EPTBrutal NUR, Marine only - Page 6
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kindle139
United States128 Posts
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Shiladie
Canada1631 Posts
On October 08 2010 10:43 kindle139 wrote: good job! though these videos would be better if you edited out the reloads, imo I did a bit on engine of destruction, but then just gave up on it later, I'll now only do that if it's getting too rediculous. | ||
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Bub
United States3518 Posts
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AlCapwn
6 Posts
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bronzeterran
United States296 Posts
"easy" | ||
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Shiladie
Canada1631 Posts
I will be seeing how All in with nydus is first, I may go back and do belly of the beast to try the air version later. Shatter the Sky showed just how effective marines can be vs zerg T3 if microed correctly. Hopefully my 1000 post can be saved for a MISSION COMPLETE in the next few days! | ||
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Tohron
United States135 Posts
EDIT: Didn't see you did it before the Protoss missions. | ||
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Hier
2391 Posts
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TheFinalWord
Australia790 Posts
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Shiladie
Canada1631 Posts
I began working with All-In Nydus. What I found out with my initial research is upsetting. While all of the regular zerg attacks are 100% reliable and predictable, the nydus worms are not. If you save before a nydus worm wave or a kerrigan wave, see where they spawn/which direction she goes, and then reload the save, they will spawn in different locations and she can choose the different path. What this means is that my initial plan of having 10-15 marines at each nydus spawn as it happens is MUCH more difficult to pull off. I also found that nydus worms are unable to spawn where there's a building or unit (situational evidence that the worms never destroy buildings or push units out of the way when they spawn). What I now need to work out, is if a nydus is blocked by a worm, does it fail to spawn, or choose a different location? If it fails to spawn, I've found an easy and surefire way of controlling them. If they spawn in a different location instead, then it is the most difficult situation. I also believe that the nydus spawn locations are fixed, but that there are simply a relatively large number of them. This is something I will need to test by mapping out all of the nydus worm locations to the square, and see if there are consistancies game to game. In the case that they have fixed spawn locations, and fail to spawn if they are blocked, then I can block as many locations as possible, and reload my save until I get a managable number of them at once. If they simply always choose spawn locations that are not blocked, then I will need to have packs of units at as many spots as I can without spreading thin, and then reload until they spawn at those spots. Another thing I noticed with the Nydus worms, though i will need to look again more closely to be sure of numbers, is that there are always ~3 nydus outside your base, and 1 inside, on each spawn wave. I then gave all-in air a try, during which time I believe I have perfected my wall-ins, which will help a lot if I swap back to Nydus. No more then 1 broodlord comes from the back, and the mutas always arrive well in advance, allowing 3 turrets and 1 BC that heads down 20 seconds in advance, enough to hold the back. The mutalisk waves really thin the herd of marines each time, while not immediately noticable, it was notably harder to hit the 200/200 mark then it was in the Nydus varient. BCs are bad at killing broodlords without using yammato. My original plan was to kite in as many as I could, and then yammato the rest; this plan appears to be impossible, as even before the leviathan comes out, I am fighting waves that include 6 purple broodlords, between a kerrigan push and an orange muta wave soon after. While over-all more controllable, the air varient simply causes far too much attrition to be sustainable, especially once the leviathan comes out. In conclusion I believe the Nydus varient will indeed be the way to go, and success will hinge on whether I will be able to control the worms in some way, or not. The deadliest threat I have yet to find a good response to other then using the nova, is the Hunter Killer's that come with Kerrigan. They 3 shot marines (no combat shield) and have 1 base armour (zerg stays ahead in upgs, so until lvl 3, marines do 4 damage a shot to them) and any tanks or BCs that come within range of kerrigan INSTANTLY get one-shot by her one-shotting ability. whenever I come through a kerrigan wave without using the nova it is with extreme extreme losses. My hairbrained plan for the nydus worms, if they work like I hope, is to clear the areas around where they can spawn with the banshees so there's no creep, and then start construction on bunkers in as many spots as I can (if it requires a building, just run a marine there otherwise) and then cancel them all (salvage any I have the luxery to complete, but this is not likely) Any spots that I can't get due to other zerg present, I'll have the banshees and maybe the BCs there and ready to kill any that spawn, hopefully cutting it off before the hydra wave comes out. TLDR I will be continueing whole haul on all-in Nydus with a new simcity since I last tried it, and a new plan for the nydus worms. I also made it to 1100 diamond playing zerg in the ladder, though i have about 300+ bonus pool I'm still eating through, I'll have enough time to mass-game it once I beat this challenge run! Edit: I realise some people may want to know %s 55% is the furthest I've gotten, though the combined waves on All-in Air crush me at this point. I was not keeping track of %s for nydus, as it was mostly research, no hardcore attempts yet (ballpark 40%) | ||
