EPTIEM Katowice 2024 - Page 86
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goldensail
132 Posts
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UnLarva
458 Posts
Nobody can circumvent that criterion. [taking a month long ban for this statement]: Korean Elitist fanboys can dive to the all embracing hole where sun never shine again. Succumb to you intra-forum worshipfullness. SAVE THE TOSS! BALANCE TOSS TO THE RELEVANCE AGAIN! And bring GSL to Finland, so The GOAT can participate it easily, while serving his time in the FED. Easy, with Saudi-money. | ||
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Gescom
Canada3443 Posts
On February 12 2024 06:08 goldensail wrote: Maru/Clem have taken Terran to the limit but they never stood a chance against someone who can make full use of the current Zerg arsenal. For years the community has complained about race balance but people continue to dismiss it as 'whine". This is not how competitive gaming should work, and why SC2 is losing its fan base. Nothing to do with the game being 14 years old. And the stadium was packed in Atlanta and Poland alike. | ||
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ZAWGURN
96 Posts
On February 12 2024 06:08 goldensail wrote: Maru/Clem have taken Terran to the limit but they never stood a chance against someone who can make full use of the current Zerg arsenal. For years the community has complained about race balance but people continue to dismiss it as 'whine". This is not how competitive gaming should work, and why SC2 is losing its fan base. Well if there’s only one person who CAN make full use of that arsenal I think he deserves to win. Cause it’s clear no one else is doing that. | ||
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kaos00
United States125 Posts
On February 12 2024 06:08 goldensail wrote: Maru/Clem have taken Terran to the limit but they never stood a chance against someone who can make full use of the current Zerg arsenal. For years the community has complained about race balance but people continue to dismiss it as 'whine". This is not how competitive gaming should work, and why SC2 is losing its fan base. How have Maru/Clem taken their race to the limit while dropping games to Cure/Byun/Bunny. and...Cyan this tournament? Out of all weekend events, this is one of the most clearly deserved outcomes. | ||
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UnLarva
458 Posts
Yes. Yes. Serral was already in the GOAT discussions several years ago, and that never happening Serral-Maru happened today. It is not like it was not 'a preparation tournament'. Of [set your preferred number of years here] years for the ultimate test of Goatness. Maru fanbois needs to shut their mouths up as unwanting tools of whining, and just get back to the reality. Excuses please! Tournament results are used as the measurement of success. You simply cannot ignore it. Korean elitism must die. | ||
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darklycid
3512 Posts
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Kitai
United States873 Posts
On February 12 2024 06:08 goldensail wrote: Maru/Clem have taken Terran to the limit but they never stood a chance against someone who can make full use of the current Zerg arsenal. For years the community has complained about race balance but people continue to dismiss it as 'whine". This is not how competitive gaming should work, and why SC2 is losing its fan base. Didn't Clem just beat Serral in the semifinals of a massive tournament a month or two ago, and win a map where he was down 100 supply? And then he beat the second best zerg in the world (Dark) in the grand finals, making it look even easier. And then everyone came out in droves begging for a widowmine nerf. But yeah, I guess he "never stood a chance" because his race is bad. I swear, some people can't remember anything beyond what happened more than 2 days ago. | ||
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MyLovelyLurker
France756 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25609 Posts
On February 12 2024 06:33 kaos00 wrote: How have Maru/Clem taken their race to the limit while dropping games to Cure/Byun/Bunny. and...Cyan this tournament? Out of all weekend events, this is one of the most clearly deserved outcomes. I mean I think he’s not quite where he was a year or two ago, but Maru has historically pushed Terran as far as anyone, and can do things others simply can’t replicate. In general I think that’s a fair observation. It’s really just a Serral issue. Maru-Solar is one of the most one-sided rivalries of vaguely similar level players there is, he took Reynor and Dark out in groups. Serral’s just a brick wall for Maru, stylistically/player atribute wise, sure of course Maru can beat him, but he doesn’t have that ability to just outpace, or win with brilliant tactical play, reliably because Serral is just as good in those areas. It comes down to clever prep and sheer nerve and who blinks first. Unfortunately Maru didn’t get the rub of the prep today, and the one game he went absolutely monster mode on, is the one that looks close to unwinnable if it goes properly late. | ||
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onPHYRE
Bulgaria923 Posts
