When: Thursday, Mar 01 1:00am GMT (GMT+00:00) (we will also have a European re-broadcast as usual at Thursday, Mar 01 5:30pm GMT (GMT+00:00))
Format
This double-elimination tournament features 16 teams from around the world and is an All-Kill team format. This match is being played for Losers Round 3. The first team to defeat everyone on the opposing team's roster (5 wins, or a best of 9), will move on in the Losers Bracket, while the loser will be eliminated from the tournament entirely. Keep in mind that this has a $20,000 prize pool, and only six teams will make it to the money!
Team Liquid Jinro HayprO Ret Sheth TLO Zenio HerO NonY
Team SCV Life Polt Ultimate RevivaL Symbol HyuN (MyWay) RagnaroK Shine Cyrano Dream Inori
The First Game for this match of IPL Team Arena Challenge 2 is on Thursday, Mar 01 1:00am GMT (GMT+00:00) (we will also have a European re-broadcast as usual at Thursday, Mar 01 5:30pm GMT (GMT+00:00))
Zenio < Darkness Falls > Dream Zenio < Terminus > Shine Ret < Antiga Shipyard > Shine Ret < Atlantis Spaceship > Revival Ret < Calm Before the Storm > Polt Sheth < Daybreak > Polt HerO < Tal'Darim Altar > Polt HerO < Sanshorn Mist AE > Symbol Congratulations to Team Liquid, winning 5-3! They move on to LR4, TSL is eliminated!
Liquid can take this. They have 2 koreans themselves and Ret+Sheth have been strong lately. TLO may be good for an upset again. Besides TLO all named zerg have decent ZvZ. TSL has no GSL players as of now. (I know Polt is good)
We may see a lot of ZvZ, because Polt should be TSLs Ace and Liquid should hold Hero back as Ace and to snipe Polt.
On March 01 2012 02:07 00Visor wrote: Liquid can take this. They have 2 koreans themselves and Ret+Sheth have been strong lately. TLO may be good for an upset again. Besides TLO all named zerg have decent ZvZ. TSL has no GSL players as of now. (I know Polt is good)
We may see a lot of ZvZ, because Polt should be TSLs Ace and Liquid should hold Hero back as Ace and to snipe Polt.
On March 01 2012 02:07 00Visor wrote: Liquid can take this. They have 2 koreans themselves and Ret+Sheth have been strong lately. TLO may be good for an upset again. Besides TLO all named zerg have decent ZvZ. TSL has no GSL players as of now. (I know Polt is good)
We may see a lot of ZvZ, because Polt should be TSLs Ace and Liquid should hold Hero back as Ace and to snipe Polt.
...Why would Hero snipe Polt?
Polt is 8-1 against Hero in the past month.
Oh well. I didnt remember all games and figured he would still have the best shot. Will be a hard task to take down Polt in his current form then.
On March 01 2012 02:07 00Visor wrote: Liquid can take this. They have 2 koreans themselves and Ret+Sheth have been strong lately. TLO may be good for an upset again. Besides TLO all named zerg have decent ZvZ. TSL has no GSL players as of now. (I know Polt is good)
We may see a lot of ZvZ, because Polt should be TSLs Ace and Liquid should hold Hero back as Ace and to snipe Polt.
...Why would Hero snipe Polt?
Polt is 8-1 against Hero in the past month.
Sending Protoss vs Polt is suicide =/
Anything else is a good bet though, sadly.
And as mentioned this was played some time ago, definitely before Assembly when he was still in the dumps so don't expect this to be the resurgent Polt.
I think the qeustion is just, whether TL can take out Polt without major loses. And sadly I don´t think so. Polt is 8-1 against Hero and after seeing his play at assembly, I highly doubt, that anyone of TL´s Zergs can take him out in straight up games. If TL can somehow prepare a snipe for Polt, I think everything is possible.
On March 01 2012 02:19 Xoronius wrote: I think the qeustion is just, whether TL can take out Polt without major loses. And sadly I don´t think so. Polt is 8-1 against Hero and after seeing his play at assembly, I highly doubt, that anyone of TL´s Zergs can take him out in straight up games. If TL can somehow prepare a snipe for Polt, I think everything is possible.
The games are usually played a few weeks to a month before they are aired, so it is likely this was before Polt's successes in IPL4 Qualifiers and Assembly. Might even be during his sick week during his GSL games. Polt's TvT is sub 50% and his TvZ is only about 55% so don't count TL out just yet :p
Could be close. Probably depends on how many kills Polt gets when he comes in. He's been looking crazy solid lately, so I can definitely see him all-killing. Inori has great PvP and can sniper Hero, and Symbol has looked great as well. That said, Liquid has been great in team leagues and can maybe pull a nice upset.
You take Polt out of the equation and I think Liquid has a slight edge. The question is who can take out Polt. Hero's been doing terribly vs him, Zenio's ZvT hasn't been incredibly impressive in the last months and while Sheth and TLO can upset, Polt would be heavily favoured vs them. I really think Liquid's best chance to take out Polt is Ret. He's looking in great shape again, and he has to be confident in his ZvT after 2-1ing MVP.
Here's the thing with TSL: They are very reliant on Polt in this matchup, whereas Liquid has a deeper roster. Maybe TLO could snipe him with just a crazy wonky build :p
how can these be played 1 month in advance when some previous games were played only 1-2 days before they were aired? they would have to wait for the result of those games before these games can be played
On March 01 2012 02:52 ninjamyst wrote: how can these be played 1 month in advance when some previous games were played only 1-2 days before they were aired? they would have to wait for the result of those games before these games can be played
I actually want to see as many Polt games as possible -> 5. I don't want them to be rape, but Liquid doesn't really have any interesting player besides JinrO to me. Not against their personality or their skill, I just like to watch Terran games so I have to count on JinrO, Ultimate and Polt.
On March 01 2012 02:07 00Visor wrote: Liquid can take this. They have 2 koreans themselves and Ret+Sheth have been strong lately. TLO may be good for an upset again. Besides TLO all named zerg have decent ZvZ. TSL has no GSL players as of now. (I know Polt is good)
We may see a lot of ZvZ, because Polt should be TSLs Ace and Liquid should hold Hero back as Ace and to snipe Polt.
...Why would Hero snipe Polt?
Polt is 8-1 against Hero in the past month.
Sending Protoss vs Polt is suicide =/
Anything else is a good bet though, sadly.
And as mentioned this was played some time ago, definitely before Assembly when he was still in the dumps so don't expect this to be the resurgent Polt.
anything else is good though? did you see the way Polt manhandled stephano?
On March 01 2012 02:19 Xoronius wrote: I think the qeustion is just, whether TL can take out Polt without major loses. And sadly I don´t think so. Polt is 8-1 against Hero and after seeing his play at assembly, I highly doubt, that anyone of TL´s Zergs can take him out in straight up games. If TL can somehow prepare a snipe for Polt, I think everything is possible.
The games are usually played a few weeks to a month before they are aired, so it is likely this was before Polt's successes in IPL4 Qualifiers and Assembly. Might even be during his sick week during his GSL games. Polt's TvT is sub 50% and his TvZ is only about 55% so don't count TL out just yet :p
I'm pretty sure IGN plays the games pretty close to the air date if I remember right.
On March 01 2012 02:19 Xoronius wrote: I think the qeustion is just, whether TL can take out Polt without major loses. And sadly I don´t think so. Polt is 8-1 against Hero and after seeing his play at assembly, I highly doubt, that anyone of TL´s Zergs can take him out in straight up games. If TL can somehow prepare a snipe for Polt, I think everything is possible.
The games are usually played a few weeks to a month before they are aired, so it is likely this was before Polt's successes in IPL4 Qualifiers and Assembly. Might even be during his sick week during his GSL games. Polt's TvT is sub 50% and his TvZ is only about 55% so don't count TL out just yet :p
I'm pretty sure IGN plays the games pretty close to the air date if I remember right.
Sheth's match history says these games played 2.5-3 weeks ago.
1 day after Polt's gsl match.
seems like these games played before Inori joining TSL.
On March 01 2012 05:51 GoSuChicken wrote: Polt all kill or Liquid wins. calling it now
HyuN and RevivaL are very good as well
Hyun's not bad, but I'm not so sure about him. It was really impressive seeing him qualify for Code A so fast, but his play in general seems mediocre, at least compared to the other Koreans. It's definitely enough to take out one of Liquid's weaker players though
On March 01 2012 02:19 Xoronius wrote: I think the qeustion is just, whether TL can take out Polt without major loses. And sadly I don´t think so. Polt is 8-1 against Hero and after seeing his play at assembly, I highly doubt, that anyone of TL´s Zergs can take him out in straight up games. If TL can somehow prepare a snipe for Polt, I think everything is possible.
The games are usually played a few weeks to a month before they are aired, so it is likely this was before Polt's successes in IPL4 Qualifiers and Assembly. Might even be during his sick week during his GSL games. Polt's TvT is sub 50% and his TvZ is only about 55% so don't count TL out just yet :p
I'm pretty sure IGN plays the games pretty close to the air date if I remember right.
I really think that Liquid can take this, these games were played long enough ago that I don't believe that Polt will be out of his slump and Inori isn't there to help TSL. Of course HerO and Zenio may have been busy preparing for their code A matches.
I can see Polt taking out good chunk of Liquid players, don't see who can stop him, may be Sheth because his "style" fits imho. Predicting 5-2/5-3 for TSL. I hope Liquid wins though
Polt seems to be te key for this match, but we don't know when it was played, and Polt can always have an off night, so I think Liquid will take it 5-4.
On March 01 2012 02:19 Xoronius wrote: I think the qeustion is just, whether TL can take out Polt without major loses. And sadly I don´t think so. Polt is 8-1 against Hero and after seeing his play at assembly, I highly doubt, that anyone of TL´s Zergs can take him out in straight up games. If TL can somehow prepare a snipe for Polt, I think everything is possible.
The games are usually played a few weeks to a month before they are aired, so it is likely this was before Polt's successes in IPL4 Qualifiers and Assembly. Might even be during his sick week during his GSL games. Polt's TvT is sub 50% and his TvZ is only about 55% so don't count TL out just yet :p
I'm pretty sure IGN plays the games pretty close to the air date if I remember right.
Sheth's match history says these games played 2.5-3 weeks ago.
1 day after Polt's gsl match.
seems like these games played before Inori joining TSL.
In that case this may well be Liquid's since Polt was sick in the week leading up to that.
On March 01 2012 05:51 GoSuChicken wrote: Polt all kill or Liquid wins. calling it now
HyuN and RevivaL are very good as well
Hyun's not bad, but I'm not so sure about him. It was really impressive seeing him qualify for Code A so fast, but his play in general seems mediocre, at least compared to the other Koreans. It's definitely enough to take out one of Liquid's weaker players though
Hyun is probably only better than Ragnarok among TSL Zergs. Honestly I think he is bad for a pro. His game sense and understanding are less than mediocre. Of course he has only been playing a short time so I hope he keeps improving.
On March 01 2012 05:51 GoSuChicken wrote: Polt all kill or Liquid wins. calling it now
HyuN and RevivaL are very good as well
Hyun's not bad, but I'm not so sure about him. It was really impressive seeing him qualify for Code A so fast, but his play in general seems mediocre, at least compared to the other Koreans. It's definitely enough to take out one of Liquid's weaker players though
Hyun is probably only better than Ragnarok among TSL Zergs. Honestly I think he is bad for a pro. His game sense and understanding are less than mediocre. Of course he has only been playing a short time so I hope he keeps improving.
His mechanics on the other hand are more than scary. Its experience that he's missing.. but yeah, his macro is sick.
On March 01 2012 02:19 Xoronius wrote: I think the qeustion is just, whether TL can take out Polt without major loses. And sadly I don´t think so. Polt is 8-1 against Hero and after seeing his play at assembly, I highly doubt, that anyone of TL´s Zergs can take him out in straight up games. If TL can somehow prepare a snipe for Polt, I think everything is possible.
The games are usually played a few weeks to a month before they are aired, so it is likely this was before Polt's successes in IPL4 Qualifiers and Assembly. Might even be during his sick week during his GSL games. Polt's TvT is sub 50% and his TvZ is only about 55% so don't count TL out just yet :p
I'm pretty sure IGN plays the games pretty close to the air date if I remember right.
