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Snute and the korean answer xD and Neeb giving zero fucks hahahahaa
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On September 11 2017 03:10 ZigguratOfUr wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:09 Topin wrote:
missed the design change talk, anything interesting or new? They're bringing back the shield battery. I wonder how long it'll take them to realize that the shield battery is even worse in SCII than BW and shelve the idea.
wait, you think the shield battery won't make up for losing photon overcharge?
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On September 11 2017 03:09 Olli wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:05 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:00 Olli wrote:On September 11 2017 02:58 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 02:56 Olli wrote:On September 11 2017 02:55 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 02:51 usopsama wrote:
I do like the new balance changes a lot more than when David Kim was leading.
I still can't believe they are really going to get rid of the mother ship core. If David Kim was still leading, this change would be impossible. Admittedly all their ideas to replace photon overcharge have been garbage and break PvP and PvZ in half, but at least they are trying. Of course design patches are going to break matchups in half at first. That's why they're design patches. They can always fine tune them once they're established. All these shield buffing abilities do absolutely nothing to prevent mineral lines to get cleaned out at a whim. Stalkers shooting things out of the sky much faster should help with that. Also widow mines being visible off cooldown. On September 11 2017 03:00 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 02:59 Olli wrote:On September 11 2017 02:57 Heartland wrote:On September 11 2017 02:56 Olli wrote:On September 11 2017 02:55 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 02:51 usopsama wrote:
I do like the new balance changes a lot more than when David Kim was leading.
I still can't believe they are really going to get rid of the mother ship core. If David Kim was still leading, this change would be impossible. Admittedly all their ideas to replace photon overcharge have been garbage and break PvP and PvZ in half, but at least they are trying. Of course design patches are going to break matchups in half at first. That's why they're design patches. They can always fine tune them once they're established. How much are they paying you?! Well this is a stance I've always had. Design patches should only be criticized for their design. Everything else will come later. So we are allowed to criticize warpgates for bad design?  Sure, people have always done that. I just don't agree. They don't though. If you only have a few stalkers it takes even longer to take out an oracle... All things that can be adjusted with build times, oracle armor, etc. and specific builds to perhaps counter SG openings. You're being way too specific about things that nobody can foresee at the moment.
Sure, if oracles were the only problem that photon overcharge was bandaid-ing. I can't help but feel pessimistic about this shield recharge solution which is meant to address a myriad of problems, but which in its current form addresses none of them.
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On September 11 2017 03:09 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:08 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 03:05 raff100 wrote:On September 11 2017 03:04 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 03:02 raff100 wrote:
MOBA are really deforming players minds: there is no need to change units/abilities to shake the meta. Changes must be done when the design is in a bad state, as it is right now for Raven and PO,not because is refreshing to see new metà every year...
There is no right or wrong concerning this If the game is fun and diversified, why should you risk everything for the sake of change? Balance in rts is way more subtle than in moba when you can just ban OP things. Because usually there will be a rather stale meta, people can boast about bw and how the meta still changes but most games are still fairly similar to each other. Change is exciting. Personally i can see both sides and don't have a strong opinion one way or another change can happen without patches. Bisu
Not sure if you mention bisu because i ranted about the stupid concept of giving credit to one player or if you are serious now 
Yes the game can change, there still will be a fairly stale meta at one point without actual changes (maps, game design).
Sure there are always small differences here and there and you can go different builds to surprise people, etc. But in general the meta will be clear and most games will look similar. Changing that with big design changes where everyone has to figure stuff out anew is definitely interesting as a concept, both to play and to watch.
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On September 11 2017 03:10 ZigguratOfUr wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:09 Topin wrote:
missed the design change talk, anything interesting or new? They're bringing back the shield battery. I wonder how long it'll take them to realize that the shield battery is even worse in SCII than BW and shelve the idea.
Clicking on pylons with a single defensive air unit was always stupid design wise, shield battery is infinitely better as it forces protoss to leave some unit to defend and offer micro and counter play possibilities. If Shield battery in it's current state is underpowered, they can always buff it after further testing.
