Maru vs Serral is hype as hell, crosserver or not who cares. Its not like Serral is unbeatable by koreans because of server lag, sure it is a bit of an advantage but it doesn't mean the conclusion is already written. Its still two amazing players facing eachother.
The point about Maru vs Serral was never about finding out who is actually the best players its just about wanting to see two such different but legendary players clash. Who is actually the best will never be decided by one bo5, yet one bo3. Offline or online
On October 02 2020 07:15 Shuffleblade wrote: Maru vs Serral is hype as hell, crosserver or not who cares. Its not like Serral is unbeatable by koreans because of server lag, sure it is a bit of an advantage but it doesn't mean the conclusion is already written. Its still two amazing players facing eachother.
The point about Maru vs Serral was never about finding out who is actually the best players its just about wanting to see two such different but legendary players clash. Who is actually the best will never be decided by one bo5, yet one bo3. Offline or online
how about letting us be hype! dont be anti hype
That's fair - even though I'm not anticipating it as much as I would have been a year ago, I shouldn't sour other people's excitement. I hope it's every bit as wondrous as you hope it will be :D
On October 02 2020 06:46 Kitai wrote: Serral vs. Maru is like George R. R. Martin releasing book 6 of a Song of Ice and Fire. We all really wanted it at some point, but now it's been so long and there's so much other good stuff out there it's hard to get hyped =(
On September 29 2020 06:29 TheOneAboveU wrote: Maybe Serral vs. Maru delivers and becomes an actual rivalry, or we can finally put this artificial hype bubble behind us and concentrate on more exciting things - I'd say that's a win-win situation for everybody.
As for the other groups: Exciting stuff - Clem gets to work on his TvT, uThermal gets to bust out the specials once again. Rogue group is quite unpredictable if he snoozes for a game or two, and even if he doesn't the battle for second place will be nice and open. Group D with the Reynor vs. Inno classic and poor Nice getting thrown in there as a reward for a fantastic quali run.
People won't see it as that. If it's bad, people will say "well it's an online tournament Maru doesn't care" and if it's good people will say "xyz lost because of ping" etc. This won't end anything, just add to it :'d
I mean, you know very well that the same thing would happen at BlizzCon or where ever they would meet (jetlaaaaaag!), can't please everybody, especially not the fanboys on both sides looking for excuses. Anyways, Maru qualified for this thing, so I am sure we can put the 'he doesn't care' argument to rest already at least. Maybe that's just easy talking for me, since I don't have a horse in this particular race as a neutral party regarding these two.
It's harder to blame jetlag than ping when both players are on the other side of the Earth and they have to meet at some time. This time it appears the time slot is quite sensitive towards the Korean players. Is it 8 PM Seoul time? (1PM CEST)
Edit> How come this awards points towards the IEM and the GSL Super Tournament #1 didn't? oO Like seriously ><
I wonder which Zerg will get the 30th premiere title for the race in this. I blame Rogue. Uh, select!! Will blame later
On September 29 2020 06:38 WardiTV wrote:
On September 29 2020 06:29 TheOneAboveU wrote: Maybe Serral vs. Maru delivers and becomes an actual rivalry, or we can finally put this artificial hype bubble behind us and concentrate on more exciting things - I'd say that's a win-win situation for everybody.
As for the other groups: Exciting stuff - Clem gets to work on his TvT, uThermal gets to bust out the specials once again. Rogue group is quite unpredictable if he snoozes for a game or two, and even if he doesn't the battle for second place will be nice and open. Group D with the Reynor vs. Inno classic and poor Nice getting thrown in there as a reward for a fantastic quali run.
People won't see it as that. If it's bad, people will say "well it's an online tournament Maru doesn't care" and if it's good people will say "xyz lost because of ping" etc. This won't end anything, just add to it :'d
Well online has a quite unique position considering the ping is bad and that's an objective statement and it affects races differently.
Prophet Wardi already called it! If anyone else but a Zerg wins the tournament to you it'll be a miracle, and if a Z does win it'll be because of lag. Great!
If zerg wins it's because the chances are zerg will win. 65 % of the premier tournamnet in the last 3 years were won by a zerg. This means other 2 races combined won 35 % So statistically if anybody other thanzerg wins it's amiracle and if zerg wins it's a standard.
Edit> Actually based on the usual scenario, it will be balanced up until finals, where zerg wins in a PvZ, because protoss is the kong race (they have the most 2nd places in the premiere tournamnets out of the all 3 races)
Edit 2> the most unlikely scenario is a Protoss champion and a Terran runner up So place your bets on Trap v TY in them finals xD
Well, its not the most premier of tourneys (but ofc, me being a fan of sc2 since 9 years still love it. Just wanted to mention that), and prize money is not insane, so maybe some of the zergs want to keep their best plays for other tourneys and toss sees an opportunity and go all in, then maybe. MAYBE. a toss might win. But it is still not very likely.
