EPTRead the OP.
TL Health and Fitness Initiative 2011 - Page 490
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Cambium
United States16368 Posts
Read the OP. | ||
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bdictkam
Canada155 Posts
I have heard of people of doing a certain workout for a certain muscle group and not touching that area for a whole week, and saying they get better results then pounding away 2-3 times a week. | ||
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Ludrik
Australia523 Posts
On August 11 2011 12:52 FiWiFaKi wrote: + Show Spoiler + I have some questions about my workout technique I'm doing right now, and what people think. So my goal is to become a very toned mid sized body. Right I have very little fat, I think losing a pound on my stomach would be nice but besides I'm pretty good elsewhere. However I want to work at developing a bigger build. I am 17 years old, 5'10 155lb. I'm pretty weak compared to many numbers I see here, and I have only seriously been working out for two months. My maxes are: Bench: 155lbs Bicep Curl: 70lb bar Squat: 225lbs Now these are maxes and generally what I do... 6 sets per exercise, 3 exercises per muscle. First two sets are warm up where I tell myself "Put a weight I can do 30 at and do 12, second one is a weight I can do 20 at and do 10." Now the next 4 are generally 6,5,4,4. As for the workout I do, I like to go 3 times a week, two muscles each day. Monday: Bicept - Regular standing curls - Sitting one arm dumbells - The squigilly bar sitting down elbows on surface. Back - Pull down to chest - Lateral pull to stomach - Bent over forward pulling bar to chest Wendesday: Chest - Declined Bench - Regular bench or machine where you put your arms together - Inclined bench w/ barbells Tricepts - Bench press, hands together - Laying down, bar up and down above head - A machine similiar to the bicept squigily bar w/ elbows on surface but opposite way Friday Legs - Squat - 45 degree leg press - Machine where you pull your legs up Shoulders - Sitting bench press thing - Shoulders up at the sides sitting or standing - Shoulders up in front. Calves - Sitting down to tippy toes - Standing to tippy toes Abs I tend to do at home twice a week, and on the day I do tricepts I like adding a couple sets of the machine for obliques. Now for my questions. How is my rep amount, my really buff uncle (450lb bench press) told me this is ideal so I decided to take his word for it. I mean trying to get a larger toned body, my overall goal would probably be 170-175lb body that's very toned. I want to keep my range of motion as large as possible and minimize the loss of flexibility as much as I can. At the moment I eat very healthy thanks to my mom, but I would have no trouble adjusting my diet even more. At the moment I am a very good endurance runner, and I like having that, so also keeping my condition as high as possible is very important. Pretty much I just want to be overall stronger, bigger, and maintain as many qualities of a skinny person as well as possible. I am not interested in taking any creatine or anything, but wondering what experience people have with protein powder, and if it's worthwhile, as if I understand it correctly it's good. Really any help to help me reach my goal would be very appreciated. Thank you. Oh and I do have a gym right near my house that I have a yearly membership too, and they have every machine imaginable, just wanted that to be added. If your goal is to put on 20lb then the only way that will happen is if you eat more. Food intake modulates weight. Exercise modulates body composition (ie. fat-muscle ratio). So eating more will cause you to increase weight. A good exercise program will make sure that weight is muscle. So EAT MORE. | ||
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Ludrik
Australia523 Posts
On August 11 2011 13:26 bdictkam wrote: It really depends on what level lifter you are, how your program is structured, the types of muscle fibers in the areas you're working, the energy system you want to train, etc.I am not over thinking, i want to get the most out of my weight training so care to know how much time is usually a recommended amount of sleep time between working wasted muscle groups again, regardless of workout. Tomorow ill likely feel pretty fine but im wondering if givening extra rest to a muscle group gives better gains. I have heard of people of doing a certain workout for a certain muscle group and not touching that area for a whole week, and saying they get better results then pounding away 2-3 times a week. For most exercises 1-2 days rest works fine. Certain exercises like deadlifts for example are done less often because the lower back takes a while to recover and they tend to interfere a lot with other lifts. Also based on your previous post you're just experiencing DOMS (Delayed onset muscle soreness). When I first started squatting I would be sore the next day guaranteed. Now that I'm starting to lift heavier weights (which feel mighty heavy while I'm lifting them) I don't feel it at all the next day. This is squatting 3 times a week. Generally the less often you do an exercise. The more sore it will get when you finally do do it. | ||