We try to play them as close as possible to air date. When live events like ASUS and MLG pop up it forces us to have them play it sooner because it knocks teams out for a week to a week and a half due to them spending time ramping up practice, spending time travelling, and taking time to recover after the event.
On March 01 2012 05:51 GoSuChicken wrote: Polt all kill or Liquid wins. calling it now
HyuN and RevivaL are very good as well
Hyun's not bad, but I'm not so sure about him. It was really impressive seeing him qualify for Code A so fast, but his play in general seems mediocre, at least compared to the other Koreans. It's definitely enough to take out one of Liquid's weaker players though
Hyun is probably only better than Ragnarok among TSL Zergs. Honestly I think he is bad for a pro. His game sense and understanding are less than mediocre. Of course he has only been playing a short time so I hope he keeps improving.
are you kidding me?
RagnaroK eating PuMa and terrans for breakfast, also ragnarok almost qualified for code A.
As I see it, the wall to overcome for Liquid is Polt. If they can take out him wihout suffering too many losses, they should be able to win quite handily. Especially if HerO isn't taken out by Polt, considering all the Zergs in the TSL line-up.
That being said, it is a korean team, so some random TSL player might own most of TL's line-up like random dudes on SlayerS did (to other teams) last year
Did anyone notice how they did the same build, but shine did an extractor trick and had MORE minerals than zenio making an overlord at 9...? Are we 100% sure about the 9 overlord being better than 10 + extractor trick?
On March 01 2012 10:31 aurum510 wrote: Did anyone notice how they did the same build, but shine did an extractor trick and had MORE minerals than zenio making an overlord at 9...? Are we 100% sure about the 9 overlord being better than 10 + extractor trick?
Might be related to putting drones in duo on close minerals patches more than the overlord timing i think.
These guys should just stay away from puns imo. They suck at it, in a (for me) non hilarious way. Just because you are a caster you don't actually HAVE to make puns.
Hum.. not sure i'd follow Doa on this. Polt usualy don"t vary his opening a lot in TvZ / TvP. He Reactor hellion into fast medivac every game at Assembly for example.
On March 01 2012 11:25 Noocta wrote: Hum.. not sure i'd follow Doa on this. Polt usualy don"t vary his opening a lot in TvZ / TvP. He Reactor hellion into fast medivac every game at Assembly for example.
On March 01 2012 11:25 Noocta wrote: Hum.. not sure i'd follow Doa on this. Polt usualy don"t vary his opening a lot in TvZ / TvP. He Reactor hellion into fast medivac every game at Assembly for example.
Wow. Just too much over-droning. Polt's army supply was almost twice Ret's. >_<
Dunno if ultras were the right choice there, either.
Should also say, Polt's retention there was INCREDIBLE. Ret was spending his money and mining so much more than Polt was, but Polt just never let anything die (with the clear exception of all of his SCVs at his natural that one time. ;-)
RezChi Canada. March 01 2012 11:06. Posts 1720 PM Profile Blog Quote Edit # If Ret's going to win this game, TSL's most likely going to send out Polt IMO. Then hopefully Sheth or HerO finishes it off.
On March 01 2012 11:39 tsuxiit wrote: No idea how Polt recovered from losing so many SCVs that fast. Wish I had the replay.
Was microing really intensively during the push and dealing with the Bane/Ling bust aggression by Ret. If you noticed RIGHT after he defended, the camera panned over the natural and he dropped EIGHT MULES(ish).
RezChi Canada. March 01 2012 11:06. Posts 1720 PM Profile Blog Quote Edit # If Ret's going to win this game, TSL's most likely going to send out Polt IMO. Then hopefully Sheth or HerO finishes it off.
Not bad, but only the first condition of your prediction has come true so far. Now let's see if the second will too.
On March 01 2012 11:39 tsuxiit wrote: No idea how Polt recovered from losing so many SCVs that fast. Wish I had the replay.
Was microing really intensively during the push and dealing with the Bane/Ling bust aggression by Ret. If you noticed RIGHT after he defended, the camera panned over the natural and he dropped EIGHT MULES(ish).
That's how Polt rolls man. There's lings and banes all over his shit, production, scvs, etc. You think he's fucked and the battle ends and he's got 15 more supply.
On March 01 2012 11:39 tsuxiit wrote: No idea how Polt recovered from losing so many SCVs that fast. Wish I had the replay.
Polt was never in a bad situation in that game.
He was down 73 drones to 45 SCVs, 3 base to two. I think he did have more energy on his OCs than I thought he did, I never saw the mules that the other guy above me saw.
When Ret got overlord speed, for a moment I had hopes for zerg drop being his plan. He needed smth like that to break in - either nydus or drops. Meanwhile Polt with a couple of medivacs could just bring in some small groups of units and kill hatcheries. Ret didn't kill CCs here, and mules make up for a large loss of SCVs.
On March 01 2012 11:39 tsuxiit wrote: No idea how Polt recovered from losing so many SCVs that fast. Wish I had the replay.
Polt was never in a bad situation in that game.
He was down 73 drones to 45 SCVs, 3 base to two. I think he did have more energy on his OCs than I thought he did, I never saw the mules that the other guy above me saw.
Uh, the baneling bust happened at polt's third, so no, he was not on two base
You also have to remember that his timing attack killed a lot of drones, and even the base, so in reality he was never really that behind
On March 01 2012 11:39 tsuxiit wrote: No idea how Polt recovered from losing so many SCVs that fast. Wish I had the replay.
Polt was never in a bad situation in that game.
He was down 73 drones to 45 SCVs, 3 base to two. I think he did have more energy on his OCs than I thought he did, I never saw the mules that the other guy above me saw.
He put down 6-8 mules at his outside natural, which count for 24-32 SCVS, so they were pretty much even on workers without having to sacrifice army supply.
On March 01 2012 11:42 Type|NarutO wrote: I think Polt will play reactor hellion (6) into 16 marine 2 medivac pressure to either cancel the 3rd or drop the main with a fast 3rd cc. :p
On March 01 2012 11:42 Type|NarutO wrote: I think Polt will play reactor hellion (6) into 16 marine 2 medivac pressure to either cancel the 3rd or drop the main with a fast 3rd cc. :p
On March 01 2012 11:42 Type|NarutO wrote: I think Polt will play reactor hellion (6) into 16 marine 2 medivac pressure to either cancel the 3rd or drop the main with a fast 3rd cc. :p
i want to call you as ultimate polt fanboy
seems like you studied his replays after Assembly
I could have described the build in detail even haha. Yes, I've studied his TvZ quiet a bit, its just a very good build. The thing is most Zergs tend to go for either in-base macro hatch or mass ling with fast 1/1 into fast 2/2 into ultras which is actually quiet good if you are not spot on with timings and how Polt playes it.
I wouldn't say it counters what Polt does play, but it certainly can put the Zerg very ahead as you cannot really pressure mass ling 1/1 with that build if the Zerg keeps an eye on what you do. Also you will be behind in midgame in terms of upgrades so you have to sit back.
On March 01 2012 11:42 Type|NarutO wrote: I think Polt will play reactor hellion (6) into 16 marine 2 medivac pressure to either cancel the 3rd or drop the main with a fast 3rd cc. :p
i want to call you as ultimate polt fanboy
seems like you studied his replays after Assembly
I could have described the build in detail even haha. Yes, I've studied his TvZ quiet a bit, its just a very good build. The thing is most Zergs tend to go for either in-base macro hatch or mass ling with fast 1/1 into fast 2/2 into ultras which is actually quiet good if you are not spot on with timings and how Polt playes it.
I wouldn't say it counters what Polt does play, but it certainly can put the Zerg very ahead as you cannot really pressure mass ling 1/1 with that build if the Zerg keeps an eye on what you do. Also you will be behind in midgame in terms of upgrades so you have to sit back.
Anyways, yup^_^ Polt fan here.
Oh.. That's why i usually lose to very heavy ling play into a very fast 3-3 Ultra bust when playing Polt build ?
On March 01 2012 11:42 Type|NarutO wrote: I think Polt will play reactor hellion (6) into 16 marine 2 medivac pressure to either cancel the 3rd or drop the main with a fast 3rd cc. :p
i want to call you as ultimate polt fanboy
seems like you studied his replays after Assembly
I could have described the build in detail even haha. Yes, I've studied his TvZ quiet a bit, its just a very good build. The thing is most Zergs tend to go for either in-base macro hatch or mass ling with fast 1/1 into fast 2/2 into ultras which is actually quiet good if you are not spot on with timings and how Polt playes it.
I wouldn't say it counters what Polt does play, but it certainly can put the Zerg very ahead as you cannot really pressure mass ling 1/1 with that build if the Zerg keeps an eye on what you do. Also you will be behind in midgame in terms of upgrades so you have to sit back.
Anyways, yup^_^ Polt fan here.
Oh.. That's why i usually lose to very heavy ling play into a very fast 3-3 Ultra bust when playing Polt build ?
Well you could see it this game as well, the EU Zergs tend to go a lot of lings and if they are not too greedy to get banelings (at least a few) you won't do a lot with your push. So... since most of us are not as cost efficient as Polt with positioning and control in his midgame pokes and we are behind in upgrades we usually get overwhelmed.. at least if you don't do it right so yes, If you are behind in upgrades such as 1-0 vs 2-2... you die. Thats why Polt USUALLY playes a bit more defensive, he just went to be a bit more agressive here because mutas were so late and he had a very good engagement vs roach/ling/bane with marines and 4 medivacs.
Now he's so far ahead that he cannot lose if he just playes it out correct.
On March 01 2012 11:42 Type|NarutO wrote: I think Polt will play reactor hellion (6) into 16 marine 2 medivac pressure to either cancel the 3rd or drop the main with a fast 3rd cc. :p
i want to call you as ultimate polt fanboy
seems like you studied his replays after Assembly
I could have described the build in detail even haha. Yes, I've studied his TvZ quiet a bit, its just a very good build. The thing is most Zergs tend to go for either in-base macro hatch or mass ling with fast 1/1 into fast 2/2 into ultras which is actually quiet good if you are not spot on with timings and how Polt playes it.
I wouldn't say it counters what Polt does play, but it certainly can put the Zerg very ahead as you cannot really pressure mass ling 1/1 with that build if the Zerg keeps an eye on what you do. Also you will be behind in midgame in terms of upgrades so you have to sit back.
Anyways, yup^_^ Polt fan here.
Oh.. That's why i usually lose to very heavy ling play into a very fast 3-3 Ultra bust when playing Polt build ?
Well you could see it this game as well, the EU Zergs tend to go a lot of lings and if they are not too greedy to get banelings (at least a few) you won't do a lot with your push. So... since most of us are not as cost efficient as Polt with positioning and control in his midgame pokes and we are behind in upgrades we usually get overwhelmed.. at least if you don't do it right so yes, If you are behind in upgrades such as 1-0 vs 2-2... you die. Thats why Polt USUALLY playes a bit more defensive, he just went to be a bit more agressive here because mutas were so late and he had a very good engagement vs roach/ling/bane with marines and 4 medivacs.
Now he's so far ahead that he cannot lose if he just playes it out correct.
On March 01 2012 11:40 RezChi wrote: WHAT UP PEOPLE
RezChi Canada. March 01 2012 11:06. Posts 1720 PM Profile Blog Quote Edit # If Ret's going to win this game, TSL's most likely going to send out Polt IMO. Then hopefully Sheth or HerO finishes it off.
Not bad, but only the first condition of your prediction has come true so far. Now let's see if the second will too.
I would say Polt is going for 2 rax now... but I really dislike if he would do so :x. It seems so fragile if the Protoss somehow defends it more handily than you think he would (i.e goes 1 gate expand into 3 gate or even more terrible for you, 4 gate pressure) Protoss can easily follow it up with insanely greedy play OR BlinG style with 5 or even 6 gate pressure and there's not a lot you can do about.
You still have to see if Polt does follow it up Happy style with 2 rax expand into fast medivacs or if he decides to add a 3rd barracks for more units first. I guess he'll do 2 rax pressure expand into fast medivacs which is very good against a greedy and after 2 rax passive Protoss but is very weak against a safe after expand but agressive after 2 rax Protoss.
