• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 14:51
CET 20:51
KST 04:51
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
SC2 All-Star Invitational: Tournament Preview5RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2
Community News
Weekly Cups (Jan 12-18): herO, MaxPax, Solar win0BSL Season 2025 - Full Overview and Conclusion8Weekly Cups (Jan 5-11): Clem wins big offline, Trigger upsets4$21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7)16Weekly Cups (Dec 29-Jan 4): Protoss rolls, 2v2 returns7
StarCraft 2
General
PhD study /w SC2 - help with a survey! When will we find out if there are more tournament Stellar Fest "01" Jersey Charity Auction Weekly Cups (Jan 12-18): herO, MaxPax, Solar win I am looking for StarCraft 2 Beta Patch files
Tourneys
$70 Prize Pool Ladder Legends Academy Weekly Open! SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-18 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SC2 AI Tournament 2026 $21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7)
Strategy
Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 509 Doomsday Report Mutation # 508 Violent Night Mutation # 507 Well Trained Mutation # 506 Warp Zone
Brood War
General
BSL Season 2025 - Full Overview and Conclusion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone [ASL21] Potential Map Candidates Gypsy to Korea
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 10 Small VOD Thread 2.0 Azhi's Colosseum - Season 2
Strategy
Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Game Theory for Starcraft
Other Games
General Games
Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason Awesome Games Done Quick 2026!
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread NASA and the Private Sector Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club! The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Navigating the Risks and Rew…
TrAiDoS
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1476 users

[IEM] Katowice 2023 - Group Stage Day 3 + Playoffs RO12 -…

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 13 14 15 16 17 36 Next All
[Page 23] Balance whining will be aggressively moderated

-Wax
[Phantom]
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
Mexico2170 Posts
February 11 2023 15:50 GMT
#281
I feel Gumiho could ahve gotten the hive if he reacted earlier
WriterTeamLiquid Staff writer since 2014 @Mortal_Phantom
Acrofales
Profile Joined August 2010
Spain18193 Posts
February 11 2023 15:51 GMT
#282
On February 12 2023 00:50 [Phantom] wrote:
I feel Gumiho could ahve gotten the hive if he reacted earlier

Agree. If he had stimmed and gunned straight for it rather than shooting the drones and the refinery for a bit, and stimming quite late.
Luolis
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Finland7155 Posts
February 11 2023 15:59 GMT
#283
Gumi should just forget bio.
pro cheese woman / Its never Sunny in Finland. Perkele / FinnishStarcraftTrivia
tigera6
Profile Joined March 2021
3454 Posts
February 11 2023 16:01 GMT
#284
On February 12 2023 00:46 Acrofales wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 12 2023 00:13 tigera6 wrote:
On February 11 2023 23:57 Luolis wrote:
On February 11 2023 23:54 tigera6 wrote:
Its completely random, no group matching, other than you cant play against guys in the same group before Ro4

It's not actually random. The ro12 games go as B2-C3, C2-D3, D2-A3 and A2-B3.

Its random in term of which group is match against which other groups. pre-determined would be based on some kind of ranking or group seeding, like A3-B2 and A2-B3.

It is almost certainly not random. The Ro12 is

A2-B3
B2-C3
C2-D3
D2-A3

That isn't random.

Then the Ro8 is:

A2B3-C1
B2C3-D1
C2D3-A1
D2A3-B1

So again, just rotated. And then finally they are set up in such a way that the numbers 1 and 2 of any group can't face each other again before the final, with the Ro4 being:

B2C3D1 vs C2D3A1
D2A3B1 vs A2B3C1

So yeah, very far from random. Not the seeding you were expecting, but very much seeded.

I did specificly said that players from the same group cant meet again until the Ro4 and 1st/2nd of the same group cant play till the Final. Thats the only rule they need to follow.
The randomness of this, is the fact that they can rotate the group order. Doesnt have to be that B2C3 go with D1, could be with A1 as well and the rest of the bracket change accordingly. We ended up with one that they show us without knowing if there is any other rules that they use.
SmoKim
Profile Joined March 2010
Denmark10305 Posts
February 11 2023 16:04 GMT
#285
Tastosis casting Solar vs Gumiho? What is this, GSL reunion?

