On September 26 2015 04:33 Noonius wrote: ZVZ FINAL
The struggle was real, now I am crying:
First I was whining around, that protoss bullshit makes the game too versatile and I don't want it to win Now we have a ZvZ instead of PvZ finals. Hmmm
the important thing is you found a thing to complain about in every instance.
Reminds me that I don't agree 100% about your GOAT articles
Go write a 12000 page essays on why you think his article is shit.
On September 26 2015 04:33 Noonius wrote: ZVZ FINAL
The struggle was real, now I am crying:
First I was whining around, that protoss bullshit makes the game too versatile and I don't want it to win Now we have a ZvZ instead of PvZ finals. Hmmm
the important thing is you found a thing to complain about in every instance.
Reminds me that I don't agree 100% about your GOAT articles
Go write a 12000 page essays on why you think his article is shit.
On September 26 2015 04:05 Rollora wrote: [quote] you mean protoss is the race of hidden things. There is a difference between leaving someone in the dark as long as possible (for terran: hiding you go mech or bio or so, for terran hide buildings), but the only race that works so often JUST because it has hidden something or you can win only because you hid something (not because of skill) is protoss. Not saying sOs has no skill, on the contrary the huge variety of builds he knows impresses me, and reading his opponent, comebacks, mindgames...
and yeah, lol i should watch chess.... or ANY other sport, because I cannot remember andy sport that works that way: hide something to surprise the oponent and if he isn't prepared then you win. The only thing that reminds me of is faking an injury/foul in soccer to win by penalties if you are the worse team and cannot score goals by yourself
And stop that bullshit statement of scouting better. you can hide things so they can NOT be scouted
Every sport and game has hidden information SC2 is just more blatant about it. Protoss having the most varied cheeses is a fact no one right in the head is arguing that so there is no need to repeat it over and over :D
Sorry, it just annoys me, that you can win a game solely by surprising an enemy It really kills the fun for me. It completely takes it away for me, and many others. Its bad design I think Starcraft is a great game if you have a fun, macro games against zerg or terran, even toss if you have one that doesn't cheese. But it immidiately gets frustrating, more then a normal loss, when you lose JUST because of BS. I hope you understand my frustration
You're probably only going to lose to a surprise if you take risks. Though at a top-level I admit it's necessary to take risks sometimes. I do think you're blowing things out of proportion, people seem to think PvP is hast he most luck and bullshit yet someone like Zest has an insane PvP winrate vs other Koreans despite PvP's reputation.
Oh lol someone is arguing that protoss isn't a bag of bullshit haha If you play safe in to cheese it makes it harder to defend earlier timings If you play safe vs early timings you expose yourself to later timings Playing safe vs later timings involve skipping safety measures to early timings/cheese to get more econ before they hit. Balancing those is what zvp is about. There is no one safe build.
thats the struggle. The constand "ladder - mindgame"
btw why the hell didn't he recall out before everything died?
Well when you watch sOs he's not playing 'ladder mindgames'.
What is your point anyway? I truly want to know what you are arguing for.
Against the notion that sOs is some guy who just flips coins. Or that flipping coins is an issue in SC2 at all... It's mainly just a way for people to rationlize their ladder losses and minimize their own blame.
Rollora admits and respects sOs skill so nothing to argue about there. Don't you agree that protoss has more ways to get easy wins at high levels than zerg or terran tho?
Thx! yeah, I am deeply impressed by the amount of builds he knows and he always finds a solution/way to get out of a troublesome situation, pressure the oponent, comebacks. He impressed me at his reverse all kill, he impressed me today. But still I hate these sort of games, won by cheese or cheesy play. And while I would never call Protoss imba, their huge variety of BS/cheese to choose from makes this race so hard to predict and therefore having a slight edge in some way - it is not predictable. And the book of protoss bullshit shows, this is simply too much, no other race has so many cheeses to choose from. The race would also do fine with half these cheese-builds
I wish HyuN his success against all ... but I would feel sad for Fantasy with his tweet ... So a draw? HyuN wins the final, but Solar gets the WCS points? :-)
On September 26 2015 04:33 Noonius wrote: ZVZ FINAL
The struggle was real, now I am crying:
First I was whining around, that protoss bullshit makes the game too versatile and I don't want it to win Now we have a ZvZ instead of PvZ finals. Hmmm
the important thing is you found a thing to complain about in every instance.
Reminds me that I don't agree 100% about your GOAT articles
Go write a 12000 page essays on why you think his article is shit.
On September 26 2015 04:33 Noonius wrote: ZVZ FINAL
The struggle was real, now I am crying:
First I was whining around, that protoss bullshit makes the game too versatile and I don't want it to win Now we have a ZvZ instead of PvZ finals. Hmmm
the important thing is you found a thing to complain about in every instance.
Reminds me that I don't agree 100% about your GOAT articles
Go write a 12000 page essays on why you think his article is shit.
Some people don't recognize jokes
My fault on that one my joke lacked the context for people to get it or for it to be funny.
