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Just a theory, up for discussion. Contribute but don't completely flame if you disagree 
Anyway, even with only the BETA out Sc2 is killing the foreign Sc1 scene, professionally anyway. Just about every foreign "pro" has more or less quit Sc1 and is practicing the hell out of Sc2. IdrA said he talked with CJ to get him practicing Sc2 immediately. Other notable ppl like Morrow and Nony have completely turned to Sc2.
Yet in Korea the general consensus among pros seems to be "wait to see what reception Sc2 gets and then start playing if the reception is positive". Why are foreigners switching to Sc2 so zealously in comparison?
My random theory is that pro gaming is very results driven, and unless ur at the very top you won't get much reward for your hard work. Korean Sc1 is just so far ahead. Even IdrA, whose skills demolish foreign players not called Ret or Escape key, is stuck in the B team. Have foreigns realized that if they're going to get any global recognition and be at the very top their only chance is to begin fresh in Sc2? If anything they have an advantage over Koreans in that they're starting a few months ahead of time. In Sc1 I don't think any foreigner has a chance to compete with the top Koreans
Anyway my Beta download nears completion ( :D), so just something I wrote to kill time lol.
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On March 01 2010 23:27 SubtleArt wrote:
Yet in Korea the general consensus among pros seems to be "wait to see what reception Sc2 gets and then start playing if the reception is positive". Why are foreigners switching to Sc2 so zealously in comparison?
They are going to need the head start.
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To be honest once you play SC2 you really can't go back to SC1. You start getting used to this new game and how it works and it's nothing like SC1. The game has so many new opportunities and everyone is trying to exploit the best strategies. Why bother playing SC when SC2 is nearly here?
I did try to play SC a week ago and it's like looking at an inferior game. Besides SC2 is so much fun to play!
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Koreans are paid to play BW. They have a lot to lose, and huge organizational overhead when switching to SC2. I find it very understandable that they first want to see if SC2 is worth the risk. Foreigners mostly just play for fun. There's almost no money involved in foreign BW, so why not try something new which has a good chance of replacing it?
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Is SC2 really that good, Amber?
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On March 01 2010 23:31 Amber[LighT] wrote:
To be honest once you play SC2 you really can't go back to SC1. You start getting used to this new game and how it works and it's nothing like SC1. The game has so many new opportunities and everyone is trying to exploit the best strategies. Why bother playing SC when SC2 is nearly here?
I did try to play SC a week ago and it's like looking at an inferior game. Besides SC2 is so much fun to play!
Because Sc1 is sill an amazing game? I still play supreme commander and Age of Empires 3...why bother playing them too?
On March 01 2010 23:37 Scorch wrote:
Koreans are paid to play BW. They have a lot to lose, and huge organizational overhead when switching to SC2. I find it very understandable that they first want to see if SC2 is worth the risk. Foreigners mostly just play for fun. There's almost no money involved in foreign BW, so why not try something new which has a good chance of replacing it?
Precisely. Foreign BW players still put a TON of hours into the game, and I'm sure they would all love to be able to play in OSL and MSL but with the skill gap so big its more or less impossible. Thus switch to Sc2 and you have a chance
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Why bother playing SC:BW when the money will be in SC2 ?? The foreign BW scene has always been weak apart from the recent TSLs.
Alot of people have hopes that major tournaments and organizations will pick up SC2 since it'll be the game that brings the SC and Wc3 community together and that is why they are making the switch.
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I think most of them came to the conclusion that with SC2 theres the chance of winnings, while with the release of SC2 BW basically will have none.
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i think after 12 years of slugging it out in one game, when the sequel comes out, you can expect anyone and everyone who loved sc1 to play the hell out of sc2 for atleast a few weeks. After that if starcraft 2 is good enough, it will take over from sc1... It's to be expected and isn't definitely a bad thing. Be open minded yo, change is good =]
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Pretty sure this is all about the Benjamins.
However, once people realize that not everybody is going to be successful at SC2, people might also come back if SC2 sucks (as happened with WC3; pretty much everybody tried that too).
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Because its 2 and not 1.
2>1, 3>2, 4>3, etc...
I also think that Starcraft outside of Korea was already in its end cycle for the last year or two, if not more.
We are also beginning to see that Starcarft is also loosing ground in Korea almost a year now.
Less and less crowds at team matches, smaller and smaller arenas for individual leagues and even the grand finals are being played out in smaller arenas.
If Starcraft 2 is not going to replace Starcraft 1, I don't know what will. Probably nothing until the whole scene dies out.
Though there are signs that SC2 could take off good in the E-Sports area globally and we see Zotac - Chinese company hosting SC2 beta tournament, few other e-sports organizations showing interest in the beta and so on...
I also think that teamliquid.net is well positioned to make the most of SC2, with huge profits from Advertisement and more tournaments.
But overall if Blizzard are not too greedy and play-out this right, they will be making the biggest profits out of SC2 tournaments.
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I just hope sc2 doesn't become the RTS equivalent of CS:S
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Artosis
United States2140 Posts
On March 01 2010 23:27 SubtleArt wrote:
Yet in Korea the general consensus among pros seems to be "wait to see what reception Sc2 gets and then start playing if the reception is positive". Why are foreigners switching to Sc2 so zealously in comparison?
thats the first thing wrong with this. where did u hear that? its completely untrue/made up. EDIT: if you heard this from any sort of interview or something like that...what it really means is 'my team will tell me what to do.'
we are all switching over because support for sc1 is leaving immediately. sc2 will take over all rts tournaments. it is time for the top foreigner pros to actually make money for playing a video game. they are 999999x more talented than the top pros of almost every single other "professional esport" yet make no money or real fame for their sacrifice. now they will.
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SC2 killing SC1 doesn't need theorizing. I'm surprised there's even discussion about it.
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i lost all my skill when i started playing protoss so i cant really go back even if i wanted to 
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On March 01 2010 23:52 Artosis wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 23:27 SubtleArt wrote:
Yet in Korea the general consensus among pros seems to be "wait to see what reception Sc2 gets and then start playing if the reception is positive". Why are foreigners switching to Sc2 so zealously in comparison?
thats the first thing wrong with this. where did u hear that? its completely untrue/made up. EDIT: if you heard this from any sort of interview or something like that...what it really means is 'my team will tell me what to do.' we are all switching over because support for sc1 is leaving immediately. sc2 will take over all rts tournaments. it is time for the top foreigner pros to actually make money for playing a video game. they are 999999x more talented than the top pros of almost every single other "professional esport" yet make no money or real fame for their sacrifice. now they will.
How much money do people serious think its gonna be in SC2? I mean sure some people will make lots of it, but now its like everyone and their grandmother think they can just change game and rack up the big bucks regardless if hundreds of others are thinking the same not to mention the huge pool of untapped potential new great players that will get into this game. The number of foreigners who makes more than 5k$ a year will probably be real low, still everyone (even mediocre players from the foreign scene) expect to be making a living from SC2, while it probably will just end up like in BW with the same few people winning all the big tournaments.
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Artosis
United States2140 Posts
ok? so? no one in sc1 makes more than 5k a year cept idra. a few will. so they switch. the entire scene moving over is good + healthy.
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Fresh game, new things to learn, even playing field, most important game rts for the next 10 years easily. Makes sense to play it as you know your gonna be playing it for years and everyone has the same chance of succeeding in it long term. The newbies of today may very well be the esports stars of tomorrow.
I don't see there being big bucks to be made unless there are pay to play tournaments to have decent prize pools often.
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On March 01 2010 23:52 Artosis wrote:
we are all switching over because support for sc1 is leaving immediately. sc2 will take over all rts tournaments. it is time for the top foreigner pros to actually make money for playing a video game. they are 999999x more talented than the top pros of almost every single other "professional esport" yet make no money or real fame for their sacrifice. now they will.
I really like the way Artosis put this, I agree completely.
More over, people who still play BW competitively, even much at much lower levels than the top foreigns (e.g. any rank of ICC/anyone who posts here) do so partially because they love competition. SC2 will have the infrastructure and sponsorship needed to allow competition to reach a whole new level, even for those players who are not going to be directly competing for cash prizes or Blizzard's "Pro" ladder. I personally can't wait.