I'm actually really impressed with how good Liquid is as a team, but god damnit Polt looks unstoppable in these games.
edit:
On March 01 2012 12:02 Type|NarutO wrote: I would say Polt is going for 2 rax now... but I really dislike if he would do so :x. It seems so fragile if the Protoss somehow defends it more handily than you think he would (i.e goes 1 gate expand into 3 gate or even more terrible for you, 4 gate pressure) Protoss can easily follow it up with insanely greedy play OR BlinG style with 5 or even 6 gate pressure and there's not a lot you can do about.
You still have to see if Polt does follow it up Happy style with 2 rax expand into fast medivacs or if he decides to add a 3rd barracks for more units first. I guess he'll do 2 rax pressure expand into fast medivacs which is very good against a greedy and after 2 rax passive Protoss but is very weak against a safe after expand but agressive after 2 rax Protoss.
Looking forward to it, wish it would be bo3.
Having your commentary in this thread is awesome. Thank you so much ^_^
On March 01 2012 12:02 Type|NarutO wrote: I would say Polt is going for 2 rax now... but I really dislike if he would do so :x. It seems so fragile if the Protoss somehow defends it more handily than you think he would (i.e goes 1 gate expand into 3 gate or even more terrible for you, 4 gate pressure) Protoss can easily follow it up with insanely greedy play OR BlinG style with 5 or even 6 gate pressure and there's not a lot you can do about.
You still have to see if Polt does follow it up Happy style with 2 rax expand into fast medivacs or if he decides to add a 3rd barracks for more units first. I guess he'll do 2 rax pressure expand into fast medivacs which is very good against a greedy and after 2 rax passive Protoss but is very weak against a safe after expand but agressive after 2 rax Protoss.
Looking forward to it, wish it would be bo3.
The 2rax TvP resurgence will not stay long i think. Polt and MKP used the build again because a lot of protoss builds weren't safe against it anymore, but with most of them reconcidering the possibility of 2rax in their builds, it's a lot harder to do damage.
On March 01 2012 12:03 FeyFey wrote: Need special tactics against polt as zerg. Wonder if polt would drill my marines to be as epic as his.
Micro, especially bio control is a lot about understanding what to move in what fashion and when to move it. If you see Polt play you will realize he first of all never moves everything when he has marauder/marine and he does position his units very well. Against ultra/ling he'll have marines in front so ultralisks attack light units (less damage) and the marauders still deal a lot of damage to the ultras, while...
...he will stim marines back and leave marauders standing in front against ling baneling to soak up baneling damage and effectively split his marines to the back, also never stimming everything at once in a timing push, really sick control by him.
Hero's style is directly countered by polt's style. hero is really aggressive in early-midgame which polt excels at. in the lategame polt is kind of bad. really awful ghost control and just can't handle it.
Since already two people did mention my 'commentary' now.. thank you, makes me blush. Just trying to get a bit of insight if you want to say so into the LR threads // trying to get something back to the community. So many guys here delivering with live reports when I can't watch games for example.. so yeah... thank you.
On March 01 2012 12:01 tsuxiit wrote: I guess they had no real choice, but a certain part of me wishes they had more faith in a TLO or a NonY to take a game off Polt.
Hehe polt played recently against tlo, so he knows tlos style a bit now and i must say tlo made it pretty close against polt and almost took him out imo. Don't think it would have been wise to send him though. But yeah would have loved to see some NonY action.
On March 01 2012 12:02 Type|NarutO wrote: I would say Polt is going for 2 rax now... but I really dislike if he would do so :x. It seems so fragile if the Protoss somehow defends it more handily than you think he would (i.e goes 1 gate expand into 3 gate or even more terrible for you, 4 gate pressure) Protoss can easily follow it up with insanely greedy play OR BlinG style with 5 or even 6 gate pressure and there's not a lot you can do about.
You still have to see if Polt does follow it up Happy style with 2 rax expand into fast medivacs or if he decides to add a 3rd barracks for more units first. I guess he'll do 2 rax pressure expand into fast medivacs which is very good against a greedy and after 2 rax passive Protoss but is very weak against a safe after expand but agressive after 2 rax Protoss.
Looking forward to it, wish it would be bo3.
The 2rax TvP resurgence will not stay long i think. Polt and MKP used the build again because a lot of protoss builds weren't safe against it anymore, but with most of them reconcidering the possibility of 2rax in their builds, it's a lot harder to do damage.
only terran options are 2 rax or 1 rax fast expand into timing attack.
personally, i find 2 rax more fun. It also gives you scouting information, punishes greedy toss openings, and delays toss tech.
It's funny that the only time HerO manages to win high level games and 'beat his nerves' is when he gets a clear BO win by cheesing (aka Code S games) and now this.
On March 01 2012 12:02 Type|NarutO wrote: I would say Polt is going for 2 rax now... but I really dislike if he would do so :x. It seems so fragile if the Protoss somehow defends it more handily than you think he would (i.e goes 1 gate expand into 3 gate or even more terrible for you, 4 gate pressure) Protoss can easily follow it up with insanely greedy play OR BlinG style with 5 or even 6 gate pressure and there's not a lot you can do about.
You still have to see if Polt does follow it up Happy style with 2 rax expand into fast medivacs or if he decides to add a 3rd barracks for more units first. I guess he'll do 2 rax pressure expand into fast medivacs which is very good against a greedy and after 2 rax passive Protoss but is very weak against a safe after expand but agressive after 2 rax Protoss.
Looking forward to it, wish it would be bo3.
The 2rax TvP resurgence will not stay long i think. Polt and MKP used the build again because a lot of protoss builds weren't safe against it anymore, but with most of them reconcidering the possibility of 2rax in their builds, it's a lot harder to do damage.
only terran options are 2 rax or 1 rax fast expand into timing attack.
personally, i find 2 rax more fun. It also gives you scouting information, punishes greedy toss openings, and delays toss tech.
There's some 1 gate FE that hold 2rax quite well, and get you as terran quite behind afaik
On March 01 2012 12:14 BlondeOna wrote: It's funny that the only time HerO manages to win high level games and 'beat his nerves' is when he gets a clear BO win by cheesing (aka Code S games) and now this.
/flame shield
You are right, but you can't blame him for doing what he needs to do to win.
On March 01 2012 12:13 poorcloud wrote: damn how do you even hold that if go u 1 rax fe, 1 rax fe not such a safe build imo...
It's holdable, on that map since the nat is so exposed you plop down a supply depot near the minerals of the nat and you get vision of that pylon. IT's far easier on most other maps. 1 rax gasless is such a very very good build. And you should always scout again beyond the initial scout since you lose to 3 gate robo busts, without bunkers and the like.
On March 01 2012 12:14 BlondeOna wrote: It's funny that the only time HerO manages to win high level games and 'beat his nerves' is when he gets a clear BO win by cheesing (aka Code S games) and now this.
/flame shield
Sigh, no need to flame, just point out the same thing that's been pointed out millions of times by others . . .
Economic cheese is no different than other cheese. Polt is very greedy when opening.
See Naniwa vs. Leenok MLG finals for why economic cheese is good, how to beat it, and why not to complain when it fails to early game pressure.
On March 01 2012 12:11 casualman wrote: Knew he couldn't win, cheesed.
LOL
His build was 1 gate --> scout --> 3 gate pressure. It's not cheese. If polt scouts the pylon or blocks the stalkers from walking in, he can still transition into an expansion. He'll be behind, but it's nothing close to an all-in.
Talking to Delphi he told me that this map is a very good map for Zerg so.. lets see how this works out for SymboL. Personally to me it seems a very good map to spread out Protoss with a mobile style such as muta/ling, but with a good sim city at the third base I guess you can prevent ling runbys, so I'm not sure about that.
I really like to watch PvZ, but there are so much options and variations... really need someone to coach me in PvZ casting/knowledge, haha.
On March 01 2012 02:07 00Visor wrote: Liquid can take this. They have 2 koreans themselves and Ret+Sheth have been strong lately. TLO may be good for an upset again. Besides TLO all named zerg have decent ZvZ. TSL has no GSL players as of now. (I know Polt is good)
We may see a lot of ZvZ, because Polt should be TSLs Ace and Liquid should hold Hero back as Ace and to snipe Polt.
Reading the first page of this thread is funny, so many people saying HerO sniping Polt would be suicide. Too bad if Polt really was sick when they played this. Still, a good chance for Liquid to take the victory, let's see how good HerO does against Symbol since i really don't know how good any of the TL players left are right now...
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
Usually you measure who the better player is by achievements and not by head to head score. I eventually can go very even in head to head score with a some players that are way better and way more constant than I am... so, I'd say they are better than me.
very good job HerO and TeamLiquid!!! Some really good games was played in this clanwar! and that micro intense control by HerO was pretty impressive for sure!
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
Better head-to-head yes, but there are other matchups and other players to consider as well. One's talent/skill is not measured by only one matchup (player or race).
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
Polt had MMA's number, doesn't mean Polt > MMA as a player overall. Last I checked, Polt isn't even in the top 3 terran players.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
Usually you measure who the better player is by achievements and not by head to head score. I eventually can go very even in head to head score with a some players that are way better and way more constant than I am... so, I'd say they are better than me.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
Usually you measure who the better player is by achievements and not by head to head score. I eventually can go very even in head to head score with a some players that are way better and way more constant than I am... so, I'd say they are better than me.
Then i just want to say
GSL Super Tournament CHAMPION! ro4 ro8
I didn't argue who was better, I just said how you should measure it.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
I think at the level that Hero and Polt are at, it doesn't take much to swing one player ahead in H2H matches.
Polt tends to be very greedy in the early game. Hero may figure this out and beat him the next 10 games, like he beat him today. Who knows? Don't think that Polt is any better than Hero in regards to micro and decision making. Polt may be slightly better with macro, but that may also have alot to do with his relatively unsafe economic play etc. Either way, both players are incredible and fun to watch.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
On March 01 2012 12:34 GreyKnight wrote: also good job TL on not hyping it like crazy and spoiling it.
You know it only seems like hyping and spoiling it when the team you are playing against that typically tweets all day long completely ignored the match...
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
Usually you measure who the better player is by achievements and not by head to head score. I eventually can go very even in head to head score with a some players that are way better and way more constant than I am... so, I'd say they are better than me.
Then i just want to say
GSL Super Tournament CHAMPION! ro4 ro8
Fruitdealer, GSL CHAMPION! ro8.
Yeah, thanks for quoting irrelevant facts. Polt's not even in Code S, and other than the Assembly win, what puts him in such an untouchable position?
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
then how would you base on a player who is better?
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
No, it doesn't. Are you serious? It's one matchup. Both of them have to play 3 matchups. It's one opponent. Both of them have to play many different opponents. Why is it not possible for one player's game to "counter" another's? Think of any other competitive activity ever. There are some opponents that just for whatever reason have your number and always beat you, even though you're probably a better all-around player. I'm not saying that this is necessarily the case for HerO and Polt. I'm just pointing out the glaringly obvious flaw in your thoughtprocess.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
Usually you measure who the better player is by achievements and not by head to head score. I eventually can go very even in head to head score with a some players that are way better and way more constant than I am... so, I'd say they are better than me.
Then i just want to say
GSL Super Tournament CHAMPION! ro4 ro8
Fruitdealer, GSL CHAMPION! ro8.
Yeah, thanks for quoting irrelevant facts. Polt's not even in Code S, and other than the Assembly win, what puts him in such an untouchable position?
Because he is still top 5 terran in korea?
also fd's championship was 2 years ago, Polt played in code S more than 1 year.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
then how would you base on a player who is better?
I tend to base it on specific skills.
Macro Micro Decision-Making
They both seem pretty close in all catagories IMO.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
then how would you base on a player who is better?
Total record, lineup of opponents in tournaments, how they defeated their opponents, specifics of playstyle, etc.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
then how would you base on a player who is better?
Over-all results. That's why Polt is still the better player (winning IPL4 qualifiers, Assembly), but not because he beats HerO consistently. If HerO can get a good run in Code S next season and wins some other LAN, maybe they'll be even. But, like I said, head-to-head is meaningless compared to real results (ie tournament wins).