Hope they will do the finals.
"LOL I have 202 supply right now (3 minutes later)..."LOL NOW I HAVE 220 SUPPLY SUP?!?!?" - Mondragon
Acrofales
Profile Joined August 2010
Spain18193 Posts
February 11 2023 16:08 GMT
#286
On February 12 2023 01:01 tigera6 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 12 2023 00:46 Acrofales wrote:
On February 12 2023 00:13 tigera6 wrote:
On February 11 2023 23:57 Luolis wrote:
On February 11 2023 23:54 tigera6 wrote:
Its completely random, no group matching, other than you cant play against guys in the same group before Ro4

It's not actually random. The ro12 games go as B2-C3, C2-D3, D2-A3 and A2-B3.

Its random in term of which group is match against which other groups. pre-determined would be based on some kind of ranking or group seeding, like A3-B2 and A2-B3.

It is almost certainly not random. The Ro12 is

A2-B3
B2-C3
C2-D3
D2-A3

That isn't random.

Then the Ro8 is:

A2B3-C1
B2C3-D1
C2D3-A1
D2A3-B1

So again, just rotated. And then finally they are set up in such a way that the numbers 1 and 2 of any group can't face each other again before the final, with the Ro4 being:

B2C3D1 vs C2D3A1
D2A3B1 vs A2B3C1

So yeah, very far from random. Not the seeding you were expecting, but very much seeded.

I did specificly said that players from the same group cant meet again until the Ro4 and 1st/2nd of the same group cant play till the Final. Thats the only rule they need to follow.
The randomness of this, is the fact that they can rotate the group order. Doesnt have to be that B2C3 go with D1, could be with A1 as well and the rest of the bracket change accordingly. We ended up with one that they show us without knowing if there is any other rules that they use.


Well, that would *also* not be random. Your accusation is thus not that they are randomizing the bracket but that they are fixing the bracket. That's a lot stronger accusation, and I'd say that it's on you to provide any evidence of that in the face of a fairly straightforward rotational setup.
ssg
Profile Joined July 2011
United States1775 Posts
February 11 2023 16:08 GMT
#287
One second slow on that hellion run by and I think that costs him the game
Captain Peabody
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3127 Posts
February 11 2023 16:13 GMT
#288
damn Gumiho really losing so much to that random runby
Dies Irae venit. youtube.com/SnobbinsFilms
Captain Peabody
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3127 Posts
February 11 2023 16:14 GMT
#289
even though Solar hasn't attacked yet Gumiho seems entirely dead rn?
Dies Irae venit. youtube.com/SnobbinsFilms
Vindicare605
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States16117 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-02-11 16:20:44
February 11 2023 16:16 GMT
#290
I dunno. It looks like Gumiho threw everything he had into that game 2 build and when it barely won, he just didn't have anything else that could even the playing field against Solar who had him beat in a straight up game.

Solar continues to show that his TvZ is seriously top class. He doesn't get the respect for how good he is in that match up that he should because of how much Maru always beats up on him.

It's such a bad draw for him to draw Maru as his next opponent. If he had any other Terran instead he'd dismantle them just like he did to Gumiho.
aka: KTVindicare the Geeky Bartender
Luolis
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Finland7155 Posts
February 11 2023 16:17 GMT
#291
Gumiho shouldve just played mech. His bio play is so subpar.
pro cheese woman / Its never Sunny in Finland. Perkele / FinnishStarcraftTrivia
Waxangel
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
United States33518 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-02-11 16:20:07
February 11 2023 16:19 GMT
#292
On February 12 2023 01:17 Luolis wrote:
Gumiho shouldve just played mech. His bio play is so subpar.


He never forces mech every game of a series though; probably knows he's too easily blind countered if he does

AdministratorHey HP can you redo everything youve ever done because i have a small complaint?
Luolis
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Finland7155 Posts
February 11 2023 16:20 GMT
#293
On February 12 2023 01:19 Waxangel wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 12 2023 01:17 Luolis wrote:
Gumiho shouldve just played mech. His bio play is so subpar.


He never forces mech every game of a series though; probably knows he's too easily blind countered if eh does

I can understand the thought process behind it, but i have no idea how he ever would win with his bio. At no place it looked like he had any chances.
pro cheese woman / Its never Sunny in Finland. Perkele / FinnishStarcraftTrivia
Nakajin
Profile Blog Joined September 2014
Canada8989 Posts
February 11 2023 16:20 GMT
#294
I see the Cabal has begun to move
Writerhttp://i.imgur.com/9p6ufcB.jpg
Vindicare605
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States16117 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-02-11 16:24:15
February 11 2023 16:22 GMT
#295
On February 12 2023 01:20 Luolis wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 12 2023 01:19 Waxangel wrote:
On February 12 2023 01:17 Luolis wrote:
Gumiho shouldve just played mech. His bio play is so subpar.


