Dont like this development. Times just around 13 minutes seemed legit but 12:46 and stuff is making me worry again cause its too close in WR Range and i dont think any Distance WR has been set by a clean guy.
On the one hand this looks bad for Farah and Rupp but on the other they just spanked these guys at Pre meet a few weeks ago.
tolen from LetsRun:
1 GEBREMESKEL Dejen ETH 12:46.81 WL 8 1 2 GEBRHIWET Hagos ETH 12:47.53 WJR 8 2 3 KOECH Isaiah Kiplangat KEN 12:48.64 PB 3 4 4 ALAMIREW Yenew ETH 12:48.77 PB 5 LONGOSIWA Thomas Pkemei KEN 12:49.04 PB 2 5 6 KIPKOECH John KEN 12:49.50 PB 1 6 7 BEKELE Tariku ETH 12:54.13 SB 8 KIPCHOGE Eliud KEN 12:55.34 SB 9 BEKELE Kenenisa ETH 12:55.79 SB 10 SOI Edwin Cheruiyot KEN 12:55.99 SB 11 MASAI Moses Ndiema KEN 12:59.21 12 EDRIS Muktar ETH 13:04.34 PB 13 KIPTOO Mark Kosgei KEN 13:06.23 SB
-------------------------------------
From PRE
1 FARAH Mo GBR 12:56.98 WL,MR 4 1 2 KOECH Isaiah Kiplangat KEN 12:57.63 2 3 3 RUPP Galen USA 12:58.90 PB 1 5 4 BEKELE Kenenisa ETH 13:01.48 SB 5 LONGOSIWA Thomas Pkemei KEN 13:03.88 SB 2 3 6 KIPKOECH John KEN 13:06.71 PB 1 5 7 ALAMIREW Yenew ETH 13:06.84 SB
Scary to think that Rupp may be in sub 12:50 shape. We could see him shattered Lagat's American record by 4-6 seconds.
I do think this will happen, though I can't say I expect much of the sort till after London.
On July 07 2012 18:17 Occultus wrote: Dont like this development. Times just around 13 minutes seemed legit but 12:46 and stuff is making me worry again cause its too close in WR Range and i dont think any Distance WR has been set by a clean guy.
I would be a little surprised if Rudisha was dirty, but ya never know. As for the others...hard to say, it's certainly possible that Haile and Kenster doped but who knows for sure. I don't think 12:45 is necessary automatically doped, since I believe that Rupp/Farah are capable of such times and don't have any reason to suspect doping there.
What really had me wondering though was that not only did Gebremesekel run 12:46...but that he was hardly phased or winded after running that time with a 54.6 last lap...that's more than a bit suspicious. Admittedly, those sorts of times haven't been run in quite a long time but the Paris meet did have a perfect storm of ideal conditions: dead calm, cool and damp, pacemaking for a fast race, and a bunch of competitors all going for it. It's been a long, long time since we've had a meet like this AND a group of guys willing to take the pace out hard..not really since KB was gunning for his WRs.
Hey guys... It's been a long while since I've last posted on TL. Little bit out of the gaming scene but once in a while I'll visit to check out new site improvements and catch some of ret's activities. I recently found out there's a running thread and I've actually just started running myself.
I'm a hardcore n00b at running and was hoping to catch some advice here. I'm running a half marathon Oct 14th and would like to have a good preparation for as far that is still possible.
I used to do A LOT of sports up to 8 years ago or so (haven't we all) and pretty much stopped doing anything at all... I have an office job and don't get a lot of movement. I try biking to work whenever it's not raining; which is about a 25mins bike ride. I've pretty much been at activity point 0 up until the beginning of 2012...
At work there's a few sporty guys who had the idea to run the half marathon in Berlin back in April. I subscribed myself and started running a little.
From January up to April 1st I did 2 runs a week. In January the runs were about 5 to 8km in length. In Feb about 8-12km. In March about 10-15km. My 'comfortable' running speed is really low and hanging around 9km/h.
Fast forward to the half marathon, I knew I could run up to 16-17km and figured to do the last couple km on character and willpower. Outcome: 2hrs 40mins... I ran the first 10km at 10km/hr, but around the 16km mark I was totally done. I had to walk certain parts. I felt a little shitty about it but hey, I actually finished before the 3hr limit... not too bad for someone who hardly gets any movement.
After this "achievement" I stopped running alltogether. I just tried running a little again and found pretty much everything I had built up to be gone again.
My goal is to finish in 2hr 10mins (or earlier if somehow possible). I'm not really athletically built, about 1.85m & 91.5kg. I think I can dedicate myself to run 3 times a week. I have no idea however what would be the most efficient way for me to train for this half marathon and to hit my goal..
