|
|
On November 04 2016 06:37 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 05:22 FrkFrJss wrote:On November 04 2016 04:03 Elentos wrote:On November 04 2016 03:55 opisska wrote:On November 04 2016 03:52 Nakajin wrote:On November 04 2016 03:47 Elentos wrote:On November 04 2016 03:45 opisska wrote:
Yeah, the other SC2 players are usually the biggest problem of people in tournaments Unbelievably so. Although some players are always their own worst enemy. True story I one started a game, totally fuck up my build by forgeting to build my gas, ragequit then saw in the post game stat that the other guy was afk. If you wanna get this feeling a lot, go play team games. The maps are so small that they get regularly mined out, so you are broke as hell, have no army and then the opponents type "gg" and leave, because they are having exactly the same experience and don't realize that it's not exclusive to their team. I feel that this is actually the way we win most 2v2s nowadays. If the people we play against had some faith in themselves, we wouldn't even be in diamond. I imagine 2v2s/team games in general are a lot more fun if you play with people you know though. I've tried some 2v2s with randoms and it wasn't exactly the pinnacle of entertainment. On November 04 2016 04:01 FrkFrJss wrote:On November 04 2016 03:34 Fango wrote:On November 04 2016 02:56 zakadar wrote:
TY can sometimes lose very weird like vs Trap in kespa cup like he is off off his game Tha fact he went the whole way through KeSPA cup without losing a single map. Then the semis happened and he choked. I think he is fine as long as he isn't on the edge of losing. If he's up 2-0 or 3-1 in a series he always wins. It's when it comes down the the deciding match or something. Statistically, TY has not done all that well in LotV against Protoss. He's consistently inconsistent in wins and losses with a 20-17 match history. Now, he performed very well against Zest likely because Zest was not in his best form and because TY knows Zest's playstyle. However, if Stats, ShoWTimE, or Neeblet faces him, I think TY will have some trouble just because TvP has been by far his worst matchup in LotV, where he has a 69% winrate in TvZ and an 81% winrate in TvT. In comparison, Neeblet has a 72% winrate PvT, Stats has a 59% winrate in PvT, and ShoWTime has a 64% winrate in PvT. If Dark and TY get to the finals, I would favour TY. Dark has had TY's number all year and TY is known for choking when it counts but you favor TY because... his winrate is really good? The difference between 55/56 (TY) and 59 (Stats) is not significant and both Neeb and ShoWTimE have mostly played against players who are definitely worse than TY. That's not to say any of them are going to get blown out of the arena, but TY's TvP is a lot better than you make it sound. To be fair, Neeb was also known to choke quite heavily. A person's winrate does generally tell how good that person is in a given matchup. It is true that Dark has performed very well vs TY historically, but yes, I would still favour TY. I haven't looked a ton into their history, but I've found two tournament results, a 3-1 and a 3-2 in Dark's favour. I don't really take into account Proleague as much when considering individual results because a lot of people did well there who did very poorly in individual leagues. So a 3-1 and a 3-2 that happened several months ago really doesn't persuade me of Dark's inherent superiority. Also, in the finals, (which I don't take as much stock in), TY beat Dark for KT to advance to the Proleague finals. Also, for TY, I don't think I misrepresented his TvP. I said that it was inconsistent, which it has been. He's gone on several win and loss streaks. He's lost consistently to weaker Protoss, like Trap, Patience, and Dear (who has been a bit of a weaker opponent) so I don't think that his TvP is a matchup I would favour him to win (except against Zest). I just feel that having a 55% winrate in a matchup for a top level pro is fairly low. And yes, Neeb and ShoWTimE have faced worse opponents, but we've seen that at the highest level of play, that doesn't seem to matter as much as it did in the past. The foreigners that we've seen at Blizzcon for the most part seem to be able to compete at a decently even level. Just because Neeb and ShoWTimE have faced "worse" opponents doesn't mean they won't be able to compete or even beat TY if they get past Dark (big IF, of course). You didn't misrepresent TY's TvP specifically. Here are the offline TvP winrates of all Terrans who made a top 8 in Korea this year (I'd have taken online + offline but the difference in games played becomes too extreme with 100 or more so I settled with offline, the sample sizes are closer to each other and offline matches are generally more important) for 2016 (results from 2015 LotV aren't worth anything at this point; one could probably even justify ignoring LotV TvP results up until the adept nerf): 1.  