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The Shikyo Memorial for QQ Therapy - Page 404

Forum Index > The Shopkeeper′s Inn
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iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
April 21 2013 20:02 GMT
#8061
On April 22 2013 04:44 obesechicken13 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2013 01:19 iCanada wrote:
On April 22 2013 01:04 obesechicken13 wrote:
On April 21 2013 19:50 Cheap0 wrote:
Fuck Thresh. Seriously. He's amazing in terms of champion design and gameplay, but I have absolutely no clue how Riot could release that champion and think that it would actually be balanced. From what it looks like, they still seem to think he's balanced!

Yea, let's put tons of damage, enormous CC, and a completely unique and extremely powerful utility move on the same champion. Also, let's make him ranged, AND innately tanky, To cap it off, we'll give him completely negligible mana costs.

Seriously, what the hell are they thinking? It's going to take Ezreal/Janna tier nerfs to bring that fucker into line.

I like it.

All his moves are decent in the early game because they have numbers if maxed (damage, or shield) and useful later on since they have utility (hook, grab, push, slow).
As a support he obviously doesn't have much damage.

Now contrast that to shit like Soraka or Janna or Blitz:
Soraka's W only gives armor over 3 seconds, and Q is only a small amount of mpen. E is still a decent silence. Her ult fades in strength until the enemy Karthus is easily doing 2x the damage that Soraka heals.
Janna's Q is still an AoE knockup. Her W is just a weak slow. Her E is a weak shield that when broken no longer provides AD. Her ult is still fine.
Blitz's W is just a movement speed buff. His ult is a short ass AoE silence, good, but nowhere near as good as any other AoE CC move.


When you think of a support you need someone who will be useful without gold. All of Thresh's abilities do well without gold. Because even when you take away all of the numbers on his abilities, you still get a decent kit. You can't say that about many other supports because they've been nerfed to oblivion or weren't designed so that each ability made them better at their role.

I mean if you give an AD carry no abilities that synergize with what an AD needs, eg. Varus, he can still do tons of damage because he has gold. The only way to make a support with a bad kit balanced is to make his numbers really strong early on so that it doesn't matter if he doesn't offer enough utility late game, or to give them only one extremely good ability like Janna's ult or Blitz's Q such that it doesn't matter that their other skills suck.


but the thing is that it goes against how the entire rest of the roster is.

It would be one thing if all those other supports were like that, but the fact that none of them are just straight up means Thresh is imbalanced. He is the best support.

Aside from maybe Elise, but that's just because Elise is ridiculous too.

I dunno. Is Elise that great of a support? She seems to only have strong base damage and a stun as far as utility goes. That's not something I'd expect to be good on supports.

Pro games are so weird these days.


Its not even that I think Elise is an imbalanced support, I think she an imbalanced champion.

Too many times I've smashed one in lane, and it just doesn't matter because despite the fact she underfarmed as all hell she can still melt people despite not building any damage items.
TSBspartacus
Profile Joined October 2011
England1046 Posts
April 21 2013 20:15 GMT
#8062
On April 22 2013 04:44 obesechicken13 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2013 01:19 iCanada wrote:
On April 22 2013 01:04 obesechicken13 wrote:
On April 21 2013 19:50 Cheap0 wrote:
Fuck Thresh. Seriously. He's amazing in terms of champion design and gameplay, but I have absolutely no clue how Riot could release that champion and think that it would actually be balanced. From what it looks like, they still seem to think he's balanced!

Yea, let's put tons of damage, enormous CC, and a completely unique and extremely powerful utility move on the same champion. Also, let's make him ranged, AND innately tanky, To cap it off, we'll give him completely negligible mana costs.

Seriously, what the hell are they thinking? It's going to take Ezreal/Janna tier nerfs to bring that fucker into line.

I like it.

All his moves are decent in the early game because they have numbers if maxed (damage, or shield) and useful later on since they have utility (hook, grab, push, slow).
As a support he obviously doesn't have much damage.

Now contrast that to shit like Soraka or Janna or Blitz:
Soraka's W only gives armor over 3 seconds, and Q is only a small amount of mpen. E is still a decent silence. Her ult fades in strength until the enemy Karthus is easily doing 2x the damage that Soraka heals.
Janna's Q is still an AoE knockup. Her W is just a weak slow. Her E is a weak shield that when broken no longer provides AD. Her ult is still fine.
Blitz's W is just a movement speed buff. His ult is a short ass AoE silence, good, but nowhere near as good as any other AoE CC move.