On July 10 2012 03:21 Smorrie wrote: Hey guys... It's been a long while since I've last posted on TL. Little bit out of the gaming scene but once in a while I'll visit to check out new site improvements and catch some of ret's activities. I recently found out there's a running thread and I've actually just started running myself.
I'm a hardcore n00b at running and was hoping to catch some advice here. I'm running a half marathon Oct 14th and would like to have a good preparation for as far that is still possible.
I used to do A LOT of sports up to 8 years ago or so (haven't we all) and pretty much stopped doing anything at all... I have an office job and don't get a lot of movement. I try biking to work whenever it's not raining; which is about a 25mins bike ride. I've pretty much been at activity point 0 up until the beginning of 2012...
At work there's a few sporty guys who had the idea to run the half marathon in Berlin back in April. I subscribed myself and started running a little.
From January up to April 1st I did 2 runs a week. In January the runs were about 5 to 8km in length. In Feb about 8-12km. In March about 10-15km. My 'comfortable' running speed is really low and hanging around 9km/h.
Fast forward to the half marathon, I knew I could run up to 16-17km and figured to do the last couple km on character and willpower. Outcome: 2hrs 40mins... I ran the first 10km at 10km/hr, but around the 16km mark I was totally done. I had to walk certain parts. I felt a little shitty about it but hey, I actually finished before the 3hr limit... not too bad for someone who hardly gets any movement.
After this "achievement" I stopped running alltogether. I just tried running a little again and found pretty much everything I had built up to be gone again.
My goal is to finish in 2hr 10mins (or earlier if somehow possible). I'm not really athletically built, about 1.85m & 91.5kg. I think I can dedicate myself to run 3 times a week. I have no idea however what would be the most efficient way for me to train for this half marathon and to hit my goal..
Any advice is welcome!
I think you PMed me about this a while ago but I'll repost what I wrote here in case that didn't send properly:
Your previous half marathon went worse than planned for two reasons: 1) WAY insufficent running 2) INSANELY too fast start
2 runs a week for a half marathon is nothing. To be honest it's nothing in general, probably not even enough to make any aerobic gains unless your massively out of shape and sedentary. As far as the pace, you went out at 10kmh which is MUCH faster than you had ever done comfortably in training. That's plain suicide.
Since you don't have much time for until the HM, the best thing you can do for yourself is run more. Build up to 6 times per week of running; 5-8km each time. You might start week 1 with 2 days of 3km each day, then add a day each week till your at 6 runs a week of 3km, then add a few km's to various runs each week.
I'm headed out at the moment, but I'll try to elaborate more and/or answer questions when I get back.
On July 10 2012 03:21 Smorrie wrote: Hey guys... It's been a long while since I've last posted on TL. Little bit out of the gaming scene but once in a while I'll visit to check out new site improvements and catch some of ret's activities. I recently found out there's a running thread and I've actually just started running myself.
I'm a hardcore n00b at running and was hoping to catch some advice here. I'm running a half marathon Oct 14th and would like to have a good preparation for as far that is still possible.
I used to do A LOT of sports up to 8 years ago or so (haven't we all) and pretty much stopped doing anything at all... I have an office job and don't get a lot of movement. I try biking to work whenever it's not raining; which is about a 25mins bike ride. I've pretty much been at activity point 0 up until the beginning of 2012...
At work there's a few sporty guys who had the idea to run the half marathon in Berlin back in April. I subscribed myself and started running a little.
From January up to April 1st I did 2 runs a week. In January the runs were about 5 to 8km in length. In Feb about 8-12km. In March about 10-15km. My 'comfortable' running speed is really low and hanging around 9km/h.
Fast forward to the half marathon, I knew I could run up to 16-17km and figured to do the last couple km on character and willpower. Outcome: 2hrs 40mins... I ran the first 10km at 10km/hr, but around the 16km mark I was totally done. I had to walk certain parts. I felt a little shitty about it but hey, I actually finished before the 3hr limit... not too bad for someone who hardly gets any movement.
After this "achievement" I stopped running alltogether. I just tried running a little again and found pretty much everything I had built up to be gone again.
My goal is to finish in 2hr 10mins (or earlier if somehow possible). I'm not really athletically built, about 1.85m & 91.5kg. I think I can dedicate myself to run 3 times a week. I have no idea however what would be the most efficient way for me to train for this half marathon and to hit my goal..
Any advice is welcome!