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Thunderflesh
United States382 Posts
Good luck man, I'm looking forward to seeing the video of you pulling this off. | ||
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Dinn
United States66 Posts
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Drunken.Jedi
Germany446 Posts
On October 14 2010 00:14 Dinn wrote: Does no upgrade mean you can't get upgrades from the engineering bay? No, it means no upgrades from the Armory (the one on the Hyperion, not the one you can build in the game) and no reasearch from the reasearch console. | ||
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iMAniaC
Norway703 Posts
Are you allowed to open the maps in the editor to check how the triggers are? I haven't done that, so it won't be cheating if I continue to speculate  Anyway, the nydus worms might be programmed to spawn at a random point in certain regions, and if there are several regions which overlap, there might be good or bad spots to leave unbuilt, in order force a single spawn point instead of one for each area. When I played through All in, I remember having the nydus worms mostly spawn by the cliff by the artifact, so that might be a good spot to leave unbuilt, possibly being an overlap area for several areas in your base. Keep in mind, though, I only played through All in on Normal... And if you want to save money, you could possibly fill your base with tech labs instead of supply depots, as they're cheaper... Oh, and awesome project! | ||
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Shiladie
Canada1631 Posts
If a worm is blocked, either by unit or building, it will simply shift where it spawns until it finds a spot to spawn within it's spawn zone. (this means if you drop a building where it will spawn, it will instead spawn right next to that building) As far as I can tell there are 4-5 spawn zones fot the nydus worms, with I believe the number spawning in each zone being set per wave. There is at the very least a distinction between in-base and outside of base. Over the course of a run on casual I gathered these results. While there is some varience with what I believe to be a low random chance that a designated outside worm spawns on the artifact highground these are fairly consistant: 0-50% 1 inside 2 outside 50-75% 1 inside 3 outside one wave at around 85 was 2 inside 4 outside all waves after that were 1 inside 4 outside after 95% worms continually spawn on the artifact highground until 100% Other info I gathered: All events were 100% predictable for what artifact % they occured at, this includes all nydus waves, all kerrigan waves, and the overlord invasion. Each % takes 18 seconds of game time, totalling the nice 30 minute total game time for 100% The artifact can nova roughly every 12.5% Hydras cut apart marines if the marines are stuck behind a wall, as only a few marines can attack at a time. Zerglings cut apart marines if there is no wall Siege tanks out-range kerrigan's one-shot spell, but only by a small amount. kerrigan will not use her one-shot spell on medics mauraders marines or SCVs at 50% a wave of banelings comes Ultralisks don't come until after 75% | ||
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TheFinalWord
Australia790 Posts
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Ritesh
United Kingdom24 Posts
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Tohron
United States135 Posts
EDIT: Also, a semi-wild idea: have you considered setting up a bunker teleporter between the two sides of your base - then you could position all your marines at the entrance and 'teleport' them elsewhere if the need arises. | ||
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loladin
Norway184 Posts
what if you structure your buildings in the base so that there isn't room for a nydus to spawn, build turrets, tech lab addons, ect. They need room to spawn, don't they? on the high ground where there are lots and lots of nydus worms at the end, you could just fill it all with bunkers. Make room so that your can funnel your marines back and forth though. No idea if this will work or not, but at least you wouldn't have the worms inside your base. | ||
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Shiladie
Canada1631 Posts
On October 15 2010 01:21 loladin wrote: Shiladie, what if you structure your buildings in the base so that there isn't room for a nydus to spawn, build turrets, tech lab addons, ect. They need room to spawn, don't they? on the high ground where there are lots and lots of nydus worms at the end, you could just fill it all with bunkers. Make room so that your can funnel your marines back and forth though. No idea if this will work or not, but at least you wouldn't have the worms inside your base. I did a test where I filled my base with bunkers and such, it shunted the worm to where my forces were on the enterences, while this is a possible strat, it took a LOT of money to do so. I still will be building my depots so they get shunted closer to my armies, but it won't be a focus of my strat. I remembered cheat codes after the fact, I guess since I already have every achievement in there there's no harm in it, I'll probably do a run through with that once before trying for real, just to make sure it's all the same. | ||
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