When you think of a support you need someone who will be useful without gold. All of Thresh's abilities do well without gold. Because even when you take away all of the numbers on his abilities, you still get a decent kit. You can't say that about many other supports because they've been nerfed to oblivion or weren't designed so that each ability made them better at their role.

I mean if you give an AD carry no abilities that synergize with what an AD needs, eg. Varus, he can still do tons of damage because he has gold. The only way to make a support with a bad kit balanced is to make his numbers really strong early on so that it doesn't matter if he doesn't offer enough utility late game, or to give them only one extremely good ability like Janna's ult or Blitz's Q such that it doesn't matter that their other skills suck.


but the thing is that it goes against how the entire rest of the roster is.

It would be one thing if all those other supports were like that, but the fact that none of them are just straight up means Thresh is imbalanced. He is the best support.

Aside from maybe Elise, but that's just because Elise is ridiculous too.

I dunno. Is Elise that great of a support? She seems to only have strong base damage and a stun as far as utility goes. That's not something I'd expect to be good on supports.

Pro games are so weird these days.

Elise has ridiculously good all-in, with 6 abilities to use at lvl 3 and good base damages. Often I get kills in lane with E that my ADC could not reach.
RagequitBM
Profile Joined November 2011
Canada2270 Posts
April 21 2013 21:32 GMT
#8063
Katarina is the best champion in the game. I've never done bad on her, and I've never seen one do bad.
Gets owned in lane, still goes legendary eventually.
Twitch.tv/Ragequitbm for all the fans
krndandaman
Profile Joined August 2009
Mozambique16569 Posts
April 22 2013 03:32 GMT
#8064
--- Nuked ---
Artline
Profile Joined September 2011
177 Posts
April 22 2013 09:01 GMT
#8065
Why is it my fault as support if adc gets caught by thresh?

WhiteDog
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France8650 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-22 10:56:33
April 22 2013 10:13 GMT
#8066
On April 22 2013 18:01 Artline wrote:
Why is it my fault as support if adc gets caught by thresh?

Yes, put yourself between tresh and adc. Never assume adc are good enough to dodge anything, give your life.


So I'm in my 10th ranked loss in a row. Last game was 4vs5, tho we all dominated our lane, we couldn't win at the end.
"every time WhiteDog overuses the word "seriously" in a comment I can make an observation on his fragile emotional state." MoltkeWarding
Zergneedsfood
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States10671 Posts
April 22 2013 12:27 GMT
#8067
On April 22 2013 18:01 Artline wrote:
Why is it my fault as support if adc gets caught by thresh?



Clearly you have no presence in the lane.
/人◕ ‿‿ ◕人\ Make a contract with me and join TLADT | Onodera isn't actually a girl, she's just a doormat you walk over to get to the girl. - Numy 2015
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
April 22 2013 14:08 GMT
#8068
I swear we had a Doublelift wannabe in our game yesterday. Picked Vayne, did decent in teamfights, but the real highlight was the fact that he would constantly splitpush a side lane while we were in mid, pinging mid tower (literally 15 pings in a row, I counted), screaming (as in typing constantly and in caps) that he needed farm and that we had to take tower without him. Never mind the fact that Morde, Zac, and Leona can't really take a tower. He then proceeded to have 11 deaths and complain that we threw because we didn't listen to him, being the best player in that game and all.

I giggled, then reported him.
It's your boy Guzma!
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-22 16:34:51
April 22 2013 16:28 GMT
#8069
REDACTED
It's your boy Guzma!
ShoreT
Profile Joined August 2008
United States489 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-22 16:56:11
April 22 2013 16:55 GMT
#8070
The thing that really bugs me the most about Thresh is his silly Lantern while pulling to target with Q. Pulling himself on top of you is good, considering all his CC. Taking someone with him is annoying (and I think a little imbalanced).
Derp
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-22 18:33:52
April 22 2013 17:05 GMT
#8071
Mute and Shikyo.
(Eve survives an all-in from Akali with 5 HP, gj dude. Oh, that was a level 1 fight between Eve and Akali? ... yeah, that just set the pace for his game.)

Also fuck the premades, the campers, and the insane amount of luck that save baddies.
I also learnt that Pantheon's Q randomly cancels, even with the animation finished, the mana consumed and the projectile up in the air, when you lose vision of the target. Pretty nice. Especially when said target has 5 HP.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
jcarlsoniv
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States27922 Posts
April 22 2013 17:14 GMT
#8072
On April 22 2013 06:32 RagequitBM wrote:
Katarina is the best champion in the game. I've never done bad on her, and I've never seen one do bad.
Gets owned in lane, still goes legendary eventually.


