• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 16:16
CET 22:16
KST 06:16
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview11Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info3herO wins SC2 All-Star Invitational14SC2 All-Star Invitational: Tournament Preview5RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8
Community News
Weekly Cups (Jan 19-25): Bunny, Trigger, MaxPax win3Weekly Cups (Jan 12-18): herO, MaxPax, Solar win0BSL Season 2025 - Full Overview and Conclusion8Weekly Cups (Jan 5-11): Clem wins big offline, Trigger upsets4$21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7)38
StarCraft 2
General
HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview StarCraft 2 Not at the Esports World Cup 2026 Weekly Cups (Jan 19-25): Bunny, Trigger, MaxPax win Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued herO wins SC2 All-Star Invitational
Tourneys
HomeStory Cup 28 KSL Week 85 $21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7) OSC Season 13 World Championship $70 Prize Pool Ladder Legends Academy Weekly Open!
Strategy
Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[A] Starcraft Sound Mod
External Content
Mutation # 510 Safety Violation Mutation # 509 Doomsday Report Mutation # 508 Violent Night Mutation # 507 Well Trained
Brood War
General
[ASL21] Potential Map Candidates BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Bleak Future After Failed ProGaming Career BW General Discussion Potential ASL qualifier breakthroughs?
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 Azhi's Colosseum - Season 2 [BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 10
Strategy
Zealot bombing is no longer popular? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Current Meta Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Path of Exile Mobile Legends: Bang Bang Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Gold Bars & Gold Nuggets for sale+27 73 799 4524
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club! The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Let's Get Creative–Video Gam…
TrAiDoS
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1658 users

[Code S] Semi-Finals 2012 GSL Season 4 - Page 5

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 215 216 217 Next
Standard LR rules apply: No balance whining, no KeSPA vs. GomTV inciting, no excessive derailing ESPECIALLY when games are on. This is not a thread for you to argue with other people.
Waxangel
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
United States33534 Posts
October 08 2012 09:00 GMT
#81
eh, I like Life a lot this tournament, tho I'm forbidden from actually picking Mvp to lose
AdministratorHey HP can you redo everything youve ever done because i have a small complaint?
opterown *
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Australia54784 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-08 09:03:28
October 08 2012 09:01 GMT
#82
On October 08 2012 16:51 HaXXspetten wrote:
Wait is this on wednesday or thursday?
OP and TL calender says the former, liquipedia the latter.

I reeeeaaally hope it's on thursday or I'll litterally miss all of it...

that's because OP and TL calendar is actually all done by me, lol. hopefully i'm right! ;p

also thinking/working on finals hype, lemme know if any of you guys have any epic ideas for and/or if you want to help out ;p
ModeratorRetired LR Bonjwa
TL+ Member
Sambobly
Profile Joined September 2010
Australia241 Posts
October 08 2012 09:05 GMT
#83
These semi-finals = best birthday present I could've hoped for!
Dodgin
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada39254 Posts
October 08 2012 09:06 GMT
#84
On October 08 2012 18:00 Waxangel wrote:
eh, I like Life a lot this tournament, tho I'm forbidden from actually picking Mvp to lose


I don't think Life can beat Taeja, not after seeing him vs keen in GSTL.
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
October 08 2012 09:19 GMT
#85
On October 08 2012 18:01 opterown wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2012 16:51 HaXXspetten wrote:
Wait is this on wednesday or thursday?
OP and TL calender says the former, liquipedia the latter.

I reeeeaaally hope it's on thursday or I'll litterally miss all of it...

that's because OP and TL calendar is actually all done by me, lol. hopefully i'm right! ;p

also thinking/working on finals hype, lemme know if any of you guys have any epic ideas for and/or if you want to help out ;p


Will let you know if I come up with something!
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
FakeDeath
Profile Joined January 2011
Malaysia6060 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-08 09:25:50
October 08 2012 09:20 GMT
#86
On October 08 2012 17:59 RPR_Tempest wrote:
Remember when people claimed PartinG was going to smash Mvp? PartinG had done much the same as Rain this season, crushing everyone in his path. Mvp is just a washed up shadow of his former self, with a wrist injury to boot, right?

