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MOD NOTE: The bracket on Liquipedia is not final and should be assumed to be speculative. If you are a competitor, trust what MLG Admins tell you over the bracket. |
On April 22 2013 04:26 farvacola wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:22 Sissors wrote:On April 22 2013 04:18 farvacola wrote:On April 22 2013 04:15 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:10 Zarahtra wrote:On April 22 2013 04:07 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:06 Zarahtra wrote:On April 22 2013 04:04 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:03 Sissors wrote:
If drunkenboy would have bothered to wall his third he would have had so much more resources.
@Bronze, quite frankly hellbat drops would have been a waste of resources, too many stalkers placed to intercept drops. You're probably right, but you have to play the strategies that got you there. You don't try and reinvent yourself. Well I mean this is the problem with being one-dimensional player. Incontrol seemed to be just hard countering Drunken's playstyle and banking on better lategame. Yep. It is also the problem with a cheesy playstyle. Your opponent can do one or two little things and suddenly you're forced to play standard and that is where you get exposed. Still, it is really fun to watch and it is interesting because it isn't the same old macro game every time. Yup, while I'm a pretty passive player and hate all these oracle rushes, reaper allins, roach rushes etc etc, they make the game so much better than the crap state of NR15 by end of WoL. Well, I play the opposite way that you play, but WOL ended up stale because Blizzard and map makers went to far in hurting all-ins and refused to accept that it should require skill to hold all-ins. HOTS will end up in an even worse state with things like Photon Overcharge and Widow Mines unforunately. This makes no sense to me....making all-ins easier to deal with prolongs games, expands windows for displays of non-game-ending skill, and removes a lot of opportunities for lesser skilled players to knock out better players with dice rolls. Then just start with 3 saturated bases and +2/+2 finished. Because that is effectively what the NR15 style is. That might be longer games, but there isn't more to do that in an average all-in way too often: one fight which decides all, only we just had to be bored for 15 minutes first. And tbh a vast majority of 'lesser skilled players' who beat better players is because the 'better players' just played way too greedy. Making all-ins more difficult to pull off and making them impossible are not the same thing. And Bronzeknee, you can say that photon overcharge takes no skill, but that is simply untrue. Making sure your core is ready and full of energy, targeting down medivacs with the overcharge, and scouting the attack all need to be done. That OP photon overcharge isn't so useful when your core is in your main while your front door expansion is getting dropped. If you are really defending Terran 1 base all ins, you are crying to the wrong Zerg.
So you build an early MSC, and then press one button to activate Photon Overcharge (I'm talking about all the early bio pressure pre-Medivac in WOL). Wow tons of skill compared to FF, Stalker, Zealot micro and splitting units...
No decent Protoss player was having huge difficulty with any Terran all-in that Photon Overcharge really helps with (2 base all-ins have so many units that the Nexus Cannon doesn't really help with).
The point of Photon Overcharge was to allow Protoss players to expand in PvP. And it doesn't do that job, 1 basing is still king.
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On April 22 2013 04:29 grs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:28 felisconcolori wrote:
Am I the only one wondering if Jaedong ended his 2-0 in Loser's Round 7 by typing into chat, "You know nothing Jon Snow." ?
Also, I miss TB. But I guess he has other obligations. He is casting ATC.
Yeh and the matches have been far superior to this so far.
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is it only me or is this tourney extremly slow.. there seems no progress in the tournament tree...
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On April 22 2013 04:29 govie wrote:
WTF":
PhysicsLee DQ
HwangSinW 2
DQ for what?
Being a know hacker and being kicked off his team for hacking.
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On April 22 2013 04:24 CoR wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:21 CEPEHDREI wrote:
hey demuslim we know we shouldve already directly invited you but please play our qualifier where we'll give you the hardest bracket there is.
from MLG with love. bs, not even CLOSE the hardest bracket, look the last one with alive, sage, jyp vs only zergs vs demuslim (revivel is good, jaedong is well ok and zenio isnt as good as demu so isnt best bracket)
who says that im talking about the lowerbracket? but you are right at least this one is only the 2nd hardest.