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On March 01 2010 23:52 Artosis wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 23:27 SubtleArt wrote:
Yet in Korea the general consensus among pros seems to be "wait to see what reception Sc2 gets and then start playing if the reception is positive". Why are foreigners switching to Sc2 so zealously in comparison?
thats the first thing wrong with this. where did u hear that? its completely untrue/made up. EDIT: if you heard this from any sort of interview or something like that...what it really means is 'my team will tell me what to do.' we are all switching over because support for sc1 is leaving immediately. sc2 will take over all rts tournaments. it is time for the top foreigner pros to actually make money for playing a video game. they are 999999x more talented than the top pros of almost every single other "professional esport" yet make no money or real fame for their sacrifice. now they will.
I know Zero has already said he's going to see how Sc2 is received before deciding whether or not to switch. Generally what I've been reading is the same response, but you're Artosis and I'm not so you opinion is probably more valid  . Everything you say after that is more or less my opinion expressed more convincingly. Foreigners realize they can't make money off Sc1. Koreans are still profiting big time.
Man, its gonna be sooooooo weird seeing all the Sc1 top pros sucking vs unknown Sc2 ppl in the beginning. Like, think about it, Nony is probably gonna be able to beat Flash cause Flash is still playing BW :O.
Also, lol IdrA
Taking your comment seriously though is Sc1 that much different?
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On March 02 2010 00:04 Artosis wrote:
ok? so? no one in sc1 makes more than 5k a year cept idra. a few will. so they switch. the entire scene moving over is good + healthy.
That was sort of my point, no one who have been playing BW have been making money so people are obviously playing the game for other reasons, still now everyone seems crazy delusional and expecting to make lots of money despite that very few will manage it and this seem to be the main reason for lots of people changing game. Hence I think people are changing the game for all the wrong reasons, you even have people like Inka saying he don really like the game but he follows the money. That leads back to my original question how much money do people really think it will be in this game?
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If sc2 was never announced, how big do you think the foreign scene would be right now? I doubt that there would even be a TSL if not for sc2. That's debatable, but what's not is that a good majority of us (pro's and noobs included) just want to play sc2, and for many of us we've wanted to play it for over ten years. You shouldn't be surprised at people jumping ship.
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On March 02 2010 00:09 Oystein wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 00:04 Artosis wrote:
ok? so? no one in sc1 makes more than 5k a year cept idra. a few will. so they switch. the entire scene moving over is good + healthy. That was sort of my point, no one who have been playing BW have been making money so people are obviously playing the game for other reasons, still now everyone seems crazy delusional and expecting to make lots of money despite that very few will manage it and this seem to be the main reason for lots of people changing game. Hence I think people are changing the game for all the wrong reasons, you even have people like Inka saying he don really like the game but he follows the money. That leads back to my original question how much money do people really think it will be in this game?
To phrase it concisely: Foreign players playing Broodwar have 0 chance of making good money. Might be blunt but come on, who is going to catch up to Korean A team players at this point? Sc2 the playing field is leveled again, so foreigners have the same chance/
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
I don't know why this is an issue..i feel like you have the wrong mindset - SC2 isn't KILLING the SC1 community...The community is simply evolving. We've been tapping B for 10 years.
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On March 02 2010 00:07 TestSubject893 wrote:SC2 will have the infrastructure and sponsorship needed to allow competition to reach a whole new level, even for those players who are not going to be directly competing for cash prizes or Blizzard's "Pro" ladder. I personally can't wait.
Its a big presumption all these sponsors are going to come out of the woodwork just for SC2. If they had to chose a game to sponsor they'd still go for something more mainstream like Halo, CoD, WoW which already have huge bases but only Halo gets much attention.
Oh as for foreigners versus Koreans, when will that even happen often unless the foreigners go to korea especially for tournaments, the Koreans will be playing SC1 for at least another 2 years minimum as its so established.
The only way to compete with full-time paid professionals of any sport is if you devote yourself to it and can afford to put in the hours they can so you either already can support yourself for the time it'll take to become pro-level or not.
I think the pro's of SC2 in the foreign community will be high-school students, uni students who have the time to put into the game other then ppl that work any old job to make ends meat and play tonnes. Someone said they work as a pizza delivery guy and thats how they are gonna pay to keep playing; thats probably the way to be able to play tonnes.
Koreans will if they take up SC2 dominate simply because of there infrastructure that already exists and there ability to churn out more pro's consistently to give them the ideal environment to improve at the fastest rate.
A way for foreigners to excel is if there are a huge number of foreigners playing at a high level together. This 'should' happen naturally thanks to the new ladder system. But to drive ppl the in-game tournaments system needs to be really aggressive imo. Like achievements and unlock-ables for tournament wins like in Wc3 but something more substantial then just avatars.
Meh, who knows what'll happen just wait and see.
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I think it's really just the fact that most people have been playing starcraft for 5-10 years, and lots of people have become bored of it. Starcraft II is something fresh and we have been waiting for a long time.
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On March 02 2010 00:13 Adeeler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 00:07 TestSubject893 wrote:SC2 will have the infrastructure and sponsorship needed to allow competition to reach a whole new level, even for those players who are not going to be directly competing for cash prizes or Blizzard's "Pro" ladder. I personally can't wait. Its a big presumption all these sponsors are going to come out of the woodwork just for SC2. If they had to chose a game to sponser they'd still go for something more mainstream like Halo, CoD, WoW which already have huge bases but only Halo gets much attention.
Many games have tried and failed, merely because there is no interest from the community. That isn't an issue with SC2, since it's just picking up where SCBW left off. ESL and ZOTAC already have SC2 cups, which brought in tons of players, despite being both a closed beta, and split between regions. Sponsors will go where customers go.
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Foreigners play mostly for fun, so it's easy to switch or spend some time with a new game. The korean players are bound by contract and make a living out of playing SC1. All leagues in Korea are SC1, the team is playing SC1 leagues -> you play SC1.
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On March 01 2010 23:37 MadNeSs wrote:
Is SC2 really that good, Amber?
I was wondering the same ... you are one of the few talking about it in excitement when comparing it to SC1 ...
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On March 02 2010 00:13 Adeeler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 00:07 TestSubject893 wrote:SC2 will have the infrastructure and sponsorship needed to allow competition to reach a whole new level, even for those players who are not going to be directly competing for cash prizes or Blizzard's "Pro" ladder. I personally can't wait. Its a big presumption all these sponsors are going to come out of the woodwork just for SC2. If they had to chose a game to sponser they'd still go for something more mainstream like Halo, CoD, WoW which already have huge bases but only Halo gets much attention.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I think it will be almost as "mainstream" as those games. I know a lot of people that didn't even realize that people still played BW that are really excited for SC2, but maybe I'm just seeing something that isn't there because I want it to be true.
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On March 02 2010 00:23 TestSubject893 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 00:13 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 00:07 TestSubject893 wrote:SC2 will have the infrastructure and sponsorship needed to allow competition to reach a whole new level, even for those players who are not going to be directly competing for cash prizes or Blizzard's "Pro" ladder. I personally can't wait. Its a big presumption all these sponsors are going to come out of the woodwork just for SC2. If they had to chose a game to sponser they'd still go for something more mainstream like Halo, CoD, WoW which already have huge bases but only Halo gets much attention. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think it will be almost as "mainstream" as those games. I know a lot of people that didn't even realize that people still played BW that are really excited for SC2, but maybe I'm just seeing something that isn't there because I want it to be true.
No you're right, a big part of the wc3 and the sc community will flock to this game. Even talking to complete casual gamers that barely play video games are pumped for SC2. Same thing on certain mmorpg forums, they're actually getting the game.
So yeah.. SC2 will be quite the "mainstream" game. While the SC/wc3 community will make out the more hardcore crowd, all the other gamers will create a larger casual crowd.
The modding community will make sure the game becomes even more popular with the mods such as a new dota SC2 version.
e-sport oriented video game with huge player base = success.
Just my predictions.
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On March 01 2010 23:58 IdrA wrote:i lost all my skill when i started playing protoss so i cant really go back even if i wanted to
You cant, but you can start a truer path; zerg.
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On March 01 2010 23:52 Artosis wrote:
we are all switching over because support for sc1 is leaving immediately. sc2 will take over all rts tournaments.
I just got really, really depressed.
