EPTFitness Questions & Answers - Page 93
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Sneakyz
Sweden2361 Posts
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
On September 16 2012 00:29 Sneakyz wrote: If we assume your statement of "Calories are not a limiting factor on muscle development." is true, there is still the issue of decreased performance when eating less. I've lowered my calories by 500 for about 3 weeks now and already experienced losses in strength. Less weight lifted means lesser muscle gains. The obvious solution is to stop eating entirely, your strength losses will stop, and you don't need any calories to build muscle mass. The current strength losses are probably an early symptom of Chronic Heart Disease, which we all know you can get just by having meat in your fridge. The solution is to hurry up and become diabetic so you can safely go on an all carb diet. /mockery User was warned for this post | ||
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Hanakurena
105 Posts
In body building and strength training it may be accepted to eat tons of calories. The truth model of the gym is to accept whatever everyone else is trying and to adjust that based on personal experience. That just doens't work and leads to myths. On September 16 2012 00:29 Sneakyz wrote: I've lowered my calories by 500 for about 3 weeks now and already experienced losses in strength. Less weight lifted means lesser muscle gains. This can't be true. You can't know if a diet program works in 3 weeks. Also, you can't get losses in strength from a diet. Yes, less weight lifted may mean less muscle gains. But the big question is why you can't lift as much. How can diet have anything to do with it? You are probably overtraining, underresting or misjudging. Why do people always see a correlationwith diet? Why is diet so important for muscles? No one has been able to tell me that. Again, it all goes back to Milo of Croton and every strong man after him doing the same thing and making the same claims without having a clue. Anyway, this is all pointless if you are on a proper diet. Why restrict your calories with 500 under what you are eating currently if your diet is good? Are you overweight? The myth of protein and calorie surplus leads to people getting fat and people consuming protein powder over their daily diet, which may not be good anyway. That's the problem. Not random people claiming they shouldn't eat less. SS with gomad, gaining 28 pounds of fat and 2 pounds of muscle is the problem. | ||
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
en·er·gy [en-er-jee] noun, plural en·er·gies. 1. the capacity for vigorous activity; available power Not complicated. Exercise is, by definition, a vigorous activity. In a month, you can have substantial strength loss due to nutrition. I should know, when I lost 40 pounds in a month before I first got diagnosed with Crohn's, I could barely walk, and muscle mass was vanishing. All due to a serious caloric deficit. I wasn't overtraining, I had paperwork from a doctor exempting me from Army physical training. I wasn't underresting, the caloric deficit had me so fatigued I was sleeping every minute I wasn't at work. By the way, this isn't just reducing to the most absurd extreme. I'm actually establishing that there is, in fact, a minimum point where you're just dead wrong. We can quibble over where that ceases to be the case, but the fact is, you're making a demonstrably false blanket statement. If we know that at some point, caloric deficit does cause dramatic mass and strength loss, it's a reasonable working hypothesis that at lower deficits, the same will hold true, just not as dramatic. So, reasonably, you'd need to show studies to disprove that, since it's the most logical conclusion to reach for purposes of generalization. | ||
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Ahzz
Finland780 Posts
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
On September 16 2012 02:29 Hanakurena wrote: If everyone here is so independently minded and college educated (lol), then how come everyone here furiously attacks anyone that does not subscribe to the dogma? In body building and strength training it may be accepted to eat tons of calories. The truth model of the gym is to accept whatever everyone else is trying and to adjust that based on personal experience. That just doens't work and leads to myths. The myth of protein and calorie surplus leads to people getting fat and people consuming protein powder over their daily diet, which may not be good anyway. That's the problem. Not random people claiming they shouldn't eat less. SS with gomad, gaining 28 pounds of fat and 2 pounds of muscle is the problem. I'm honestly so confused right now  Also, 3 months of SS with gomad to keep my calories above 4k+ daily: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/llck1.jpg) Did I do something wrong. I just don't get it. | ||
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Sneakyz
Sweden2361 Posts
On September 16 2012 02:29 Hanakurena wrote: This can't be true. You can't know if a diet program works in 3 weeks. Also, you can't get losses in strength from a diet. Yes, less weight lifted may mean less muscle gains. But the big question is why you can't lift as much. How can diet have anything to do with it? You are probably overtraining, underresting or misjudging. Why do people always see a correlationwith diet? Why is diet so important for muscles? No one has been able to tell me that. Again, it all goes back to Milo of Croton and every strong man after him doing the same thing and making the same claims without having a clue. Anyway, this is all pointless if you are on a proper diet. Why restrict your calories with 500 under what you are eating currently if your diet is good? Are you overweight? Obviously I'm overweight  . I've had consistent strength gains for like 6 months prior to lowering my calories, so if I'm suddenly overtraining or underresting with the only variable changed being diet, that would imply that more calories increases recovery. | ||
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kastoob
Australia153 Posts