Wrong. Even if Rain had crushed Mvp 20-0 in other tournaments, that doesn't mean a DAMN THING to Mvp right now. The GSL is Mvp's playground. Rain is trying to get a legitimate claim to best in the world, but he can't do that unless he beats Mvp on his home turf. You can talk about Rain's amazing run all you want, but the truth is EVERY SINGLE TIME people count Mvp out, he wins. GSL is Mvp's home turf, where he thrives in this EXACT kind of environment. Throw out your statistics all you want, but they don't mean a damn thing to Mvp.

If Mvp wins, Rain is another derailed hype train, just like so many before him. But if Rain wins, he will win this season of GSL and be on the road to immortality.


No.

What separates Sun and Parting is attitude and skill level.

Season 1: Winning so many of his PvTs and deemed a PvT specialist before he played his first official PvZ Code S match against DRG and got smashed 0-3.

Season 2: Parting literally show only PvT( he won 2 PvP against Oz who then claimed vP is all about skills lol) until he got beaten by MVP .Parting thought MVP is free ticket to the finals.Read up his interview. Got cocky and lose. Got tilted after being 1/1/1 by MVP.

Unlike Sun who is a total beast in all of the match-up(PvP,PvZ,PvT), Parting was only a PvT specialist and a good PvPer.
Sun is humble and doesn't show much in interview but in his games.

Sun is gonna beat MVP 3-1 or 3-0.

But I never count MVP out since he is a 4X GSL champion and has the uncanny ability to fucking win games with his injuries.

Play your best
Kontys
Profile Joined October 2011
Finland659 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-08 09:28:04
October 08 2012 09:24 GMT
#87
I am going to agree to 3-0 for Rain over MVP. The production team running behind Rain will come up with as many match-up revolutionising strategies as is required to win every set in any single elimination round. Those people, whoever they are, put the S in RTS.

To Rain's other credit is that he is the cleanest player in the business. There are no unforced errors in his gameplay, and I guess I can attribute this straight away to the rigorous training regimens of the KESPA teams... and we thought we knew what korean training meant.

The big hurdle with the coming of KESPA to SC2 has been the (somewhat expected) revelation, that noone in the ESF establishment has a brain. MVP is actually the only plausible exception to that, but he isn't a convincing exception by comparison, nowhere near ingenious enough.

In closing, I conclude that the entire non-kespa starcraft establishment are slackers, no-brainers and inexperienced in their approach to RTS gaming. Rain 3-0. He is coming in with training and preparation on a whole another level than what the established SC2 scene is yet even able to comprehend.

Please refrain from arguing with me until the results are in.

User was temp banned for this post.
opterown *
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Australia54784 Posts
October 08 2012 09:27 GMT
#88
On October 08 2012 18:24 Kontys wrote:
I am going to agree to 3-0 for Rain over MVP. The production team running behind Rain will come up with as many match-up revolutionising strategies as is required to win every set in any single elimination round. Those people, whoever they are, put the S in RTS.

To Rain's other credit is that he is the cleanest player in the business. There are no unforced errors in his gameplay, and I guess I can attribute this straight away to the rigorous training regimens of the KESPA teams... and we thought we knew what korean training meant.

The big hurdle with the coming of KESPA to SC2 has been the (somewhat expected) revelation, that noone in the ESF establishment has a brain. MVP is actually the only plausible exception to that, but he isn't a convincing exception by comparison, nowhere near ingenious enough.

In closing, I conclude that the entire non-kespa starcraft establishment are slackers, no-brainers and inexperienced in their approach to RTS gaming. Rain 3-0.

Please refrain from arguing with me until the results are in.

way to shit on everything ESF has done.
ModeratorRetired LR Bonjwa
TL+ Member
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
October 08 2012 09:28 GMT
#89
On October 08 2012 18:24 Kontys wrote:
I am going to agree to 3-0 for Rain over MVP. The production team running behind Rain will come up with as many match-up revolutionising strategies as is required to win every set in any single elimination round. Those people, whoever they are, put the S in RTS.