ByuN - 37-24 (60.66%) in games, 13-8 (61.90%) in matches 2. TY - 31-21 (59.62%) in games, 14-9 (60.87%) in matches 3. GuMiho - 31-22 (58.49%) in games, 16-10 (61.54%) in matches 4. Cure - 16-12 (57.14%) in games, 8-5 (61.54%) in matches 5. Maru - 30-27 (52.63%) in games, 16-11 (59.26%) in matches 6. aLive - 8-11 (42.11%) in games, 3-7 (30.00%) in matches 7. Dream - 5-7 (41.67%) in games, 3-5 (37.50%) in matches 8. Ryung - 7-10 (41.18%) in games, 3-6 (33.33%) in matches 9. TaeJa - 8-12 (40.00%) in games, 3-4 (42.86%) in matches Also for the lulz I looked at the same winrates for the 3 top non-Korean Terrans (per WCS standings). uThermal, MaSa and MarineLorD would take 1st, 2nd and 3rd place on the list. So I guess the TL;DR of this would be that all high level Korean Terrans have trouble against Protoss offline. And I specifically said that I don't mean ShoWTimE or Neeb wouldn't be able to compete (in fact, I'm pretty confident they can if they bring their A-game). But they're still quite a bit removed from being favored or even against TY imo (both of them even specifically pointed out that they wanted to avoid him). I don't want to discredit them or anything, just make clear that despite everything, TY is an extremely scary player. Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 06:34 Cricketer12 wrote:On November 04 2016 06:25 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
ya so, just heard Blizzard made $737 million last quarter. and we get weird al yankovic for the closing ceremonies? with the cash they are bringing in they could've reunited Led Zeppelin and charged $10,000 a ticket. fuck that noise Weird Al is the shit Weird Al gonna educate some nerds.
That is true, this year specifically, most (all) Terran have had trouble against Protoss....
Though I would rate Byun as the stronger threat because of his recent form than TY, as TY recently has had worse results against Protoss.
I suppose with the bracket it really doesn't matter since he faces his best matchup tomorrow, and if he wins, then he will face either a Protoss, Dark, or Elazer in the finals. If he faces Elazer, I think we all know how that will turn out, and Dark could be a toss up. So he faces either a historically bad matchup TvZ or a (I'm not sure I would necessarily use "scary," TvP, but it has been challenging to him as of late) challenging TvP.
Though, I feel like Neeb and ShoWTimE would have a better result against TY than they would Dark.
|
On November 04 2016 08:53 FrkFrJss wrote:
Though I would rate Byun as the stronger threat because of his recent form than TY, as TY recently has had worse results against Protoss.
I would have, too. But the fact that ShoWTimE completely figured ByuN out and smashed his entire game plan to pieces (making it look easy) discouraged me from that line of thought. I think it might be a stylistic thing. Like ByuN relies a lot on getting damage and snowballing out of control while TY often makes things go slower at first only to then pick up the pace and hit 3 places at once. Every Protoss player seemingly prefers playing against one of the two.
Also I just realized that considering all the text walls I'm writing, the next time Die4Ever posts the pashun board I could be up like 500 points without trying. So I really hope the pashun posts are starting soon.
|
On November 04 2016 09:05 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 08:53 FrkFrJss wrote:
Though I would rate Byun as the stronger threat because of his recent form than TY, as TY recently has had worse results against Protoss.
I would have, too. But the fact that ShoWTimE completely figured ByuN out and smashed his entire game plan to pieces (making it look easy) discouraged me from that line of thought. I think it might be a stylistic thing. Like ByuN relies a lot on getting damage and snowballing out of control while TY often makes things go slower at first only to then pick up the pace and hit 3 places at once. Every Protoss player seemingly prefers playing against one of the two. Also I just realized that considering all the text walls I'm writing, the next time Die4Ever posts the pashun board I could be up like 500 points without trying. So I really hope the pashun posts are starting soon.
I will be first in 24 hours, don't worry
|
well I think to figure out Byun is much easyer then TY
|
On November 04 2016 09:05 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 08:53 FrkFrJss wrote:
Though I would rate Byun as the stronger threat because of his recent form than TY, as TY recently has had worse results against Protoss.
I would have, too. But the fact that ShoWTimE completely figured ByuN out and smashed his entire game plan to pieces (making it look easy) discouraged me from that line of thought. I think it might be a stylistic thing. Like ByuN relies a lot on getting damage and snowballing out of control while TY often makes things go slower at first only to then pick up the pace and hit 3 places at once. Every Protoss player seemingly prefers playing against one of the two. Also I just realized that considering all the text walls I'm writing, the next time Die4Ever posts the pashun board I could be up like 500 points without trying. So I really hope the pashun posts are starting soon.
I noticed when Byun was facing Dear and sOs that he tended to delay his third base and then go with a strong bio force to do damage to the Protoss and delay their third base for a long while.
