overwhelming numbers will now have smaller armies than Terran.


Z still has Zlings.... ^^'

But really: How long until Blizzard realizes that they need to get rid of the roaches, move Hydras back to T1 (but make them weaker in some way) and just add a nice T2-Unit.

Or why not move Roaches to T2 and give them the Tunneling-Claws+Burrow by default and move Hydras to T1. Then, maybe add a nice Upgrade for another Unit, like tunnelling claws for Hydras or sth to replace the Upgrade for the raoches et. voilà - much better already!
https://soundcloud.com/thesamplethief
Liquid`Jinro
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Sweden33719 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-13 18:05:50
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#172
On May 14 2010 03:03 Jdanzi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2010 03:02 FrozenArbiter wrote:
On May 14 2010 03:00 Jdanzi wrote:
wow, some zergs will have to do more than make 200 roaches to win games, might even have to unit mix. This encourages zergs to use their tech switching versatility to win games as opposed to overwhelming with sheer numbers of roaches.

Great, the race supposed to be all about overwhelming numbers will now have smaller armies than Terran.


My bad I forgot zerglings now cost 2 supply.

Because massing zerglings instead of massing roaches is just soooooooooo much better.
Moderatortell the guy that interplanatar interaction is pivotal to terrans variety of optionitudals in the pre-midgame preperatories as well as the protosstinal deterriggation of elite zergling strikes - Stimey n | Formerly FrozenArbiter
StriverzG
Profile Joined March 2010
United States115 Posts
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#173
they nerfed forge bc of cannon rush in pvp, very hard to stop
Sun Tzu once said..
ZenDeX
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Philippines2916 Posts
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#174
On May 14 2010 03:03 SensFaiL wrote:
well looks like ZvZ will just be lings/banelings now

Hell yes. That's the way I like it. I hate it when my opponent switches to roaches.
Mr.Pyro
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Denmark959 Posts
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#175
On May 14 2010 03:04 kapriel wrote:
I don't understand why is the Thor change considered a buff?


Because what was holding thors back was that they could never quite reach their destination.
P⊧[1]<a>[2]<a>[3]<a>tt | P ≝ 1.a.2.a.3.a.P
Zelniq
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
United States7166 Posts
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#176
i'm confident the reason why there's almost no other changes to the game is just to see exactly how this single change effects the entire game..because they understand the gravity of it

tbh, as a zerg player, i'm pleased with this change. people became a little too dependent on roaches, this is the single best change to 'diversify zerg' that i can see.

however some changes to other units are probably in order, melee vs force field is a major issue for one, ultralisks are obviously another, etc
ModeratorBlame yourself or God
Artisan
Profile Joined February 2010
United States336 Posts
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#177
The only change that made sense was reducing thor size =(
willeesmalls
Profile Joined March 2010
United States477 Posts
May 13 2010 18:05 GMT
#178
I think Roaches were nerfed to make room for ultras to take their role. Now roaches will just never be used.

Does blizzard know what they are doing? they just completely removed a unit from the game.
MindRush
Profile Joined April 2010
Romania916 Posts
May 13 2010 18:06 GMT
#179
On May 14 2010 02:51 MrRey wrote:
Where is the ultralisk change they talked about?
We need that ultralisk buff or the roach nerf is just too much


the roach WAS nerfed
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
Ghazwan
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Netherlands444 Posts
May 13 2010 18:06 GMT
#180
I am no pro or anything but looking at my supply count was a good way to assess my army strength during a game or to guess where my opponent might be tech-wise, army-wise.
This roach change will take time to get used to as it might now give a false sense of having a strong army or I might screw up my timings
Prev 1 7 8 9 10 11 79 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
Crank Gathers S4: Qualifiers
CranKy Ducklings96
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ViBE220
Nina 146
ProTech101
StarCraft: Brood War
NaDa 16
Bale 9
League of Legends
Doublelift3758
Counter-Strike
summit1g10111
Other Games
shahzam399
C9.Mang0358
JimRising 180
Maynarde122
Mew2King71
UpATreeSC49
JuggernautJason20
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream144
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP116
• Hupsaiya 94
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Stunt239
Upcoming Events
HomeStory Cup
10h 13m
Replay Cast
23h 13m
HomeStory Cup
1d 10h
OSC
1d 12h
WardiTV Weekly
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
CrankTV Team League
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
CrankTV Team League
6 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S3: W1
Douyu Cup 2026
Murky Cup 2026

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 2
SCTL 2026 Spring
HSC XXIX
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026

Upcoming

CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
Escore Tournament S3: W2
ASL Season 22:Wild Card Qualifier
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E3
Eternal Conflict S2 E2
Heroes Pulsing #3
Eternal Conflict S2 E1
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.