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
And I tried so hard not to call names. :-( lichter made my point above.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
I think at the level that Hero and Polt are at, it doesn't take much to swing one player ahead in H2H matches.
Polt tends to be very greedy in the early game. Hero may figure this out and beat him the next 10 games, like he beat him today. Who knows? Don't think that Polt is any better than Hero in regards to micro and decision making. Polt may be slightly better with macro, but that may also have alot to do with his relatively unsafe economic play etc. Either way, both players are incredible and fun to watch.
Tonight's game was played before Assembly and Polt destroyed HerO there.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
Keep insulting the community that you apprentlly enjoy interacting with (300+ posts) and see where that gets you.
Somehow I feel like I can already see your future! lol
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
then how would you base on a player who is better?
Over-all results. That's why Polt is still the better player (winning IPL4 qualifiers, Assembly), but not because he beats HerO consistently. If HerO can get a good run in Code S next season and wins some other LAN, maybe they'll be even. But, like I said, head-to-head is meaningless compared to real results (ie tournament wins).
so lets just say if i beat you in starcraft 2 every single day every time we met each other on ladder tournaments blah blah blah... but if you won a tournament and got LUCKY in tournament brackets and faced off mroe easiler opponents you would consider yourself the better player? i dont know but that just doesnt sound to right?
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
On March 01 2012 12:13 ninjamyst wrote: why can't HerO beat Polt when it really counts...like at Assembly!
-__-
good days, bad days? difference of circumstances?
hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Strange, why do the Korean pro gamers keep mentioning MMA in interviews when talking about the best Terran, but never mentions Polt? Well, I trust your judgement dragonborn.
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Strange, why do the Korean pro gamers keep mentioning MMA in interviews when talking about the best Terran, but never mentions Polt? Well, I trust your judgement dragonborn.
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Strange, why do the Korean pro gamers keep mentioning MMA in interviews when talking about the best Terran, but never mentions Polt? Well, I trust your judgement dragonborn.
because of MMA's condition was better than Polt's in last 3 month.
Now Polt is better than ever and he is always been most underrated player in Korea.
On March 01 2012 12:16 dragonborn wrote: [quote] hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
then how would you base on a player who is better?
Over-all results. That's why Polt is still the better player (winning IPL4 qualifiers, Assembly), but not because he beats HerO consistently. If HerO can get a good run in Code S next season and wins some other LAN, maybe they'll be even. But, like I said, head-to-head is meaningless compared to real results (ie tournament wins).
so lets just say if i beat you in starcraft 2 every single day every time we met each other on ladder tournaments blah blah blah... but if you won a tournament and got LUCKY in tournament brackets and faced off mroe easiler opponents you would consider yourself the better player? i dont know but that just doesnt sound to right?
Of course you have to consider what tournament it is. If it's some nameless tournament with bad players then obviously it means nothing. But if I win a Playhem, ZOTAC, or TLOpen, and you fail at the same tournament consistently, then yes I would be better than you. Even with an easier run, I will obviously face opponents that beat you, or beat those who beat you, and that would make me better than you (if head-to-head is really that important) through transitivity. In that situation, Me > dude1 > dude2 > you.
Well let's use a hypothetical pro-sports analogy.
If the Wizards / Swansea go undefeated versus Miami / Manchester United, does that mean the former teams are better than the latter? Of course not. The team with the better overall record and more achievements is better.
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage. Jjakji is too volatile in TvT (he was lucky to make it out of the Ro16 in one piece), Supernova has not made deep runs in the GSL, Ganzi's TvP is woefully bad, Gumiho had one good run in the current GSL, and the same applies to Alive. MKP and Polt are roughly equal. The only players who are heads-and-shoulders above Polt are MMA and Mvp, and Mvp has struggled recently.
On March 01 2012 12:16 dragonborn wrote: [quote] hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
On March 01 2012 12:16 dragonborn wrote: [quote] hmm...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Polt is a fantastic player, and one of my favorite terran players, but MMA is just stronger at the moment. I do not doubt that Polt has the potential to be great. I think the same about HerO btw.
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
He won a foreigner-filled tournament by only playing Koreans from group stages until the finals, then beating the best non-Korean player in the world. I already explained why you were wrong on everyone else.
- MMA, better than Polt, has shown it over and over - Alive had one good run, needs to show more - Gumiho had one good run, needs to show more - Mvp, better than Polt, has shown it over and over - Ganzi, too bad in TvP - Jjakji, too up and down in TvT - Supernova, too up and down in TvP
Good runs don't mean shit unless they are repeatable.
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
then how would you base on a player who is better?
Over-all results. That's why Polt is still the better player (winning IPL4 qualifiers, Assembly), but not because he beats HerO consistently. If HerO can get a good run in Code S next season and wins some other LAN, maybe they'll be even. But, like I said, head-to-head is meaningless compared to real results (ie tournament wins).
so lets just say if i beat you in starcraft 2 every single day every time we met each other on ladder tournaments blah blah blah... but if you won a tournament and got LUCKY in tournament brackets and faced off mroe easiler opponents you would consider yourself the better player? i dont know but that just doesnt sound to right?
Of course you have to consider what tournament it is. If it's some nameless tournament with bad players then obviously it means nothing. But if I win a Playhem, ZOTAC, or TLOpen, and you fail at the same tournament consistently, then yes I would be better than you. Even with an easier run, I will obviously face opponents that beat you, or beat those who beat you, and that would make me better than you (if head-to-head is really that important) through transitivity. In that situation, Me > dude1 > dude2 > you.
Well let's use a hypothetical pro-sports analogy.
If the Wizards / Swansea go undefeated versus Miami / Manchester United, does that mean the former teams are better than the latter? Of course not. The team with the better overall record and more achievements is better.
so why are you saying HerO > Polt? Polt i dont even like him i actually think his overrated... but he has a overall better achievement list then HerO would you agree? wouldnt you say GSL Super Tournament is more Prestige then Dreamhack Winter? Polts 2 Titles > HerOs 1 Title only reason why people think HerO is the next MC is because his on TEAMLIQUID and thats the truth ...
NASL show match 4-1 Polt won IPL4 Qualifiers 2-0 Polt won Assembly 2-0 Polt won
Seems like HerO always have a bad day when he is playing with Polt
soooooo....cheese? you stats-schooled me, kuddos
no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Strange, why do the Korean pro gamers keep mentioning MMA in interviews when talking about the best Terran, but never mentions Polt? Well, I trust your judgement dragonborn.
wtf? When talking about the best Terran, neither player is mentioned when there's MVP. Since MVP's fallen off, people aren't particularly sure and are pretty silent about it though they do say there are good players at certain styles.
On March 01 2012 12:19 dragonborn wrote: [quote] no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
On March 01 2012 12:19 dragonborn wrote: [quote] no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
then how would you base on a player who is better?
Over-all results. That's why Polt is still the better player (winning IPL4 qualifiers, Assembly), but not because he beats HerO consistently. If HerO can get a good run in Code S next season and wins some other LAN, maybe they'll be even. But, like I said, head-to-head is meaningless compared to real results (ie tournament wins).
so lets just say if i beat you in starcraft 2 every single day every time we met each other on ladder tournaments blah blah blah... but if you won a tournament and got LUCKY in tournament brackets and faced off mroe easiler opponents you would consider yourself the better player? i dont know but that just doesnt sound to right?
Of course you have to consider what tournament it is. If it's some nameless tournament with bad players then obviously it means nothing. But if I win a Playhem, ZOTAC, or TLOpen, and you fail at the same tournament consistently, then yes I would be better than you. Even with an easier run, I will obviously face opponents that beat you, or beat those who beat you, and that would make me better than you (if head-to-head is really that important) through transitivity. In that situation, Me > dude1 > dude2 > you.
Well let's use a hypothetical pro-sports analogy.
If the Wizards / Swansea go undefeated versus Miami / Manchester United, does that mean the former teams are better than the latter? Of course not. The team with the better overall record and more achievements is better.
so why are you saying HerO > Polt? Polt i dont even like him i actually think his overrated... but he has a overall better achievement list then HerO would you agree? wouldnt you say GSL Super Tournament is more Prestige then Dreamhack Winter? Polts 2 Titles > HerOs 1 Title only reason why people think HerO is the next MC is because his on TEAMLIQUID and thats the truth ...
Please read properly. I said that Polt is better than HerO (read 2 messages before this), but not because of their head-to-head. Polt is better because of his over-all accomplishments. HerO has the potential to be better than Polt in the next season, though.
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
On March 01 2012 12:27 GeorgeForeman wrote: [quote] To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
what are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
On March 01 2012 12:27 GeorgeForeman wrote: [quote] To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
I don't have a problem with either of your logic nor do I have a problem with you saying MMA is better than Polt.
Buuuuut. Taken together, both of your logic contradicts one another. You claim that personal matchups against each other between Polt and MMA does not make Polt a better player yet you use MMA beating MVP as meaning he's better than MVP. By itself, I can kind of understand, but you're contradicting yourself here.
On March 01 2012 12:19 dragonborn wrote: [quote] no, im just saying Polt is better player than HerO.
To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
then how would you base on a player who is better?
Over-all results. That's why Polt is still the better player (winning IPL4 qualifiers, Assembly), but not because he beats HerO consistently. If HerO can get a good run in Code S next season and wins some other LAN, maybe they'll be even. But, like I said, head-to-head is meaningless compared to real results (ie tournament wins).
so lets just say if i beat you in starcraft 2 every single day every time we met each other on ladder tournaments blah blah blah... but if you won a tournament and got LUCKY in tournament brackets and faced off mroe easiler opponents you would consider yourself the better player? i dont know but that just doesnt sound to right?
Of course you have to consider what tournament it is. If it's some nameless tournament with bad players then obviously it means nothing. But if I win a Playhem, ZOTAC, or TLOpen, and you fail at the same tournament consistently, then yes I would be better than you. Even with an easier run, I will obviously face opponents that beat you, or beat those who beat you, and that would make me better than you (if head-to-head is really that important) through transitivity. In that situation, Me > dude1 > dude2 > you.
Well let's use a hypothetical pro-sports analogy.
If the Wizards / Swansea go undefeated versus Miami / Manchester United, does that mean the former teams are better than the latter? Of course not. The team with the better overall record and more achievements is better.
so why are you saying HerO > Polt? Polt i dont even like him i actually think his overrated... but he has a overall better achievement list then HerO would you agree? wouldnt you say GSL Super Tournament is more Prestige then Dreamhack Winter? Polts 2 Titles > HerOs 1 Title only reason why people think HerO is the next MC is because his on TEAMLIQUID and thats the truth ...
You know, your argument was ok until you your blanket statement at the end. Being on TeamLiquid helped his exposure many folds, but that alone is never enough. The reason why people have such high expectations of HerO, is because of display of skill on his stream. Earlier we saw glimpses of this in his tournament play. Lately he has become much more consistent, he is actually improving from tournament to tournament. If his progress continues as it is, we may see him take a GSL championship this year.
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
And its simple MMA > MVP > Polt > MMA
On March 01 2012 13:05 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:57 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:56 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:53 CosmicSpiral wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:48 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:40 dragonborn wrote:
Because he is still top 5 terran in korea?
also fd's championship was 2 years ago, Polt played in code S more than 1 year.
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
I don't have a problem with either of your logic nor do I have a problem with you saying MMA is better than Polt.
Buuuuut. Taken together, both of your logic contradicts one another. You claim that personal matchups against each other between Polt and MMA does not make Polt a better player yet you use MMA beating MVP as meaning he's better than MVP. By itself, I can kind of understand, but you're contradicting yourself here.
No, I'm not claiming that MMA > Mvp because of their matchup. I'm proving that it isn't so. Despite MMA beating Mvp. MvP > MMA even after GSL October. And that is what I was saying. And what Tastosis were saying, and what most were saying. Until MMA won Blizzcup, and even after till he had done more, and won more, MMA wasn't > Mvp.
