EPTThat said, I'd rather if it had the anti air attack instead of the anti armor missles. It would feel more mech that way.
[D] Warhound: Is it good or should it be changed? - Page 31
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xrapture
United States1644 Posts
That said, I'd rather if it had the anti air attack instead of the anti armor missles. It would feel more mech that way. | ||
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DuckNuked
France60 Posts
This units just make everything is fun and interesting in mech going away. where are positionnal play? Where are leapfroging? And weaknesseses when extending too far with too few units. Batlle Hellion and 1 supply widowmines alone would have make TvP mech pretty much more easy to pull off. But this... thing, is just killing meching terran. Swarm, i'm just coming ! Never through of switching before, but this, omagad, it's just the worst addition i can think of in mech. | ||
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JacobShock
Denmark2485 Posts
On September 06 2012 06:01 Jasiwel wrote: I'd rather they bring back the Goliath. It's a standard mech unit that has high DPS (so the Immortal's Hardened Shield wouldn't matter), would still allow Immortals to be viable agaisnt Mech (which is important for balance), and it can be micro'd to better usage. It has an Anti-Air attack so it allows better transitions into Mech versus Zerg since the only anti-air Mech is the Thor (not counting the Viking) and the Goliath was known for chasing off Mutas in Brood War. It just bridges so many gaps that currently are presented. Not to mention it looks way cooler =P | ||
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Embir
Poland567 Posts
On September 06 2012 05:59 maybenexttime wrote: Well, blizzard killed BW for this thing. StarCraft fans are just trying to salvage whatever they can. Try to be objective. Compare HotS to BW and TFT. When experiencing the latter two for the first time, pretty much everybody was like "OH SHIT, OH SHIT, I CAN'T WAIT!!". When it comes to HotS, most additions are either meh or making the game worse. There are tons of people who are majorly dissapointed. Blizzard is dumbing down the game even more, adding blatant a-move units and showing they have no clue were they're going with this expansion pack. Instead of fixing the flaws, they are botching the game further. First off Blizz killed nothing - BW died naturally, it wasnt popular outside Korea these days and there were difficulties with sponsors - thus as buisness model it was unsustainable. Secondly, I don't see tons of people majorly dissapointed - what I see is a vocal minority of whiny nerds and dumb BW fanbois. BW is still there - if this is such a perfect game no one is denying them to play it. So BW fans, dont salvage what is best in your opinion in SC2, you still got your precious BW. I love SC2, most of my friends play it too, it is great game. Of course some decisions of the developers might be questionable but contrary to most whiners I look forward optimistically. | ||
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DuckNuked
France60 Posts
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kruxey
Bulgaria168 Posts
I think if it's made 4 supply or atleast 3 and the missle thing isn't autocasted it could become an interesting unit but from the streams I've watched so far it seems a bit too good especialy vs protoss. Also blizzard has said that they like for people to have multiple army comp choices and the warhoud kinda forces protoss to go zealot/archon/ht(which I like but it takes out the choice). | ||
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kaokentake
383 Posts
On September 06 2012 05:49 Scila wrote: There's 2 options: Keep it as it is with perhaps slight stat adjustments, and make Thors AA attack do 48 dmg to all types of air units. Nerf ground atack to compensate. That way Thor doesn't overlap with Warhound as ground support and never gets made. Option 2, remove Thor, give Warhound AA attack and nerf other stuff accordingly. I prefer option 1 personally. Either way, Mech REALLY needs a viable AA unit, not the shitty Thor we have now. i think thors are great and completely fine as the source of mech anti-air i think mech in WoL is much better designed than mech in BW because I think the thor fits it much better than the goliath. Unlike goliaths the thor is slow (fits mech) and moreso big and powerful (fits mech). The thing making mech so weak against toss is theres no optimal thing the tank for the tanks (unlike mines in BW). I believe battle hellions by itself completely solve the lacking aspect of Mech in WoL. i believe the warhound is completely unneeded and should essentially be removed. Battle Hellion/tank armies should be ALMOST as powerful as warhound based armies, without the lameness of the warhound needing to exist back to thors thors are weak anti-air, sure, however I think they are fine because the mech area of terran can be focused on anti-ground (with small anti-air capability in the thor) while the terran gets vikings for anti-air if needed the problem is not that mech lacks anti-air, the problem is that fungal