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phyre112
United States3090 Posts
On August 11 2011 12:36 bdictkam wrote: I imagine u still get sore when u tear your muscles even after u get used to it.. And I'm telling you that, when your muscles are used to working out you don't get sore. At least not to the point where it's something that bothers you. Sure you might be aware you've worked out recently, but that's it. On August 11 2011 12:36 bdictkam wrote: my question is how much time you leave inbetween lifting on the same muscle groups? Day A Squat 3x5 Bench 3x5 Deadlift 3x5 Day B Squat 3x5 OHP 3x5 Powerclean 3x5 So for squats, one day in between most workouts. Thing is, Squats, deads, and powercleans all involve some significant muscle overlap, as do Bench and OHP. So There's not really "one" answer to that question. On August 11 2011 12:36 bdictkam wrote: For example how many days inbetween that u give your body to recover before you do squats again Squat three times a week on SS. People like Decaf and Dimsum that are doing more advanced, specific training squat even more. On August 11 2011 12:48 AoN.DimSum wrote: what workout are you doing? I think you are overthinking this. haha + Show Spoiler + On August 10 2011 14:50 bdictkam wrote: I do approx 45 mins cardio plus a 15 end of gymtime cardio And i do 4-5 weight exercises 3 sets each, 10/9/failureor8 That's the extent of information we've gotten about his workout routine, and he's been over thinking things for the last twenty pages, and two pages of last year's thread (which is now locked. Shoutout to Zatic for being a boss) | ||
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phyre112
United States3090 Posts
On August 11 2011 12:52 FiWiFaKi wrote: I have some questions about my workout technique I'm doing right now, and what people think. So my goal is to become a very toned mid sized body. Right I have very little fat, I think losing a pound on my stomach would be nice but besides I'm pretty good elsewhere. However I want to work at developing a bigger build. I am 17 years old, 5'10 155lb. I'm pretty weak compared to many numbers I see here, and I have only seriously been working out for two months. My maxes are: Bench: 155lbs Bicep Curl: 70lb bar Squat: 225lbs Nice lifts - I don't think anyone else here keeps track of what they can curl (or even does curls on a regular basis) but whatever you like. You sure that squat is to parallel or lower? On August 11 2011 12:52 FiWiFaKi wrote: Now these are maxes and generally what I do... 6 sets per exercise, 3 exercises per muscle. First two sets are warm up where I tell myself "Put a weight I can do 30 at and do 12, second one is a weight I can do 20 at and do 10." Now the next 4 are generally 6,5,4,4. That looks like a routine structured by someone who's way more advanced than you're describing. Why not go with something simpler, especially if your goal is strength and a bit of size? On August 11 2011 12:52 FiWiFaKi wrote: As for the workout I do, I like to go 3 times a week, two muscles each day. Monday: Bicept - Regular standing curls - Sitting one arm dumbells - The squigilly bar sitting down elbows on surface. Back - Pull down to chest - Lateral pull to stomach - Bent over forward pulling bar to chest Wendesday: Chest - Declined Bench - Regular bench or machine where you put your arms together - Inclined bench w/ barbells Tricepts - Bench press, hands together - Laying down, bar up and down above head - A machine similiar to the bicept squigily bar w/ elbows on surface but opposite way Friday Legs - Squat - 45 degree leg press - Machine where you pull your legs up Shoulders - Sitting bench press thing - Shoulders up at the sides sitting or standing - Shoulders up in front. Calves - Sitting down to tippy toes - Standing to tippy toes The super-bro routine. The one that looks like it just makes sense and works right to everyone who's never done research into different routines and how to best program one. It's not the worst thing you could do, but you definitely would be better off training full body 3x/week if you're still a beginner. On August 11 2011 12:52 FiWiFaKi wrote: Abs I tend to do at home twice a week, and on the day I do tricepts I like adding a couple sets of the machine for obliques. Now for my questions. How is my rep amount, my really buff uncle (450lb bench press) told me this is ideal so I decided to take his word for it. I mean trying to get a larger toned body, my overall goal would probably be 170-175lb body that's very toned. I want to keep my range of motion as large as possible and minimize the loss of flexibility as much as I can. Starting strength is perfect for what you're describing, check out the OP. On August 11 2011 12:52 FiWiFaKi wrote: At the moment I eat very healthy thanks to my mom, but I would have no trouble adjusting my diet even more. At the moment I