On March 01 2012 12:38 kochujang wrote: [quote] So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
And its simple MMA > MVP > Polt > MMA
On March 01 2012 13:05 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:57 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:56 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:53 CosmicSpiral wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:48 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:40 dragonborn wrote:
Because he is still top 5 terran in korea?
also fd's championship was 2 years ago, Polt played in code S more than 1 year.
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
Those are the current points. /The points you showed are from last year. And GSL ranking points don't mean that you are top in the world.
And Polt is rank 51 in the current list. Thanks for showing me that he is top 5. Nevermind.
Congrats, you've sure showed me what's up.
This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
On March 01 2012 12:41 dragonborn wrote: [quote] Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
And its simple MMA > MVP > Polt > MMA
On March 01 2012 13:05 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:57 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:56 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:53 CosmicSpiral wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:48 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:40 dragonborn wrote:
Because he is still top 5 terran in korea?
also fd's championship was 2 years ago, Polt played in code S more than 1 year.
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
Those are the current points. /The points you showed are from last year. And GSL ranking points don't mean that you are top in the world.
And Polt is rank 51 in the current list. Thanks for showing me that he is top 5. Nevermind.
Congrats, you've sure showed me what's up.
This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
On March 01 2012 12:27 GeorgeForeman wrote: [quote] To be clear, you were demonstrating that Polt beats HerO head-to-head. That does nothing to demonstrate which player is "better".
Right because when quote several high level tournament games that they've played, where one player has won convincingly in all of the matches, it doesn't demonstrate one is better then the other?
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
I am no HerO fan (I criticized his selection, ate my words) and I do think Polt is the better player because of his history, but determining which player is better based on their head-to-head is crazy.
then how would you base on a player who is better?
Over-all results. That's why Polt is still the better player (winning IPL4 qualifiers, Assembly), but not because he beats HerO consistently. If HerO can get a good run in Code S next season and wins some other LAN, maybe they'll be even. But, like I said, head-to-head is meaningless compared to real results (ie tournament wins).
so lets just say if i beat you in starcraft 2 every single day every time we met each other on ladder tournaments blah blah blah... but if you won a tournament and got LUCKY in tournament brackets and faced off mroe easiler opponents you would consider yourself the better player? i dont know but that just doesnt sound to right?
Of course you have to consider what tournament it is. If it's some nameless tournament with bad players then obviously it means nothing. But if I win a Playhem, ZOTAC, or TLOpen, and you fail at the same tournament consistently, then yes I would be better than you. Even with an easier run, I will obviously face opponents that beat you, or beat those who beat you, and that would make me better than you (if head-to-head is really that important) through transitivity. In that situation, Me > dude1 > dude2 > you.
Well let's use a hypothetical pro-sports analogy.
If the Wizards / Swansea go undefeated versus Miami / Manchester United, does that mean the former teams are better than the latter? Of course not. The team with the better overall record and more achievements is better.
so why are you saying HerO > Polt? Polt i dont even like him i actually think his overrated... but he has a overall better achievement list then HerO would you agree? wouldnt you say GSL Super Tournament is more Prestige then Dreamhack Winter? Polts 2 Titles > HerOs 1 Title only reason why people think HerO is the next MC is because his on TEAMLIQUID and thats the truth ...
You know, your argument was ok until you your blanket statement at the end. Being on TeamLiquid helped his exposure many folds, but that alone is never enough. The reason why people have such high expectations of HerO, is because of display of skill on his stream. Earlier we saw glimpses of this in his tournament play. Lately he has become much more consistent, he is actually improving from tournament to tournament. If his progress continues as it is, we may see him take a GSL championship this year.
It's his second time either subtly or overtly bashing Team Liquid in this thread alone. Every online community has it's hypocritical-hater crowd that visits often and yet attacks people that are fans of the site. This guy is no exception. Unfortunate, because he might have had some good points if he didn't completely negate everything he said by crapping all over TL in all of his posts.
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
GSL still didnt give gsl march code S invites, wait untill they are revealing
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
Those are the current points. /The points you showed are from last year. And GSL ranking points don't mean that you are top in the world.
And Polt is rank 51 in the current list. Thanks for showing me that he is top 5. Nevermind.
Congrats, you've sure showed me what's up.
This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
So why are you using 2011 stats as a measure of current skill and level? I can point gloriously towards the days of Fruitdealer being #1 two years ago, or claim that Mvp is the best in the world followed by Nestea on your system. Mvp got knocked out in the bottom 16 of MLG and Nestea got beaten by Demuslim and got knocked out in the top 13-16 category of MLG winter. I'm glad the number 1 and 2 of your list did so well.
Use a correct ranking system please, not a ranking system based on your adoration of Polt.
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
GSL still didnt give gsl march code S invites, wait untill they are revealing
So getting invited to GSL Code S is a big thing now? How about earning it through Code A, or winning in Code S when given that seed?
I guess you're of the belief that Idra and Sen were superstars. Given the seed to Code S and all...
On March 01 2012 12:51 dragonborn wrote: [quote] Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
And its simple MMA > MVP > Polt > MMA
On March 01 2012 13:05 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:57 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:56 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:53 CosmicSpiral wrote: [quote]
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
Those are the current points. /The points you showed are from last year. And GSL ranking points don't mean that you are top in the world.
And Polt is rank 51 in the current list. Thanks for showing me that he is top 5. Nevermind.
Congrats, you've sure showed me what's up.
This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
So why are you using 2011 stats as a measure of current skill and level? I can point gloriously towards the days of Fruitdealer being #1 two years ago, or claim that Mvp is the best in the world followed by Nestea on your system. Mvp got knocked out in the bottom 16 of MLG and Nestea got beaten by Demuslim and got knocked out in the top 13-16 category of MLG winter. I'm glad the number 1 and 2 of your list did so well.
Use a correct ranking system please, not a ranking system based on your adoration of Polt.
Because last tournaments played on 2011 and we are on 1/4 of 2012, welcome the world!
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
GSL still didnt give gsl march code S invites, wait untill they are revealing
So getting invited to GSL Code S is a big thing now? How about earning it through Code A, or winning in Code S when given that seed?
I guess you're of the belief that Idra and Sen were superstars. Given the seed to Code S and all...
Stop hating on Polt, he deserves this spot with beating TaeJa/HerO/Lucky and Stephano.
Also he can qualify code A easypz, he lost his gsl matches because of sickness.
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
On March 01 2012 12:41 dragonborn wrote: [quote] Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
And its simple MMA > MVP > Polt > MMA
On March 01 2012 13:05 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:57 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:56 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:53 CosmicSpiral wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:48 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:40 dragonborn wrote:
Because he is still top 5 terran in korea?
also fd's championship was 2 years ago, Polt played in code S more than 1 year.
MMA, Alive, Mvp, MKP, Gumiho, GanZi, Jjakji, Supernova. To paraphrase a saying from other sports, Polt isn't fit to plug in their keyboards for them. He's a good player, and you've somehow hyped him up to be untouchable. One solid win at Assembly is hardly enough to elevate him to god status. And comparing their head to head is pure folly. MMA > Polt despite their questionable stats.
Um...I understand that you think Polt is not a top-tier player, but your list is pretty much garbage.
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
Those are the current points. /The points you showed are from last year. And GSL ranking points don't mean that you are top in the world.
And Polt is rank 51 in the current list. Thanks for showing me that he is top 5. Nevermind.
Congrats, you've sure showed me what's up.
This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
TLPD ELO is not a reliable indicator of anything. It doesn't take into account the prestige of the tournament or the legitimate skill of the opponent, so ELO rankings are often artificially inflated by weekly tournaments and similar things. This was the case with Taeja in the past, Empire.Happy right now, and FXOTear.
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
And its simple MMA > MVP > Polt > MMA
On March 01 2012 13:05 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:57 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 12:56 Falconblade wrote: [quote]
Um... They all rank higher than Polt on the Korean TLPD, and have all played some spectacular games this year. So Polt managed to beat a foreigner filled tournament, the aforementioned all had much greater peaks, whether it was ro8/ro4 GSL, or good runs in MLG against top level koreans. The exception is Mvp, and as much as I don't like him, he still has played against far better people.
Those are the current points. /The points you showed are from last year. And GSL ranking points don't mean that you are top in the world.
And Polt is rank 51 in the current list. Thanks for showing me that he is top 5. Nevermind.
Congrats, you've sure showed me what's up.
This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
So why are you using 2011 stats as a measure of current skill and level? I can point gloriously towards the days of Fruitdealer being #1 two years ago, or claim that Mvp is the best in the world followed by Nestea on your system. Mvp got knocked out in the bottom 16 of MLG and Nestea got beaten by Demuslim and got knocked out in the top 13-16 category of MLG winter. I'm glad the number 1 and 2 of your list did so well.
Use a correct ranking system please, not a ranking system based on your adoration of Polt.
Because last tournaments played on 2011 and we are on 1/4 of 2012, welcome the world!
Do you still not understand that GSL ranking points are useless, which I've been trying to explain? This is the same system that proclaimed Top and July to be top 10. If that doesn't make sense, why does it make sense that Polt's top 5 ranking in the system is accurate? DRG is easily considered one of the best players in the world right now. Ask anyone. If you add both GSL points from last year and this year, DRG wouldn't even make it to top 10. He wasn't top 10 in your list. Yet people are saying that his #1 or Top 3 atleast in the world.
So let me ask again. Why are you validating your stupid argument using a flawed and old system for this year?
Because you are wrong.
Let me know if I'm using big words, that may explain why you don't seem to understand anything.
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Im saying lets talk about 2011 GSL results and points.
Talking about 2012 is kinda pointless because of first GSL is not even finished. Since 2012's first gsl not even finished, its not wrong to talking about 2011's 3/4 or 4/4.
On March 01 2012 12:55 dragonborn wrote: [quote] LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
Those are the current points. /The points you showed are from last year. And GSL ranking points don't mean that you are top in the world.
And Polt is rank 51 in the current list. Thanks for showing me that he is top 5. Nevermind.
Congrats, you've sure showed me what's up.
This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
So why are you using 2011 stats as a measure of current skill and level? I can point gloriously towards the days of Fruitdealer being #1 two years ago, or claim that Mvp is the best in the world followed by Nestea on your system. Mvp got knocked out in the bottom 16 of MLG and Nestea got beaten by Demuslim and got knocked out in the top 13-16 category of MLG winter. I'm glad the number 1 and 2 of your list did so well.
Use a correct ranking system please, not a ranking system based on your adoration of Polt.
Because last tournaments played on 2011 and we are on 1/4 of 2012, welcome the world!
Do you still not understand that GSL ranking points are useless, which I've been trying to explain? This is the same system that proclaimed Top and July to be top 10. If that doesn't make sense, why does it make sense that Polt's top 5 ranking in the system is accurate? DRG is easily considered one of the best players in the world right now. Ask anyone. If you add both GSL points from last year and this year, DRG wouldn't even make it to top 10. He wasn't top 10 in your list. Yet people are saying that his #1 or Top 3 atleast in the world.
So let me ask again. Why are you validating your stupid argument using a flawed and old system for this year?
Because you are wrong.
Let me know if I'm using big words, that may explain why you don't seem to understand anything.
You are just saying Polt isnt top-tier terran with utterly useless ELO rankings, then im showing you GSL points.
What is wrong?
Nothing.
and tell me what is making FXOTear #6 korean player on ELO?
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Meh, on the contrary, I don't hate Polt. I just hate when people try to bash a player based on something as stupid as one bad matchup and then try to definitively say that X is better than Y, when Y has done pretty damn well recently, and has earned himself a Code S spot.
I'm a huge fan of Liquid (Sheth, Ret and TLO, what badasses!), though admittedly ambivalent towards HerO. Regardless, I just want to drive it home that his method of fanboyism is absolutely stupid.
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Meh, on the contrary, I don't hate Polt. I just hate when people try to bash a player based on something as stupid as one bad matchup and then try to definitively say that X is better than Y, when Y has done pretty damn well recently, and has earned himself a Code S spot.
I'm a huge fan of Liquid (Sheth, Ret and TLO, what badasses!), though admittedly ambivalent towards HerO. Regardless, I just want to drive it home that his method of fanboyism is absolutely stupid.
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Im saying lets talk about 2011 GSL results and points.
