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RHoudini
Belgium3627 Posts
On March 25 2015 04:14 royalroadweed wrote: I doubt its match fixing. Just MarineKing going full MarineKing. I would be inclined to agree with this, but for the suspicious betting pattern. So sad. | ||
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RPR_Tempest
Australia7799 Posts
On March 25 2015 04:30 OtherWorld wrote: From the beginning of the game, he looks kinda different than usual, I'd say stressed out, even the casters point it out. -he legit didn't saw it. Is it possible? Yes, for sure. Maru didn't saw Dark's nydus on his minimap at IEM Katowice, and that is recent, so I think that we can find many games with a player not seeing things on the minimap. I seriously don't see what people are talking about when they say MarineKing looks stressed. He looks completely normal... And yeah, Maru not seeing Dark's nydus that was in plain view (at least I think it was Dark vs Maru. It was on Overgrowth, right?) for it's entire duration and still going up is another mistake very similar to the one MarineKing makes here. I've legit seen Platinums pick up on nyduses in their base instantly that are at the edge of their vision. Silly mistakes do happen. | ||
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Clonester
Germany2808 Posts
This spine was there for a real time minute and another 15 secs of not reacting to creep crawling in his base. | ||
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Wuster
1974 Posts
Innovation missed a Nydus literally in the middle of his base against Symbol. IntotheRainbow also missed an inbase Nydus against Fruitdealer in the first GSL finals. But in both cases they were busy multitasking, which MKP wasn't. What was Maru during while the needs went up? The thing that bugs me about this game is MKP's scouting pattern. He knew to look for a proxy hatch. He scouts both golds, but not the actual proxy location which was used by Symbol in a previous game. And this despite having two reapers in his base that he freely moves into the natural and back (but not behind the rocks). | ||
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ionONE
Germany605 Posts
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On March 25 2015 04:36 RPR_Tempest wrote: I seriously don't see what people are talking about when they say MarineKing looks stressed. He looks completely normal... And yeah, Maru not seeing Dark's nydus that was in plain view (at least I think it was Dark vs Maru. It was on Overgrowth, right?) for it's entire duration and still going up is another mistake very similar to the one MarineKing makes here. I've legit seen Platinums pick up on nyduses in their base instantly that are at the edge of their vision. Silly mistakes do happen. Look at the player presentation part before the game starts ; he looks somewhere between tired and stressed ; he actively does things with his left hand on the keyboard ; and his body is shaking, probably because he is shaking his leg out of excitation/stress. Look at the same scene from last week's MK vs Rogue. He looks way less tired/stressed, he looks calm, doesn't do anything with his left hand, does not shake. Look at the same scene from MK vs Reality the week before. He looks just like he did vs Rogue : calm, no left hand action, no shaking. Look at the same scene from MK vs Leenock the first week of R2. He looks less calm than the two following weeks, possibly because it's the first match of R2, he even looks nervous and pensive, but doesn't look stressed, excited ; no left hand action ; no shaking. Is that indicative of any kind of matchfixing? Obviously not. However it does indicate that his mental state was different from the previous week (tbh he looks pretty ill to me, this blend of looking tired and void yet excited), which may account for his terrible game today. | ||
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On March 25 2015 04:44 Wuster wrote: The Nydus argument is maybe a good analogy. Missed Nydus's seem to happen a lot more than they should. Innovation missed a Nydus literally in the middle of his base against Symbol. IntotheRainbow also missed an inbase Nydus against Fruitdealer in the first GSL finals. But in both cases they were busy multitasking, which MKP wasn't. What was Maru during while the needs went up? The thing that bugs me about this game is MKP's scouting pattern. He knew to look for a proxy hatch. He scouts both golds, but not the actual proxy location which was used by Symbol in a previous game. And this despite having two reapers in his base that he freely moves into the natural and back (but not behind the rocks). Actually I think that the fact that MK wasn't busy plays in his favor. He is waiting for an all-in to come, so there is no real need to look at the minimap very often. I agree about the scouting pattern though, but well some players aren't very good and that's all. | ||
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ZAiNs
United Kingdom6525 Posts
On March 25 2015 04:46 ionONE wrote: why didnt he use his 2 reapers to scout? Probably expecting some kind of attack. Personally I would give benefit of doubt if not for Pinnacle voiding the bets :/. | ||
Zealously
East Gorteau22261 Posts