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While I hope that I'll be proven wrong, I think almost everyone is delusional about the expected impact of SC2. Sure, it will be a modern and very good RTS, but I doubt how its popularity will evolve and that sponsors will appear out of nowhere to pay all this money everyone is expecting.
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i still play clan wars and im also in a ingoing bwml in gosugamers. but obviosuly i agree with the main point, sc2 is gonna lower the standards ALOT in foreign scene skill level, personally i will stop improve and start getting alittle worse every day at sc cause i stopped training
i dont really see this as a bad thing. sc2 is here and its awesome, it has the exact same feeling as sc has imo, speed and strategy. i hope everyone moves on to sc2 when it releases and gives it a real chance. everyone who i met ingame of top foreigners (dimaga, white ra, infernal) and more has all said it got nice potential and they like the game (accepting its imba and giving blizzard time to balance)
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I think it is healthy for the scene that everyone is inspired to switch over and make money. You even have WC3 players wanting to become pro. Everyone sees the potential and don't want to miss their opportunity. I think SC2 WILL EVENTUALLY be more famous than sc2 and have a pro scene in a lot more countries. Also as a spectator, SC2 is a lot more fun to watch than sc2. I can't wait to see the builds/strata that unfold in pro matches for sc2.
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it's just that they know sc1 has survived 10+ years of constant evolution in the gaming biz (graphics, gameplay wise etc.) and still kept its fascination to them. apart from that they have the whole infrastructure geared to sc1. this game is timeless in a sense and why should they switch prematurely before even knowing if the korean proscene isn't conservative and still values their old but established game higher than the new fancy one which may wear off as years go by (unlike sc1).
the comparison to CS is quite good:
SC1 = CS 1.6
SC2 = CS:Source
cs1.6 is as old as sc1 and still it remained more popular than its newer brother - why? because the feel of the game - despite the "shitty" graphics - was just superior and couldn't be emulated - the "what you get out of the game".
the big question is: what do the koreans want out of starcraft? and can sc2 satisfy what they want and what they value highly in sc1 or does sc1 have similar unique qualities like cs1.6 which cannot be emulated? maybe these crazy mechanic monsters actually LOVE these additional gameplay barriers like missing mbs/automine because it gives them a higher challenge in their nerdiness to take games to the extreme (analogy: *click*).
foreigners aren't as crazy as koreans. they'll bitch about missing mbs and automine, because it's not up to date, doesn't feel comfortable etc.. they don't see an extra challenge in it which tackles their ambition to become "crazy" in things which are actually pretty dull (sc1 macro) "why should I play an old game if the mechanics in WCIII are way more comfortable?".
I think the "success" - the _long term_ success - of sc2 (whether it can become as timeless as sc1 is) will depend on the question in how far blizzard is willing to make profound changes to their game in this beta stage and if they listen to the right people. if we had a beta phase of half a year and they would implement 100% of TL's suggestions, I guess this game can become pretty fucking awesome from what it is now still. If they are too lazy/indifferent/have other things in mind this game will be cool, will have a huge scene (take WCIII's place at least) but will have to be replaced by something better in the not too distant future.
I derive this whole argument from the question: would anyone in THIS scene have been sad if there never had been a sc2 and we would have been "forced" to continue watching/playing sc1? if I look at the hype of an osl final I can't help but think that it could have gone on for another 10 years with the real fans being content with a game "perfect as it is".
let's hope sc2 will evolve as sc1 did and become as great / even greater. at this stage nobody can really tell.
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Bulgaria5679 Posts
On March 01 2010 23:58 IdrA wrote:i lost all my skill when i started playing protoss so i cant really go back even if i wanted to
Oh Idra how could you ... + Show Spoiler +Should have stuck with Terran or play zerg instead
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On March 02 2010 00:04 Artosis wrote:
ok? so? no one in sc1 makes more than 5k a year cept idra. a few will. so they switch. the entire scene moving over is good + healthy.
What about Nony?
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On March 02 2010 01:11 Dr.Frost wrote:
I think SC2 WILL EVENTUALLY be more famous than sc2 and have a pro scene in a lot more countries. Also as a spectator, SC2 is a lot more fun to watch than sc2.
I completely agree...
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Cause they can't compete with the korean pros, so they are hoping a head start at a new game that they can claim to be the best at.
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On March 02 2010 01:19 red.venom wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 00:04 Artosis wrote:
ok? so? no one in sc1 makes more than 5k a year cept idra. a few will. so they switch. the entire scene moving over is good + healthy. What about Nony?
Lol, quintuple digits in one tourney. Not too shabby.
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wtf are there really foreigners who plan to be professional SC2 players? Why not just aim for the top without playing professionally?
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On March 02 2010 01:21 uNiGNoRe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 01:11 Dr.Frost wrote:
I think SC2 WILL EVENTUALLY be more famous than sc2 and have a pro scene in a lot more countries. Also as a spectator, SC2 is a lot more fun to watch than sc2. I completely agree...
Agree also but the pro-scene will probably only get relatively big in the US but even so it'll be bedroom gamers still, getting to any sponsored house type situation is many many years away for even being feasible unless Blizzard make a there own TV channel(which would be the only way they could break into mainstream audiences as advertisements and probably programmes would come to them bringing audiences.
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United States12235 Posts
On March 02 2010 00:36 Senx wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 00:23 TestSubject893 wrote:On March 02 2010 00:13 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 00:07 TestSubject893 wrote:SC2 will have the infrastructure and sponsorship needed to allow competition to reach a whole new level, even for those players who are not going to be directly competing for cash prizes or Blizzard's "Pro" ladder. I personally can't wait. Its a big presumption all these sponsors are going to come out of the woodwork just for SC2. If they had to chose a game to sponser they'd still go for something more mainstream like Halo, CoD, WoW which already have huge bases but only Halo gets much attention. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think it will be almost as "mainstream" as those games. I know a lot of people that didn't even realize that people still played BW that are really excited for SC2, but maybe I'm just seeing something that isn't there because I want it to be true. No you're right, a big part of the wc3 and the sc community will flock to this game. Even talking to complete casual gamers that barely play video games are pumped for SC2. Same thing on certain mmorpg forums, they're actually getting the game. So yeah.. SC2 will be quite the "mainstream" game. While the SC/wc3 community will make out the more hardcore crowd, all the other gamers will create a larger casual crowd. The modding community will make sure the game becomes even more popular with the mods such as a new dota SC2 version. e-sport oriented video game with huge player base = success. Just my predictions.
An important disclaimer here would be that casual players are not necessarily looking for multiplayer, and especially competitive multiplayer. In fact, I'd say that 90% of the people I talk to who don't still play BW are looking forward to the campaign, map editor, and custom maps much more than a robust new Battle.net AMM and fierce competition. I agree with you that SC2 will be an extremely "mainstream" game, but I think much of the ladder will be composed of ICCup players, and that this will be emphasized much more 6 months after release.
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United States47024 Posts
On March 02 2010 00:23 Xeln4g4 wrote:I was wondering the same ... you are one of the few talking about it in excitement when comparing it to SC1 ...
Actually, lots of people who are actually in the beta are excited about it. Have you listened to Day[9] on his stream?
Lots of the complaints in this forum are coming from people who aren't in beta and just watch streams lol.
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On March 02 2010 00:23 Xeln4g4 wrote:I was wondering the same ... you are one of the few talking about it in excitement when comparing it to SC1 ...
I think SC2 is awesome too, not as balanced as SC1 right now obv cuz It's beta, but It's really fun, not the feeling I had when WC3 came out at all, It's much much better
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On March 02 2010 01:29 Fayth wrote:
wtf are there really foreigners who plan to be professional SC2 players? Why not just aim for the top without playing professionally?