Talking about 2012 is kinda pointless because of first GSL is not even finished. Since 2012's first gsl not even finished, its not wrong to talking about 2011's 3/4 or 4/4.
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
Those are the current points. /The points you showed are from last year. And GSL ranking points don't mean that you are top in the world.
And Polt is rank 51 in the current list. Thanks for showing me that he is top 5. Nevermind.
Congrats, you've sure showed me what's up.
This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
So why are you using 2011 stats as a measure of current skill and level? I can point gloriously towards the days of Fruitdealer being #1 two years ago, or claim that Mvp is the best in the world followed by Nestea on your system. Mvp got knocked out in the bottom 16 of MLG and Nestea got beaten by Demuslim and got knocked out in the top 13-16 category of MLG winter. I'm glad the number 1 and 2 of your list did so well.
Use a correct ranking system please, not a ranking system based on your adoration of Polt.
Because last tournaments played on 2011 and we are on 1/4 of 2012, welcome the world!
Do you still not understand that GSL ranking points are useless, which I've been trying to explain? This is the same system that proclaimed Top and July to be top 10. If that doesn't make sense, why does it make sense that Polt's top 5 ranking in the system is accurate? DRG is easily considered one of the best players in the world right now. Ask anyone. If you add both GSL points from last year and this year, DRG wouldn't even make it to top 10. He wasn't top 10 in your list. Yet people are saying that his #1 or Top 3 atleast in the world.
So let me ask again. Why are you validating your stupid argument using a flawed and old system for this year?
Because you are wrong.
Let me know if I'm using big words, that may explain why you don't seem to understand anything.
You are just saying Polt isnt top-tier terran with utterly useless ELO rankings, then im showing you GSL points.
What is wrong?
Nothing.
I'm saying he isn't top 5 currently. I didn't say that he wasn't top 5, and he was top 5 last year for sure.
But right now he isn't, and anyone will attest to that.
GSL points from last year don't mean a thing on how people are now. Polt is easily not top 5 Terrans right now. All of the Code S terrans, and some not in Code A have a valid claim to being better.
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Im saying lets talk about 2011 GSL results and points.
Talking about 2012 is kinda pointless because of first GSL is not even finished. Since 2012's first gsl not even finished, its not wrong to talking about 2011's 3/4 or 4/4.
On March 01 2012 13:29 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:23 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:22 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:16 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:15 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:12 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:11 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: [quote] wtf are you talking about?
You are not even put Polt in your top 5 terran list and talking about how MMA beats MVP and why he is best terran?
Their records not in foreigner tournaments, its in GSL!
And its simple MMA > MVP > Polt > MMA
[quote] I dont care about full list, just tell me top 5
Also TaeJa was #1 in korean TLPD when he won ESV korean weekly.So its a not big deal for being top 5 or 10 in TLPD rankings.
Those are the current points. /The points you showed are from last year. And GSL ranking points don't mean that you are top in the world.
And Polt is rank 51 in the current list. Thanks for showing me that he is top 5. Nevermind.
Congrats, you've sure showed me what's up.
This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
So why are you using 2011 stats as a measure of current skill and level? I can point gloriously towards the days of Fruitdealer being #1 two years ago, or claim that Mvp is the best in the world followed by Nestea on your system. Mvp got knocked out in the bottom 16 of MLG and Nestea got beaten by Demuslim and got knocked out in the top 13-16 category of MLG winter. I'm glad the number 1 and 2 of your list did so well.
Use a correct ranking system please, not a ranking system based on your adoration of Polt.
Because last tournaments played on 2011 and we are on 1/4 of 2012, welcome the world!
Do you still not understand that GSL ranking points are useless, which I've been trying to explain? This is the same system that proclaimed Top and July to be top 10. If that doesn't make sense, why does it make sense that Polt's top 5 ranking in the system is accurate? DRG is easily considered one of the best players in the world right now. Ask anyone. If you add both GSL points from last year and this year, DRG wouldn't even make it to top 10. He wasn't top 10 in your list. Yet people are saying that his #1 or Top 3 atleast in the world.
So let me ask again. Why are you validating your stupid argument using a flawed and old system for this year?
Because you are wrong.
Let me know if I'm using big words, that may explain why you don't seem to understand anything.
You are just saying Polt isnt top-tier terran with utterly useless ELO rankings, then im showing you GSL points.
What is wrong?
Nothing.
I'm saying he isn't top 5 currently. I didn't say that he wasn't top 5, and he was top 5 last year for sure.
But right now he isn't, and anyone will attest to that.
GSL points from last year don't mean a thing on how people are now. Polt is easily not top 5 Terrans right now. All of the Code S terrans, and some not in Code A have a valid claim to being better.
TaeJa is code S terran and Polt manhandled him at Assembly, sup?
Polt is still in top 5 with mma,mvp,alive and jjakji.
Also saying some of code A terrans better than Polt, simply hating on him.
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Im saying lets talk about 2011 GSL results and points.
Talking about 2012 is kinda pointless because of first GSL is not even finished. Since 2012's first gsl not even finished, its not wrong to talking about 2011's 3/4 or 4/4.
Those are the current points. /The points you showed are from last year. And GSL ranking points don't mean that you are top in the world.
And Polt is rank 51 in the current list. Thanks for showing me that he is top 5. Nevermind.
Congrats, you've sure showed me what's up.
This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
So why are you using 2011 stats as a measure of current skill and level? I can point gloriously towards the days of Fruitdealer being #1 two years ago, or claim that Mvp is the best in the world followed by Nestea on your system. Mvp got knocked out in the bottom 16 of MLG and Nestea got beaten by Demuslim and got knocked out in the top 13-16 category of MLG winter. I'm glad the number 1 and 2 of your list did so well.
Use a correct ranking system please, not a ranking system based on your adoration of Polt.
Because last tournaments played on 2011 and we are on 1/4 of 2012, welcome the world!
Do you still not understand that GSL ranking points are useless, which I've been trying to explain? This is the same system that proclaimed Top and July to be top 10. If that doesn't make sense, why does it make sense that Polt's top 5 ranking in the system is accurate? DRG is easily considered one of the best players in the world right now. Ask anyone. If you add both GSL points from last year and this year, DRG wouldn't even make it to top 10. He wasn't top 10 in your list. Yet people are saying that his #1 or Top 3 atleast in the world.
So let me ask again. Why are you validating your stupid argument using a flawed and old system for this year?
Because you are wrong.
Let me know if I'm using big words, that may explain why you don't seem to understand anything.
You are just saying Polt isnt top-tier terran with utterly useless ELO rankings, then im showing you GSL points.
What is wrong?
Nothing.
I'm saying he isn't top 5 currently. I didn't say that he wasn't top 5, and he was top 5 last year for sure.
But right now he isn't, and anyone will attest to that.
GSL points from last year don't mean a thing on how people are now. Polt is easily not top 5 Terrans right now. All of the Code S terrans, and some not in Code A have a valid claim to being better.
TaeJa is code S terran and Polt manhandled him at Assembly, sup?
Polt is still in top 5 with mma,mvp,alive and jjakji.
Also saying some of code A terrans better than Polt, simply hating on him.
[chime] MarineKing best Terran of 2012 [/chime] kindly continue
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Im saying lets talk about 2011 GSL results and points.
Talking about 2012 is kinda pointless because of first GSL is not even finished. Since 2012's first gsl not even finished, its not wrong to talking about 2011's 3/4 or 4/4.
On March 01 2012 13:29 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:23 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:22 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:16 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:15 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:12 dragonborn wrote: [quote] This list only for 2012 and only 1 GSL has been played, LOLOLOL.
lets talk about full list or only 2011 ))))))))
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
So why are you using 2011 stats as a measure of current skill and level? I can point gloriously towards the days of Fruitdealer being #1 two years ago, or claim that Mvp is the best in the world followed by Nestea on your system. Mvp got knocked out in the bottom 16 of MLG and Nestea got beaten by Demuslim and got knocked out in the top 13-16 category of MLG winter. I'm glad the number 1 and 2 of your list did so well.
Use a correct ranking system please, not a ranking system based on your adoration of Polt.
Because last tournaments played on 2011 and we are on 1/4 of 2012, welcome the world!
Do you still not understand that GSL ranking points are useless, which I've been trying to explain? This is the same system that proclaimed Top and July to be top 10. If that doesn't make sense, why does it make sense that Polt's top 5 ranking in the system is accurate? DRG is easily considered one of the best players in the world right now. Ask anyone. If you add both GSL points from last year and this year, DRG wouldn't even make it to top 10. He wasn't top 10 in your list. Yet people are saying that his #1 or Top 3 atleast in the world.
So let me ask again. Why are you validating your stupid argument using a flawed and old system for this year?
Because you are wrong.
Let me know if I'm using big words, that may explain why you don't seem to understand anything.
You are just saying Polt isnt top-tier terran with utterly useless ELO rankings, then im showing you GSL points.
What is wrong?
Nothing.
I'm saying he isn't top 5 currently. I didn't say that he wasn't top 5, and he was top 5 last year for sure.
But right now he isn't, and anyone will attest to that.
GSL points from last year don't mean a thing on how people are now. Polt is easily not top 5 Terrans right now. All of the Code S terrans, and some not in Code A have a valid claim to being better.
TaeJa is code S terran and Polt manhandled him at Assembly, sup?
Polt is still in top 5 with mma,mvp,alive and jjakji.
Also saying some of code A terrans better than Polt, simply hating on him.
[chime] MarineKing best Terran of 2012 [/chime] kindly continue
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Meh, on the contrary, I don't hate Polt. I just hate when people try to bash a player based on something as stupid as one bad matchup and then try to definitively say that X is better than Y, when Y has done pretty damn well recently, and has earned himself a Code S spot.
I'm a huge fan of Liquid (Sheth, Ret and TLO, what badasses!), though admittedly ambivalent towards HerO. Regardless, I just want to drive it home that his method of fanboyism is absolutely stupid.
Your methods is more stupid than mines.
Tell me what is make FXOTear #6 in korean ELO?
is he best Korean protoss?
Genius is ahead of him in TLPD btw.
And no, but ELO is better than GSL points (FROM LAST YEAR NO LESS) to assess current skills of players. And there are many terrans ahead of Polt. I didn't make outrageous claims like Maru, Noblesse, Happy, etc etc. as being better than Polt. The list I gave of the terrans ahead of Polt were all Code S Terrans, many of which made it to ro16 or greater. And they were GSL terrans, the holy grail of rankings for you it seems.
Let me dumb it down for you.
Terran List - GSL Terrans, Code S. Have good current records in GSL/MLG, etc. etc. > Polt. And there are more than 5 of those.
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Im saying lets talk about 2011 GSL results and points.
Talking about 2012 is kinda pointless because of first GSL is not even finished. Since 2012's first gsl not even finished, its not wrong to talking about 2011's 3/4 or 4/4.
On March 01 2012 13:29 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:23 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:22 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:16 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:15 Falconblade wrote: [quote]
Last I checked, we are talking about how Polt is right now. And the year is 2012. And you still don't grasp the concept of the points. GSL ranking points don't show if someone is better or not, just that they have gotten further. TLPD is a more valid measure of skill as it measures current form. But even if you want to use GSL points, you can't use last years for this year can you? Think about it. It may take you a few hours to grasp why you are wrong in everything you assert... But you'll get there.
Or not.
Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
So why are you using 2011 stats as a measure of current skill and level? I can point gloriously towards the days of Fruitdealer being #1 two years ago, or claim that Mvp is the best in the world followed by Nestea on your system. Mvp got knocked out in the bottom 16 of MLG and Nestea got beaten by Demuslim and got knocked out in the top 13-16 category of MLG winter. I'm glad the number 1 and 2 of your list did so well.
Use a correct ranking system please, not a ranking system based on your adoration of Polt.
Because last tournaments played on 2011 and we are on 1/4 of 2012, welcome the world!
Do you still not understand that GSL ranking points are useless, which I've been trying to explain? This is the same system that proclaimed Top and July to be top 10. If that doesn't make sense, why does it make sense that Polt's top 5 ranking in the system is accurate? DRG is easily considered one of the best players in the world right now. Ask anyone. If you add both GSL points from last year and this year, DRG wouldn't even make it to top 10. He wasn't top 10 in your list. Yet people are saying that his #1 or Top 3 atleast in the world.