absolutely and completely rape-fucks vikings all day. not to mention infestors also get to add in infested terrans to compliment the fungal (as if fungal wasnt bad enough) and the broodlings tank damage making the infested terrans stay alive alot longer and so powerful, and you cant really "run" from the infested terrans since mech is so slow and you lose too much while retreating to the infestors/broodlords I believe the biggest problem in WoL right now is the infestor. Collossi isnt really that badly designed compared to the infestor. What makes collossi the most OP is forcefields. Roach/hydra/corrupter would trade well with it if not for the forcefields. i believe the source of the problem in almost all things in WoL is the infestor. fungal rapes air too hard. If fungal was changed to not target air it would fix SO MUCH. vikings would become so much stronger against broodlords, zerg could just mass queen/hydra against voidrays/carriers and would still be completely fine, and ZvZ doesnt matter (heck, muta wars is more fun than this current crap) | ||
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killy666
France204 Posts
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Tausken
United States81 Posts
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Adonminus
Israel543 Posts
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kranten
Netherlands236 Posts
A counter to tanks? Makes no sense, we hardly see huge tank stalemates anymore due to better maps. (I don't even know where DB got the idea) A counter to archons and immortals? Maybe, but they could've just buffed tanks and modified hardened shield, a much more interesting option. I don't think it has a role in TvZ, tanks are better vs roaches and thors are better vs mutas. And all 3 suck vs BLs. I like the widow mine and battle hellion. The battle mode adds another dimension to the hellion, which is cool. The concept of the widow mine is good, but I feel like the damage/cost/supply should be tweaked. Maybe make it static defense? Solves the supply problem, and isn't too much of a BW-copy. | ||
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architecture
United States643 Posts
It doesn't fit T, it looks like something that comes from the C&C universe, where a bunch of bland robots walk around. Look at a mech army with tanks, thors, and warhounds. It looks really really awkward - only tanks look appropriate. Maybe 1-2 thors looks ok, but when you have like 6-7, they look really dumb too. 1. It looks bad because it's a bland generic robot. 2. There are too many robot walkers, T has FOUR! Thors, vikings, battle hellion, warhound! 3. The attack looks really uninspired: looks like stalker shot 4. The feel is wrong. T is all about grit and resourcefulness. There are transformations because of necessity. I'm not sure what the warhound represents in any sense. And why does it have a shield? | ||
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maybenexttime
Poland5830 Posts
On September 06 2012 06:11 Embir wrote: First off Blizz killed nothing - BW died naturally, it wasnt popular outside Korea these days and there were difficulties with sponsors - thus as buisness model it was unsustainable. Secondly, I don't see tons of people majorly dissapointed - what I see is a vocal minority of whiny nerds and dumb BW fanbois. BW is still there - if this is such a perfect game no one is denying them to play it. So BW fans, dont salvage what is best in your opinion in SC2, you still got your precious BW. I love SC2, most of my friends play it too, it is great game. Of course some decisions of the developers might be questionable but contrary to most whiners I look forward optimistically. I'm not talking about the foreign scene... Blizzard killed BW in Korea. They bullied the whole scene for two years, blackmailed KeSPA to force them to switch to sc2. To the point all sponsors outside KeSPA did not want to have anything to do with "illegitimate leagues". You seem pretty blind. People optimistically looking forward to hots are in a minority. Not to mention the fact that sc2 lost half of its original player base since release, while both BW and WC3 were actually gaining players over the years. | ||
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Duncaaaaaan
United Kingdom101 Posts
No thought required, make battle hellions, make warhounds, make vikings, A move, win game. So this is how Dustin Bowder thought of making mech more viable in TvP? Just turn mech into bio in big metal boxes with legs? Fuck this shit. I can stand changes like worker auto mine and not being able to click on enemies or mineral patches, but I cannot stand the way the terran game is shifting. I've been watching ForGG and all he's done every single match is make those two units and just tried to out-upgrade and out-concave his opponent, absolutely zero skill involved compared to making tanks or going bio. | ||
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architecture
United States643 Posts
And then they come out with Thor and Warhound. Thor looks really dumb when you have a ton of them, though 1-2 with a primarily bio army looks kinda cool. Honestly, if you just used the Goliath model instead of the Warhound model, it would look 100x better. | ||