On September 16 2012 06:09 Ahzz wrote: I don't have weightlifting shoes, so is it fine to keep using a piece of wood under my heels when I squat? Liftbigeatbig makes an argument saying it would probably be necessary: http://www.liftbigeatbig.com/2012/07/you-need-olympic-weightlifting-shoes.html (prolly NSFW they always post pics of women's butts for whatever reason) I think that's more for people who are serious about lifting. I'm at 1.7 x bw squat and I haven't had issues in just chucks without anything under heels (though I might be able to go deeper with heels raised). Depending on you level it might not be worth worrying about. edit: On September 15 2012 22:47 Hanakurena wrote: Everything the body does requires energy. So it's an absurd notion that I suggest energy isn't conserved. Calories build fat, not muscle. Training and recovery of the muscle build muscle. This just in, eating makes you fat, better stop doing that. Lift weights and don't eat anything -> ripped. Gotcha. This is what you are saying right? You do know that calories and energy are synonymous? You do realise that the metabolic pathway for muscle anabolism requires energy to take place, and it won't start adapting without energy right? By that it means you need energy (= calories) which you get from eating anything (ie vegetable, fruit as well as meat) in order for the process to occur, without worrying about the details of how specific nutrients work. You do realise in order to train you need calories to even do the mechanical work of pushing a weight against the Earth's gravitational potential, right? You could've just said "The meme in question has flawed logic since cardiovascular exercise doesn't necessarily cause muscle tissue loss, [insert relevant link]". None would get mad, question the research maybe. But this all routes to explaining the 'my gains sorry no cardio' meme. Look at how ridiculous this looks now. You drop a one line red herring just to start an argument, and then say people are getting mad because of some other reason. No bro, it's because of how misleading or blatantly incorrect you get. You're claiming we're being dogmatic because we're using thermodynamics. You serious bro? double edit: Since cardio works the muscle tissue, it is capable of causing over training too. Cardio isn't magical. The meme is about some guy that only cares about muscle growth ie 'mah gainz'. He doesn't do cardio since he wants all his training to go towards muscle. If said person only cared about cardiovascular ability then the weightlifting would be cut. | ||
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Emnjay808
United States10665 Posts
Now its 9 months later and Ive progressed slowly to doing my sets from 55 to 65 lbs. Ive pushed to 70lbs before but only when I felt super in shape and could muster up the adrenaline. I feel like I could clear 80lbs for a set but Im scared Im pushing it too much and might hurt myself. Is there any tips for making better progress? I normally do 3 sets of 7-10 reps and adding 5lbs for each progressive set. At the end of the year I want to be able to push at least 80, maybe even 90. Im more looking for diet advice or how to set up my work out sets/reps better. Only supplements I take is whey protein. Thanks in advance. | ||
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kastoob
Australia153 Posts
Starting strength has over head press and bench pressing on alternating training days, so you could do something along the lines of that. I've heard dumbbells are harder that barbell bench, but I've hit 143.3 lbs barbell bench (I weighed 137.7lbs at the time if it matters) just alternating between overhead and bench press each session. Also don't forget to balance pushing movements with pulling movements (chin ups, rows, dealifts, cleans etc.) to ensure good posture. Since you want performance (ie hitting a press number) I'd suggest supplementing with creatine monohydrate. It's cheap, safe and has a ridiculous amount of studies backing it. I'm a fan. http://examine.com/supplements/Creatine/ Diet: just follow eshlow's advice on the nutritional sticky on what to eat. Here's some good stuff more specific to training: http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/category/muscle-gain/eating-for-muscle-gain | ||
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Hanakurena
105 Posts
On September 16 2012 11:42 kastoob wrote: You could've just said "The meme in question has flawed logic since cardiovascular exercise doesn't necessarily cause muscle tissue loss, [insert relevant link]". None would get mad, question the research maybe. But this all routes to explaining the 'my gains sorry no cardio' meme. Look at how ridiculous this looks now. You drop a one line red herring just to start an argument, and then say people are getting mad because of some other reason. No bro, it's because of how misleading or blatantly incorrect you get. You're claiming we're being dogmatic because we're using thermodynamics. You serious bro? double edit: Since cardio works the muscle tissue, it is capable of causing over training too. Cardio isn't magical. The meme is about some guy that only cares about muscle growth ie 'mah gainz'. He doesn't do cardio since he wants all his training to go towards muscle. If said person only cared about cardiovascular ability then the weightlifting would be cut. I can't even follow this. How is it that you people's reading comprehensions are all equally bad in exactly the same way? I used to write posts on TL assuming my audience are average teenagers that just happen to like video games (so not high educated young adults with degrees). But it seems the people on H&F don't even cut the 'average'-label. Where the fuck did I say cardio can't cause overtraining. WTF. Also, why do you act like cardio is something special according to me? WTF. Meme? You even the fuck know what that means? Shit people do on this board when they know mods got their backs covered... Also, what's up with warning JingleHell when he already did the same thing 6 times before but was let off the hook? That's just to try to convince me? Wow. User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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eshlow