So let me ask again. Why are you validating your stupid argument using a flawed and old system for this year?
Because you are wrong.
Let me know if I'm using big words, that may explain why you don't seem to understand anything.
You are just saying Polt isnt top-tier terran with utterly useless ELO rankings, then im showing you GSL points.
What is wrong?
Nothing.
I'm saying he isn't top 5 currently. I didn't say that he wasn't top 5, and he was top 5 last year for sure.
But right now he isn't, and anyone will attest to that.
GSL points from last year don't mean a thing on how people are now. Polt is easily not top 5 Terrans right now. All of the Code S terrans, and some not in Code A have a valid claim to being better.
TaeJa is code S terran and Polt manhandled him at Assembly, sup?
Polt is still in top 5 with mma,mvp,alive and jjakji.
Also saying some of code A terrans better than Polt, simply hating on him.
[chime] MarineKing best Terran of 2012 [/chime] kindly continue
oh well i forget him :S
mkp,polt,mma,mvp and alive/jjakji
I would definitely put GuMiho in there somewhere too; outside of GSL he actually has been doing very well lately: -one game away from GSL finals, and some great games before that (3-1 Puzzle, 4-1 Mvp) -one game away from qualifying for MLG winter arena -multiple multi-kills in team leagues (IPL, KSL)
On March 01 2012 13:07 dragonborn wrote: GSL is more important than any tournament.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Meh, on the contrary, I don't hate Polt. I just hate when people try to bash a player based on something as stupid as one bad matchup and then try to definitively say that X is better than Y, when Y has done pretty damn well recently, and has earned himself a Code S spot.
I'm a huge fan of Liquid (Sheth, Ret and TLO, what badasses!), though admittedly ambivalent towards HerO. Regardless, I just want to drive it home that his method of fanboyism is absolutely stupid.
Your methods is more stupid than mines.
Tell me what is make FXOTear #6 in korean ELO?
is he best Korean protoss?
Genius is ahead of him in TLPD btw.
And no, but ELO is better than GSL points (FROM LAST YEAR NO LESS) to assess current skills of players. And there are many terrans ahead of Polt. I didn't make outrageous claims like Maru, Noblesse, Happy, etc etc. as being better than Polt. The list I gave of the terrans ahead of Polt were all Code S Terrans, many of which made it to ro16 or greater. And they were GSL terrans, the holy grail of rankings for you it seems.
Let me dumb it down for you.
Terran List - GSL Terrans, Code S. Have good current records in GSL/MLG, etc. etc. > Polt.
Im not sure if you serious or not.Being code S terran and playing ro16 doesnt make you better than Polt.
or being code S zerg deosnt make you better than LosirA.
You just need to watch game of these players for decide who is better than other, and Polt already proved himself for winning Assembly with hardest bracket.
also ELO is definitely not good for saying these player is better because of higher rank.
like i said, FXOTear
and stop it, i dont want to argue with you anymore.You think polt isnt top terran and i think he is still top , thats it.
Well.... then..... HerO = Code S, Polt = Code B so by your logic?????
Congrats to Liquid! Such a huge turnaround from the last IPL TAC. Liquid showing that they can hang with the Korean teams NP.
Polt was in code S more than 1 year, where was HerO?
so?
You do understand that you contradict yourself repeatedly. You point to GSL points as a measure of his current skill, and then you discredit current points, code S/ code B status and ranking? I'm glad that Polt was in code S last year, is he in there now? Oh, wait he isn't.
You're a hypocrite. Either that or you have no concept of logic. Or both.
By his logic, Fruitdealer is better than HerO too. Better than Polt as well since FD has a GSL championship under his belt. Also better than DRG, etc., etc. You might as well give up. Arguing with fanboys is kinda pointless. No one was really even "hating" on Polt to begin with.
Note, I don't even believe that HerO is the better player overall compared to Polt, but his arguments are kinda funny.
Im saying lets talk about 2011 GSL results and points.
Talking about 2012 is kinda pointless because of first GSL is not even finished. Since 2012's first gsl not even finished, its not wrong to talking about 2011's 3/4 or 4/4.
On March 01 2012 13:29 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:23 dragonborn wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:22 Falconblade wrote:
On March 01 2012 13:16 dragonborn wrote: [quote] Then use 2012 list after at least 3 gsl finishing, to early to using this.
So why are you using 2011 stats as a measure of current skill and level? I can point gloriously towards the days of Fruitdealer being #1 two years ago, or claim that Mvp is the best in the world followed by Nestea on your system. Mvp got knocked out in the bottom 16 of MLG and Nestea got beaten by Demuslim and got knocked out in the top 13-16 category of MLG winter. I'm glad the number 1 and 2 of your list did so well.
Use a correct ranking system please, not a ranking system based on your adoration of Polt.
Because last tournaments played on 2011 and we are on 1/4 of 2012, welcome the world!
Do you still not understand that GSL ranking points are useless, which I've been trying to explain? This is the same system that proclaimed Top and July to be top 10. If that doesn't make sense, why does it make sense that Polt's top 5 ranking in the system is accurate? DRG is easily considered one of the best players in the world right now. Ask anyone. If you add both GSL points from last year and this year, DRG wouldn't even make it to top 10. He wasn't top 10 in your list. Yet people are saying that his #1 or Top 3 atleast in the world.
So let me ask again. Why are you validating your stupid argument using a flawed and old system for this year?
Because you are wrong.
Let me know if I'm using big words, that may explain why you don't seem to understand anything.
You are just saying Polt isnt top-tier terran with utterly useless ELO rankings, then im showing you GSL points.
What is wrong?
Nothing.
I'm saying he isn't top 5 currently. I didn't say that he wasn't top 5, and he was top 5 last year for sure.
But right now he isn't, and anyone will attest to that.
GSL points from last year don't mean a thing on how people are now. Polt is easily not top 5 Terrans right now. All of the Code S terrans, and some not in Code A have a valid claim to being better.
TaeJa is code S terran and Polt manhandled him at Assembly, sup?
Polt is still in top 5 with mma,mvp,alive and jjakji.
Also saying some of code A terrans better than Polt, simply hating on him.
[chime] MarineKing best Terran of 2012 [/chime] kindly continue
oh well i forget him :S
mkp,polt,mma,mvp and alive/jjakji
I would definitely put GuMiho in there somewhere too; outside of GSL he actually has been doing very well lately: -one game away from GSL finals, and some great games before that (3-1 Puzzle, 4-1 Mvp) -one game away from qualifying for MLG winter arena -multiple multi-kills in team leagues (IPL, KSL)
GuMiHo still need to prove himself more than being one time semi finalist.
Polt played against two Protoss with below 40% w/r in PvT, and Lucky who has a sub 45% w/r against Terran. And he beat a good foreigner in Stephano.
None of that makes it the toughest bracket in the world for Polt to come out. He also lost to BlinG. (Btw, Bling has a 2-0 record against Polt, does that make him better than Polt as your Polt > Hero for their matchup?)
He had a good showing, and I was rooting for him against Stephano.
Doesn't mean that it propels him to top 5 status when looking at Alive who took down MMA and made it to ro4. Or MMA who made it to ro8 GSL. Or Gumiho who made it to ro4 defeating Puzzle, Mvp (who btw has beaten Polt in their last encounter and holds a winning record against him, and has a generally high TvT). Or Mvp, despite his slumping, who has still done pretty well considering things. Or GanZi who beat Mvp and MC, both of them good against Terran and Code S players. Or Supernova who took 2nd at Iem to a rampaging viOlet, or and got to ro16 over Leenock, Fin and beating MC to top his group. And MKP, who I don't even need to bother defending.
You say Gumiho needs to prove himself, I say Polt could do the same. When was the last time he prevailed over the cream of crop? The super tournament way back? What about now? All of those aforementioned have a clear claim to being better than Polt right now. And their results, their status in Code S... Polt, despite your fanboy love for him, is simply not top 5.
Especially since you keep harping on about GSL this, GSL that, as being the true test of skill. Guess what, if you're doing that, Polt definitely isn't top 5. Stop going back on your argument to try and find loopholes to get Polt in there. I figured bolding this might help you out.
On March 01 2012 14:03 Falconblade wrote: Polt played against two Protoss with below 40% w/r in PvT, and Lucky who has a sub 45% w/r against Terran. And he beat a good foreigner in Stephano.
None of that makes it the toughest bracket in the world for Polt to come out. He also lost to BlinG. (Btw, Bling has a 2-0 record against Polt, does that make him better than Polt as your Polt > Hero for their matchup?)
He had a good showing, and I was rooting for him against Stephano.
Doesn't mean that it propels him to top 5 status when looking at Alive who took down MMA and made it to ro4. Or MMA who made it to ro8 GSL. Or Gumiho who made it to ro4 defeating Puzzle, Mvp (who btw has beaten Polt in their last encounter and holds a winning record against him, and has a generally high TvT). Or Mvp, despite his slumping, who has still done pretty well considering things. Or GanZi who beat Mvp and MC, both of them good against Terran and Code S players. Or Supernova who took 2nd at Iem to a rampaging viOlet, or and got to ro16 over Leenock, Fin and beating MC to top his group. And MKP, who I don't even need to bother defending.
You say Gumiho needs to prove himself, I say Polt could do the same. When was the last time he prevailed over the cream of crop? The super tournament way back? What about now? All of those aforementioned have a clear claim to being better than Polt right now. And their results, their status in Code S... Polt, despite your fanboy love for him, is simply not top 5.
Especially since you keep harping on about GSL this, GSL that, as being the true test of skill. Guess what, if you're doing that, Polt definitely isn't top 5. Stop going back on your argument to try and find loopholes to get Polt in there. I figured bolding this might help you out.
LOLLLLLLLLL the person who says just because Polt beats HerO 1on1 doesnt mean his better is just straight ignorant .. i swear most TL fans and i mean MOST not all are just bandwagoners i swear
So Polt is better than MMA?
Yes he is?
Now dragonborn, Polt is a great player, and he was better than MMA back in the summer of 2011, but I don't think he is anymore. MMA's has turned into such a strong player that it would not be any stretch to call him the world's best player now that MVP has started to look very mortal (unfortunately due to his wrists )
Polt is still a fantastic player, just remember Blizzard Cup, and Polt lose in GSL/GSTL because of he was sick and his condition wasnt okay.
He is still on same level with MMA and polt's current condition is good as when he won gsl super tournament.
Wait untill Polt qualifiying for code A or getting Seed from GOM.
Did he do well in Blizz Cup?
Oh nevermind, he tied against MMA 1-1, and lost to Mvp who was crushed by MMA 3-0, and then MMA followed it up with a spectacular win against DRG. Polt is no where near MMA's level. Even if Polt manages to beat MMA, Polt is not as good against the other top tiers as MMA is.
LOL ok, i get it!
you just hating on Polt for beating MMA left and right, okay!
No, I just have brains to look beyond a single 1 on 1. Despite the 4-1 at GSL Oct, Tastosis claimed that Mvp was better than MMA till MMA wrested the crown from him at the end of Blizz cup. One matchup does not make a player better than the other, as you seek to do with Polt and HerO and MMA.
Did you know that MMA v Polt has the same exact record as MC vs HuK in foreign tournaments? Huk has won 7 and lost 2 to MC. And most would agree that MC right now is much better. I wonder why that is?
Maybe because they have common sense.
I don't have a problem with either of your logic nor do I have a problem with you saying MMA is better than Polt.
Buuuuut. Taken together, both of your logic contradicts one another. You claim that personal matchups against each other between Polt and MMA does not make Polt a better player yet you use MMA beating MVP as meaning he's better than MVP. By itself, I can kind of understand, but you're contradicting yourself here.
No, I'm not claiming that MMA > Mvp because of their matchup. I'm proving that it isn't so. Despite MMA beating Mvp. MvP > MMA even after GSL October. And that is what I was saying. And what Tastosis were saying, and what most were saying. Until MMA won Blizzcup, and even after till he had done more, and won more, MMA wasn't > Mvp.
Ah my bad then, I must've confused you with someone else.