"My dad once told me, if your good at something, don't do it for free" - The Joker
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Yeah, this is the first game I've wanted to play so much since BW
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On March 02 2010 01:37 Irrelevant wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 01:29 Fayth wrote:
wtf are there really foreigners who plan to be professional SC2 players? Why not just aim for the top without playing professionally? "My dad once told me, if your good at something, don't do it for free" - The Joker
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician, It's a game that's eventually going to die, and you make money from what, competitions only? Or you have to move in another country?(lol)
I dunno, I might be biased, I just think most talented, dedicated and highly competitive gamers should try out poker for a living while they play like SC2 competitively but not try to make a living out of it
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On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 01:37 Irrelevant wrote:On March 02 2010 01:29 Fayth wrote:
wtf are there really foreigners who plan to be professional SC2 players? Why not just aim for the top without playing professionally? "My dad once told me, if your good at something, don't do it for free" - The Joker Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician, It's a game that's eventually going to die, and you make money from what, competitions only? Or you have to move in another country?(lol) I dunno, I might be biased, I just think most talented, dedicated and highly competitive gamers should try out poker for a living while they play like SC2 competitively but not try to make a living out of it
Since when is being a musician something with any amazing potential? Oh you could being a pop star or some shit? Just cos a game isn't gonna get you the ladies doesn't mean its pointless to play. You play cos its fun and you would rather be playing a challenging game then sitting in-front of the telly vegetating or selling your soul in a pub or club making a fool of yourself.
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On March 01 2010 23:58 IdrA wrote:i lost all my skill when i started playing protoss so i cant really go back even if i wanted to
O__________________O. Idra.....why...you're a Terran at heart D:.
I would rofl it if turned out TvP became easy for Terran now and they got to 12 CC with any protoss 2 gate opening failing
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On March 02 2010 01:49 Adeeler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 01:37 Irrelevant wrote:On March 02 2010 01:29 Fayth wrote:
wtf are there really foreigners who plan to be professional SC2 players? Why not just aim for the top without playing professionally? "My dad once told me, if your good at something, don't do it for free" - The Joker Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician, It's a game that's eventually going to die, and you make money from what, competitions only? Or you have to move in another country?(lol) I dunno, I might be biased, I just think most talented, dedicated and highly competitive gamers should try out poker for a living while they play like SC2 competitively but not try to make a living out of it Since when is being a musician something with any amazing potential? Oh you could being a pop star or some shit? Just cos a game isn't gonna get you the ladies doesn't mean its pointless to play. You play cos its fun and you would rather be playing a challenging game then sitting in-front of the telly vegetating or selling your soul in a pub or club making a fool of yourself.
I talked about being a musician cuz it also has very little potential, and you need to make it to the top to make any decent money, but music is never going to die, as opposed to SC2
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On March 02 2010 01:49 SubtleArt wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 23:58 IdrA wrote:i lost all my skill when i started playing protoss so i cant really go back even if i wanted to O__________________O. Idra.....why...you're a Terran at heart D:. I would rofl it if turned out TvP became easy for Terran now and they got to 12 CC with any protoss 2 gate opening failing
sadly so far it's easier for P than T lol
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On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician
You are saying they complete opposite; as if playing a game has no reward/worth but music always will.
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Netherlands4511 Posts
On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 01:37 Irrelevant wrote:On March 02 2010 01:29 Fayth wrote:
wtf are there really foreigners who plan to be professional SC2 players? Why not just aim for the top without playing professionally? "My dad once told me, if your good at something, don't do it for free" - The Joker Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician, It's a game that's eventually going to die, and you make money from what, competitions only? Or you have to move in another country?(lol) I dunno, I might be biased, I just think most talented, dedicated and highly competitive gamers should try out poker for a living while they play like SC2 competitively but not try to make a living out of it
Not everyone has to live your life. Your need to post your opinion constantly on how 'stupid' these people are that play games for a living reeks of insecurity. What you gonna do when everyone figures out poker? Stop the crusade.
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On March 02 2010 01:58 Adeeler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician You are saying they complete opposite; as if playing a game has no reward/worth but music always will.
Just wondering what the so-said professional SC2 player will do once SC2 dies, go back to school? I mean come on.... What about life? How are you going to feed your kids? lol
Unless you plan on staying a lone geek ur whole life thinking only playing games really makes you happy, then go for it
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On March 02 2010 02:02 Fayth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 01:58 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician You are saying they complete opposite; as if playing a game has no reward/worth but music always will. Just wondering what the so-said professional SC2 player will do once SC2 dies, go back to school? I mean come on.... What about life? How are you going to feed your kids? lol Unless you plan on staying a lone geek ur whole life thinking only playing games really makes you happy, then go for it
When SC2 dies(10years or so?) ppl will migrate to SC3 or WC4 or w/e RTS takes the crown at that time. Its 2010 send the wife to work and be a house-husband \o/.
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On March 02 2010 02:02 Fayth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 01:58 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician You are saying they complete opposite; as if playing a game has no reward/worth but music always will. Just wondering what the so-said professional SC2 player will do once SC2 dies, go back to school? I mean come on.... What about life? How are you going to feed your kids? lol Unless you plan on staying a lone geek ur whole life thinking only playing games really makes you happy, then go for it
So you suggest gambling instead of playing video games?
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On March 01 2010 23:31 Amber[LighT] wrote:
To be honest once you play SC2 you really can't go back to SC1. You start getting used to this new game and how it works and it's nothing like SC1. The game has so many new opportunities and everyone is trying to exploit the best strategies. Why bother playing SC when SC2 is nearly here?
I did try to play SC a week ago and it's like looking at an inferior game. Besides SC2 is so much fun to play!
Precisely my opinion.
There will also be more non-korean sponsors and paid teams for SC2, most likely.
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On March 02 2010 02:05 Amber[LighT] wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 02:02 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 01:58 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician You are saying they complete opposite; as if playing a game has no reward/worth but music always will. Just wondering what the so-said professional SC2 player will do once SC2 dies, go back to school? I mean come on.... What about life? How are you going to feed your kids? lol Unless you plan on staying a lone geek ur whole life thinking only playing games really makes you happy, then go for it So you suggest gambling instead of playing video games?
if you aim to make money, yes, poker is the only really profitable form of gambling so don't misunderstand me.... not any gambling lol
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On March 02 2010 02:04 Adeeler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 02:02 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 01:58 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician You are saying they complete opposite; as if playing a game has no reward/worth but music always will. Just wondering what the so-said professional SC2 player will do once SC2 dies, go back to school? I mean come on.... What about life? How are you going to feed your kids? lol Unless you plan on staying a lone geek ur whole life thinking only playing games really makes you happy, then go for it When SC2 dies(10years or so?) ppl will migrate to SC3 or WC4 or w/e RTS takes the crown at that time. Its 2010 send the wife to work and be a house-husband \o/.
LOL WTF house husband hahahahah
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On March 02 2010 02:10 Fayth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 02:05 Amber[LighT] wrote:On March 02 2010 02:02 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 01:58 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician You are saying they complete opposite; as if playing a game has no reward/worth but music always will. Just wondering what the so-said professional SC2 player will do once SC2 dies, go back to school? I mean come on.... What about life? How are you going to feed your kids? lol Unless you plan on staying a lone geek ur whole life thinking only playing games really makes you happy, then go for it So you suggest gambling instead of playing video games? if you aim to make money, yes, poker is the only really profitable form of gambling so don't misunderstand me.... not any gambling lol
The house always wins. Poker is not reliable even if you can potentially earn a lot you can potentially lose everything. Also, its just so boring to play poker all the time...
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@ghardo I don't think that is a good comparison at all. SC2 is in beta. We don't know how it will turn out. From the looks of things it will be a huge hit, players from BW, WC3, CC3, WOW, and Diablo all seem to be jumping on board plus all the new comers. I think sc2 will far surpass sc2 And wc3 combined in popularity.
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I love how so many people write SC1 as SC2. Some really hilarious posts come out of it.
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Hey guys why is this brand new game called Starcraft 2 killing the 11 year game called Starcraft?
While the answer may be incredibly clear and obvious, let's propose our THEORIES!
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On March 02 2010 02:12 Adeeler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 02:10 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 02:05 Amber[LighT] wrote:On March 02 2010 02:02 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 01:58 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician You are saying they complete opposite; as if playing a game has no reward/worth but music always will. Just wondering what the so-said professional SC2 player will do once SC2 dies, go back to school? I mean come on.... What about life? How are you going to feed your kids? lol Unless you plan on staying a lone geek ur whole life thinking only playing games really makes you happy, then go for it So you suggest gambling instead of playing video games? if you aim to make money, yes, poker is the only really profitable form of gambling so don't misunderstand me.... not any gambling lol The house always wins. Poker is not reliable even if you can potentially earn a lot you can potentially lose everything. Also, its just so boring to play poker all the time...