I wrote in the past 3 years, since having so long zerg one race dominant is slightly weird, isn't it?
Nope, as long as its Serral or Reynor winning its fine
On October 02 2020 06:46 Kitai wrote: Serral vs. Maru is like George R. R. Martin releasing book 6 of a Song of Ice and Fire. We all really wanted it at some point, but now it's been so long and there's so much other good stuff out there it's hard to get hyped =(
Nah I am still looking forward to a potentially good starcraft match at least.
Could not care less about GRRM books though at this point, the writer is utter joke. Props to him for creating an interesting universe, but I suppose he should have left the storytelling to a better writer because he seems more and more lost and clueless since book 4 :/ And the last season of GOT destroyed any last glimmer of hype I had for this saga unfortunately. Its a shame but it is what it is
On October 02 2020 08:35 [Phantom] wrote: Since this will be online.
Can we all agree Zerg is the race least affected by ping?
No
I mean yes it is, it very clearly is. As long as we don't use that as the default excuse for every result we didn't want to see and to downgrade the entire event there's nothing wrong with saying that.
On October 02 2020 08:35 [Phantom] wrote: Since this will be online.
Can we all agree Zerg is the race least affected by ping?
No
I mean yes it is, it very clearly is. As long as we don't use that as the default excuse for every result we didn't want to see and to downgrade the entire event there's nothing wrong with saying that.
I can agree that Terran bio is very micro heavy. But what about Mech? No micro at all. What about Muta? A lot of micro. What about Golden Armada? A-move + a storm here or there
On October 02 2020 08:35 [Phantom] wrote: Since this will be online.
Can we all agree Zerg is the race least affected by ping?
No
I mean yes it is, it very clearly is. As long as we don't use that as the default excuse for every result we didn't want to see and to downgrade the entire event there's nothing wrong with saying that.
I can agree that Terran bio is very micro heavy. But what about Mech? No micro at all. What about Muta? A lot of micro. What about Golden Armada? A-move + a storm here or there
So in a general sense: No! I don't agree
Right because the Protoss just spawns in with carrier/storm armies and doesn't have to get there with a defense that falls apart completely if their spellcasting isn't on point. Pros also don't micro their mech armies at all, that's why we see it every game in these events instead of bio because it's so strong it works without you needing to do anything.
Not to say Zerg isn't affected by lag at all or that there aren't situations where things get harder for them than for the other races, but overall cross server play does them more of a favor than the other races.
The macro part of terran is also affected by lag with the addon switching / barracks/facto/spatioport lifting and stuff as well as fragile army. But anyways you could see in the Serral vs TY (or INno? DH fall...) games that lag on both sides makes for kinda bad games.
On October 02 2020 08:35 [Phantom] wrote: Since this will be online.
Can we all agree Zerg is the race least affected by ping?
No
I mean yes it is, it very clearly is. As long as we don't use that as the default excuse for every result we didn't want to see and to downgrade the entire event there's nothing wrong with saying that.
I can agree that Terran bio is very micro heavy. But what about Mech? No micro at all. What about Muta? A lot of micro. What about Golden Armada? A-move + a storm here or there
So in a general sense: No! I don't agree
Right because the Protoss just spawns in with carrier/storm armies and doesn't have to get there with a defense that falls apart completely if their spellcasting isn't on point. Pros also don't micro their mech armies at all, that's why we see it every game in these events instead of bio because it's so strong it works without you needing to do anything.
Not to say Zerg isn't affected by lag at all or that there aren't situations where things get harder for them than for the other races, but overall cross server play does them more of a favor than the other races.
Pretty much exactly my point. It is very situational, that's why I won't flatout agree to such a general statement. Things can go very wrong for a Zerg, too. For example two mines can wreck your whole muta flock if reaction is half a second too late and this will lose you the game most likely.
And I didn't say mech is super strong but it is the playstyle that micro lazy and old people like me favor over bio When I play TvZ on ladder I always go mech cause I'm to slow and regularly lose 20 marines to 2 banelings
On October 02 2020 08:35 [Phantom] wrote: Since this will be online.
Can we all agree Zerg is the race least affected by ping?
No
I mean yes it is, it very clearly is. As long as we don't use that as the default excuse for every result we didn't want to see and to downgrade the entire event there's nothing wrong with saying that.