On February 12 2024 04:46 Solio wrote: Because burrowed infestors fungals = bullshit So much easier to get them than to catch them and defend against them, the fact that Maru was able to make the game close while playing on this difficult map and against this stupid unit clearly shows he is better, like every single engagement that serral won was because of that, without that it would not even be close Some quotes age like spoiled milk.. and then there is this. At what point do you take the blinders off and give Serral his props? He just 4-0 Maru at a grand final with hundreds of thousands of dollars on the line and no “latency” issues. 4-0 doesn’t happen because of the maps or the races. Just give him his due already, Jesus. The mental gymnastics are astounding. Maru played extremely well, he is a top tier player.. and he didn’t win a single map. Just stop. There is no debating what we just saw. Serral is the GOAT. On February 12 2024 04:42 yezzir88 wrote: Agreed. In an actual balanced game, Maru would've won easily. We saw a clear example of a better player losing to a worse player because the tournament organizer making a map to heavily favor the inferior player. Ah yes, and the other 3 maps? And what about the other players Serral destroyed? Maru was wrecking every Zerg he played up to that point. You are arguing that Maru is the better player?.. cmon. They are both at the very top, and one is just better than the other. In every way. | ||
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Topin
Peru10081 Posts
 as a Maru fanboy i have to admit that Serral is the GOAT. the 2nd map was a great game and for a minute there i thought Maru could tie the series... alas it couldnt be. lets see whats happen in the future. GGs | ||
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Antithesis
Germany1196 Posts
On February 12 2024 06:08 Gescom wrote: There's no point in even engaging. 'The break was too short', 'the veto system was bad'. People will find any reason to complain. The reality is, in the interview before the match Maru said he was afraid of Serral. And for good reason. Similarly, Maru lost a series to Cyan, and was pushed to the brink by ByuN. Serral went 20-1. Exactly. And it must be said that it was quite disconcerting how quickly a good number of commentators in this thread began to resort to balance whining and dismissive remarks. Everyone was hyping up the finals, until suddenly midway through the series, when it became clear that Maru is losing, some of those guys collectively decided that it is not anymore his own play but balance issues and a single map which prevent Maru from winning. With this dominant a tournament run, an overall score of 20-1, a 3-1 over the next best zerg in the world, and a 4-0 in the finals, over Maru out of all players, there is no reasonable argument left to question the deservedness of Serral's victory and status at large. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On February 12 2024 06:08 Gescom wrote: There's no point in even engaging. 'The break was too short', 'the veto system was bad'. People will find any reason to complain. The reality is, in the interview before the match Maru said he was afraid of Serral. And for good reason. Similarly, Maru lost a series to Cyan, and was pushed to the brink by ByuN. Serral went 20-1. Well the breaks and veto system definitely felt silly and favored Serral, as did the maps. That's something worth talking about if you want future tournaments to do better. Not saying Serral didn't deserve to win, like he won 4-0 so even with different circumstances he would have probably won 4-2 at worst. The pain for some of us is that the one game they both played to their strength (lategame) was on a map terran basically can't win, despite the most perfect terran play you'll ever see out of Maru. And that's down to both a bad veto system and ridiculous maps being allowed in the pool (and burrow infestors being impossible to see). I'll go out and say Maru played better in that game specifically. The other games were Serral straight duping Maru with allins Rogue-style, not even letting Maru play the game he wants. Serral won the mind games and build choices. | ||
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dysenterymd
1238 Posts
On February 12 2024 08:03 Topin wrote: amazing performance by Serral as a Maru fanboy i have to admit that Serral is the GOAT. the 2nd map was a great game and for a minute there i thought Maru could tie the series... alas it couldnt be. lets see whats happen in the future. GGsI still think Rogue vs Serral is debatable, they have three world championship-tier victories apiece. Hard to say whether 4 GSL is worth more or less than Serral's consistency and plethora of other trophies from less prestigious tournaments. | ||
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NeWHoriZonS
54 Posts
Simply unreal. | ||
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Elche
Finland170 Posts
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FFXthebest
75 Posts