am a very good endurance runner, and I like having that, so also keeping my condition as high as possible is very important. Pretty much I just want to be overall stronger, bigger, and maintain as many qualities of a skinny person as well as possible. I am not interested in taking any creatine or anything, but wondering what experience people have with protein powder, and if it's worthwhile, as if I understand it correctly it's good. Really any help to help me reach my goal would be very appreciated. Thank you. Most of us are eating Paleo - and for general health and nutrition that's going to be the leading suggestion here. The point of the diet is that you should eat "real" foods - the foods that we evolved eating. Again, check out the OP for more information (it's really quite comprehensive). As far as whey protein goes - It's only important if you're not getting enough protein in your regular diet. It's a "supplement" not an "enhancement." You shouldn't need it unless you have problems cooking (too busy or too lazy, or poor shopping list by whoever provides food in the house.) Creatine is something useful when you start to hit plateaus, but it's definitely not a necessity. All it does is provide a little extra energy to do maybe one or two more reps on each set. On August 11 2011 12:52 FiWiFaKi wrote: Oh and I do have a gym right near my house that I have a yearly membership too, and they have every machine imaginable, just wanted that to be added. Machines are bleh. There's no reason to use them when you clearly have free weights available. | ||
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Malinor
Germany4733 Posts
Unfortunately that basically means I have sacrificed my Front Squat-workout today. I guess I go lighter and focus on technic. On the top of the movement I have major arms involvement to keep the bar in the rack position. It just feels that if I lean back more I would just fall backwards. I am pretty sure the bar position is right... I guess that's why people use straps for this. Well, I just need to practice more I guess. On August 11 2011 05:34 sJarl wrote: Quads are sitting at about 25.5". Will be interesting how much they will grow. How do you measure your quads actually? I mean on which part of the leg? And I assume you should be standing? I have never managed to get a decent measurement of my legs -.- | ||
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bdictkam
Canada155 Posts
So i realize i might not feel it the next day etc after i get used to it, infact for some muscle groups i already am used to it.. But that doesnt mean its good for me. So if i do a days rest inbetween squats, but do something like deadlifts on those inbetween days, overlapping.. when will my muscles have time to properly recover? I dont want to write out my workout routine as i dont know what to call all the workouts, but break it down to legs - core/back - shoulders/arms then a day of just cardio and repeat each day doing 4-5 different weight trainings 3 sets of 10/9/8-failure My point is have you ever had like 3-7 days off completely from gym, then go and you feel like a monster. I have when i used to go quite a while ago, and i think its definetly from the extended recovery. And alot of people seem to be pumpin 5-6 days of overlapping weight trainings that are intense including myself, and im wondering maybe its beneficial to add in an extra rest day between each day and do something like,d1 legs- d2cardio - d3core/back - d4cardio -d5shoulders/arms -d6cardio -d7cardio repeat. Extra rest, more complete muscle recovery, better results? And phyre i have legitimiate questions, and dont appricate your undertone man, either help me without the attitude or blow me and dont answer my posts | ||
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jjhchsc2
Korea (South)2393 Posts
On August 10 2011 21:14 Zafrumi wrote: are you doing SS? if so, stick to the program! if not I guess you can do bp and dips on the same day. they are both pretty tough compound exercises, so maybe dont do them right after each other (then again, I have no idea how to structure workout programs  thats why I always copy programs from people who know their shit!)and I think the positioning of your hands doesnt really matter as long as the movement is done correctly planks are awesome and if done correctly wont hurt your spine nor your back. @glurio: this has been bugging me for a while: your signature is wrong :p its supposed to be "whether you think you can or you think you can't, youre right." Nah i am not doing SS. Just some hard/weighted BW excercises since i dont have an access to the gym. i hoping to buy http://www.amazon.com/Stamina-50-1690-1690-Power-Tower/dp/B002Y2SUU4/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1313043575&sr=8-5 since it's pretty cheap compared to a full bench set with barbells and stuff. I will try both (dips and weighted push ups) and if i screw up i will just alternate lol. ok i will try and have good plank form when doing so then. thanks for the advice. On August 10 