United States5210 Posts
On September 16 2012 19:08 Emnjay808 wrote: Been working on flat bench dumbells since the beginning of this year. I heard that its great for working out your chest, arms, and overall core. Start of the year I could probably push my sets from 40 to 50 lbs. Now its 9 months later and Ive progressed slowly to doing my sets from 55 to 65 lbs. Ive pushed to 70lbs before but only when I felt super in shape and could muster up the adrenaline. I feel like I could clear 80lbs for a set but Im scared Im pushing it too much and might hurt myself. Is there any tips for making better progress? I normally do 3 sets of 7-10 reps and adding 5lbs for each progressive set. At the end of the year I want to be able to push at least 80, maybe even 90. Im more looking for diet advice or how to set up my work out sets/reps better. Only supplements I take is whey protein. Thanks in advance. What does your current routine look like? And how much time do you rest between sets? And are you doing sets of 3x70,75,80 or something ? Or is it like 3x5 of 70 And what are your goals? Hyperrtophy, strength or what? | ||
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Emnjay808
United States10665 Posts
On September 17 2012 00:57 eshlow wrote: What does your current routine look like? And how much time do you rest between sets? And are you doing sets of 3x70,75,80 or something ? Or is it like 3x5 of 70 And what are your goals? Hyperrtophy, strength or what? First set is 55lbs x10, second 60lbs x7, third 65lbs x 7. Rest is about 2-3 minute. I guess Im aiming for both strength and hypertrophy, more so for strength though. I consider this my to be my main workout set as its the only one I have set a goal for. Other sets I do (if it matters) are mostly chest and back work on the machines. 3 sets of 7-10 reps, maybe 4 sets if I dont go too heavy. I total up about 4-5 different work outs every session then jog 1-2 miles at the park right after. | ||
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ieatkids5
United States4628 Posts
On September 17 2012 02:31 Emnjay808 wrote: First set is 55lbs x10, second 60lbs x7, third 65lbs x 7. Rest is about 2-3 minute. I guess Im aiming for both strength and hypertrophy, more so for strength though. I consider this my to be my main workout set as its the only one I have set a goal for. Other sets I do (if it matters) are mostly chest and back work on the machines. 3 sets of 7-10 reps, maybe 4 sets if I dont go too heavy. I total up about 4-5 different work outs every session then jog 1-2 miles at the park right after. if you want to be more well rounded, you should consider dumbbell squats and deadlifts as part of your routine. right now, you're only working your upper body. when i first started deadlifting, i got sore in places i didnt know were supposed to have muscle. you can add squats to every workout in your routine, and deadlifts every other workout. | ||
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eshlow
United States5210 Posts
On September 17 2012 02:31 Emnjay808 wrote: First set is 55lbs x10, second 60lbs x7, third 65lbs x 7. Rest is about 2-3 minute. I guess Im aiming for both strength and hypertrophy, more so for strength though. I consider this my to be my main workout set as its the only one I have set a goal for. Other sets I do (if it matters) are mostly chest and back work on the machines. 3 sets of 7-10 reps, maybe 4 sets if I dont go too heavy. I total up about 4-5 different work outs every session then jog 1-2 miles at the park right after. Pyramiding up can be OK, but generally speaking cross sets of 3x7 65 if you can do it would be more effective for strength. What other work are you doing? What are you doing for legs? | ||
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Emnjay808
United States10665 Posts
On September 17 2012 06:46 eshlow wrote: Pyramiding up can be OK, but generally speaking cross sets of 3x7 65 if you can do it would be more effective for strength. What other work are you doing? What are you doing for legs? I dont do legs. I did it once with a friend, deadlifts. My legs turned to jello and I couldnt go running for a week. Havent thought of working on legs since. I suppose thats a bad idea since Im only working on upper body. But I enjoy running after a gym session so I dont know what to do. Anyways, Ill try doing 65 with starting set and 65 finishing set. | ||
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Zafrumi
Switzerland1272 Posts
On September 17 2012 17:03 Emnjay808 wrote: I dont do legs. I did it once with a friend, deadlifts. My legs turned to jello and I couldnt go running for a week. Havent thought of working on legs since. I suppose thats a bad idea since Im only working on upper body. But I enjoy running after a gym session so I dont know what to do. Anyways, Ill try doing 65 with starting set and 65 finishing set. you probably took too much weight. start easy and increase the weight each week  and maybe only deadlift once per week.I absolutely do recommend you train your legs, even if you are into running. strong legs can run faster than weak legs! | ||
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Ahzz
Finland780 Posts
On September 17 2012 17:03 Emnjay808 wrote: I dont do legs. I did it once with a friend, deadlifts. My legs turned to jello and I couldnt go running for a week. Havent thought of working on legs since. I suppose thats a bad idea since Im only working on upper body. But I enjoy running after a gym session so I dont know what to do. Anyways, Ill try doing 65 with starting set and 65 finishing set. The first attempt at something new will always make you feel super sore. After a few times in, it won't feel so bad. IMO you want to do something with your legs at least, because you'll look stupid if nothing else if everything else is trained and you have small legs | ||
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kastoob
Australia153 Posts
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Malinor
Germany4751 Posts
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