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Andre
Slovenia3523 Posts
On September 06 2012 06:06 xrapture wrote: I think it looks pretty cool. Sure, it's just another a move unit, but that's the state of SC2- Maradaurs, roaches, collosi, archons, chargelots, zerglings. That said, I'd rather if it had the anti air attack instead of the anti armor missles. It would feel more mech that way. You can do basic kite micro with marauders, you can spread them out and shit. With roaches you can burow micro(granted we never see this but the possibility is still there), you can do some pickup micro with WP as far as colossi is concerned. Archons are a-move sure, chargelots too..with lings you set up flanks and counter attack & hold micro etc. Warhounds? AMOVEAMOVEAMOVE. -_____- I hate this unit. If the best MU to watch becomes who makes more warhounds i'll be super pissed. No more Gumiho vs MMA style games, MVP vs MMA. it's all about who makes more warhounds..I hope not :[ I would definetely change warhound, nerf its HP a bit and make the rocket manually-castable so it actually requires some skill to use. | ||
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Jasiwel
United States146 Posts
On September 06 2012 06:11 Embir wrote: First off Blizz killed nothing - BW died naturally, it wasnt popular outside Korea these days and there were difficulties with sponsors - thus as buisness model it was unsustainable. Secondly, I don't see tons of people majorly dissapointed - what I see is a vocal minority of whiny nerds and dumb BW fanbois. BW is still there - if this is such a perfect game no one is denying them to play it. So BW fans, dont salvage what is best in your opinion in SC2, you still got your precious BW. I love SC2, most of my friends play it too, it is great game. Of course some decisions of the developers might be questionable but contrary to most whiners I look forward optimistically. When I talk about bringing the Goliath back, or rather into SCII Multiplayer (since it is in the Single Player), it's not for some displaced sense of nostalgia. It's legitimately for better balance and qualitative gameplay. The Warhound just feels like a plug-in solution that offers little reward in the way of gameplay and as a designer it just reeks of a half-assed attitude. There are so many better ways to make Terran Mech viable. The Goliath just currently works well with the metagame and how everything is trying to balance as of now. The Warhound ruins the point of the Immortal (which was to help Protoss Gateway units be able to fight Mech Terran and Armored Zerg, that of which it does well) and throws PvT into a massive question mark, more so as a result of the War Hellion and Widow Mines. As for people not being majorly disappointed or bringing up BW units that can fill in gaps (like giving Protoss the Scout could also help legitimize Stargate further from a balance perspective), not a lot of SCII players have played Brood War. You will run into them frequently on Customs, but just as frequently as you run into them you'll run into players that have only heard of Brood War. It's not because people are BW nostalgiacs that BW units are called back to replace half-assedly designed units, I assure you. | ||
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Insoleet
France1806 Posts
Poll: What is worst in the Warhound ? Option 1, 2 & 3 (16) It has no sense to have a amove unit in mech play, remove it (2) Ugly, another robot unit, but could be nice with another design (1) Currently too much OP but could be nice (0) 19 total votes Your vote: What is worst in the Warhound ? (Vote): Ugly, another robot unit, but could be nice with another design | ||
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architecture
United States643 Posts
On September 06 2012 06:20 maybenexttime wrote: I'm not talking about the foreign scene... Blizzard killed BW in Korea. They bullied the whole scene for two years, blackmailed KeSPA to force them to switch to sc2. To the point all sponsors outside KeSPA did not want to have anything to do with "illegitimate leagues". You seem pretty blind. People optimistically looking forward to hots are in a minority. Not to mention the fact that sc2 lost half of its original player base since release, while both BW and WC3 were actually gaining players over the years. I think Blizzard really needs to be worried. Lots of bad decisions have made the reception and growth of SC2 and D3 fairly lukewarm. I imagine they wanted to make a bigger splash. As much of a disaster as D3 was, it sold well. But I don't think they will have that luxury with HOTS. Most people are not looking forward to it: 1. Most people are not interested in playing Z only single player. Not _that_ many Z fans in casual players 2. Game doesn't have public mindshare, everyone was still playing SC1 when BW came out 3. Game doesn't have momentum, it's not growing. I really doubt that HOTS will sell well. | ||
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Trotim
Germany95 Posts
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