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your Country52797 Posts
On August 08 2013 02:10 Waise wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2013 02:09 The_Templar wrote:On August 08 2013 02:08 Kleinmuuhg wrote:On August 08 2013 02:02 Panozen wrote:On August 08 2013 02:00 Lysanias wrote:On August 08 2013 01:59 Exarl25 wrote:On August 08 2013 01:57 Gojira621 wrote: naniwa made voids every single game and tefel whines balance despite the fact that he didnt make a single infestor or corruptors. what a joke You don't make Corruptors in that situation. This isn't WoL, Void Rays hard counter Corruptors. You need an overwhelming number to beat out VRs and against 3 SGs you aren't likely to get that. Wich is amusing and horribly wrong balanced, An anti air unit losing to a allround unit. Do Corruptors actually beat anything air straight up? (not counting Msc/Oracle etc) Your army of corrupters can beat a smaller army of corrupters from your enemy! I think you just figured out the metagame. if i saw a corruptor in zvz i would probably get so confused that i would have to quit and go splash cold water on my face I make corrupters all the time in ZvZ...
...so I can make brood lords!
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On August 08 2013 02:08 Greendotz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2013 02:04 Hryul wrote:On August 08 2013 02:02 Panozen wrote:On August 08 2013 02:00 Lysanias wrote:On August 08 2013 01:59 Exarl25 wrote:On August 08 2013 01:57 Gojira621 wrote: naniwa made voids every single game and tefel whines balance despite the fact that he didnt make a single infestor or corruptors. what a joke You don't make Corruptors in that situation. This isn't WoL, Void Rays hard counter Corruptors. You need an overwhelming number to beat out VRs and against 3 SGs you aren't likely to get that. Wich is amusing and horribly wrong balanced, An anti air unit losing to a allround unit. Do Corruptors actually beat anything air straight up? (not counting Msc/Oracle etc) i haven't tried it, but i would guess phoenixes and carriers? Even without charge Voids can still go toe-to-toe with corrupters, and with charge they can take them on 3 to 1. When 3-3-3 air was all the rage in Hots beta corrupters was obviously the first response zerg tried, even some pure corrupter army got crushed. Corrupters are good for taking out colossi, and countering mass phoenix nothing more. (They do smash carriers into the ground but a toss would only go carriers vs Z if the game was already won, or they're White-Ra).
Corruptors are good to kill Void Ray. But only one by one, thanks to viper in the air and locust on the ground. But that make some shitty games. :'(
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On August 08 2013 02:09 Tachion wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2013 02:06 scypio wrote:On August 08 2013 02:01 AgentW wrote:On August 08 2013 02:00 scypio wrote: Naniwa looked pretty good there, he adapted to Tefel's playstyle pretty well (apart from the throw in G1). What? It was much more Tefel NOT adapting to NaNiwa's play. Not a single infestor was built. Tefel has a story of sticking to his builds forever. He is unlikely to surprise anyone with building hydras, he just executes it well enough to get into wcs eu ro16. Naniwa on the other hand is known for coming up with new builds and he played differently vs Tefel today. Naniwa doesn't adapt to peoples builds either though. See Leenock vs Naniwa MLG. He has a long history, and has admitted himself to simply executing his set build order and not necessarily responding to his opponent.
I think this is different, he knew he would play vs Tefel and prepared a build that apparently looks really solid vs Tefel's roach-hydra-viper style.
In MLG you can't prepare for everyone really.
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Russian Federation36 Posts
wtf, revers russian flag on players preview @ wcs stream !
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On August 08 2013 02:10 GaliX wrote: nobody renembers the MC game in the end of WoL with the epic carrier storm void build?
On Daybreak? I remember it. We never got to see the metagame develop for airtoss in PvZ at the end of WoL.
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On August 08 2013 02:11 Left hand wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2013 02:00 NovaMB wrote:On August 08 2013 01:58 arterian wrote: Naniwa with the F Bomb Only a north american would care about that to be honest Only Europeans would make such a big deal about how big of a deal F bombs are in America.  Seriously, more than ten of you guys have already commented on how much Europe doesn't care about cursing. Think it's enough? people say it because it's true... we don't have a secret club where we plan to all post it at the same time
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Why Happy had serbian flag? xD
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On August 08 2013 02:01 Apoteosis wrote: Wait, Naniwa being polite ?
WTH has happened to him ?
Naniwa isn't rude per-say. He gets very emotional and lashes out after he loses. If you look at interviews after he’s lost, as long as he’s had a little cooling off time he’s very level headed. He’s fine when he wins and when he loses he just needs about 30 minutes to calm down and disconnect.
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On August 08 2013 02:11 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2013 02:10 Waise wrote:On August 08 2013 02:09 The_Templar wrote:On August 08 2013 02:08 Kleinmuuhg wrote:On August 08 2013 02:02 Panozen wrote:On August 08 2013 02:00 Lysanias wrote:On August 08 2013 01:59 Exarl25 wrote:On August 08 2013 01:57 Gojira621 wrote: naniwa made voids every single game and tefel whines balance despite the fact that he didnt make a single infestor or corruptors. what a joke You don't make Corruptors in that situation. This isn't WoL, Void Rays hard counter Corruptors. You need an overwhelming number to beat out VRs and against 3 SGs you aren't likely to get that. Wich is amusing and horribly wrong balanced, An anti air unit losing to a allround unit. Do Corruptors actually beat anything air straight up? (not counting Msc/Oracle etc) Your army of corrupters can beat a smaller army of corrupters from your enemy! I think you just figured out the metagame. if i saw a corruptor in zvz i would probably get so confused that i would have to quit and go splash cold water on my face It happens super lategame
Look the last game of DRG vs Nestea in Iron Squid 2.