If you can really only manage 3 runs per week you just have to keep running a little longer every couple weeks or so. You don't want to get injured by trying to run too fast, too often, or for too long if your body isn't ready for it. So start slow, run easy, and build up the mileage the best you can. If you're feeling good maybe you can add in some sort of workouts before your race.
Consider getting into a good eating plan and start strength training. If you want more specific help or advice let me know or look around in this sub forum.
Ahh, I never received any message back from you... figured you probably didn't have time Thanks for your write-up so far though! Eventhough... you make my current condition sound superawful >.<
I think I'm in bad shape, but not horrible+++ Perhaps I still have some sort of base level in me if anything like it exists. In my 'history' I mentioned I used to sport a lot, I really did; 5 to 6 times a week. I used to play a lot of volleyball (finished 4th once and top 8 once @ National Championships under 18), I like to believe that this has helped me develop a good set of legs for life :D
Maybe I portrayed my situation worse than it is but the fact that I wasn't able to complete the HM in a normal pace is pretty bad I guess.
I actually just came home from a run a bit back. Distance: 9.28km. Duration: 1hr 0mins 41sec. Avg Pace: 6:32 min/km Avg. Speed: 9.18
I felt like I could do at least another 15mins on the same pace but I figured to go home and make it a nice hour run. I'll try and see if there's any way to export my Runkeeper data tomorrow or so (eventho I don't track all my runs). I'm not sure if I can do 5 runs a week, 4 would be really pushing it. Do you think it helps if I vary my runs a lot? For example doing 9-10km at regular pace twice, a 5km full speed & then another 7km at a comfy pace? Or would I be off better doing everything at regular pace?
Edit: A few more questions. - What's the best time to run to get the most out of it? I like running in the evening/night. After I get home from work I cook and eat, then sit around for 2 hours and start running at 9pm. I've tried running in the morning before work a few times but I haven't really liked it and it seemed performance wise I've always done worse.
- In order to push out more runs a week I would probably have to mix in some morning runs to fit it in my schedule. If I have done a late evening run, would you recommend doing a morning run right after as well if I have no option to run that day?
- Should I alter my running plan to how I feel at the moment of running? As in, if I feel it's going to be a shitty run should I make it shorter and rather do 6km instead of 8km? And if I feel great should I keep running and go for an extra 2km?
On July 10 2012 06:15 Smorrie wrote: Ahh, I never received any message back from you... figured you probably didn't have time Thanks for your write-up so far though! Eventhough... you make my current condition sound superawful >.<
I think I'm in bad shape, but not horrible+++ Perhaps I still have some sort of base level in me if anything like it exists. In my 'history' I mentioned I used to sport a lot, I really did; 5 to 6 times a week. I used to play a lot of volleyball (finished 4th once and top 8 once @ National Championships under 18), I like to believe that this has helped me develop a good set of legs for life :D
Maybe I portrayed my situation worse than it is but the fact that I wasn't able to complete the HM in a normal pace is pretty bad I guess.
I actually just came home from a run a bit back. Distance: 9.28km. Duration: 1hr 0mins 41sec. Avg Pace: 6:32 min/km Avg. Speed: 9.18
I felt like I could do at least another 15mins on the same pace but I figured to go home and make it a nice hour run. I'll try and see if there's any way to export my Runkeeper data tomorrow or so (eventho I don't track all my runs). I'm not sure if I can do 5 runs a week, 4 would be really pushing it. Do you think it helps if I vary my runs a lot? For example doing 9-10km at regular pace twice, a 5km full speed & then another 7km at a comfy pace? Or would I be off better doing everything at regular pace?
Edit: A few more questions. - What's the best time to run to get the most out of it? I like running in the evening/night. After I get home from work I cook and eat, then sit around for 2 hours and start running at 9pm. I've tried running in the morning before work a few times but I haven't really liked it and it seemed performance wise I've always done worse.
- In order to push out more runs a week I would probably have to mix in some morning runs to fit it in my schedule. If I have done a late evening run, would you recommend doing a morning run right after as well if I have no option to run that day?
- Should I alter my running plan to how I feel at the moment of running? As in, if I feel it's going to be a shitty run should I make it shorter and rather do 6km instead of 8km? And if I feel great should I keep running and go for an extra 2km?
Run whenever you feel like is the best time for you.
It's usually better to just run once per day unless you're running lots of miles per week.
Yes, always run by feel. Generally shitty runs won't give you much results. Sometimes it's better to just stop and try again the next day. If you feel good most people are inclined to run a little faster and maybe a little longer. That's fine as long as you don't go too crazy. If you're used to running 10 minute miles for 30 minutes don't run 8 minute miles for 50 minutes. A little faster and a little longer is okay. Do what feels good within reason.