On March 25 2015 03:05 The_Red_Viper wrote: So does teamliquid plan on making an article about all these fishy actions we had the past few months? As long as people don't talk about this i doubt anything will change. I somewhat think TL should cover this and make people aware (that doesn't mean you have to accuse and draw big conclusions, an objective article would be great though) Nothing will ever change if all the big names are just silent about it The detail such an article would demand for me to even consider is far greater than what any of our writers (maybe bar 1) would bother with. So no. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9439 Posts
He is waiting for an all-in to come, so there is no real need to look at the minimap very often. But he did though... Check his eye movement between 4:53 and 4:54... He is glancing at the bottom left side of the screen, and any decent player is simply (out of habit) frequently looking at the minimap. | ||
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On March 25 2015 04:55 Hider wrote: But he did though... Check his eye movement between 4:34 and 4:35... He is glancing at the bottom left side of the screen, and any decent player is simply (out of habit) frequently looking at the minimap. That's true, and it seems difficult to argue against that. But then again look at Maru vs Dark at IEM Katowice, I can't believe that Maru didn't look at the minimap during 20 whole in game seconds. And MarineKing is a nervous wreck, if he was scared of an all-in he is capable of looking at the minimap by reflex but the connection between "red dot" and "ennemy building" just wasn't made. | ||
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Wuster
1974 Posts
In the two cases I brought up: Innovation - Symbol, Symbol was posturing between two pathsl with roaches which forced Inno to move his army back and forth in response Rainbow - Fruitdealer, Rainbow was executing a tank cliff drop against Fruitdealer's gold base so was doing a lot of micro there | ||
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Hider
Denmark9439 Posts
On March 25 2015 05:01 OtherWorld wrote: That's true, and it seems difficult to argue against that. But then again look at Maru vs Dark at IEM Katowice, I can't believe that Maru didn't look at the minimap during 20 whole in game seconds. And MarineKing is a nervous wreck, if he was scared of an all-in he is capable of looking at the minimap by reflex but the connection between "red dot" and "ennemy building" just wasn't made. Can you link me to the Maru vs Dark game with clock? | ||
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Solar424
United States4001 Posts
On March 25 2015 04:53 ZAiNs wrote: Probably expecting some kind of attack. Personally I would give benefit of doubt if not for Pinnacle voiding the bets :/. If he was expecting an attack than why 3CC? | ||
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ionONE
Germany605 Posts
On March 25 2015 04:53 ZAiNs wrote: Probably expecting some kind of attack. Personally I would give benefit of doubt if not for Pinnacle voiding the bets :/. Wouldn't you scout if you are expecting an attack (fast gold exe ... scv was on the map, ling baneling, roaches etc)? He had 2 idle reapers ... | ||
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On March 25 2015 05:07 Hider wrote: Can you link me to the Maru vs Dark game with clock? Here : Timestamp is at 8:30 into the game ; nydus starts building at 8:47/48 according to the minimap indicator ; Nydus finishes at 9:07 ; Maru reacts at ~9:10. edit : considering MK's attitude during the game vs ByuL I wonder if he wasn't ill. That would explain that he could look at the minimap without reacting. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On March 25 2015 04:55 Zealously wrote: The detail such an article would demand for me to even consider is far greater than what any of our writers (maybe bar 1) would bother with. So no. Hm i understand what you are getting at, but that's kinda disappointing nonetheless. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On March 25 2015 05:12 OtherWorld wrote: Here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=01zzFgej2T8#t=1310 Timestamp is at 8:30 into the game ; nydus starts building at 8:47/48 according to the minimap indicator ; Nydus finishes at 9:07 ; Maru reacts at ~9:10. edit : considering MK's attitude during the game vs ByuL I wonder if he wasn't ill. That would explain that he could look at the minimap without reacting. No it wouldn't explain anything. How ill do you have to be to make such mistakes as a progamer? Sry but all your arguments you made in defense of MKP² make no sense at all imo | ||
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Zealously
East Gorteau22261 Posts
On March 25 2015 05:15 The_Red_Viper wrote: Hm i understand what you are getting at, but that's kinda disappointing nonetheless. I would much much sooner remain quiet than potentially incriminating someone innocent and starting a career-ending, large scale witch hunt. Reddit can take care of that. | ||
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royalroadweed
United States8301 Posts
On March 25 2015 05:08 Solar424 wrote: If he was expecting an attack than why 3CC? Because he's MarineKing. | ||
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