Stop turning this into whether or not poker is profitable. If it interests you that much go make a thread about it. Thanks
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Fayth stop being a hater and dont judge people. im personally excited to see what the future brings even though at the same time i hope bw doesnt die
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sc2 is not gonna last 10 years in progaming i think ) unless they stretch out the 3 parts over a long time, then it should last 10 years. blizzard has all the attention and ppl to make the game work, atm its all up to blizzard to balance the game and keep up the good work
poker isnt something that u can guarantee to succeed in but tbh if uve been a progamer in sc2 or wc3 scbw w/e i think u have talent and practice enough to make it. the games r almost the same in theory and i dont see a better way to prepare a career of poker than to practice strategy games like this when ur a kid while ur in school. obviously this sounds hilarious to most ppl but this is what i think is true :p
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meh im not being a hater, I'm trying to understand, but I've talked with iNkA and it seems when they talk about playing professionally it just means they make money off it, not their only source of income?
So the proper term would be semi-pro?
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On March 02 2010 01:11 Dr.Frost wrote:
I think SC2 WILL EVENTUALLY be more famous than sc2 and have a pro scene in a lot more countries. Also as a spectator, SC2 is a lot more fun to watch than sc2. I can't wait to see the builds/strata that unfold in pro matches for sc2.
At least go back and edit your post...
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On March 02 2010 02:12 Adeeler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 02:10 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 02:05 Amber[LighT] wrote:On March 02 2010 02:02 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 01:58 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician You are saying they complete opposite; as if playing a game has no reward/worth but music always will. Just wondering what the so-said professional SC2 player will do once SC2 dies, go back to school? I mean come on.... What about life? How are you going to feed your kids? lol Unless you plan on staying a lone geek ur whole life thinking only playing games really makes you happy, then go for it So you suggest gambling instead of playing video games? if you aim to make money, yes, poker is the only really profitable form of gambling so don't misunderstand me.... not any gambling lol The house always wins. Poker is not reliable even if you can potentially earn a lot you can potentially lose everything. Also, its just so boring to play poker all the time...
Just as it is to play Starcraft all the time? It's a game that involves competition... You like competition or you don't
I think SC1 dying is fine since SC2 will prob be huge, I mean even when I got 2nd in wcg can in 2005 it was starting to die, the foreign scene was fading away, and I don't give a flying shit about koreans, take out koreans from broodwar, and the game is pretty much dead
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On March 02 2010 01:55 Fayth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 01:49 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 01:37 Irrelevant wrote:On March 02 2010 01:29 Fayth wrote:
wtf are there really foreigners who plan to be professional SC2 players? Why not just aim for the top without playing professionally? "My dad once told me, if your good at something, don't do it for free" - The Joker Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician, It's a game that's eventually going to die, and you make money from what, competitions only? Or you have to move in another country?(lol) I dunno, I might be biased, I just think most talented, dedicated and highly competitive gamers should try out poker for a living while they play like SC2 competitively but not try to make a living out of it Since when is being a musician something with any amazing potential? Oh you could being a pop star or some shit? Just cos a game isn't gonna get you the ladies doesn't mean its pointless to play. You play cos its fun and you would rather be playing a challenging game then sitting in-front of the telly vegetating or selling your soul in a pub or club making a fool of yourself. I talked about being a musician cuz it also has very little potential, and you need to make it to the top to make any decent money, but music is never going to die, as opposed to SC2
Music is never going to die, just like games never will. You made wrong comparison mate
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sc2 will last at least as long wc3 lasted. That's four or five years with a lot of tournaments and leagues with prize money, all over the world (not just Korea).
Why not compare CS:S and CS 1.6 with SC:BW and SC2?
Because CS:S was a piece of shit from the release. It had good graphics and some solid game engine, but everything else was a fail, from esports perspective. i know Arqon (from Q3 promode) was working on a mode that would work give the game back "the feel", while SC2 already has it.
Blizzard gives a damn. It's evolution, baby.
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On March 02 2010 02:31 Fayth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 02:12 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 02:10 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 02:05 Amber[LighT] wrote:On March 02 2010 02:02 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 01:58 Adeeler wrote:On March 02 2010 01:41 Fayth wrote:
Dude it's just sooo time consuming with so little potential, It's not like being a musician You are saying they complete opposite; as if playing a game has no reward/worth but music always will. Just wondering what the so-said professional SC2 player will do once SC2 dies, go back to school? I mean come on.... What about life? How are you going to feed your kids? lol Unless you plan on staying a lone geek ur whole life thinking only playing games really makes you happy, then go for it So you suggest gambling instead of playing video games? if you aim to make money, yes, poker is the only really profitable form of gambling so don't misunderstand me.... not any gambling lol The house always wins. Poker is not reliable even if you can potentially earn a lot you can potentially lose everything. Also, its just so boring to play poker all the time... Just as it is to play Starcraft all the time? It's a game that involves competition... You like competition or you don't I think SC1 dying is fine since SC2 will prob be huge, I mean even when I got 2nd in wcg can in 2005 it was starting to die, the foreign scene was fading away, and I don't give a flying shit about koreans, take out koreans from broodwar, and the game is pretty much dead
SC2 will give fun competition as you'll be able to always play people of your own skill level thanks to the new ladder system. But where SC is different from poker is that you can constantly learn and become better in more realistic terms game by game where as poker being based on probability is not a game where you can force a win through shear skill and determination game by game; as luck dictates your hand(in poker) not your hand dictating your luck(in SC).
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Yeah, Starcraft is a mindless waste of time, but that's what people said about rock & roll too at first. In my opinion excellent SC-play has an artistic quality similar to chess to a point where I really admire pro gamers and would never consider them "losers", just because they didn't go where the money is. With some luck SC2 will be where the money is, anyway.
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lol I can't believe there needs to be discussion about this, this should be painfully obvious to anyone who's ever anticipated a video game sequel.
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People who write these threads are people who haven't played the game yet. Believe me, the game is fucking awesome. It has the same feel as sc1 to it, the graphics are ridiculous, and it still requires a relatively high amount of apm to play the game well. This isn't just starcraft 2. This is starcraft broodwar new and improved. Its like starcraft was a zealot and was a badass that lasted a long time, then got reborn as a dragoon. It's different and it's buggy, but it's still awesome. The game is so much fun and I see it becoming really big as soon as it launches.
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On March 02 2010 02:18 Hehlol wrote:
Hey guys why is this brand new game called Starcraft 2 killing the 11 year game called Starcraft?
While the answer may be incredibly clear and obvious, let's propose our THEORIES!
Hahahhaha oh lol
anyways, big tournaments will turn to SC2 if the game is good. And I see no way for it to become a bad game given how the Beta is coming... also coupled with Blizzard's support + 2 planned expansions, this game will be awesome.
SC1 will still survive in smaller hardcore circles though, and may even get a fair amount of Retro champs if the international progaming scene evolves. It seems to me that the two games are way too vastly different to be compared in the "superior" and "inferior" sense.
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starcraft has a bit of luck, prob not as much as poker but it has some, It's all about long terms results btw, obviously you'll win a shitload of money thru shear skill and determination
I've played both at a fairly high level and I can say both requires similar qualities..
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On March 02 2010 02:43 Mothxal wrote:
Yeah, Starcraft is a mindless waste of time, but that's what people said about rock & roll too at first. In my opinion excellent SC-play has an artistic quality similar to chess to a point where I really admire pro gamers and would never consider them "losers", just because they didn't go where the money is. With some luck SC2 will be where the money is, anyway.
there's not any significant money to be made unless you're like top 10 in the whole world, talk about gambling -.-
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On March 02 2010 02:50 Fayth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 02:43 Mothxal wrote:
Yeah, Starcraft is a mindless waste of time, but that's what people said about rock & roll too at first. In my opinion excellent SC-play has an artistic quality similar to chess to a point where I really admire pro gamers and would never consider them "losers", just because they didn't go where the money is. With some luck SC2 will be where the money is, anyway. there's not any significant money to be made unless you're like top 10 in the whole world, talk about gambling -.-
SC2 will no doubt take esports to another level, sure its a gamble but now with the combination of MLG + european organisations like ESL + Korean scene there's money for far more than just 10 people if things go according to the plan and SC2 does not suck.