If you were good at volleyball you should still have the power and speed in your legs. This is the stuff that doenst disappear. Endurance is only temporarily. Unfortunately you dont need any of your given speed for a sub 2 Half.
Here is the basic advice that worked for everyone i spoke to. Its a simple recipe for a guaranteed sub 2 Half. And trust me, its all you need. No need to go deeper in training theory and weird pace calculations.
-Step 1: Run 4 times a week. Really, do it. Your running an endurance event, show endurance in training and not just on the road. The remaining time till October is a short span so the risk of injury is not that high at all, even if you run 4 times continously. There is always time for a little running.
-Ingredients: 1 longer run (progress 5 minutes every week, start with 60 minutes, 2nd week 65 minutes etc...once you reach 90 minutes dont go further up), 1 interval (8x90 seconds of fast running, 90 seconds rest OR 6x3 minutes fast, 2 minutes rest. Alternate these 2 every week. It should feel hard to complete but you should remain the same pace throughout every repeat in your session) 2 easy jogs 30-50 minutes. Dont look at the pace, just an easy feel.
This is your checklist to do every week. If you cant manage everything, leave out an easy jog. Dont cut your longrun, you need to run some kilometres at least. Dont do your longrun the day after or before interval session.
Ahh, I never received any message back from you... figured you probably didn't have time Thanks for your write-up so far though! Eventhough... you make my current condition sound superawful >.<
I think I'm in bad shape, but not horrible+++ Perhaps I still have some sort of base level in me if anything like it exists. In my 'history' I mentioned I used to sport a lot, I really did; 5 to 6 times a week. I used to play a lot of volleyball (finished 4th once and top 8 once @ National Championships under 18), I like to believe that this has helped me develop a good set of legs for life :D
Your condition isn't superbad, relatively average is probably correct. You could even be in good shape for hiking and general activity and still only be in mediocre running shape. Your talking about a HM though, with a goal time...which requires solid conditioning.
The volleyball definitely didn't hurt, but it doesn't do a ton for overall aerobic conditioning which is by FAR the most important thing with running. The type of leg strength/speed developed by volleyball can be applicable to running, but not as much for slower run like a HM or marathon. In short, the volleyball definitely helped, but it's not super running specific and was a while.
Maybe I portrayed my situation worse than it is but the fact that I wasn't able to complete the HM in a normal pace is pretty bad I guess.
No, not at all. It takes solid training and decent pacing for most people to complete a HM in a solid time. You did fine for a first effort off of what is essentially no training.
. I'm not sure if I can do 5 runs a week, 4 would be really pushing it.
Why? What is keeping you from doing more? I mean this earnestly as there are numerous reasons why people can't always run as much as would be ideal.
Do you think it helps if I vary my runs a lot? For example doing 9-10km at regular pace twice, a 5km full speed & then another 7km at a comfy pace? Or would I be off better doing everything at regular pace?
Where you are now, no. The exception would be if your out for a run, feeling great, and the last 1-2km of a run and you want to let it rip a little more than usual and bring it home strong (don't got hard, just strong and smooth; powerful without straining or going to the hurt zone). Runs at "full speed" are generally a bad idea, as that is a race and doing that on a regular basis isn't good. One or two races of 5k or 10k before a HM can be good preparation though.
What's the best time to run to get the most out of it? I like running in the evening/night. After I get home from work I cook and eat, then sit around for 2 hours and start running at 9pm. I've tried running in the morning before work a few times but I haven't really liked it and it seemed performance wise I've always done worse.
That's somewhat up to you. I generally run much slower on morning runs too; but it's the effort that counts, not the pace. So even if in the morning your "easy" effort is 8:30 min/km pace its still as beneficial as running 6:30 min/km pace in the evening. That said, if it generally feels better to run at a certain time then I'd go for that because being in a good mental state is always a good thing not to mention you'll make your running more enjoyable.
In order to push out more runs a week I would probably have to mix in some morning runs to fit it in my schedule. If I have done a late evening run, would you recommend doing a morning run right after as well if I have no option to run that day?
Yes, that's fine. Most serious runners run 10-14 times a week so it's perfectly okay to run a night run and then a run the next morning.
Should I alter my running plan to how I feel at the moment of running? As in, if I feel it's going to be a shitty run should I make it shorter and rather do 6km instead of 8km? And if I feel great should I keep running and go for an extra 2km?
Perfectly fine, just be sure you give the run a little time (10-15 min) before you decide it's shitty or not. Sometimes you can feel awful starting but find a nice rhythm ten minutes into the run.