I can agree that Terran bio is very micro heavy. But what about Mech? No micro at all. What about Muta? A lot of micro. What about Golden Armada? A-move + a storm here or there
So in a general sense: No! I don't agree
Right because the Protoss just spawns in with carrier/storm armies and doesn't have to get there with a defense that falls apart completely if their spellcasting isn't on point. Pros also don't micro their mech armies at all, that's why we see it every game in these events instead of bio because it's so strong it works without you needing to do anything.
Not to say Zerg isn't affected by lag at all or that there aren't situations where things get harder for them than for the other races, but overall cross server play does them more of a favor than the other races.
And I didn't say mech is super strong but it is the playstyle that micro lazy and old people like me favor over bio When I play TvZ on ladder I always go mech cause I'm to slow and regularly lose 20 marines to 2 banelings
That is exactly my experience as well. But I am very, very far from pro level and I going to make the bold guess that you are too. A-moving the mech deathball is just not something they can do, then they just get wrecked.
Besides, the fact that so many top Terrans prefer bio over mech even when playing on 200 ms ping says quite a bit about the strength of mech at pro level imo.
On October 02 2020 08:35 [Phantom] wrote: Since this will be online.
Can we all agree Zerg is the race least affected by ping?
No
I mean yes it is, it very clearly is. As long as we don't use that as the default excuse for every result we didn't want to see and to downgrade the entire event there's nothing wrong with saying that.
I can agree that Terran bio is very micro heavy. But what about Mech? No micro at all. What about Muta? A lot of micro. What about Golden Armada? A-move + a storm here or there
So in a general sense: No! I don't agree
Right because the Protoss just spawns in with carrier/storm armies and doesn't have to get there with a defense that falls apart completely if their spellcasting isn't on point. Pros also don't micro their mech armies at all, that's why we see it every game in these events instead of bio because it's so strong it works without you needing to do anything.
Not to say Zerg isn't affected by lag at all or that there aren't situations where things get harder for them than for the other races, but overall cross server play does them more of a favor than the other races.
Pretty much exactly my point. It is very situational, that's why I won't flatout agree to such a general statement. Things can go very wrong for a Zerg, too. For example two mines can wreck your whole muta flock if reaction is half a second too late and this will lose you the game most likely.
And I didn't say mech is super strong but it is the playstyle that micro lazy and old people like me favor over bio When I play TvZ on ladder I always go mech cause I'm to slow and regularly lose 20 marines to 2 banelings
I sincerely hope you are not serious with this post :D
On October 02 2020 08:35 [Phantom] wrote: Since this will be online.
Can we all agree Zerg is the race least affected by ping?
No
Overall I think the statement is correct. Which makes sense, due to the way the race is designed in the first place. It does not mean that it is the case in absolutely every situation, but overall Zerg seem to be the least affected. Especially in standard games in each matchup this seems to be the case. Set up has always been more important for Zerg than infight execution, imo. Which doesn‘t mean that Zerg just A-Move their army around once being in a good position, of course.
Quick question, did terran win a single cross-server TvZ in the Dreamhack Masters tournament (given that was the last 'international' event)? I don't remember it happening.
Even beyond that, neither Maru or Serral are in their best shape. It's not going to settle anything regardless of who wins. Maru apparently has a broken spine and has to be in the hospital 3x a week, so there's a 0% chance he's practicing like normal. Even Serral isn't in his best shape given its impossible to stay that consistent in an online era (people forget his big LAN wins are all months apart, he didn't play in weekly online cups. Then you add on the litter of 'its online' and 'ping issues' yada yada.
People will be disappointed even if the games turn out good, which they won't because it's a cross-server TvZ and you're talking about players known specifically for perfect micro/multitasking and mechanics.
On October 02 2020 08:35 [Phantom] wrote: Since this will be online.
Can we all agree Zerg is the race least affected by ping?
No
I mean yes it is, it very clearly is. As long as we don't use that as the default excuse for every result we didn't want to see and to downgrade the entire event there's nothing wrong with saying that.
I can agree that Terran bio is very micro heavy. But what about Mech? No micro at all. What about Muta? A lot of micro. What about Golden Armada? A-move + a storm here or there
So in a general sense: No! I don't agree
Right because the Protoss just spawns in with carrier/storm armies and doesn't have to get there with a defense that falls apart completely if their spellcasting isn't on point. Pros also don't micro their mech armies at all, that's why we see it every game in these events instead of bio because it's so strong it works without you needing to do anything.
Not to say Zerg isn't affected by lag at all or that there aren't situations where things get harder for them than for the other races, but overall cross server play does them more of a favor than the other races.
And I didn't say mech is super strong but it is the playstyle that micro lazy and old people like me favor over bio When I play TvZ on ladder I always go mech cause I'm to slow and regularly lose 20 marines to 2 banelings
That is exactly my experience as well. But I am very, very far from pro level and I going to make the bold guess that you are too. A-moving the mech deathball is just not something they can do, then they just get wrecked.
