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[GSL] 2012 Season 1 Code S Ro16 Group C - Page 95

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
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-UMADIMSTYLIN-
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Cuba292 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1881
lol, this is just a standard marine,helion,medivac opening in tvt, what are they talking about
Dakkas
Profile Joined October 2010
2550 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1882
Wow holy crap that was an awesome game as Jjakiji

LittLeD
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden7973 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1883
Adopting TvZ builds to TvT


Still wrecks face
☆Grubby ☆| Tod|DeMusliM|ThorZaiN|SaSe|Moon|Mana| ☆HerO ☆
McBengt
Profile Joined May 2011
Sweden1684 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1884
Well. That was unexpected.
"My twelve year old will out-reason Bill Maher when it comes to understanding, you know, what, uh, how to logic work" - Rick Santorum
Drazerk
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United Kingdom31255 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1885
Game One on Bel'Shir Beach

In the bottom right is Ganzi

In the top left is JJakji

3:00


factory opening from JJakji while Ganzi gets a reaper in order to scout jjakji's base however his scv scouts a lot on its own.

A reactor now starts on the barracks of JJakji and ganzi just expands

5:00


The reaper does a lot of damage and survives with red health.

A starport for JJakji and Ganzi now with a bunker in anticipation of JJakji's hellions for Ganzi

6:40


Viking after a medivac for JJakji while prparing for a elevator into the main.

The elevator works and ganzi does not have enough units to prevent it attacking the Main CC

7:30


Both players land their vikings but the hellions kill all the scvs of Ganzi forcing him to GG instantly

JJakji wins the first game
ChaosTerran
Profile Joined August 2011
Austria844 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1886
On February 08 2012 19:53 Noktix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 08 2012 19:50 Notfragile wrote:
On February 08 2012 19:42 Noktix wrote:
On February 08 2012 19:39 MorroW wrote:
no pro players want to give feedback or post in these forums because not its not always what you want to hear. and then you all come bashing

daybreak and metropolis are too long distances to punish something like this

you cant give the 15cc argument because 1rax expo gives a weaker followup than 15cc. thats why people go 15cc rofl, because the econ kicks in more quickly. then you get you extra raxes and geysers more quickly. you dont understand basic rts or tvp build.

toss scouts 15cc, grabs 2 nexuses, then goes onwards to not barely be able to defend, nope, he goes on to almost go kill protoss that was constantly building units on 2bases

you guys should realize me being in this game 12 hours a day for over a year knowing and talking to almost all pros plus practicing these gsl maps regularly, dont you think i should know the timings and find the flaws better than you?
its silly some tosses just come at me here just because they are defending their race

if you want feedback and pros opinions, the good and bad comes in a pack. im not gonna sit here and obliviously say "great timing on that 2base protoss" every time we watch gsl. please realize they can play macro oriented, they dont have to play like this. but they almost play like this exclusively because its more easy and they are more successful with it.


It isn't your job to bitch about imbalance, It is your job to show amazing games and work out ways to beat it.

Instead of sitting on this forum and explaining why it's impossible, how about you practice your ass off and become an innovator.

I lose respect for every single pro i see do this...


Don't you even feel the least bit of shame saying this? I am not going to discuss why your comment is plain dumb (more work =/ results if there is a racial imbalance, gimmicky strat. Think of the early 1-1-1 days and all the protoss pro gamer JUSTIFIED tears)

I am just saying that comments like this should be flamed by the rest of the community. A pro does not have "immunity" to comments from us, it's just... you are flaming someone in codeA level for not being good enough. Who the fuck are you to do that, sir?


The fuck? When did i say anything about Morrow specifically? He is a great player who i completely respect. When did i say he wasn't good enough?

If you have trouble with a race, a strategy, ANYTHING, practice and innovate. Don't bitch about imbalance. That is the point i'm making.


That's a bullshit argument.So if something is obviously imbalanced you are not allowed to complain so it does get nerfed..... THE FUCK?
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7681 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1887
Tastosis flipping out over a TvT build that is used on ladder all the time. Super easy, super safe 111 into expo, no addons required.
The unrealistic sound of these propositions is indicative, not of their utopian character, but of the strength of the forces which prevent their realization.
Typhon
Profile Joined July 2009
United States387 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1888
man, Jjakji makes TvT look so imba.
Mouzone
Profile Joined April 2011
3937 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1889
Boss build.
Onox
Profile Joined June 2011
United States1072 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1890
Yeah, don't know why Tastosis is so surprised build has been around forever.
MentalGNT
Profile Joined January 2011
Denmark1264 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1891
Who said that every TvT has to last an hour?