To Rain's other credit is that he is the cleanest player in the business. There are no unforced errors in his gameplay, and I guess I can attribute this straight away to the rigorous training regimens of the KESPA teams... and we thought we knew what korean training meant.

The big hurdle with the coming of KESPA to SC2 has been the (somewhat expected) revelation, that noone in the ESF establishment has a brain. MVP is actually the only plausible exception to that, but he isn't a convincing exception by comparison, nowhere near ingenious enough.

In closing, I conclude that the entire non-kespa starcraft establishment are slackers, no-brainers and inexperienced in their approach to RTS gaming. Rain 3-0.

Please refrain from arguing with me until the results are in.


Interesting opinion. Not a sign of proof anywhere though so that's all it's gonna remain.
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
Kontys
Profile Joined October 2011
Finland659 Posts
October 08 2012 09:31 GMT
#90
On October 08 2012 18:27 opterown wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2012 18:24 Kontys wrote:
I am going to agree to 3-0 for Rain over MVP. The production team running behind Rain will come up with as many match-up revolutionising strategies as is required to win every set in any single elimination round. Those people, whoever they are, put the S in RTS.

To Rain's other credit is that he is the cleanest player in the business. There are no unforced errors in his gameplay, and I guess I can attribute this straight away to the rigorous training regimens of the KESPA teams... and we thought we knew what korean training meant.

The big hurdle with the coming of KESPA to SC2 has been the (somewhat expected) revelation, that noone in the ESF establishment has a brain. MVP is actually the only plausible exception to that, but he isn't a convincing exception by comparison, nowhere near ingenious enough.

In closing, I conclude that the entire non-kespa starcraft establishment are slackers, no-brainers and inexperienced in their approach to RTS gaming. Rain 3-0.

Please refrain from arguing with me until the results are in.

way to shit on everything ESF has done.


Note that I am arguing for why Rain is invincible, not for why ESF is shit. I respect what the ESF have been able to bring about, but it all ends right here.
Kontys
Profile Joined October 2011
Finland659 Posts
October 08 2012 09:32 GMT
#91
On October 08 2012 18:28 DarkLordOlli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2012 18:24 Kontys wrote:
I am going to agree to 3-0 for Rain over MVP. The production team running behind Rain will come up with as many match-up revolutionising strategies as is required to win every set in any single elimination round. Those people, whoever they are, put the S in RTS.

To Rain's other credit is that he is the cleanest player in the business. There are no unforced errors in his gameplay, and I guess I can attribute this straight away to the rigorous training regimens of the KESPA teams... and we thought we knew what korean training meant.

The big hurdle with the coming of KESPA to SC2 has been the (somewhat expected) revelation, that noone in the ESF establishment has a brain. MVP is actually the only plausible exception to that, but he isn't a convincing exception by comparison, nowhere near ingenious enough.

In closing, I conclude that the entire non-kespa starcraft establishment are slackers, no-brainers and inexperienced in their approach to RTS gaming. Rain 3-0.

Please refrain from arguing with me until the results are in.


Interesting opinion. Not a sign of proof anywhere though so that's all it's gonna remain.


Yes, well, there is a way I might be proven wrong. Little do I doubt my own correctness of course.
Dodgin
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada39254 Posts
October 08 2012 09:34 GMT
#92
On October 08 2012 18:24 Kontys wrote:
I am going to agree to 3-0 for Rain over MVP. The production team running behind Rain will come up with as many match-up revolutionising strategies as is required to win every set in any single elimination round. Those people, whoever they are, put the S in RTS.

To Rain's other credit is that he is the cleanest player in the business. There are no unforced errors in his gameplay, and I guess I can attribute this straight away to the rigorous training regimens of the KESPA teams... and we thought we knew what korean training meant.

The big hurdle with the coming of KESPA to SC2 has been the (somewhat expected) revelation, that noone in the ESF establishment has a brain. MVP is actually the only plausible exception to that, but he isn't a convincing exception by comparison, nowhere near ingenious enough.