On February 12 2024 08:52 Fango wrote: Well the breaks and veto system definitely felt silly and favored Serral, as did the maps. That's something worth talking about if you want future tournaments to do better. Not saying Serral didn't deserve to win, like he won 4-0 so even with different circumstances he would have probably won 4-2 at worst. The pain for some of us is that the one game they both played to their strength (lategame) was on a map terran basically can't win, despite the most perfect terran play you'll ever see out of Maru. And that's down to both a bad veto system and ridiculous maps being allowed in the pool (and burrow infestors being impossible to see). I'll go out and say Maru played better in that game specifically. The other games were Serral straight duping Maru with allins Rogue-style, not even letting Maru play the game he wants. Serral won the mind games and build choices. Which game was that game 2? The map where Serral basically had to use his 10k bank and still couldn’t finish the game because the terran player could literally just hide his ghost behind mass planetary and turrets? If anything it just shows how ridiculous terran is at late game. Terran can literally sit and do nothing and wait and try to draw the game. I give Maru some credit for having some “dignity” gged out of the game instead of trying to drag and game even longer and force a draw. ( He should have gged out 10 minutes earlier when he clearly lost the game already, but thank god we have Serral who didn’t want to disappoint the viewers and fans decided to keep throwing his army into a turtling Maru Maru turtle style literally makes the games unwatchable, it’s literally up to the Zerg to make something happen for the viewers to be entertained. Imagine if Maru plays another Zerg with his mindset. Just turtle and do nothing with a 10k bank (literally on par watching swarm host vs swarm host) | ||
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Nasigil
137 Posts
The reason they are being insufferable after Serral win is simply because Serral is the only threat to Maru's GOAT status. And Dark is not. The people that somehow link their self esteem to the player they idolized are driven insane by the thought that their favorite player is less and less likely to be considered GOAT. And they are trying to use every excuse imaginable to discredit Serral's achievement. If it's Maru winning you can be damn sure they will talk about it like greatest achievement ever and no one would be complaining about waning scene of Korean Starcraft 2. Having been through the Jordan/Lebron and Messi/Ronaldo debate from other sports, this is just painfully all too familiar. | ||
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Balnazza
Germany1197 Posts
On February 12 2024 09:10 FFXthebest wrote: Which game was that game 2? The map where Serral basically had to use his 10k bank and still couldn’t finish the game because the terran player could literally just hide his ghost behind mass planetary and turrets? If anything it just shows how ridiculous terran is at late game. Terran can literally sit and do nothing and wait and try to draw the game. I give Maru some credit for having some “dignity” gged out of the game instead of trying to drag and game even longer and force a draw. ( He should have gged out 10 minutes earlier when he clearly lost the game already, but thank god we have Serral who didn’t want to disappoint the viewers and fans decided to keep throwing his army into a turtling Maru Maru turtle style literally makes the games unwatchable, it’s literally up to the Zerg to make something happen for the viewers to be entertained. Imagine if Maru plays another Zerg with his mindset. Just turtle and do nothing with a 10k bank (literally on par watching swarm host vs swarm host) Even as someone who generally doesn't enjoy seeing terran: I would never blame Maru for trying until the very last moment to play out that game. He made it extremly close and it was just the 2nd map in a Grand Final, ofc he fights "to the death". And I'm quite sure that he would have won against any other Zerg with that performance - Serral was just better. On February 12 2024 09:12 Nasigil wrote: The funny thing is, if it's Dark beating Serral and then beating Maru in the finals, I can guarantee you will see much less complaining. The same people that's non-stop bitching about balance/veto system/grouping etc now will actually very likely just express disappointment Maru losing again and congrats Dark for gaining another big win before military, with very little ill feelings. The reason they are being insufferable after Serral win is simply because Serral is the only threat to Maru's GOAT status. And Dark is not. The people that somehow link their self esteem to the player they idolized are driven insane by the thought that their favorite player is less and less likely to be considered GOAT. And they are trying to use every excuse imaginable to discredit Serral's achievement. If it's Maru winning you can be damn sure they will talk about it like greatest achievement ever and no one would be complaining about waning scene of Korean Starcraft 2. Having been through the Jordan/Lebron and Messi/Ronaldo debate from other sports, this is just painfully all too familiar. Yeah, usually Serral triggers these kind of debates. Reynor sometimes, too, but to a lesser extend. When the Zerg-Haters can team up with the Maru-Fanboys and the korean elitists (and/or EU-haters) you get quite the toxic mix. | ||
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