Cool build by Jjakji
What a player
graNite
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Germany4434 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1892
...aaand the finals will probably onesided :D
omg that was so good!
"Oink oink, bitches" - Tasteless on Pigbaby winning a map against Flash
zul
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Germany5427 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1893
ouch. ganzi must feel terrible right now.
keep it deep! @zulison
HQuality
Profile Joined October 2009
2682 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1894
"every game i play i just suddenly lose" (c) tasteless
xDDD
No carpal tunnel no skill
LeoLeo
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Sweden456 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1895
That build is like the hard counter to teching expoes. So good!
Bacon, Orangina and chilling
ETisME
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
12499 Posts
February 08 2012 11:11 GMT
#1896
omg, I am loving jjaki in that game. he is probably the 2nd terran that I actually like (other than boxer)
其疾如风,其徐如林,侵掠如火,不动如山,难知如阴,动如雷震。
ambient_orange
Profile Joined January 2010
170 Posts
February 08 2012 11:12 GMT
#1897
seriously what???
DOA: "Where are the signs for Nestea?" MC: "In Korea."
andaylin
Profile Joined August 2010
United States10830 Posts
February 08 2012 11:12 GMT
#1898
On February 08 2012 20:11 IgnE wrote:
Tastosis flipping out over a TvT build that is used on ladder all the time. Super easy, super safe 111 into expo, no addons required.

exactly lol
"Hard work beats talent when talent fails to work hard." - Kevin Durant
Azurues
Profile Joined March 2011
Malaysia5612 Posts
February 08 2012 11:12 GMT
#1899
no reason jjakji doesn't enter top 8 even though Parting is so good.
Ribbon
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5278 Posts
February 08 2012 11:12 GMT
#1900
On February 08 2012 20:03 mvtaylor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 08 2012 19:55 Seraphone wrote:
On February 08 2012 19:50 mvtaylor wrote:
On February 08 2012 19:46 Seraphone wrote:
On February 08 2012 19:39 MorroW wrote:
no pro players want to give feedback or post in these forums because not its not always what you want to hear. and then you all come bashing

daybreak and metropolis are too long distances to punish something like this

you cant give the 15cc argument because 1rax expo gives a weaker followup than 15cc. thats why people go 15cc rofl, because the econ kicks in more quickly. then you get you extra raxes and geysers more quickly. you dont understand basic rts or tvp build.

toss scouts 15cc, grabs 2 nexuses, then goes onwards to not barely be able to defend, nope, he goes on to almost go kill protoss that was constantly building units on 2bases

you guys should realize me being in this game 12 hours a day for over a year knowing and talking to almost all pros plus practicing these gsl maps regularly, dont you think i should know the timings and find the flaws better than you?
its silly some tosses just come at me here just because they are defending their race

if you want feedback and pros opinions, the good and bad comes in a pack. im not gonna sit here and obliviously say "great timing on that 2base protoss" every time we watch gsl. please realize they can play macro oriented, they dont have to play like this. but they almost play like this exclusively because its more easy and they are more successful with it.


So when pro Protoss players said you can't hold a 1-1-1 were they right?

When Protoss said you can't stop Mutas in ZvP were they right?

When Terran said you couldn't stop Infestor/BroodLord were they right?

When Zerg said you couldn't stop the Protoss deathball were they right?

Pro's always whine about balance they have a long, long history in this game of calling strategies broken and crying/whining about the game when the same strats were later just figured out when players played vs them more.


And then shit gets patched. For what it's worth 1/1/1 is still damn effective against P even after patches, Destiny managed to knock Mana and HasuObs out of IPL TAC with mass muta despite winning $700 in his SC2 career and Blizzard introducing a new unit in HotS specifically to deal with muta. Thorzain got destroyed by Stephano's late game ZvT Infestor / Broodlord earlier this month despite killing Stephano's Hive during the game. Simply check the Shoutcraft Invitational final game 1.

I'll give you one though, ZvP late game is now pretty Z favoured baring archon toilet.


So because the strats still work they're imbalanced?

The point was pro players would regularly consider these builds unbeatable but they got figured out and now they're just one of many solid strats than sometimes win and sometimes don't.


There is a difference between things being "figured out" and map pool changes / balance patches. If the game hadn't been patched a lot and xel naga caverns / steppes of war were still standard tournament maps people would still say it was imbalanced.

Let me try and explain as best I can...

You go CC first to get the best economy early. This allows the P to throw down triple nexus while going for this power sentry build. Even if it's scouted the length of the maps these days means by the time T production has really kicked in they can't go over and pressure it. In return even though P has barely got the economic benefit of his third base the warp gate mechanic means the map distance is irrelevant for him. Forcefielding away SCVS and army when they are on a base less than you with two bunkers is crazy.

So, what does T do... not go CC first?

Right, so now P scouts with their probe you're going 1 rax gasless FE, tech barely comes any faster with that but I guess they could decide to not throw down a third and simply play a more standard game.

P scouts 1 rax then gas before CC. They definitely don't make the third and get a robo.


Well, it's hard for Protoss to know for sure that Terran is 1-rax FEing, so he can't "blind" counter it.

I don't know. I can't say I mind Terran being the sad race for a while . It might be that CC-first just isn't viable anymore, it might be that you need like 4 blind bunkers. We'll see. It'll be fun!

On topic, Jjakji man, wow :O
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