In closing, I conclude that the entire non-kespa starcraft establishment are slackers, no-brainers and inexperienced in their approach to RTS gaming. Rain 3-0. He is coming in with training and preparation on a whole another level than what the established SC2 scene is yet even able to comprehend.

Please refrain from arguing with me until the results are in.


this is almost as good as waxangel's post about stephano and the GSL in the grudgematch thread
InoyouS2
Profile Joined December 2011
1005 Posts
October 08 2012 09:38 GMT
#93
Not sure why people think Rain vs TaeJa finals would be any better than their Ro16 matches, Rain crushed TaeJa handily.

IMMvp|fOrGG|IMNesTea|oGsMC|Liquid`Hero|DongRaeGu|Slayers_MMA|Liquid`TLO|MarineKingPrime|IMSeed
rotinegg
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States1719 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-08 09:40:07
October 08 2012 09:39 GMT
#94
On October 08 2012 18:24 Kontys wrote:
I am going to agree to 3-0 for Rain over MVP. The production team running behind Rain will come up with as many match-up revolutionising strategies as is required to win every set in any single elimination round. Those people, whoever they are, put the S in RTS.

To Rain's other credit is that he is the cleanest player in the business. There are no unforced errors in his gameplay, and I guess I can attribute this straight away to the rigorous training regimens of the KESPA teams... and we thought we knew what korean training meant.

The big hurdle with the coming of KESPA to SC2 has been the (somewhat expected) revelation, that noone in the ESF establishment has a brain. MVP is actually the only plausible exception to that, but he isn't a convincing exception by comparison, nowhere near ingenious enough.

In closing, I conclude that the entire non-kespa starcraft establishment are slackers, no-brainers and inexperienced in their approach to RTS gaming. Rain 3-0. He is coming in with training and preparation on a whole another level than what the established SC2 scene is yet even able to comprehend.

Please refrain from arguing with me until the results are in.

mvp was an A-class kespa progamer before he switched, he definitely knows what a rigorous training regimen is.
Translator
InoyouS2
Profile Joined December 2011
1005 Posts
October 08 2012 09:42 GMT
#95
On October 08 2012 18:24 Kontys wrote:
I am going to agree to 3-0 for Rain over MVP. The production team running behind Rain will come up with as many match-up revolutionising strategies as is required to win every set in any single elimination round. Those people, whoever they are, put the S in RTS.

To Rain's other credit is that he is the cleanest player in the business. There are no unforced errors in his gameplay, and I guess I can attribute this straight away to the rigorous training regimens of the KESPA teams... and we thought we knew what korean training meant.

The big hurdle with the coming of KESPA to SC2 has been the (somewhat expected) revelation, that noone in the ESF establishment has a brain. MVP is actually the only plausible exception to that, but he isn't a convincing exception by comparison, nowhere near ingenious enough.

In closing, I conclude that the entire non-kespa starcraft establishment are slackers, no-brainers and inexperienced in their approach to RTS gaming. Rain 3-0. He is coming in with training and preparation on a whole another level than what the established SC2 scene is yet even able to comprehend.

Please refrain from arguing with me until the results are in.


Even Rain has noted that he feels a lot of his wins are due to a stylistic divide rather than a skill gap, once people figure out his style he won't be doing so hot.
IMMvp|fOrGG|IMNesTea|oGsMC|Liquid`Hero|DongRaeGu|Slayers_MMA|Liquid`TLO|MarineKingPrime|IMSeed
FakeDeath
Profile Joined January 2011
Malaysia6060 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-08 09:43:22
October 08 2012 09:42 GMT
#96
On October 08 2012 18:39 rotinegg wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2012 18:24 Kontys wrote:
I am going to agree to 3-0 for Rain over MVP. The production team running behind Rain will come up with as many match-up revolutionising strategies as is required to win every set in any single elimination round. Those people, whoever they are, put the S in RTS.

To Rain's other credit is that he is the cleanest player in the business. There are no unforced errors in his gameplay, and I guess I can attribute this straight away to the rigorous training regimens of the KESPA teams... and we thought we knew what korean training meant.