2011 21:21 emjaytron wrote: A plank exercise isn't about adding extra weight really, because it's primarily an exercise for the deep postural muscles - these are predominantly 'red' type muscle fibres designed for endurance. Basically you are training the muscles that need to be on all day long to protect your spine. So I would say that time spent on the exercise is more important than adding extra weight. Endurance is more beneficial than gross strength in this case i could probably hold the plank for about 2-3mins without weights and using both hands. i definitely have seen improvement in my posture for sure. i dont have much time to workout so i have to add weights to shorten the time so yea. i am just hoping that weighted planks dont affect my lower back or spine. On August 10 2011 20:42 glurio wrote: Afaik dips got more triceps and shoulder activation then bench, but i might be wrong. Yes of course its ok to do both. Post pics, no clue whate you're talking about. thanks for the advice but i think as Zaf said the positioning of the hand doesnt really matter. Thinking of buying http://www.amazon.com/Stamina-50-1690-1690-Power-Tower/dp/B002Y2SUU4/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1313043575&sr=8-5 .looks good. | ||
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ModernAgeShaman
Norway484 Posts
On August 11 2011 14:55 bdictkam wrote: Yeh i know there is overlap, however if tear your muscle tissue, and it doesnt have enough time to heal/fill in the gaps etc then you dont actualy get any gains/improvement if you just tear them up mid heal.... thats like tearing a scab a day after a wipe out So i realize i might not feel it the next day etc after i get used to it, infact for some muscle groups i already am used to it.. But that doesnt mean its good for me. So if i do a days rest inbetween squats, but do something like deadlifts on those inbetween days, overlapping.. when will my muscles have time to properly recover? I dont want to write out my workout routine as i dont know what to call all the workouts, but break it down to legs - core/back - shoulders/arms then a day of just cardio and repeat each day doing 4-5 different weight trainings 3 sets of 10/9/8-failure My point is have you ever had like 3-7 days off completely from gym, then go and you feel like a monster. I have when i used to go quite a while ago, and i think its definetly from the extended recovery. And alot of people seem to be pumpin 5-6 days of overlapping weight trainings that are intense including myself, and im wondering maybe its beneficial to add in an extra rest day between each day and do something like,d1 legs- d2cardio - d3core/back - d4cardio -d5shoulders/arms -d6cardio -d7cardio repeat. Extra rest, more complete muscle recovery, better results? And phyre i have legitimiate questions, and dont appricate your undertone man, either help me without the attitude or blow me and dont answer my posts I think a lot of people have misunderstood what you're asking. For me, I only work the same muscle group once a week. Especially after a good deadlift session, there is no way I am close to rested after 1-2 days, I need 7-8 days before I'm ready to go at it again. Soreness is irrelevant pretty much and as others have pointed out you can handle more volume if you get used to it, but that doesn't necessarily mean doing it more often means greater strength gains at the end of the week. My advice to you is that test it for yourself. I've tried every other day on some lifts, I've tried every 5th day and I found every 7th day for each lift to be a good balance where I can progress weekly. Hope this clears some things up for you. P.S - There are better ways of dealing with disrespectfulness than asking them to blow you. | ||
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Zafrumi
Switzerland1272 Posts
On August 11 2011 14:55 bdictkam wrote: Yeh i know there is overlap, however if tear your muscle tissue, and it doesnt have enough time to heal/fill in the gaps etc then you dont actualy get any gains/improvement if you just tear them up mid heal.... thats like tearing a scab a day after a wipe out So i realize i might not feel it the next day etc after i get used to it, infact for some muscle groups i already am used to it.. But that doesnt mean its good for me. So if i do a days rest inbetween squats, but do something like deadlifts on those inbetween days, overlapping.. when will my muscles have time to properly recover? I think there is a graph on the starting strength wiki about how muscles recover but I cant seem to find it :/ here's what I remember from it (no guarantee that any of the following is correct ) some hours after your workout, the muscles go in a sort of "supersolid" state meaning they are harder and stronger than before your workout. THAT is the optimal time to workout again, because after a few more hours they will soften up again and become weaker.when exactly that time is I have no idea (again, the graph might help here. try looking for it yourself). and I have a feeling the