On September 26 2015 04:05 Rollora wrote: [quote] you mean protoss is the race of hidden things. There is a difference between leaving someone in the dark as long as possible (for terran: hiding you go mech or bio or so, for terran hide buildings), but the only race that works so often JUST because it has hidden something or you can win only because you hid something (not because of skill) is protoss. Not saying sOs has no skill, on the contrary the huge variety of builds he knows impresses me, and reading his opponent, comebacks, mindgames...
and yeah, lol i should watch chess.... or ANY other sport, because I cannot remember andy sport that works that way: hide something to surprise the oponent and if he isn't prepared then you win. The only thing that reminds me of is faking an injury/foul in soccer to win by penalties if you are the worse team and cannot score goals by yourself
And stop that bullshit statement of scouting better. you can hide things so they can NOT be scouted
Every sport and game has hidden information SC2 is just more blatant about it. Protoss having the most varied cheeses is a fact no one right in the head is arguing that so there is no need to repeat it over and over :D
Sorry, it just annoys me, that you can win a game solely by surprising an enemy It really kills the fun for me. It completely takes it away for me, and many others. Its bad design I think Starcraft is a great game if you have a fun, macro games against zerg or terran, even toss if you have one that doesn't cheese. But it immidiately gets frustrating, more then a normal loss, when you lose JUST because of BS. I hope you understand my frustration
You're probably only going to lose to a surprise if you take risks. Though at a top-level I admit it's necessary to take risks sometimes. I do think you're blowing things out of proportion, people seem to think PvP is hast he most luck and bullshit yet someone like Zest has an insane PvP winrate vs other Koreans despite PvP's reputation.
Oh lol someone is arguing that protoss isn't a bag of bullshit haha If you play safe in to cheese it makes it harder to defend earlier timings If you play safe vs early timings you expose yourself to later timings Playing safe vs later timings involve skipping safety measures to early timings/cheese to get more econ before they hit. Balancing those is what zvp is about. There is no one safe build.
thats the struggle. The constand "ladder - mindgame"
btw why the hell didn't he recall out before everything died?
Well when you watch sOs he's not playing 'ladder mindgames'.
What is your point anyway? I truly want to know what you are arguing for.
Against the notion that sOs is some guy who just flips coins. Or that flipping coins is an issue in SC2 at all... It's mainly just a way for people to rationlize their ladder losses and minimize their own blame.
Rollora admits and respects sOs skill so nothing to argue about there. Don't you agree that protoss has more ways to get easy wins at high levels than zerg or terran tho?
Yea but not by a problematic margin. There are a shit ton of subtleties involved in SC2 and that includes all-ins, whenever you lose there are usually a ton of things you could have done better. Deception in itself is a skill, but deception aside, the best all-inners tend to be the players that are known for it -- they're able to win despite their reputation.
Protoss is also maybe the race where it's easiest to lose someone worse than you. A lot of top progamers have lost matches just because they missed a double Medivac drop, or a mine killed too many probes, or because their Zealot wasn't on hold positions. Is losing in those ways bullshit too?
In the end, if you lose the person you should be blaming is yourself usually.
On September 26 2015 04:33 Noonius wrote: ZVZ FINAL
The struggle was real, now I am crying:
First I was whining around, that protoss bullshit makes the game too versatile and I don't want it to win Now we have a ZvZ instead of PvZ finals. Hmmm
Zerg not getting the manliest race this year thanks to you. As punishment you will play protoss on NA ladder for 1 week.
On September 26 2015 04:33 Noonius wrote: ZVZ FINAL
The struggle was real, now I am crying:
First I was whining around, that protoss bullshit makes the game too versatile and I don't want it to win Now we have a ZvZ instead of PvZ finals. Hmmm
the important thing is you found a thing to complain about in every instance.
that is what i was pointing too with that post. Something is wrong with me Protoss BS really f...ed me up
On September 26 2015 04:08 HellHound wrote: [quote]Every sport and game has hidden information SC2 is just more blatant about it. Protoss having the most varied cheeses is a fact no one right in the head is arguing that so there is no need to repeat it over and over :D
Sorry, it just annoys me, that you can win a game solely by surprising an enemy It really kills the fun for me. It completely takes it away for me, and many others. Its bad design I think Starcraft is a great game if you have a fun, macro games against zerg or terran, even toss if you have one that doesn't cheese. But it immidiately gets frustrating, more then a normal loss, when you lose JUST because of BS. I hope you understand my frustration
You're probably only going to lose to a surprise if you take risks. Though at a top-level I admit it's necessary to take risks sometimes. I do think you're blowing things out of proportion, people seem to think PvP is hast he most luck and bullshit yet someone like Zest has an insane PvP winrate vs other Koreans despite PvP's reputation.
Oh lol someone is arguing that protoss isn't a bag of bullshit haha If you play safe in to cheese it makes it harder to defend earlier timings If you play safe vs early timings you expose yourself to later timings Playing safe vs later timings involve skipping safety measures to early timings/cheese to get more econ before they hit. Balancing those is what zvp is about. There is no one safe build.
thats the struggle. The constand "ladder - mindgame"
btw why the hell didn't he recall out before everything died?
Well when you watch sOs he's not playing 'ladder mindgames'.
What is your point anyway? I truly want to know what you are arguing for.
Against the notion that sOs is some guy who just flips coins. Or that flipping coins is an issue in SC2 at all... It's mainly just a way for people to rationlize their ladder losses and minimize their own blame.
Rollora admits and respects sOs skill so nothing to argue about there. Don't you agree that protoss has more ways to get easy wins at high levels than zerg or terran tho?
Yea but not by a problematic margin. There are a shit ton of subtleties involved in SC2 and that includes all-ins, whenever you lose there are usually a ton of things you could have done better. Deception in itself is a skill, but deception aside, the best all-inners tend to be the players that are known for it -- they're able to win despite their reputation.
Protoss is also maybe the race where it's easiest to lose someone worse than you. A lot of top progamers have lost matches just because they missed a double Medivac drop, or a mine killed too many probes, or because their Zealot wasn't on hold positions. Is losing in those ways bullshit too?
In the end, if you lose the person you should be blaming is yourself usually.
Agree with everything except protoss being the easiest to lose to. In my expirience (have played every race a fair bit T the least) you can derp in game ending ways with every race in every MU.
EPT