Besides, the fact that so many top Terrans prefer bio over mech even when playing on 200 ms ping says quite a bit about the strength of mech at pro level imo.
Mech is unplayable against a zerg as good as Reynor or Serral. They will pick off every unit you have with vipers and there's nothing you can do about it.
Although on the other hand if you play bio on that kind of ping you're going to lose it all to banelings, so honestly good luck beating Reynor or Serral in general really.
On October 02 2020 08:35 [Phantom] wrote: Since this will be online.
Can we all agree Zerg is the race least affected by ping?
No
I mean yes it is, it very clearly is. As long as we don't use that as the default excuse for every result we didn't want to see and to downgrade the entire event there's nothing wrong with saying that.
I can agree that Terran bio is very micro heavy. But what about Mech? No micro at all. What about Muta? A lot of micro. What about Golden Armada? A-move + a storm here or there
So in a general sense: No! I don't agree
Right because the Protoss just spawns in with carrier/storm armies and doesn't have to get there with a defense that falls apart completely if their spellcasting isn't on point. Pros also don't micro their mech armies at all, that's why we see it every game in these events instead of bio because it's so strong it works without you needing to do anything.
Not to say Zerg isn't affected by lag at all or that there aren't situations where things get harder for them than for the other races, but overall cross server play does them more of a favor than the other races.
And I didn't say mech is super strong but it is the playstyle that micro lazy and old people like me favor over bio When I play TvZ on ladder I always go mech cause I'm to slow and regularly lose 20 marines to 2 banelings
That is exactly my experience as well. But I am very, very far from pro leveland I going to make the bold guess that you are too. A-moving the mech deathball is just not something they can do, then they just get wrecked.
Besides, the fact that so many top Terrans prefer bio over mech even when playing on 200 ms ping says quite a bit about the strength of mech at pro level imo.
Yes ^-^ A-moving works mostly because my opponents can't execute 360° attacks and stuff. So once mech is setup the only way you lose is basetrade. At least that's what happens in Dia
On October 02 2020 08:35 [Phantom] wrote: Since this will be online.
Can we all agree Zerg is the race least affected by ping?
No
I mean yes it is, it very clearly is. As long as we don't use that as the default excuse for every result we didn't want to see and to downgrade the entire event there's nothing wrong with saying that.
I can agree that Terran bio is very micro heavy. But what about Mech? No micro at all. What about Muta? A lot of micro. What about Golden Armada? A-move + a storm here or there
So in a general sense: No! I don't agree
Right because the Protoss just spawns in with carrier/storm armies and doesn't have to get there with a defense that falls apart completely if their spellcasting isn't on point. Pros also don't micro their mech armies at all, that's why we see it every game in these events instead of bio because it's so strong it works without you needing to do anything.
Not to say Zerg isn't affected by lag at all or that there aren't situations where things get harder for them than for the other races, but overall cross server play does them more of a favor than the other races.
Pretty much exactly my point. It is very situational, that's why I won't flatout agree to such a general statement. Things can go very wrong for a Zerg, too. For example two mines can wreck your whole muta flock if reaction is half a second too late and this will lose you the game most likely.
And I didn't say mech is super strong but it is the playstyle that micro lazy and old people like me favor over bio When I play TvZ on ladder I always go mech cause I'm to slow and regularly lose 20 marines to 2 banelings
I sincerely hope you are not serious with this post :D
On October 02 2020 20:14 Fango wrote: Quick question, did terran win a single cross-server TvZ in the Dreamhack Masters tournament (given that was the last 'international' event)? I don't remember it happening.
Even beyond that, neither Maru or Serral are in their best shape. It's not going to settle anything regardless of who wins. Maru apparently has a broken spine and has to be in the hospital 3x a week, so there's a 0% chance he's practicing like normal. Even Serral isn't in his best shape given its impossible to stay that consistent in an online era (people forget his big LAN wins are all months apart, he didn't play in weekly online cups. Then you add on the litter of 'its online' and 'ping issues' yada yada.
People will be disappointed even if the games turn out good, which they won't because it's a cross-server TvZ and you're talking about players known specifically for perfect micro/multitasking and mechanics.
Inno - Scarlett 2:0
and
Inno - Scarlett 2:1
I assume Scarlett was playing from home since visa issues, corona and stuff
Personally I think it's awsome how AlphaX has players on all levels, so lower level players can occasionally get help from higher lever players to learn and get better. It would be great if they did something similar for casters. Consider bringing on more experienced casters to co-cast with the less experienced ones, so they can learn and get better. ESL was great that way the last season. And honestly: The games are just more fun to watch with the more experienced casters casting them.
EPT