He never forces mech every game of a series though; probably knows he's too easily blind countered if eh does

I can understand the thought process behind it, but i have no idea how he ever would win with his bio. At no place it looked like he had any chances.


Nah Wax is right. At this level you need to be able to bring out Bio at least sometimes in a series to keep the Zerg honest. If Zerg knows you're going to go Mech every game it's too easy for them to just blind counter you and then the series is even easier for them.

TBH there isn't a TvZ game much easier than a Zerg who blind counters expecting Mech only to be hit with Bio. You gotta keep that fear in them to have a chance.
aka: KTVindicare the Geeky Bartender
Fango
Profile Joined July 2016
United Kingdom8987 Posts
February 11 2023 16:23 GMT
#296
Solar vs Maru ro8? It might not be a ZvZvZvZ ro4 after all !
Zest, sOs, PartinG, Dark, and Maru are the real champs. ROOT_herO is overrated. Snute, Serral, and Scarlett are the foreigner GOATs
[Phantom]
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
Mexico2170 Posts
February 11 2023 16:23 GMT
#297
Zergs runbys very strong
WriterTeamLiquid Staff writer since 2014 @Mortal_Phantom
geokilla
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada8245 Posts
February 11 2023 16:23 GMT
#298
Solar with some very good English. Wish the other Koreans spoke more English.
Luolis
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Finland7155 Posts
February 11 2023 16:23 GMT
#299
On February 12 2023 01:22 Vindicare605 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 12 2023 01:20 Luolis wrote:
On February 12 2023 01:19 Waxangel wrote:
On February 12 2023 01:17 Luolis wrote:
Gumiho shouldve just played mech. His bio play is so subpar.


He never forces mech every game of a series though; probably knows he's too easily blind countered if eh does

I can understand the thought process behind it, but i have no idea how he ever would win with his bio. At no place it looked like he had any chances.


Nah Wax is right. At this level you need to be able to bring out Bio at least sometimes in a series to keep the Zerg honest. If Zerg knows you're going to go Mech every game it's too easy for them to just blind counter you and then the series is even easier for them.

I mean as i said, i understand the thought process. Problem is that Gumiho's bio play is complete garbo.
pro cheese woman / Its never Sunny in Finland. Perkele / FinnishStarcraftTrivia
Captain Peabody
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3127 Posts
February 11 2023 16:24 GMT
#300
I don't think Gumiho's bio is that hopeless. Solar is just one of the most solid adaptable Zergs in the world, he did a great job deflecting Gumi's attempts to throw him off guard.
Dies Irae venit. youtube.com/SnobbinsFilms
Prev 1 13 14 15 16 17 36 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 5h 9m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
mouzHeroMarine 450
UpATreeSC 181
ProTech127
BRAT_OK 108
JuggernautJason81
SKillous 54
FoxeR 53
MindelVK 38
Railgan 14
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 6338
Calm 2173
Mini 363
hero 38
NaDa 14
Dota 2
qojqva1642
Dendi400
Pyrionflax66
syndereN15
League of Legends
C9.Mang0133
Counter-Strike
fl0m1778
Fnx 1495
FalleN 751
rGuardiaN44
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu301
Other Games
Grubby4676
Beastyqt969
FrodaN728
B2W.Neo444
allub335
Fuzer 188
QueenE137
ArmadaUGS113
Livibee76
Liquid`Ken15
OptimusSC25
Organizations
StarCraft 2
angryscii 32
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH83
• Reevou 6
• Kozan
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Laughngamez YouTube
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• 80smullet 31
• FirePhoenix15
• Pr0nogo 6
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• TFBlade1327
Other Games
• imaqtpie1712
• Shiphtur316
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Monday
5h 9m
The PondCast
14h 9m
OSC
15h 9m
Clem vs Cure
ByuN vs TBD
TBD vs Solar
MaxPax vs TBD
Krystianer vs TBD
ShoWTimE vs TBD
Big Brain Bouts
2 days
Serral vs TBD
BSL 21
3 days
BSL 21
4 days
Wardi Open
5 days
Monday Night Weeklies
5 days
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-01-19
SC2 All-Star Inv. 2025
NA Kuram Kup

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Proleague 2026-01-20
OSC Championship Season 13
Underdog Cup #3
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: W5
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Rongyi Cup S3
Nations Cup 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.