On March 01 2012 14:03 Falconblade wrote: Polt played against two Protoss with below 40% w/r in PvT, and Lucky who has a sub 45% w/r against Terran. And he beat a good foreigner in Stephano.
None of that makes it the toughest bracket in the world for Polt to come out. He also lost to BlinG. (Btw, Bling has a 2-0 record against Polt, does that make him better than Polt as your Polt > Hero for their matchup?)
He had a good showing, and I was rooting for him against Stephano.
Doesn't mean that it propels him to top 5 status when looking at Alive who took down MMA and made it to ro4. Or MMA who made it to ro8 GSL. Or Gumiho who made it to ro4 defeating Puzzle, Mvp (who btw has beaten Polt in their last encounter and holds a winning record against him, and has a generally high TvT). Or Mvp, despite his slumping, who has still done pretty well considering things. Or GanZi who beat Mvp and MC, both of them good against Terran and Code S players. Or Supernova who took 2nd at Iem to a rampaging viOlet, or and got to ro16 over Leenock, Fin and beating MC to top his group. And MKP, who I don't even need to bother defending.
You say Gumiho needs to prove himself, I say Polt could do the same. When was the last time he prevailed over the cream of crop? The super tournament way back? What about now? All of those aforementioned have a clear claim to being better than Polt right now. And their results, their status in Code S... Polt, despite your fanboy love for him, is simply not top 5.
Especially since you keep harping on about GSL this, GSL that, as being the true test of skill. Guess what, if you're doing that, Polt definitely isn't top 5. Stop going back on your argument to try and find loopholes to get Polt in there. I figured bolding this might help you out.
Most of Hero's losses were before September. You're straight-out lying about Bling.
Alive beat a sick MMA.
Supernova's performance at IEM was supremely disappointing and actually reflects negatively on his skill. He was also fortunate to beat MC.
I was worried about FXO vs. Liquid but then I remembered that Liquid recently defeated them in the NASTL 3-1 (Mouz also defeated them in NASTL) so I'd definately say they are favored.
The most epic possible tournament run would be FXO --> Startale --> OGS (IMAGINE THAT ) --> and then a rematch vs Prime.
On March 01 2012 14:03 Falconblade wrote: Polt played against two Protoss with below 40% w/r in PvT, and Lucky who has a sub 45% w/r against Terran. And he beat a good foreigner in Stephano.
None of that makes it the toughest bracket in the world for Polt to come out. He also lost to BlinG. (Btw, Bling has a 2-0 record against Polt, does that make him better than Polt as your Polt > Hero for their matchup?)
He had a good showing, and I was rooting for him against Stephano.
Doesn't mean that it propels him to top 5 status when looking at Alive who took down MMA and made it to ro4. Or MMA who made it to ro8 GSL. Or Gumiho who made it to ro4 defeating Puzzle, Mvp (who btw has beaten Polt in their last encounter and holds a winning record against him, and has a generally high TvT). Or Mvp, despite his slumping, who has still done pretty well considering things. Or GanZi who beat Mvp and MC, both of them good against Terran and Code S players. Or Supernova who took 2nd at Iem to a rampaging viOlet, or and got to ro16 over Leenock, Fin and beating MC to top his group. And MKP, who I don't even need to bother defending.
You say Gumiho needs to prove himself, I say Polt could do the same. When was the last time he prevailed over the cream of crop? The super tournament way back? What about now? All of those aforementioned have a clear claim to being better than Polt right now. And their results, their status in Code S... Polt, despite your fanboy love for him, is simply not top 5.
Especially since you keep harping on about GSL this, GSL that, as being the true test of skill. Guess what, if you're doing that, Polt definitely isn't top 5. Stop going back on your argument to try and find loopholes to get Polt in there. I figured bolding this might help you out.
Most of Hero's losses were before September. You're straight-out lying about Bling.
Alive beat a sick MMA.
Supernova's performance at IEM was supremely disappointing and actually reflects negatively on his skill. He was also fortunate to beat MC.
Lying where? And Alive showed that he was damn good. Sick MMA or not.
Hero's TvP is touch and go. And Bling did beat Polt 2-0 in the group stages, Polt played Hero who has have low rates against T. I thought he played JYP (the other protoss I meant to point out but I was wrong there, its been a ton of games and I mixed up who played Taeja and who played JYP since I missed that round of games). But accusing me of lying in regards to Bling, is unfounded? I take rather offense to that allegation that I am lying. Check the stats, Bling has a 2-0 record against Polt overall, having only played him once. This was meant to highlight the previous bloke's love of comparing people on the matchup between them as opposed to overall skill. The only thing I claimed was that Bling beat Polt, and that is true is it not?
Supernova may have been disappointing at IEM but still got 2nd despite it, but why should you justify fortunate or not? Shit happens, and end of the day, Supernova beat him.
On March 01 2012 14:03 Falconblade wrote: Polt played against two Protoss with below 40% w/r in PvT, and Lucky who has a sub 45% w/r against Terran. And he beat a good foreigner in Stephano.
None of that makes it the toughest bracket in the world for Polt to come out. He also lost to BlinG. (Btw, Bling has a 2-0 record against Polt, does that make him better than Polt as your Polt > Hero for their matchup?)
He had a good showing, and I was rooting for him against Stephano.
Doesn't mean that it propels him to top 5 status when looking at Alive who took down MMA and made it to ro4. Or MMA who made it to ro8 GSL. Or Gumiho who made it to ro4 defeating Puzzle, Mvp (who btw has beaten Polt in their last encounter and holds a winning record against him, and has a generally high TvT). Or Mvp, despite his slumping, who has still done pretty well considering things. Or GanZi who beat Mvp and MC, both of them good against Terran and Code S players. Or Supernova who took 2nd at Iem to a rampaging viOlet, or and got to ro16 over Leenock, Fin and beating MC to top his group. And MKP, who I don't even need to bother defending.
You say Gumiho needs to prove himself, I say Polt could do the same. When was the last time he prevailed over the cream of crop? The super tournament way back? What about now? All of those aforementioned have a clear claim to being better than Polt right now. And their results, their status in Code S... Polt, despite your fanboy love for him, is simply not top 5.
Especially since you keep harping on about GSL this, GSL that, as being the true test of skill. Guess what, if you're doing that, Polt definitely isn't top 5. Stop going back on your argument to try and find loopholes to get Polt in there. I figured bolding this might help you out.
Most of Hero's losses were before September. You're straight-out lying about Bling.
Alive beat a sick MMA.
Supernova's performance at IEM was supremely disappointing and actually reflects negatively on his skill. He was also fortunate to beat MC.
Lying where? And Alive showed that he was damn good. Sick MMA or not.
Hero's TvP is touch and go. And Bling did beat Polt 2-0 in the group stages, Polt played Hero who has have low rates against T. I thought he played JYP (the other protoss I meant to point out but I was wrong there, its been a ton of games and I mixed up who played Taeja and who played JYP since I missed that round of games). But accusing me of lying in regards to Bling, is unfounded? I take rather offense to that allegation that I am lying. Check the stats, Bling has a 2-0 record against Polt overall, having only played him once. This was meant to highlight the previous bloke's love of comparing people on the matchup between them as opposed to overall skill. The only thing I claimed was that Bling beat Polt, and that is true is it not?
Supernova may have been disappointing at IEM but still got 2nd despite it, but why should you justify fortunate or not? Shit happens, and end of the day, Supernova beat him.
Polt's road was Phoenix, TLO, Bling, Taeja, Hero, Lucky, and Stephano. There are only two protosses there, Hero and Bling. Bling is known as one of the better PvT players in Europe and his PvT record is above 60% (he did beat Polt, but that was not what I was accusing you about). Hero's KR PvT record since July 2011 in 7-4; I don't know why you bother to include his losses from a year ago to measure the state of his PvT now.
Everyone knows JYP is crap at PvT. He lost to Diestar for God's sake.
It means that Alive played well enough to beat a sick MMA, not necessarily that Alive played brilliantly. He played more aggressive than what we are used to seeing from him, but it's nonsense to say he is a top-level Terran because he advanced to RoX in a single tournament. You want to use his other recent results and how those played out to make a qualitative statement.
Supernova's gameplay at IEM was far below his usual standard, but he managed to get 2nd because the field at San Paulo was exceptionally weak. So the placing does not reflect his skill at the event at all. If you only saw Supernova play at IEM you would think he was much worse than the games he showed in the Ro32.
Shit happens like a fakeout based on intimate knowledge of MC's thought processes. It certainly showed when Supernova got absolutely smoked in the Ro16 by protosses he didn't know. The Ro16 showed that Supernova's TvP was dependent on early mindgames and crumbled when it was forced into a macro game.
This is a silly and long argument. Both HerO and Polt are elite players. Both top ten of their races. For my money, Polt is outside the top five terrans and HerO is in the top five protosses, but given how much deeper T is than P, Polt may still be better. He's certainly still a better performer under pressure.
Results only get you so far, use your eyes whenever you can and make judgements like that. Both are world class players.
On March 01 2012 15:26 tree.hugger wrote: This is a silly and long argument. Both HerO and Polt are elite players. Both top ten of their races. For my money, Polt is outside the top five terrans and HerO is in the top five protosses, but given how much deeper T is than P, Polt may still be better. He's certainly still a better performer under pressure.
Results only get you so far, use your eyes whenever you can and make judgements like that. Both are world class players.
On March 01 2012 15:26 tree.hugger wrote: This is a silly and long argument. Both HerO and Polt are elite players. Both top ten of their races. For my money, Polt is outside the top five terrans and HerO is in the top five protosses, but given how much deeper T is than P, Polt may still be better. He's certainly still a better performer under pressure.
Results only get you so far, use your eyes whenever you can and make judgements like that. Both are world class players.
Good post. For a while I thought Polt was falling off after his big win, but he's looking really scary again lately.
Unclear if Polt is top 5 terran, but as you say its only because the terran line is so insanely deep now. I do think Polt MIGHT have a stylistic weakness where he struggles a little vs the absolute, absolute top tier but I dont really have anything to back that up, it's just an impression I get from how he plays.
On March 01 2012 15:26 tree.hugger wrote: This is a silly and long argument. Both HerO and Polt are elite players. Both top ten of their races. For my money, Polt is outside the top five terrans and HerO is in the top five protosses, but given how much deeper T is than P, Polt may still be better. He's certainly still a better performer under pressure.
Results only get you so far, use your eyes whenever you can and make judgements like that. Both are world class players.
Good post. For a while I thought Polt was falling off after his big win, but he's looking really scary again lately.
Unclear if Polt is top 5 terran, but as you say its only because the terran line is so insanely deep now. I do think Polt MIGHT have a stylistic weakness where he struggles a little vs the absolute, absolute top tier but I dont really have anything to back that up, it's just an impression I get from how he plays.
I called you out to be the one to beat Polt but HerO didn't give you the chance T_T
Good win for Hero over Polt. Now 8-2 in the past month!
Also both players are elite, so need to argue. These were played before Polt started becoming a monster again and 5-0'ed Hero after that (IPL Qualifier/Assembly), but I think both can argue to being top fiveish at their respective race and both good enough to make at least a quarterfinal run to Code S next season if Polt gets his deserved invite.
On March 02 2012 02:39 Daigomi wrote: So, is the rebroadcast starting soon?
The rebroadcast should be over already?
Yeah, I asked that about 10 minutes after it was scheduled to start, and about 5 minutes before it actually started. Managed to catch most of the games
On March 01 2012 20:09 Fionn wrote: Good win for Hero over Polt. Now 8-2 in the past month!
Also both players are elite, so need to argue. These were played before Polt started becoming a monster again and 5-0'ed Hero after that (IPL Qualifier/Assembly), but I think both can argue to being top fiveish at their respective race and both good enough to make at least a quarterfinal run to Code S next season if Polt gets his deserved invite.
Not so sure about that. Puzzle, Parting, MC, Genius and Oz are players I would place higher than Hero. But number 6 is tied between Hero, Seed and Killer, I couldn´t decide who is better.
Polt Top 5 Terran? He did well in the last couple days but MVP, MMA, MKP, Gumiho, Alive and im far but finished.
EPT
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