The big hurdle with the coming of KESPA to SC2 has been the (somewhat expected) revelation, that noone in the ESF establishment has a brain. MVP is actually the only plausible exception to that, but he isn't a convincing exception by comparison, nowhere near ingenious enough.

In closing, I conclude that the entire non-kespa starcraft establishment are slackers, no-brainers and inexperienced in their approach to RTS gaming. Rain 3-0. He is coming in with training and preparation on a whole another level than what the established SC2 scene is yet even able to comprehend.

Please refrain from arguing with me until the results are in.

mvp was an A-class kespa progamer before he switched, he definitely knows what a rigorous training regimen is.


Sadly,MVP can't practice as much as anymore due to wrist and neck injuries.

Sun on the other hand is fine and healthy and can easily do his 12-hour rigorous Kespa training regimen everyday.
Play your best
Dodgin
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada39254 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-08 09:47:56
October 08 2012 09:47 GMT
#97
It feels like some posters think all Kespa players are going to be like Rain, crush everyone and be top 4 of both leagues at once.

They're not, Kespa players have a great training environment and years of experience but they are not naturally more gifted at RTS, they do well because of their hard work. Rain just happens to be a genius at sc2 and in one of the absolute best practice environments at SKT.

" In closing, I conclude that the entire non-kespa starcraft establishment are slackers, no-brainers and inexperienced in their approach to RTS gaming. " just lol, that's all I can say.
Wildmoon
Profile Joined December 2011
Thailand4189 Posts
October 08 2012 10:02 GMT
#98
Mvp will crush Rain.
Aquila-
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
516 Posts
October 08 2012 10:08 GMT
#99
People, when will you finally understand it? Mvp doesn't lose. Ever.

Mvp 3-2 Rain
Taeja 3-1 Life
SxP
Profile Joined May 2011
Netherlands51 Posts
October 08 2012 10:12 GMT
#100
On October 08 2012 18:01 opterown wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2012 16:51 HaXXspetten wrote:
Wait is this on wednesday or thursday?
OP and TL calender says the former, liquipedia the latter.

I reeeeaaally hope it's on thursday or I'll litterally miss all of it...

that's because OP and TL calendar is actually all done by me, lol. hopefully i'm right! ;p


gomtv.net says Wednesday, so liquipedia is wrong.
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 215 216 217 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
AI Arena Tournament
20:00
Swiss - Round 3 - Day 2
Laughngamez YouTube
HomeStory Cup
12:00
Day 2
TaKeTV4996
ComeBackTV 1302
IndyStarCraft 524
TaKeSeN 373
SteadfastSC320
3DClanTV 101
CosmosSc2 96
Rex92
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
IndyStarCraft 524
SteadfastSC 320
PiGStarcraft195
JuggernautJason103
CosmosSc2 96
Rex 92
ProTech11
StarCraft: Brood War
Larva 175
Shuttle 163
Dewaltoss 87
ZZZero.O 44
NaDa 12
Dota 2
Dendi1020
420jenkins506
febbydoto6
League of Legends
JimRising 82
Counter-Strike
fl0m3806
kRYSTAL_60
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor325
Other Games
FrodaN4493
Grubby3270
summit1g2790
Mlord553
crisheroes332
ToD276
Liquid`Hasu235
KnowMe58
Livibee45
Organizations
Other Games
EGCTV1569
gamesdonequick1140
BasetradeTV40
StarCraft 2
angryscii 16
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 23 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 37
• printf 28
• iHatsuTV 27
• poizon28 2
• Kozan
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• IndyKCrew
• intothetv
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 40
• FirePhoenix20
• 80smullet 10
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota2852
• WagamamaTV494
League of Legends
• Jankos3425
• imaqtpie2309
• Doublelift1069
Counter-Strike
• Shiphtur181
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
2h 44m
HomeStory Cup
15h 44m
OSC
15h 44m
Replay Cast
1d 2h
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S1: W6
OSC Championship Season 13
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Acropolis #4 - TS4
Proleague 2026-01-31
Rongyi Cup S3
HSC XXVIII
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: W7
Escore Tournament S1: W8
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.