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On April 22 2013 04:30 govie wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:30 Godwrath wrote:On April 22 2013 04:29 govie wrote:
WTF":
PhysicsLee DQ
HwangSinW 2
DQ for what? For being a cheater. Well that would be my first thought on it but could be anything. Took m 2 days to find that out?
If I've learned anything this weekend it's that if there's any people that don't know how to do their jobs correctly it's MLG admins.
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LOL this manner building doesn't actually do anything...
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United States97276 Posts
next level ebay block - Lee
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wtf is with that engi bay? :/ To scout if he has 6 on workers?
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On April 22 2013 04:30 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:26 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:24 Plansix wrote:On April 22 2013 04:23 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:18 farvacola wrote:On April 22 2013 04:15 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:10 Zarahtra wrote:On April 22 2013 04:07 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:06 Zarahtra wrote:On April 22 2013 04:04 BronzeKnee wrote:
[quote]
You're probably right, but you have to play the strategies that got you there. You don't try and reinvent yourself.
Well I mean this is the problem with being one-dimensional player. Incontrol seemed to be just hard countering Drunken's playstyle and banking on better lategame. Yep. It is also the problem with a cheesy playstyle. Your opponent can do one or two little things and suddenly you're forced to play standard and that is where you get exposed. Still, it is really fun to watch and it is interesting because it isn't the same old macro game every time. Yup, while I'm a pretty passive player and hate all these oracle rushes, reaper allins, roach rushes etc etc, they make the game so much better than the crap state of NR15 by end of WoL. Well, I play the opposite way that you play, but WOL ended up stale because Blizzard and map makers went to far in hurting all-ins and refused to accept that it should require skill to hold all-ins. HOTS will end up in an even worse state with things like Photon Overcharge and Widow Mines unforunately. This makes no sense to me....making all-ins easier to deal with prolongs games, expands windows for displays of non-game-ending skill, and removes a lot of opportunities for lesser skilled players to knock out better players with dice rolls. Photon Overcharge doesn't take any skill, which is why it is bad. And it goes too far, denying almost all Terran 1 base all-ins. You mean all those amazing builds that involve building a ton of marines and some other crap and charging cross map? I think we are better off without those, personally. Also, build bunker and slap units into bunker is not the paragon of skill either. Well, I got to Masters in WOL being able to hold all types of Terran all-ins. It is difficult and it takes skill. And it is enjoyable to hold a Terran all-in as Protoss. Photon Overcharge makes the game boring for me. I hated WOL PvT, 15 minutes of build up for 30 seconds of action decided by HT and Ghost micro. The guy above is right, if you don't want viable 1 base plays, then just start the game with everyone on two bases and a basic infrastructure. There are still one base timings that are out there and I am sure people will find them. Like everything else, it will take time. The overcharge means that people can't just walk across the map with a mob of marines and hope that the protoss doesn't have enough to hold them off, which I am ok with.
As I said, no good player was having issues with the mob of Marines. It took skill. Now it doesn't.
And no, Photon Overcharge counters all early 1 base Terran play that isn't worker harass. It is way too strong.
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Does it scout the MSC popping out though?
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Alright here comes Drunkenboi!
