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Adrenal Glands is a joke - Page 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
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internetwarrior
Profile Joined February 2010
32 Posts
March 02 2010 17:50 GMT
#41
The point, and the problem, is that zerglings pretty much become obsolete by end game.
Part of SC's accomplishments was keeping most t1 units useful all game long.

Hopefully they get tweaked in some way shape or form.
spinesheath
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Germany8679 Posts
March 02 2010 17:51 GMT
#42
Well it does if they are killed twice as quickly because of splash. And if they can't even get close thanks to force field...
If you have a good reason to disagree with the above, please tell me. Thank you.
Excalibur_Z
Profile Joined October 2002
United States12240 Posts
March 02 2010 17:51 GMT
#43
On March 02 2010 21:00 lololol wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2010 19:06 caution.slip wrote:
Taken from http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=114249 third page

relative parts bolded

On March 02 2010 09:12 Mystlord wrote:
On March 02 2010 08:32 Yurebis wrote:
Is there any hard data that zerglings and zealots do in fact have the same dps in sc2 compared to sc1?

It seems to me zerglings attack a lot slower in sc2 even with adrenal upgrade, like 3.5 attacks per second when in sc1 it was like 5.

Look at my previous post. Absolute DPS doesn't matter in this case, what matters is relative DPS, of which it's now 2:1 instead of 3:1.

And since you brought up the Adrenal upgrade:

SC1:
Normal Zergling Cooldown - 8
Normal Zealot Cooldown - 22
Adrenal Zergling Cooldown - 6
Ratio w/o Adrenal - 2.75:1
Ratio w/ Adrenal - 3.6667

SC2:
Normal Zergling Cooldown - .696
Normal Zealot Cooldown - 1.2
Adrenal Zergling Cooldown - .587
Ratio w/o Adrenal - 1.724:1
Ratio w/ Adrenal - 2.044

So yes, Zerglings suck relative balls against Zealots now. Your primary damage dealers should come from other sources.

If you want hard DPS numbers, take the damage values for Zerglings and Zealot, divide them by the cooldowns I just gave you, and tada~. I reiterate that ling DPS decreases dramatically compared to Zealots since losing 1 ling is pretty big.


so SC1 was a 25% increased attack speed. SC2 is ~16%? doesn't the adrenal tooltip say 20%

maybe attack cooldown != attack speed...


It's 33.(3)% attack speed increase in SC1(25% cooldown, but the number of attacks in the same time period increase by 33.(3)%) and just 18.57% in SC2(if the values given are correct).


That's right. Personally, though, I always found Adrenal to be an extremely overpowered upgrade. The difference in ling damage output is extremely noticeable and completely transforms lings from being annoying and elusive pests to miniature killing machines, all from one upgrade that doesn't even take much time to research. I think it needed a nerf, and is probably going to be in a better position overall in SC2, particularly in light of what Klockan said regarding the improved pathing.
Moderator
Foreplay
Profile Joined May 2008
United States1154 Posts
March 02 2010 17:52 GMT
#44
noo blizzard stop ruining my race
Better than Pokebunny
InToTheWannaB
Profile Joined September 2002
United States4770 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-02 18:03:41
March 02 2010 18:03 GMT
#45
Why do people assume this is something that needs fixing? With auto surround+mass unit selection. If lings attacked the same as in SC1 they may just beat everything on the ground. If Adrenal not worth the 200/200 investment early anymore thats fine. Just get your plus 3 attack ups, and then Adrenal last. Just because your not geting the upgrades in the same order as BW does not mean its wrong lol.
When the spirit is not altogether slain, great loss teaches men and women to desire greatly, both for themselves and for others.
Teejing
Profile Joined January 2009
Germany1360 Posts
March 02 2010 18:07 GMT
#46
Cracklings are my fav unit, i do not see me playing zerg without cracklings : /
internetwarrior
Profile Joined February 2010
32 Posts
March 02 2010 18:11 GMT
#47
As some people already pointed out, being able to fit more Zerglings into a small space ALSO means they get owned harder by all types of splash damage. Not that awesome if you actually think about it past the OMG IMBA LINGS OMG knee jerk stuff being thrown around here.
onmach
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States1241 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-02 19:30:10
March 02 2010 19:29 GMT
#48
Zerglings are already more obsolete now than ever. A lot of things in SC2 have way more armor than they did in the first game. Terran buildings have an armour upgrade of what, plus 2? Immortals and collosus get +2 per armour/shield upgrade if I'm not mistaken. Some units like roach start with 2 armour. It used to be that lings with crack could be relied upon to kill most things, but now that's no longer the case. They need adrenal more than ever to remain viable late game.
wintergt
Profile Joined February 2010
Belgium1335 Posts
March 02 2010 19:35 GMT
#49
On March 03 2010 04:29 onmach wrote:
Zerglings are already more obsolete now than ever.

This is so wrong. Discounting mirrors (don't watch them much), most zerg players are making zerglings all throughout every match. Lots more than roaches.
here i am
ArC_man
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States2798 Posts
March 02 2010 20:25 GMT
#50
I completely agree that Adrenal is garbage currently. Not only does it cost 200/200, but it also requires Hive tech (so it's not fair comparing it to a level 2 weapons upgrade)! It was the upgrade that made zerglings viable at hive tech in BW, it should at least somewhat retain that essence in SC2.
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