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On March 02 2010 02:49 Fayth wrote:
starcraft has a bit of luck, prob not as much as poker but it has some, It's all about long terms results btw, obviously you'll win a shitload of money thru shear skill and determination
I've played both at a fairly high level and I can say both requires similar qualities..
If it matters that much to you, why do people pursue fine art? Or competitive dancing? Or cooking? Fine artists, competitive dancers, and chefs don't make much money, and a lot of them make no money at all.
Why do people do things that barely pay anything, or even things that pay nothing unless you're really good?
It's not all about making a living. Yes they want to make money off it, but they want to make it off something they enjoy.
If everyone just wanted the safest career, everyone would go into law or medicine. For a lot of people, there's more to life than practicality and cold hard logic.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On March 02 2010 02:55 Puosu wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 02:50 Fayth wrote:On March 02 2010 02:43 Mothxal wrote:
Yeah, Starcraft is a mindless waste of time, but that's what people said about rock & roll too at first. In my opinion excellent SC-play has an artistic quality similar to chess to a point where I really admire pro gamers and would never consider them "losers", just because they didn't go where the money is. With some luck SC2 will be where the money is, anyway. there's not any significant money to be made unless you're like top 10 in the whole world, talk about gambling -.- SC2 will no doubt take esports to another level, sure its a gamble but now with the combination of MLG + european organisations like ESL + Korean scene there's money for far more than just 10 people if things go according to the plan and SC2 does not suck.
I am NOWHERE near top 10 in the world and I've done fairly well.
Money isn't everything Fayth. I've traveled the world, done a reality show, been to the Video Game Awards as a guest and I've gotten in touch with everyone in WCG and my community. I wouldn't trade my experience for a successful poker career at this point, but that is just me.
SC2 is going to breath new life into our game. We will remain nostalgic of SCBW good times and the skill it took to master but we will enjoy the renewed attention, the funding and the growth in our community.
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On March 02 2010 02:29 Hehlol wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 01:11 Dr.Frost wrote:
I think SC2 WILL EVENTUALLY be more famous than sc2 and have a pro scene in a lot more countries. Also as a spectator, SC2 is a lot more fun to watch than sc2. I can't wait to see the builds/strata that unfold in pro matches for sc2. At least go back and edit your post...
ROFL
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well inc the poker community is pretty much the exact same, you travel the world, you appear on tv and so on, It's exactly the same feeling you have with video games, or very close, except you can pretty much be set for life once you're successful, and then do whatever you enjoy, like play SC2 and travel the world for SC2 tournaments and stuff
Money isn't everything but why then are people talking about making money off SC2?
Also it might not be everything but it gets you almost everything in this capitalist world we live in
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Oh and to answer to Kyo Yuy, I wouldn't play poker if I didn't enjoy it, just saying most people here pursuing SC2 career would probably enjoy poker just as much as they enjoy video games, I get the same feeling off it....
and now I can play as much SC2 as I want without having to go work 8 hours thinking about playing the game, I'm not trying to be a douche here, just telling people they could make a good living off something they enjoy while being able to have a load of time on their hand to play games like SC2 without having to win the next big tournament to be able to eat
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everything pretty much been said already. sc2 is a new game and like with any new game its a fresh start for pros and noobs alike to make a foundation to build off of. with sc2 its a chance for everyone to actually get a fresh start on where as with sc1 its almost impossible now to catch up with the top gamers in the world. theres still possibility that a D- player from sc1 becomes one of the top ranked players in the world in sc2. alot of new faces as well as old faces will establish themselves with sc2.
and about the money thing... well theres not alot of money to be made to actually make a living on. i dont know why ppl would want to switch to the sc2 scene mainly for the money when ur not guaranteed that u will get money. if money is solely what u want then its best to play a real sport professionaly like boxing or football/basketball or something. youll get alot more money playing those sports then u would playing starcraft. the money u do get is purely for a cherry on top of the cake type thing. its a bonus u get money to play video games, but nothing at all to make a real living off of.
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This is like asking why Windows 7 is making Windows 98 less popular. Sure, Windows 98 was widely regarded as a rock solid, great OS, but...
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Just a thought:
If any of the top players would have spent that time on a real job, they could have travelled the entire world instead.
I wish everyone could stop being so delusional about the $$$ possibilities in SC2, and just take it for what its gonna be - a fun and challenging game, not a career.
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the only thing that makes me want to play SC (other than you know, not having a sc2 beta key).. Is that my comp kinda sucks, so SC2 is slightly jumpy for me atm.. Like I cant do a worker split at the start perfectly, it is physically impossible with the startup lag I get first like 3 seconds..
BW is so responsive.. But, I think thats more an issue of my computer sucking, than SC2.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On March 02 2010 03:25 Fayth wrote:
Oh and to answer to Kyo Yuy, I wouldn't play poker if I didn't enjoy it, just saying most people here pursuing SC2 career would probably enjoy poker just as much as they enjoy video games, I get the same feeling off it....
and now I can play as much SC2 as I want without having to go work 8 hours thinking about playing the game, I'm not trying to be a douche here, just telling people they could make a good living off something they enjoy while being able to have a load of time on their hand to play games like SC2 without having to win the next big tournament to be able to eat
well evidently it doesn't get you love on these forums because in 23 posts you've done a smash up job as coming off as a pretty shallow and single-track minded guy.
We're all really happy you make lots of money with poker. Spend some of that on professional guidance on how to relate to those that don't give a fuck about your money.
PS: This comes off as really abrasive but I cannot stand people that make arguments like yours. Who are you to judge the value of this game to people? If they can "make money" while doing something they love why would you argue against that? Obviously there are better ways to make money.. but it doesn't involve SC so on a fucking SC forum they might discuss the melding of two awesome concepts.
For all your money you still have a LOT of maturity to achieve dude.
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buy new comp skyze, problem solved
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On March 02 2010 03:25 Fayth wrote:
Oh and to answer to Kyo Yuy, I wouldn't play poker if I didn't enjoy it, just saying most people here pursuing SC2 career would probably enjoy poker just as much as they enjoy video games, I get the same feeling off it....
and now I can play as much SC2 as I want without having to go work 8 hours thinking about playing the game, I'm not trying to be a douche here, just telling people they could make a good living off something they enjoy while being able to have a load of time on their hand to play games like SC2 without having to win the next big tournament to be able to eat
You could say the same thing about getting a real job and being successful in it so you could play SC2 all day.
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On March 02 2010 04:04 {88}iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 03:25 Fayth wrote:
Oh and to answer to Kyo Yuy, I wouldn't play poker if I didn't enjoy it, just saying most people here pursuing SC2 career would probably enjoy poker just as much as they enjoy video games, I get the same feeling off it....
and now I can play as much SC2 as I want without having to go work 8 hours thinking about playing the game, I'm not trying to be a douche here, just telling people they could make a good living off something they enjoy while being able to have a load of time on their hand to play games like SC2 without having to win the next big tournament to be able to eat well evidently it doesn't get you love on these forums because in 23 posts you've done a smash up job as coming off as a pretty shallow and single-track minded guy. We're all really happy you make lots of money with poker. Spend some of that on professional guidance on how to relate to those that don't give a fuck about your money.
wtf inc I've been VERY active back when I played broodwar, I'm just saying people should be realistic about SC2 and not talk about it as if you could make a living off it, enjoy the challenge, aim for the top, don't expect to make money
I mean come on inc how many BW player have done a TV show?....