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On September 11 2017 03:08 Ej_ wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:06 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:On September 11 2017 03:05 raff100 wrote:On September 11 2017 03:04 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 03:02 raff100 wrote:
MOBA are really deforming players minds: there is no need to change units/abilities to shake the meta. Changes must be done when the design is in a bad state, as it is right now for Raven and PO,not because is refreshing to see new metà every year...
There is no right or wrong concerning this If the game is fun and diversified, why should you risk everything for the sake of change? Balance in rts is way more subtle than in moba when you can just ban OP things. The true next generation RTS will have 50 units per race and a draft phase The truth is that next generation RTS will be BW in Korea, WC3 in China and Clash of Clans everywhere else.
Why do we have to get the pay2win game
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On September 11 2017 03:12 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:08 Ej_ wrote:On September 11 2017 03:06 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:On September 11 2017 03:05 raff100 wrote:On September 11 2017 03:04 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 03:02 raff100 wrote:
MOBA are really deforming players minds: there is no need to change units/abilities to shake the meta. Changes must be done when the design is in a bad state, as it is right now for Raven and PO,not because is refreshing to see new metà every year...
There is no right or wrong concerning this If the game is fun and diversified, why should you risk everything for the sake of change? Balance in rts is way more subtle than in moba when you can just ban OP things. The true next generation RTS will have 50 units per race and a draft phase The truth is that next generation RTS will be BW in Korea, WC3 in China and Clash of Clans everywhere else. Why do we have to get the pay2win game
Because white people suck at games.
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On September 11 2017 03:12 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:10 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:09 Topin wrote:
missed the design change talk, anything interesting or new? They're bringing back the shield battery. I wonder how long it'll take them to realize that the shield battery is even worse in SCII than BW and shelve the idea. wait, you think the shield battery won't make up for losing photon overcharge?
What about
Offensive shield battery rush with new stalkers
10 easy ways to steal your opponent's ladder points, by SGTK the dev! Terrans hate him!
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i thought Neeb was going to kill Snute right there with his psi blade
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On September 11 2017 03:12 fastr wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:10 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:09 Topin wrote:
missed the design change talk, anything interesting or new? They're bringing back the shield battery. I wonder how long it'll take them to realize that the shield battery is even worse in SCII than BW and shelve the idea. Clicking on pylons with a single defensive air unit was always stupid design wise, shield battery is infinitely better as it forces protoss to leave some unit to defend and offer micro and counter play possibilities. If Shield battery in it's current state is underpowered, they can always buff it after further testing.
Shield batteries are a fundamentally garbage concept of a do nothing support building that always falls into uselessness or overpoweredness.
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I really hope Mal stays as host for good. Way more exiting than Smix
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On September 11 2017 03:15 ZigguratOfUr wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:12 fastr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:10 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:09 Topin wrote:
missed the design change talk, anything interesting or new? They're bringing back the shield battery. I wonder how long it'll take them to realize that the shield battery is even worse in SCII than BW and shelve the idea. Clicking on pylons with a single defensive air unit was always stupid design wise, shield battery is infinitely better as it forces protoss to leave some unit to defend and offer micro and counter play possibilities. If Shield battery in it's current state is underpowered, they can always buff it after further testing. Shield batteries are a fundamentally garbage concept of a do nothing support building that always falls into uselessness or overpoweredness.
I'm not sure in which situation they'd be overpowered
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On September 11 2017 03:15 ZigguratOfUr wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:12 fastr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:10 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:09 Topin wrote:
missed the design change talk, anything interesting or new? They're bringing back the shield battery. I wonder how long it'll take them to realize that the shield battery is even worse in SCII than BW and shelve the idea. Clicking on pylons with a single defensive air unit was always stupid design wise, shield battery is infinitely better as it forces protoss to leave some unit to defend and offer micro and counter play possibilities. If Shield battery in it's current state is underpowered, they can always buff it after further testing. Shield batteries are a fundamentally garbage concept of a do nothing support building that always falls into uselessness or overpoweredness.
Pylon overcharge is several times worse
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On September 11 2017 03:16 Fango wrote:
I really hope Mal stays as host for good. Way more exiting than Smix
There's a joke to be made about your typo but I'm holding it back this time.