I need to rewatch the vods for ShoWTimeE and Byun, but I know that TY is very much the multi attack Terran, which makes him both hard and easy to play against.
I feel like if Neeb gets into a comfortable place and places the right amount of units, then he has shown that he can counter TY's style. The only problem is that most Protoss have at one time been pulled apart by multiprong drops. (I think that game against Zest in the GSL finals is a perfect example).
|
|
|
surprisingly, ShowTime is actually struggled with his PvZ so it would be bad if he met with Dark
oh well, he is also afraid of PvP god, Neeb :D
anyway, I hope TY can go far... it's time for him to shine and get some achievement in his career
|
All these Byun doubters. Jesus.
Byun will win Blizzcon and solidify has place a Starcraft legend. 
|
On November 04 2016 14:41 Za7oX wrote:All these Byun doubters. Jesus. Byun will win Blizzcon and solidify has place a Starcraft legend.
Nah.
|
On November 04 2016 14:41 Za7oX wrote:All these Byun doubters. Jesus. Byun will win Blizzcon and solidify has place a Starcraft legend.
Nah he sucks
|
The thing is, if ByuN beats TY he probably goes to the finals. I doubt Zest can beat Stats
|
On November 04 2016 05:23 Cricketer12 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 04:26 Elentos wrote:On November 04 2016 04:18 opisska wrote:On November 04 2016 04:03 Elentos wrote:On November 04 2016 03:55 opisska wrote:On November 04 2016 03:52 Nakajin wrote:On November 04 2016 03:47 Elentos wrote:On November 04 2016 03:45 opisska wrote:
Yeah, the other SC2 players are usually the biggest problem of people in tournaments Unbelievably so. Although some players are always their own worst enemy. True story I one started a game, totally fuck up my build by forgeting to build my gas, ragequit then saw in the post game stat that the other guy was afk. If you wanna get this feeling a lot, go play team games. The maps are so small that they get regularly mined out, so you are broke as hell, have no army and then the opponents type "gg" and leave, because they are having exactly the same experience and don't realize that it's not exclusive to their team. I feel that this is actually the way we win most 2v2s nowadays. If the people we play against had some faith in themselves, we wouldn't even be in diamond. I imagine 2v2s/team games in general are a lot more fun if you play with people you know though. I've tried some 2v2s with randoms and it wasn't exactly the pinnacle of entertainment. OMG no, don't do that, you might become a serial killer or something. The basic reason why I never understood the popularity of MOBAs and whatnot - how the hell can you play with strangers on your team? I mean I don't see the problem in playing with strangers necessarily. But I'll never understand why some of those strangers decide to be total assholes to the people they're supposed to cooperate with. I used to play Halo Wars 3v3 with randoms and every now and then you had that guy who built his hero and started attacking his allies. At that point I'm like "Why did you even bother?" you should get HW2 for pc next year when it comes out. so we can outmacro some scrubs
tried it and it felt terrible.
|
well stats has very solid tvp himself
|
Seeker
Where dat snitch at?37055 Posts
Ugh... Seriously? Passionboard is back? Damn it... Now I have to spam all over again...
|
ALLEYCAT BLUES50601 Posts
On November 04 2016 17:32 Seeker wrote:
Ugh... Seriously? Passionboard is back? Damn it... Now I have to spam all over again...
|
On November 04 2016 14:41 Za7oX wrote:All these Byun doubters. Jesus. Byun will win Blizzcon and solidify has place a Starcraft legend.
K
|
Canada8159 Posts
|
On November 04 2016 17:45 Jer99 wrote:
TODAYS THE DAY
YUP!! Today, we got our first African-American president 8 years ago.
Oh wait, you meant Blizzcon. I'm just glad I live in Canada, so I can sleep 6 hours, and it'll almost the time.
|
|
|
On November 04 2016 09:07 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2016 09:05 Elentos wrote:On November 04 2016 08:53 FrkFrJss wrote:
Though I would rate Byun as the stronger threat because of his recent form than TY, as TY recently has had worse results against Protoss.
I would have, too. But the fact that ShoWTimE completely figured ByuN out and smashed his entire game plan to pieces (making it look easy) discouraged me from that line of thought. I think it might be a stylistic thing. Like ByuN relies a lot on getting damage and snowballing out of control while TY often makes things go slower at first only to then pick up the pace and hit 3 places at once. Every Protoss player seemingly prefers playing against one of the two. Also I just realized that considering all the text walls I'm writing, the next time Die4Ever posts the pashun board I could be up like 500 points without trying. So I really hope the pashun posts are starting soon. I will be first in 24 hours, don't worry
Good, I need some competition.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/BeEfgZE.jpg)
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