My volleyball training has always focused on acceleration and explosiveness rather than endurance but still nice to fall back on. I guess bottom line of all is that I just have to run more, but there always so many excuses not to run. It's definitely possible but work, traveling, upcoming events (wedding, birthday, holidays, etc), are all taking up my time as well. Either way, I'm going to try and better my life
I'll probably have more questions in the future, regarding picking up my pace and most optimized preparation from 2 weeks in front to the actual run etc., so I'll be around.
I could also share my progress/training but I doubt my noob data is interesting.
I could also share my progress/training but I doubt my noob data is interesting.
No not at all, feel free to share whatever; whether you want advice, motivation, feedback it's all stuff I don't mind reading and discussing. Whether your running 9 min/km or 2:40 min/km doesn't really make it any more or less interesting.
Hey everyone, just wondering what you guys think of treadmill running. I really want to get into running but the problem is I live in Phoenix and its just so bloody hot outside, especially now that it's summer. So instead of running outside in the uncomfortable 100F+ heat, I am thinking about using a treadmill. I am a total beginner and pretty out of shape, with a 5k time of about 30 mins, but i'm hoping to improve, not only speed but also distance. One of my biggest goals is to run a marathon someday and would like to start seriously training for one asap.
So I know that in general treadmill running isn't as good as real running because on a treadmill all you're doing is lifting your feet up and re-positioning them as the treadmill mat moves beneath you and you're not actually propelling yourself forward with your legs, but I am still wondering if it would be a good idea for me to start off on a treadmill, just until I become less of a beginner. I was thinking maybe that once I can run a good 10k in a reasonable amount of time on the treadmill I would gradually switch over to real running and continue my training from there.
So does anyone think this is a good idea? starting off as a beginner on the treadmill. Or is it better to avoid the treadmill all together and just stick with real running? Also if anyone has any good tips/thoughts on treadmill running I'd love to hear.
Treadmills aren't as bad as some people (myself included ) make them out to be. I just don't like them because I feel they're very boring. But you can still get good work outs running on a treadmill, especially if the alternative is dying outside and taking shorter runs because you heat up so quickly.
Any running is good running :D Just avoid concrete.
Treadmills are fine, I just hate them for personal reasons. If you do use them one thing I'd recommend is to put the incline to 1 to compensate for wind resistance and inertia.
Build up the amount of time you spend running very slowly to avoid injury. Also don't worry about your pace for now and just go focus on keeping things enjoyable and interesting. And log all your workouts too.
On July 11 2012 09:03 procrastibation wrote: Hey everyone, just wondering what you guys think of treadmill running. I really want to get into running but the problem is I live in Phoenix and its just so bloody hot outside, especially now that it's summer. So instead of running outside in the uncomfortable 100F+ heat, I am thinking about using a treadmill. I am a total beginner and pretty out of shape, with a 5k time of about 30 mins, but i'm hoping to improve, not only speed but also distance. One of my biggest goals is to run a marathon someday and would like to start seriously training for one asap.
So I know that in general treadmill running isn't as good as real running because on a treadmill all you're doing is lifting your feet up and re-positioning them as the treadmill mat moves beneath you and you're not actually propelling yourself forward with your legs, but I am still wondering if it would be a good idea for me to start off on a treadmill, just until I become less of a beginner. I was thinking maybe that once I can run a good 10k in a reasonable amount of time on the treadmill I would gradually switch over to real running and continue my training from there.
So does anyone think this is a good idea? starting off as a beginner on the treadmill. Or is it better to avoid the treadmill all together and just stick with real running? Also if anyone has any good tips/thoughts on treadmill running I'd love to hear.
This isn't actually true. Your most definitely propelling yourself forward, after all the belt is moving back...if you weren't propelling yourself you would be flung unceremoniously off the back of the treadmill.
The difference with the treadmill is in the landing, in that your feet are contacting ground that is unstable and moving backward; a condition your unlikely to encounter when running outside. That and there is no wind resistance to deal with. That said these are minimal things, and if conditions dictate a run on the treadmill can be as good or better as what you wanted to do outside. If it's 100 degree heat and don't have an issue with treadmill running...go for it. If you had planned workouts I would say absolutely do them on the mill as opposed to in sweltering heat.
At the end of the day they were more than good enough for this man, so I imagine it can't be all that terrible of a way to train:
EPT
Thanks for your write-up so far though! Eventhough... you make my current condition sound superawful >.<
) make them out to be. I just don't like them because I feel they're very boring. But you can still get good work outs running on a treadmill, especially if the alternative is dying outside and taking shorter runs because you heat up so quickly.