timing also heavily depends on what your body is used to. the point is, if you squat every day, your body becomes used to squatting every day meaning it will adapt to the stress you expose it to. a lot of olympic weightlifters squat very frequently and they are obviously aiming at getting stronger/growing more muscles tissue. and as someone else mentioned, the leg muscles are very very good at recovering whereas the back muscles take a little bit longer. so dont deadlift every day, but squatting every day is fine! On August 11 2011 14:55 bdictkam wrote: My point is have you ever had like 3-7 days off completely from gym, then go and you feel like a monster. I have when i used to go quite a while ago, and i think its definetly from the extended recovery. And alot of people seem to be pumpin 5-6 days of overlapping weight trainings that are intense including myself, and im wondering maybe its beneficial to add in an extra rest day between each day and do something like,d1 legs- d2cardio - d3core/back - d4cardio -d5shoulders/arms -d6cardio -d7cardio repeat. Extra rest, more complete muscle recovery, better results? its true that more recovery means more gains. but you have to balance it out. just working out once a week will not give you the same gains as working out 3 times a week. I'm gonna leave you with a quote from strength coach rippetoe: "lifting heavy ass weights won't make you stronger. recovering from lifting heavy ass weights does." | ||
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Zafrumi
Switzerland1272 Posts
On August 11 2011 10:49 Matoo- wrote: + Show Spoiler + Ok this is going to be a beginner's post so please bear with me. Matoo Age: 27 || Height: 6'2" - 188 cm || Weight: 170 lbs - 77 kg Context: I haven't done any exercise in the past 10 yrs. Two weeks ago I decided to get in better shape and did some exercise, mostly pull-ups, push-ups, sit-ups and such. I capped out at a ridiculously low amount of reps (around 3 pulls-ups, 10 push-ups, and 20 sit-ups). Then my body ached for half a week. I bought a 15 lbs dumbbell and continued training for about 30 min everyday. 2 weeks later I felt like ok I like this and I want to continue. So I started documentating myself, including spending about 5 hrs reading through the links in the OP. And yeah I was doing it all wrong of course. Overstraining the shoulder and elbow, doing a shitton of reps of biceps curls, etc. That's fine. It's not like I was expecting to get it right without any prior knowledge anyway. But now that I know that I want to continue then I should do it right. Facts: - I'd like to keep exercizing at home. - I already have a pullup bar, a 15 lb dumbbell, and a basic bench (see picture). - Barbells looks like the best thing out there and I could buy one. However my right knee is fucked; if I do some running, about 10 minutes in it will start hurting like hell and then it'll take days for the pain to disappear. So I'm really not hot for any squat- or deadlift-based workouts, since they will require me to flex/unflex my knee a lot, with added weight on top of it. - I can definitely buy a pair of rings. With all of that taken into account, what would you think about doing: - Dumbbell bench presses (SS says it's as good as barbell ones) - Dumbbell presses - Chin-ups (adding weight once I reach 12+ reps) - Ring exercises: Now I'm a bit lost. There's so many. What would be the best ring exercises that I could do to train the remaining muscles that haven't been covered by the previous exercises (since I probably can't do squats or deadlifts, sadly). I was also thinking about: - Handstand push-ups: they look both very useful and fun as hell, especially if I manage to do them freestanding after a while, and I could buy a mat. But aren't they redundant with dumbbell presses? - Roman chair exercises (cheap!): useful according to SS, but aren't abs covered by ring exercises already? I'd also incorporate stretching several times a day for flexibility (mine is terrible), and swimming for about 30 min every day for cardio/endurance. On the days that I workout, I would do stretching - workout - swimming - stretching. Regarding nutrition: I'm French so bread has been my life so far. However I'm living in the US now so it's a good occasion to try a grainless paleo diet (despite my absolute love for good burgers). I'll keep at it for the next two months and see if I feel healthier or not. Anyway I'd like to have input regarding the set of exercises I could incorporate in my workout (taking into account my bad knee). Once I know what exercises I do I'll be able to make it to the next step and get a precise workout build running with weight/set/reps/goals etc. do you know whats wrong with your knee? sounds quite bad, but is it unfixable? its a shame you cant squat :/ I dont know anything about ring exercises, but everything else looks pretty good to me. maybe alternate pull ups and chin ups, and you could try doing some dumbbell snatches if your knees allow it. also maybe alternate dumbbell rows and bench press, i.e. workout 1: db bp, workout 2: db rows honestly, a bit of bread is not as bad as everyone makes it out to be (unless you are sensitive/allergic to wheat/gluten obviously ). a hamburger with buns is not the end of the world and still MILES better than a donut etc.hope that covers everything just try to make real food the majority of your diet and you will be all set. | ||