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On August 08 2013 02:10 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2013 02:06 Nebuchad wrote:On August 08 2013 02:05 Big J wrote:On August 08 2013 02:02 Zenbrez wrote:On August 08 2013 01:59 Big J wrote:On August 08 2013 01:56 DJHelium wrote: The best thing about the void rays is that you don't have to target fire, they will kill the hydras first anyway. As soon as you see them targeting a roach, just activate them.
I don't think Tefel is reacting to this build in a good way, infestors would at least twice as good. I think people overestimate infestors for that. Fungal has been nerfed by 10damage vs armored and infestors are really expensive in the midgame. He would get at most 10infestors instead of the 30hydras he was working with. Imo, the way to go against this style is either blindcounter the third with an allin or sit on 4bases forever with hydra/viper/swarmhost/statics. Edit: fungal is still good vs void rays, but it's not affordable to deal with them in the midgame. You underestimate it. You don't need 10 infestors. You only use them for fungal, ITs are useless. Voidrays stack a loooot - sure he could split them, but lets be honest, nobody really does. Even having just 2 infestors, pinning them and dealing 50-60 dmg (since people generally overlap the fungals) to ALL of them is hugely significant. A pure hydra army won't do the job I don't think you should base your strategy on your opponent playing shit. Naniwa scouted a lot. Had he seen infestors, he would have surely presplit his army. That's a bit unrealistic. That's like saying, "don't ever go for templars in PvT, the terran is good, he will split his bio." Just look at the numbers... Tefel had ~30hydralisks. Now if he goes infestors as well he immidiatly misses 5 of them (infestation pit + energy upgrade) for the tech and 3 for each infestor he builds due to the gas being the limiting factor. The remaining army will be mostly zerglings with 10 hydras and 5 infestors. That's simply not enough. You don't have to be split perfectly, just having an arc in which not more than 5 voidrays get fungaled at once (there are only 5fungals) will be enough to hold.
Sure, but that assumes he stays on 3 bases and attacks with that army instead of having a good economy and attacking in open areas.
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On August 08 2013 02:10 Yello wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2013 02:07 BlueFlames wrote:On August 08 2013 02:06 Waise wrote:On August 08 2013 02:04 Gojira621 wrote:On August 08 2013 02:01 Undead1993 wrote: actually just a simple question, is someone really enjoying this after game analysis stuff by apollo? i mean it's not apollo's fault but i feel like this is unnecessary its cool but it makes the broadcasts unnecessarily long. I know they have no control over how long each game is, but it seems like there is so much time between games sometimes in WCS and I simply can't just sit here and watch an entire 4 or 5 hour broadcast where it feels like 2 hours of that is the guys at the desk, videos, analysis, etc. well they don't have commercials to run like typical sports events and you can't just run game after game after game... i think most people want some downtime to go to the bathroom, make lunch, occupy their brains with things other than starcraft for a little bit... Espeacially after HasuObs games. But maybe they could find something else for the segment. There is always some downtime between games and matches. I really like it when they show the facial expressions of the end of the game or of important points in the game in the downtime. The analysis desk isn't too bad either. It's not perfect but I rather see that than skyscrapers
I agree, showing skyscrapers is just boring and lazy. The same goes for crowdshots, unless the camera actually moves and show different crowdshots.
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Very excited to see MMA in action. I think these games will be fun
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Apollo, his vetoes also may be about reapers.
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ahhhh shit MMA, beginning of the bounce back!
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On August 08 2013 02:11 IntoTheheart wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2013 02:10 GaliX wrote: nobody renembers the MC game in the end of WoL with the epic carrier storm void build? Link please.
I don't know when it was.
I think it was the last GSL season where MC was the only Protoss left (ro16?) and showed a epic skytoss late game macro gam against Symbol or someone like that.
I will search it. But I am not sure if I will find something.
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Vetos around mech-play but leaves newkirk?
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MMA who beat Mvp on daily basis is having problems against Happy's mech?
How the mighty have fallen.
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On August 08 2013 02:11 opisska wrote: If the king in the north falls, this should be called The Red Group. Naniwa is not Rob Stark, Hes Roose Bolton, Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North.
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On August 08 2013 02:11 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2013 02:10 Waise wrote:On August 08 2013 02:09 The_Templar wrote:On August 08 2013 02:08 Kleinmuuhg wrote:On August 08 2013 02:02 Panozen wrote:On August 08 2013 02:00 Lysanias wrote:On August 08 2013 01:59 Exarl25 wrote:On August 08 2013 01:57 Gojira621 wrote: naniwa made voids every single game and tefel whines balance despite the fact that he didnt make a single infestor or corruptors. what a joke You don't make Corruptors in that situation. This isn't WoL, Void Rays hard counter Corruptors. You need an overwhelming number to beat out VRs and against 3 SGs you aren't likely to get that. Wich is amusing and horribly wrong balanced, An anti air unit losing to a allround unit. Do Corruptors actually beat anything air straight up? (not counting Msc/Oracle etc) Your army of corrupters can beat a smaller army of corrupters from your enemy! I think you just figured out the metagame. if i saw a corruptor in zvz i would probably get so confused that i would have to quit and go splash cold water on my face It happens super lategame i honestly can't remember the last time i played or saw a zvz go to hive tech
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