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On March 02 2010 04:05 andrewlt wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 03:25 Fayth wrote:
Oh and to answer to Kyo Yuy, I wouldn't play poker if I didn't enjoy it, just saying most people here pursuing SC2 career would probably enjoy poker just as much as they enjoy video games, I get the same feeling off it....
and now I can play as much SC2 as I want without having to go work 8 hours thinking about playing the game, I'm not trying to be a douche here, just telling people they could make a good living off something they enjoy while being able to have a load of time on their hand to play games like SC2 without having to win the next big tournament to be able to eat You could say the same thing about getting a real job and being successful in it so you could play SC2 all day.
thing is a real job is not the same as playing a game at all, poker has the same feeling SC provides, so you'd enjoy it just as much, live tournaments included (similar to like WCG)..... It's really 2 different things
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On March 02 2010 04:06 Fayth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 04:04 {88}iNcontroL wrote:On March 02 2010 03:25 Fayth wrote:
Oh and to answer to Kyo Yuy, I wouldn't play poker if I didn't enjoy it, just saying most people here pursuing SC2 career would probably enjoy poker just as much as they enjoy video games, I get the same feeling off it....
and now I can play as much SC2 as I want without having to go work 8 hours thinking about playing the game, I'm not trying to be a douche here, just telling people they could make a good living off something they enjoy while being able to have a load of time on their hand to play games like SC2 without having to win the next big tournament to be able to eat well evidently it doesn't get you love on these forums because in 23 posts you've done a smash up job as coming off as a pretty shallow and single-track minded guy. We're all really happy you make lots of money with poker. Spend some of that on professional guidance on how to relate to those that don't give a fuck about your money. wtf inc I've been VERY active back when I played broodwar, I'm just saying people should be realistic about SC2 and not talk about it as if you could make a living off it, enjoy the challenge, aim for the top, don't expect to make money I mean come on inc how many BW player have done a TV show?....
Where is the post of someone saying anyone can do it? Obviously no one is saying that. But iNcontrol makes a very valid point in saying that he HAS done it. And I think it is a totally different experience to travel the world as a competitor than just a business man or something. Not better or worse, just different. I think I'd prefer it. Not to say I expect to do so in SC2, but it'd be cool.
The fact is, there WILL be people doing what iNcontrol is saying. There will be professionals making tons of money. It won't be ALL the people who are trying for it, but obviously some will. Do you think Flash would be as successful as he is now if he never hoped for it? There is no doubt that competition to reach professional goals like that is extremely fierce. But people do it. No one is saying its some kinda "everyone, come on in and be a professional gamer making 6 figures!" situation. That wouldn't even make sense.
You should also start using the "edit" feature to quote two people. Its messy and poor etiquette to double post when you can just as easily edit your post to include both replies.
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On March 02 2010 04:04 Fayth wrote:buy new comp skyze, problem solved
Im trying. I think if I upgrade the graphics card + ram, i might be ok.. I spend all my money on guitar stuff, no money for comp stuff =[
btw fayth, come join rS again -_-
btw I envy your poker playing "passion".. ive tried, really hard.. and I just get bored with it fast, or tilt hard when I start losing (last few months). I did well back in 2007 and went up a grand or so, but ever since then Ive just had no desire to play, even though I want to so bad. I wish I could learn to love the game again..
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Fayth, stop educating the fish - kthx :3
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On March 02 2010 00:04 Artosis wrote:
ok? so? no one in sc1 makes more than 5k a year cept idra. a few will. so they switch. the entire scene moving over is good + healthy.
yes, absolutely. sc1 is a great game but it looks to be that sc2 will be just as good. there will be a lot of money thrown into the game, making the community grow. this doesn't make it better than sc1, just gives the foreign scene some more breathing room.
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koreans have years of head start and its e-sports is very good there. here meh just play for fun ;D
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On March 02 2010 04:04 {88}iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 03:25 Fayth wrote:
Oh and to answer to Kyo Yuy, I wouldn't play poker if I didn't enjoy it, just saying most people here pursuing SC2 career would probably enjoy poker just as much as they enjoy video games, I get the same feeling off it....
and now I can play as much SC2 as I want without having to go work 8 hours thinking about playing the game, I'm not trying to be a douche here, just telling people they could make a good living off something they enjoy while being able to have a load of time on their hand to play games like SC2 without having to win the next big tournament to be able to eat well evidently it doesn't get you love on these forums because in 23 posts you've done a smash up job as coming off as a pretty shallow and single-track minded guy. We're all really happy you make lots of money with poker. Spend some of that on professional guidance on how to relate to those that don't give a fuck about your money. PS: This comes off as really abrasive but I cannot stand people that make arguments like yours. Who are you to judge the value of this game to people? If they can "make money" while doing something they love why would you argue against that? Obviously there are better ways to make money.. but it doesn't involve SC so on a fucking SC forum they might discuss the melding of two awesome concepts. For all your money you still have a LOT of maturity to achieve dude.
Still on the poker guy? Recommending a career choice and saying how its superior to what some1 else is doing is just idiotic I agree, but ignore the troll?
On topic though, what makes people so certain Sc2 will be as awesome. I'm playing BETA and all I see is an above average RTS. Doesn't have the same "feel" as BW
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yeah dude I'm a troll because you missed the whole point
nice logic
Oh well my point doesn't get across, I know you hate everyone who plays poker Inc I saw some earlier posts about it, no need to involve ur feelings into this discussion
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Two reasons for this and both already mentioned in thread so just let me sum it up for our new viewers:
1. Foreign scene needs head start. As soon as the korean pros start playing sc2 for real foreigners will be forgotten. So they need their 15 minutes...
2. Someone said "its all about the Benjamins" and that is absolutely correct. Dont kid yourself, sc1 is serious business in korea.
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United States47024 Posts
On March 02 2010 03:25 Fayth wrote:
Oh and to answer to Kyo Yuy, I wouldn't play poker if I didn't enjoy it, just saying most people here pursuing SC2 career would probably enjoy poker just as much as they enjoy video games, I get the same feeling off it....
and now I can play as much SC2 as I want without having to go work 8 hours thinking about playing the game, I'm not trying to be a douche here, just telling people they could make a good living off something they enjoy while being able to have a load of time on their hand to play games like SC2 without having to win the next big tournament to be able to eat
You can't know that everyone else will feel the same way you do about it. Some people do. Some people don't. That's the way people are. Assuming your way is the way people should feel is incredibly presumptuous.
Some people like gaming and don't like poker. That's the way it is.
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fayth, it's nice that you descend upon earth to educate a bunch of video game nerds about how the big boys play but you might have missed that we keep our own rl baller aka rekrul who already blessed us with his wisdom in 200x Rek wrote: If you are intelligent you can make money grow on trees through poker. And remember. I did it the hard way. Its very easy to do nowadays.
so you come a little late, buddy, to save our sorry souls from eternal failure and as your posts lack any kind of fun factor usually found in rek's crazy life stories you're only a terrible bore with your self righteous and patronizing manner of spamming this thread.
get lost :|
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SC1 never has any chance of becoming huge in the United States or any other non-asian country. SC2 also has a very slim chance of doing that, but hell, it's better than SC1's chances.
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On March 01 2010 23:58 IdrA wrote:i lost all my skill when i started playing protoss so i cant really go back even if i wanted to
one problem with that statement idra...dts are hell to tech to in sc2 which means protoss doesnt have the imba unit 3-4 minutes into the game ^^
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On March 02 2010 09:02 dextahr wrote:
SC1 never has any chance of becoming huge in the United States or any other non-asian country. SC2 also has a very slim chance of doing that, but hell, it's better than SC1's chances.
that "slim chance" is actually rather large....w/mlg...LOL mlg lets hope that if they do try to get a slice of this cake they play by our rules without players signing their soulzzzzz
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I don't like when poker players act like other people are suckers for not doing what is easiest.
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I mean even rekrul has some fucked up form of modesty where he acknowledges that he is a mess, even though he acts outrageously cocky.
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Dominican Republic825 Posts
i think SC1 will never die, just look at Counter strike 1, just look at Unreal Tournament 1
those game are old and still being played everyday,
but in the other hand i think SC2 will be a game with his community apart of SC1 community
i love so much SC1, i havent played sc2 yet dont have beta key but im sure i will be in love with it as soon as i play online, but im sad and happy at the same time
cause i just have playing SC1 in iccup almost 1year and im loving it and just SC2 appear
what to do ? play both ?
u cant love 2 ppl or yes? xD
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On March 02 2010 09:03 unit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 23:58 IdrA wrote:i lost all my skill when i started playing protoss so i cant really go back even if i wanted to one problem with that statement idra...dts are hell to tech to in sc2 which means protoss doesnt have the imba unit 3-4 minutes into the game ^^
who needs dts when you have fuckin walking death stars
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On March 02 2010 09:02 dextahr wrote:
SC1 never has any chance of becoming huge in the United States or any other non-asian country. SC2 also has a very slim chance of doing that, but hell, it's better than SC1's chances.