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On September 11 2017 03:17 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:16 Fango wrote:
I really hope Mal stays as host for good. Way more exiting than Smix There's a joke to be made about your typo but I'm holding it back this time.
haha
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On September 11 2017 03:17 Fango wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:15 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:12 fastr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:10 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:09 Topin wrote:
missed the design change talk, anything interesting or new? They're bringing back the shield battery. I wonder how long it'll take them to realize that the shield battery is even worse in SCII than BW and shelve the idea. Clicking on pylons with a single defensive air unit was always stupid design wise, shield battery is infinitely better as it forces protoss to leave some unit to defend and offer micro and counter play possibilities. If Shield battery in it's current state is underpowered, they can always buff it after further testing. Shield batteries are a fundamentally garbage concept of a do nothing support building that always falls into uselessness or overpoweredness. Pylon overcharge is several times worse
Shit design that maintains balance > Shit design that can't even maintain balance
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On September 11 2017 03:12 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:09 Charoisaur wrote:On September 11 2017 03:08 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 03:05 raff100 wrote:On September 11 2017 03:04 The_Red_Viper wrote:On September 11 2017 03:02 raff100 wrote:
MOBA are really deforming players minds: there is no need to change units/abilities to shake the meta. Changes must be done when the design is in a bad state, as it is right now for Raven and PO,not because is refreshing to see new metà every year...
There is no right or wrong concerning this If the game is fun and diversified, why should you risk everything for the sake of change? Balance in rts is way more subtle than in moba when you can just ban OP things. Because usually there will be a rather stale meta, people can boast about bw and how the meta still changes but most games are still fairly similar to each other. Change is exciting. Personally i can see both sides and don't have a strong opinion one way or another change can happen without patches. Bisu Not sure if you mention bisu because i ranted about the stupid concept of giving credit to one player or if you are serious now Yes the game can change, there still will be a fairly stale meta at one point without actual changes (maps, game design). Sure there are always small differences here and there and you can go different builds to surprise people, etc. But in general the meta will be clear and most games will look similar. Changing that with big design changes where everyone has to figure stuff out anew is definitely interesting as a concept, both to play and to watch.
why is it bad when the game gets stale? Football is stale too but nobody complains that we should change the rules to shake things up. I mentioned Bisu because he usually gets credited for coming up with this build so it's clear what I mean
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On September 11 2017 03:18 ZigguratOfUr wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:17 Fango wrote:On September 11 2017 03:15 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:12 fastr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:10 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:09 Topin wrote:
missed the design change talk, anything interesting or new? They're bringing back the shield battery. I wonder how long it'll take them to realize that the shield battery is even worse in SCII than BW and shelve the idea. Clicking on pylons with a single defensive air unit was always stupid design wise, shield battery is infinitely better as it forces protoss to leave some unit to defend and offer micro and counter play possibilities. If Shield battery in it's current state is underpowered, they can always buff it after further testing. Shield batteries are a fundamentally garbage concept of a do nothing support building that always falls into uselessness or overpoweredness. Pylon overcharge is several times worse Shit design that maintains balance > Shit design that can't even maintain balance
Can't we just bring back nexus overcharge?
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On September 11 2017 03:19 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 03:18 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:17 Fango wrote:On September 11 2017 03:15 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:12 fastr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:10 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 11 2017 03:09 Topin wrote:
missed the design change talk, anything interesting or new? They're bringing back the shield battery. I wonder how long it'll take them to realize that the shield battery is even worse in SCII than BW and shelve the idea. Clicking on pylons with a single defensive air unit was always stupid design wise, shield battery is infinitely better as it forces protoss to leave some unit to defend and offer micro and counter play possibilities. If Shield battery in it's current state is underpowered, they can always buff it after further testing. Shield batteries are a fundamentally garbage concept of a do nothing support building that always falls into uselessness or overpoweredness. Pylon overcharge is several times worse Shit design that maintains balance > Shit design that can't even maintain balance Can't we just bring back nexus overcharge?
+1 nexus overcharge was 100% better than pylon overcharge
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EPT