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On April 22 2013 04:32 BronzeKnee wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:30 Plansix wrote:On April 22 2013 04:26 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:24 Plansix wrote:On April 22 2013 04:23 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:18 farvacola wrote:On April 22 2013 04:15 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:10 Zarahtra wrote:On April 22 2013 04:07 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:06 Zarahtra wrote:
[quote]
Well I mean this is the problem with being one-dimensional player. Incontrol seemed to be just hard countering Drunken's playstyle and banking on better lategame. Yep. It is also the problem with a cheesy playstyle. Your opponent can do one or two little things and suddenly you're forced to play standard and that is where you get exposed. Still, it is really fun to watch and it is interesting because it isn't the same old macro game every time. Yup, while I'm a pretty passive player and hate all these oracle rushes, reaper allins, roach rushes etc etc, they make the game so much better than the crap state of NR15 by end of WoL. Well, I play the opposite way that you play, but WOL ended up stale because Blizzard and map makers went to far in hurting all-ins and refused to accept that it should require skill to hold all-ins. HOTS will end up in an even worse state with things like Photon Overcharge and Widow Mines unforunately. This makes no sense to me....making all-ins easier to deal with prolongs games, expands windows for displays of non-game-ending skill, and removes a lot of opportunities for lesser skilled players to knock out better players with dice rolls. Photon Overcharge doesn't take any skill, which is why it is bad. And it goes too far, denying almost all Terran 1 base all-ins. You mean all those amazing builds that involve building a ton of marines and some other crap and charging cross map? I think we are better off without those, personally. Also, build bunker and slap units into bunker is not the paragon of skill either. Well, I got to Masters in WOL being able to hold all types of Terran all-ins. It is difficult and it takes skill. And it is enjoyable to hold a Terran all-in as Protoss. Photon Overcharge makes the game boring for me. I hated WOL PvT, 15 minutes of build up for 30 seconds of action decided by HT and Ghost micro. The guy above is right, if you don't want viable 1 base plays, then just start the game with everyone on two bases and a basic infrastructure. There are still one base timings that are out there and I am sure people will find them. Like everything else, it will take time. The overcharge means that people can't just walk across the map with a mob of marines and hope that the protoss doesn't have enough to hold them off, which I am ok with. As I said, no good player was having issues with the mob of Marines. It took skill. Now it doesn't. And no, Photon Overcharge counters all early 1 base Terran play that isn't worker harass. It is way too strong.
Well the game I am watching on stream is showing its not really a problem. Unless you are better than incontrol, which I am not sure.
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Ouch... those sentries... <.<
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On April 22 2013 04:35 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 04:32 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:30 Plansix wrote:On April 22 2013 04:26 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:24 Plansix wrote:On April 22 2013 04:23 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:18 farvacola wrote:On April 22 2013 04:15 BronzeKnee wrote:On April 22 2013 04:10 Zarahtra wrote:On April 22 2013 04:07 BronzeKnee wrote:
[quote]
Yep. It is also the problem with a cheesy playstyle. Your opponent can do one or two little things and suddenly you're forced to play standard and that is where you get exposed.
Still, it is really fun to watch and it is interesting because it isn't the same old macro game every time. Yup, while I'm a pretty passive player and hate all these oracle rushes, reaper allins, roach rushes etc etc, they make the game so much better than the crap state of NR15 by end of WoL. Well, I play the opposite way that you play, but WOL ended up stale because Blizzard and map makers went to far in hurting all-ins and refused to accept that it should require skill to hold all-ins. HOTS will end up in an even worse state with things like Photon Overcharge and Widow Mines unforunately. This makes no sense to me....making all-ins easier to deal with prolongs games, expands windows for displays of non-game-ending skill, and removes a lot of opportunities for lesser skilled players to knock out better players with dice rolls. Photon Overcharge doesn't take any skill, which is why it is bad. And it goes too far, denying almost all Terran 1 base all-ins. You mean all those amazing builds that involve building a ton of marines and some other crap and charging cross map? I think we are better off without those, personally. Also, build bunker and slap units into bunker is not the paragon of skill either. Well, I got to Masters in WOL being able to hold all types of Terran all-ins. It is difficult and it takes skill. And it is enjoyable to hold a Terran all-in as Protoss. Photon Overcharge makes the game boring for me. I hated WOL PvT, 15 minutes of build up for 30 seconds of action decided by HT and Ghost micro. The guy above is right, if you don't want viable 1 base plays, then just start the game with everyone on two bases and a basic infrastructure. There are still one base timings that are out there and I am sure people will find them. Like everything else, it will take time. The overcharge means that people can't just walk across the map with a mob of marines and hope that the protoss doesn't have enough to hold them off, which I am ok with. As I said, no good player was having issues with the mob of Marines. It took skill. Now it doesn't. And no, Photon Overcharge counters all early 1 base Terran play that isn't worker harass. It is way too strong. Well the game I am watching on stream is showing its not really a problem. Unless you are better than incontrol, which I am not sure.
Really? You can't read?
On April 22 2013 04:32 BronzeKnee wrote:
And no, Photon Overcharge counters all early 1 base Terran play that isn't worker harass. It is way too strong.
That playstyle is worker harass.
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DAMNIT! I wanted to believe  .
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Incontrol
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Babyknight is a real asset to there casting tho.. it really makes the casting bit better
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EPT