Hm its pretty huge as it is to me...
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I really hope sc2 will deliver and become huge. Original starcraft is still the best game ever in my mind but it's just old now, I have no more fun to watch it or play it (besides nostalgia) why stay stuck in the past, I hope with sc2 everyone can move on.
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I play SC2 because it's fun to me, not because I think I'll have a chance at "beating those darned Koreans." Heck, I cheer for them, being a Korean myself >.>
Just saying.
I don't care about the money. I want to play the darn game.
See, I think why Korean gaming is so different from "Foreign" gaming is because of culture. To Koreans, everything is a waste of time unless it eventually leads to money. To places like the US...we just like video games because they're fun >.>
Not saying that Koreans can't enjoy games; I'm sure they do enjoy games. They just have more pressure due to their culture to rake in cash through everything they do.
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beating koreans is over rated.
If you have great passion for something and have the will to drive forward. Your ethnicity doesn't play a role...
I honestly think talent can be replaced by passion and willpower. maybe thats what the talent is. but it seems to be after playing wc3 at a high lvl. thats what it came down to..
Koreans have the advantadge of practice partners(sc1)
but with the game being fresh we all have the power to compete at an even level.. and i hope you guys dont lose sight of that.
its also possible that western market could boom with sc2 like korea did with sc.
Now with the economic crisis which replicated what south korea was going through when the SC boom took place.
it just depends on western culture taking risks.
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On March 01 2010 23:31 Amber[LighT] wrote:
To be honest once you play SC2 you really can't go back to SC1. You start getting used to this new game and how it works and it's nothing like SC1. The game has so many new opportunities and everyone is trying to exploit the best strategies. Why bother playing SC when SC2 is nearly here?
I did try to play SC a week ago and it's like looking at an inferior game. Besides SC2 is so much fun to play!
just no. i think the only thing fun about it is its novelty. i've played it and i still think sc1 is way more fun to play.
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SC2 gives a much better chance for non-Korean to actually win the Koreans. Though I do believe it's just a matter of time for the Koreans to dominate the world of Starcraft once again (assuming they do play SC2 in the same manner they're playing SC1).
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The reason the foreigner scene is moving to SC2 is because we don't have a regular flow of money to support SC1, unlike Korea. If the rest of the world suddenly died, Korea would still have regular tournaments and Proleague - not so the other way around.
Obviously when it comes out all the ESPORTS organizations like MLG are going to be trying to make a buck off of SC2, because there's no centralized governing body like KeSPA to say anything - so that's where the tournament cash will be.
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On March 01 2010 23:45 Senx wrote:
Why bother playing SC:BW when the money will be in SC2 ?? The foreign BW scene has always been weak apart from the recent TSLs.
Alot of people have hopes that major tournaments and organizations will pick up SC2 since it'll be the game that brings the SC and Wc3 community together and that is why they are making the switch.
There have been between 25,000-30,000$$ in prizes in tournaments in 2009-2010 (not even counting TSL) ... that's actually a LOT more than even 2005-2006-2007 for example. 2008 was pretty solid as well.
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dont let the koreans fool you lol they will play sc2 .
they will be scouting it out maybe with managers and play pals till After release when they study the gave for a month or two before they start .switching over . they will love watching the replays and fine tuneing it over 8 hours a day of practice . the replays and stuff to help adept Fast fingers . fast fingers doesnt mean fast thinkers... they let us * beta testers and early adopters do the hard work lol
my two cents
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clueless people should not post their opinions as if theres a chance they might be correct
proleague is still going on and is still sc1, until that changes the teams are entirely focused on sc1. the war3 progamers are playing sc2 openly, and the sc1 progamers are not playing it at all.
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you really need a theory about this?
how bout it's STARCRAFT 2
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God damnit is it really that hard to understand that people might be interested in a new game and don't have time to play BW at the moment?
Give SC2 some frigging time god.
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there will be no money in sc2 unless those running the tournaments (god forbid it is solely blizzard) learn how to market a game -- any game -- to the noncompetitive gamer and even the nongamer. The reason why Korean starcraft is so lucrative is because they've been able to do exactly that, just like every other major sport in the US: They've been able to create team loyalties, player loyalties, fan clubs... they've been able to get WOMEN to love games they don't even know how to play.
Of course, what good is such interests if there's no way to materialize that into advertising dollars? That's exactly why their tv broadcasting strategy works so well: they turn that marketing prowess into eager abiding eyes poring away at a TV screen while corporate brand names crawl around the screen. That's why they don't need to charge people to watch the game and why they can run tournaments without a main sponsor (MSL Survivor Tournaments?).
Of course, what if things go awry and the marketing efforts falter? Then you'd better have something like a government-sanctioned organization (KESPA) to fight on your behalf so you don't have people saying things like "video games are evil" and etc. Even if there is some truth behind those words, you NEVER hear about it in Korea because KeSPA effectively acts as a lobbyist. Yeah, KeSPA fucks up a lot; some people call them evil, whatever... but BW as a game would have not existed the past five years without them, and in many aspects the demand for SC2 wouldn't have been so tangible either.
These three reasons -- marketing, TV, independent supervisory organization -- is why the foreign BW scene fails and why SC2 will fail if it maintains the status quo. This is why i dread Blizzard's insistence on becoming a central figure in the tournament scene and forcing everything to go through BNET: Blizzard is great at making games but sucks at marketing. Yeah, they whupped ass with World of Warcraft -- but an RTS and a MMORPG are totally different things, for a whole variety of reasons i won't get into in this post.
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hmm just a question i want to ask. wth are ppl trying to compare starcraft with poker? there nothing alike. the only similarities is that theres some strategy and thinking in both (altho poker is alot more mind game heavy) so where did the stupid idea sprout that if u like starcraft ull have more fun playing poker? theres strategy in ANY game u play competively. SC>poker. just because i play SC does not mean ill enjoy poker or want to play poker. infact why would i want to play a gamble game where i risk loosing alot of money compared to a game where i loose no money at all if i loose? its stupid. stop comparing poker to SC there 2 completly diffrent worlds.
honestly its like trying to compare basketball to football. both are sports and both are competivive but there NOTHING alike. and being a basketball fan does not mean you will be a football fan by default or vice versa.
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United States47024 Posts
On March 02 2010 18:38 Ballistixz wrote:
hmm just a question i want to ask. wth are ppl trying to compare starcraft with poker? there nothing alike. the only similarities is that theres some strategy and thinking in both (altho poker is alot more mind game heavy) so where did the stupid idea sprout that if u like starcraft ull have more fun playing poker? theres strategy in ANY game u play competively. SC>poker. just because i play SC does not mean ill enjoy poker or want to play poker. infact why would i want to play a gamble game where i risk loosing alot of money compared to a game where i loose no money at all if i loose? its stupid. stop comparing poker to SC there 2 completly diffrent worlds.
honestly its like trying to compare basketball to football. both are sports and both are competivive but there NOTHING alike. and being a basketball fan does not mean you will be a football fan by default or vice versa.
Several prominent former Starcraft players (some of which who post on this site or it's sister site LiquidPoker) have gone on to be successful professional poker players. Some of those players have vouched for the fact that the thought processes involved in them are similar, and that success at one could imply reasonable success at the other.
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On March 02 2010 18:38 Ballistixz wrote:
hmm just a question i want to ask. wth are ppl trying to compare starcraft with poker? there nothing alike. the only similarities is that theres some strategy and thinking in both (altho poker is alot more mind game heavy) so where did the stupid idea sprout that if u like starcraft ull have more fun playing poker? theres strategy in ANY game u play competively. SC>poker. just because i play SC does not mean ill enjoy poker or want to play poker. infact why would i want to play a gamble game where i risk loosing alot of money compared to a game where i loose no money at all if i loose? its stupid. stop comparing poker to SC there 2 completly diffrent worlds.
honestly its like trying to compare basketball to football. both are sports and both are competivive but there NOTHING alike. and being a basketball fan does not mean you will be a football fan by default or vice versa.
Theres not a big risk in poker if you play smart and do proper bankroll management.
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United States33418 Posts
Umm...
Korean Progamers are getting paid to play Brood War.
Foreigners aren't.
Easy answer
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EPT