You've clearly never seen me play Kat
Soniv ||| Soniv#1962 ||| @jcarlsoniv ||| The Big Golem ||| Join the Glorious Evolution. What's your favorite aminal, a bear? ||| Joe "Don't call me Daniel" "Soniv" "Daniel" Carlsberg LXIX ||| Paging Dr. John Shadow
ninjakingcola
Profile Joined March 2011
United States405 Posts
April 22 2013 20:55 GMT
#8073
I'm lithe with rage right now, I've been demoted 3 tiers since a month ago, fucking people can't fucking play this fucking game and I get matched with the fucking worst of em. You can tell me that the odds are that both teams have even distribution of HERP DERP, but FOR FUCK'S SAKE THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR THIS SHIT AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Where my demons hide? Why, if I showed you it wouldn't be a secret my dear.
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35153 Posts
April 23 2013 01:19 GMT
#8074
That was by far my worst game ever... time for a big break.
Amui
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada10567 Posts
April 23 2013 01:56 GMT
#8075
Honestly, when's the next rumble nerf coming. He had 56% winrate for like 6 months now, and even after the ult "nerf" he's still at 56%.
Porouscloud - NA LoL
overt
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States9006 Posts
April 23 2013 05:20 GMT
#8076
So TL was talking about Thresh over in the GD and there's already Thresh QQ on this page but I figured I'd pile on some more. I'm pretty certain that Caitlyn+Thresh is an unbeatable lane at the moment. You basically just hug tower and ask your jungler to gank for you as much as possible. They shove the wave, they have harass, they have hard engage. I am racking my brain to come up with something that beats this and everything I've tried thus far just falls on its face.

The other thing that sucks about going against a Cait+Thresh lane is that there are zero good openings. You want to go Dblade for the extra HP if you get engaged by Thresh. You want to go long sword+2pot or boots+3 pot to shrug off Cait/Thresh harass. Right now the only opening that's worked for me is fort pot plus 6 HP pot but they're nerfing that like tomorrow.
M2
Profile Joined December 2002
Bulgaria4116 Posts
April 23 2013 09:40 GMT
#8077
On April 23 2013 14:20 overt wrote:
So TL was talking about Thresh over in the GD and there's already Thresh QQ on this page but I figured I'd pile on some more. I'm pretty certain that Caitlyn+Thresh is an unbeatable lane at the moment. You basically just hug tower and ask your jungler to gank for you as much as possible. They shove the wave, they have harass, they have hard engage. I am racking my brain to come up with something that beats this and everything I've tried thus far just falls on its face.

The other thing that sucks about going against a Cait+Thresh lane is that there are zero good openings. You want to go Dblade for the extra HP if you get engaged by Thresh. You want to go long sword+2pot or boots+3 pot to shrug off Cait/Thresh harass. Right now the only opening that's worked for me is fort pot plus 6 HP pot but they're nerfing that like tomorrow.

I have no idea what can beat Thresh at all, regardless of the carry, the best thing you can do is playing Lulu, Soraka, Janna and try not to lose the lane. Winning? no way
Knife kitty, night kitty, put you on a slab. Stealthy kitty, hunter kitty, stab stab stab :-)
Cedstick
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
Canada3336 Posts
April 23 2013 10:27 GMT
#8078
On April 23 2013 10:56 Amui wrote:
Honestly, when's the next rumble nerf coming. He had 56% winrate for like 6 months now, and even after the ult "nerf" he's still at 56%.

@_@ I see you Alex.

So, we're bitchin' about Thresh? Well, the thing that really gets me is that I actually have to ban him now. It took waaaay too long (thankfully) to start seeing him in almost every game, so I had a ban spot open for another champion :3 Now I gotta ban him, though :<
"What does Rivington do when he's not commentating?" "Drool." ~ Categorist
Gaslo
Profile Joined February 2011
Finland951 Posts
April 23 2013 14:47 GMT
#8079
Singed vs Vlad. Getting somewhat farmed, managed to kill the Vlad once when he got cocky. Then got blamed for not pushing down the tower while 4 players were bot. Twice. Both times we had 4 people bot too, and Vlad was top.

Ok.
canucks12
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Canada812 Posts
April 23 2013 16:09 GMT
#8080
On April 22 2013 19:13 WhiteDog wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2013 18:01 Artline wrote:
Why is it my fault as support if adc gets caught by thresh?

Yes, put yourself between tresh and adc. Never assume adc are good enough to dodge anything, give your life.


Don't take this too far. Had a taric purposely get hit by thresh hooks to try to block for me. He literally got hit by every single one on cooldown and died often. I was playing Sivir. T_T
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