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jjhchsc2
Korea (South)2393 Posts
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KimJongChill
United States6429 Posts
shoulder back or up, but it's not serious pain....wat do? Should I just lay off shoulder and chest workouts for a while? Any treatment? Thanks~ | ||
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AnxiousHippo
Australia1451 Posts
On August 11 2011 18:09 jjhchsc2 wrote: Not junk food. Is "healthy food" better?what do people mean by real foods? seems like a broad term to use. | ||
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sJarl
Iceland1699 Posts
On August 11 2011 14:21 Malinor wrote: How do you measure your quads actually? I mean on which part of the leg? And I assume you should be standing? I have never managed to get a decent measurement of my legs -.- I just stood, flexed my quads and measured around the part I though was the largest. | ||
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Zafrumi
Switzerland1272 Posts
On August 11 2011 18:09 jjhchsc2 wrote: what do people mean by real foods? seems like a broad term to use. its easy. if man made it, dont eat it. have you every seen a spaghetti-tree? or donuts growing in the earth? no. those foods are made/created by humans (often called convenience food or processed food) and are generally way unhealthier than something that grows in nature. like a steak! On August 11 2011 18:16 KimJongChill wrote: So I tried seated ohp for the first time, but the balance felt weird and I ended up stretching back my shoulders a bit too much. Now, I feel a bit of pain if I move my shoulder back or up, but it's not serious pain....wat do? Should I just lay off shoulder and chest workouts for a while? Any treatment? Thanks~ RICE it! ( Rest, Ice, Compression and Elevation) | ||
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Sneakyz
Sweden2361 Posts
On August 11 2011 14:55 bdictkam wrote: And phyre i have legitimiate questions, and dont appricate your undertone man, either help me without the attitude or blow me and dont answer my posts It's because your questions are difficult to answer. Muscle recovery time range from like 48 hours(maybe lower for very experienced lifters, I don't know) to a week, with a ton of different factors, for example: Your genetics Your age Your experience lifting What program/routine you are on How intense your workouts are What non-lifting exercise you also do What you are doing on your “rest days” Your diet Your sleeping Your stress levels Your mental strength If you can't lift the same or a slight increase in weight you did in your prior work out I'd say you're not getting enough rest, but it's hard to say. This is why people say you should do a program made for beginners, like starting strength, because then you don't have to think about all this stuff. Obviously you should do whatever routine you feel like, just listen to your body. I did a 5-day split myself so I've never done starting strength, and while I am very happy with the gains I've had, It's probably more because I have very good genetics and I'd have made even better gains on something like starting strength. | ||
zatic
Zurich15361 Posts
For like 3 to 4 weeks, whenever I put just moderate weights on, I am getting this pain in my arms. So after the first few reps my arms start to hurt, and it only gets worse the more I use them. At first I thought this was due to incorrect squatting technique, but it was just that squats are my first excersize, and switching them to last didn't do anything, quite the opposite. It's not soreness, it's just pain that is most intense around the elbow, but extends over my entire arm deep into the shoulder. It is really intense for 1-2 hours after workout then slowly wears off, but still remains for about 2-3 days. It gets worse the more I stress my arms, to the point that, if I just ignore it and continue my workout, I am in such intense pain after that I can barely drive home because steering is so painful. So far I tried sleeping more (up to 10 hours before and after workout day), no effect. I eat better than ever in my life. Then I stopped all working out for over a week until all traces of pain were gone. Felt fantastic this week and was super pumped to continue working out. But just after the first work set of squats the pain was back, and was again so bad after 1 set of bench that I had to stop. It's not only lifting but any strong physical stress. Same pain was there after a few dances on my sister's wedding. This is really really frustrating. | ||
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rEiGN~
369 Posts
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