EPT[GSL] 2012 Season 1 Code S Ro16 Group C - Page 163
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Dumboprime
985 Posts
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Olinimm
1471 Posts
On February 09 2012 06:40 FuzzyJAM wrote: MC continues to be the least interesting player in the entire SC2 scene. Obviously play to win, that's fine for him, but how do people enjoy watching his games? You serious? MC has had some of the best series in Starcraft. MC vs PuMa, MC vs thorzain, Just a couple weeks ago at HSCIV vs JYP was one of the best pvp series. | ||
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:25 Olinimm wrote: You serious? MC has had some of the best series in Starcraft. MC vs PuMa, MC vs thorzain, Just a couple weeks ago at HSCIV vs JYP was one of the best pvp series. When you have to quote two one year old series (and one PvP) to say how MC has some great series, you have to know you're fooling yourself writing it =) It's the eyes of love tho, nothing wrong with that. | ||
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s3rp
Germany3192 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:10 Kharnage wrote: Watching Parting vs Jjakji I can't help but feel something has to change in how Terran is approaching the end game. Jjakji was playing a fantastic game, but he was banking 3k gas. Everyone says gas is the most important resource, and yet Terran can't spend it with MMMGV. Parting always had both resources low. I don't find it surprising that when the Terran army is smaller by at least 3k resources, and the 'most important' resource at that, that they lose. Obviously I don't know what the answer is, but clearly something needs to change in that composition so that the gas can be used more effectively from mid game on. I think the only really valid transition is BC's once you reached +2 or +3 on your Vikings at that point you can spend your Gas problem is reaching a point where you have enough time to mix in some BC's that take 6 Supply and build 90 seconds which is ages. If the Toss attacks you while 2 or maybe even more BC's are building then you have a huge problem since their supply does nothing for you at that point. | ||
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ZasZ.
United States2911 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:27 MrCon wrote: When you have to quote two one year old series (and one PvP) to say how MC has some great series, you have to know you're fooling yourself writing it =) It's the eyes of love tho, nothing wrong with that. ...Yeah, he had to go back a year to demonstrate that MC had one of the best series in the history of SC2, which is 2 years old. I see no problem with that. There is no doubt MC favors a 2-base style over the macro games Parting/Oz seem to be fond of, but he has the habit of producing really exciting series. Only recently with Oz and Parting have we seen non-MC Protoss players capable of doing that. | ||
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Kharnage
Australia920 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:27 MrCon wrote: When you have to quote two one year old series (and one PvP) to say how MC has some great series, you have to know you're fooling yourself writing it =) It's the eyes of love tho, nothing wrong with that. What he's saying is that MC clearly has the ability to play longer games, but chooses to win quickly so he can go eat. That is, if he eats. He may just live off the souls of his slain enemies... | ||
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Olinimm
1471 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:27 MrCon wrote: When you have to quote two one year old series (and one PvP) to say how MC has some great series, you have to know you're fooling yourself writing it =) It's the eyes of love tho, nothing wrong with that. First of all NASL S1 is not a year old. Secondly, I'm just saying he's played some of the best series yet in Starcraft 2. Saying he's the "least interesting player in the entire SC2 scene" is retarded. MC makes tons of great games. | ||
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SeaSwift
Scotland4486 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:27 MrCon wrote: When you have to quote two one year old series (and one PvP) to say how MC has some great series, you have to know you're fooling yourself writing it =) It's the eyes of love tho, nothing wrong with that. What are you saying? That because the games are old they are invalid? That he doesn't play enjoyable games? That people aren't allowed to enjoy his games? Hell, that was the best PvP ever. Go watch it, especially the last two games, and then tell me it wasn't enjoyable. Dismissing it by going "(and one PvP)" is very ignorant. Did you even watch that series? | ||
CosmicSpiral
United States15275 Posts
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SeaSwift
Scotland4486 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:36 CosmicSpiral wrote: I'm waiting for the day that terrans can figure out a proper tank transition in TvP. I know what people say about any mention of mech in the matchup, but imagine how that firepower and range would change the entire dynamic of the game. Tanks aren't the solution. They just aren't. Thors, on the other hand... EMP'd Thors which block the true most devastating Protoss lategame unit, Chargelots, from having any decent surround, would be amazing. Basically, Ghost + Thor + Viking is an amazing combination. The problem is getting there, because you would need upgrades for all 3 types of weapon/armour. I really think Terran would benefit in every matchup from having more combined upgrades, allowing for better transitions away from bio in general. | ||
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CeriseCherries
6170 Posts
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IMBAkorean
Canada835 Posts
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s3rp
Germany3192 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:36 CosmicSpiral wrote: I'm waiting for the day that terrans can figure out a proper tank transition in TvP. I know what people say about any mention of mech in the matchup, but imagine how that firepower and range would change the entire dynamic of the game. Tanks are horrible against Zealots and Archons and to make matters worse can't move out of t AOE. Tanks are only good if they at most 2 maybe 3 shot targets otherwise you'd have to clump them up too much and they take too much damage from aoe. You have to remember tanks barely have more HP then Marauders . Tanks don't kill Protoss stuff fast enough and cost a fortune in gas. | ||
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CosmicSpiral
United States15275 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:38 SeaSwift wrote: Tanks aren't the solution. They just aren't. Thors, on the other hand... EMP'd Thors which block the true most devastating Protoss lategame unit, Chargelots, from having any decent surround, would be amazing. Basically, Ghost + Thor + Viking is an amazing combination. The problem is getting there, because you would need upgrades for all 3 types of weapon/armour. I really think Terran would benefit in every matchup from having more combined upgrades, allowing for better transitions away from bio in general. Too bad thors are going to be gone in HotS. Thor-Ghost-Viking is incredibly awkward to create and control anyway. On February 09 2012 07:41 s3rp wrote: Tanks are horrible against Zealots and Archons and to make matters worse can't move out of t AOE. Tanks are only good if they at most 2 maybe 3 shot targets otherwise you'd have to clump them up too much and they take too much damage from aoe. You have to remember tanks barely have more HP then Marauders . Tanks don't kill Protoss stuff fast enough and cost a fortune in gas. No shit. I know all the problems tanks have against Protoss. But terrans need an answer that's more than marine/marauder/medivac/ghost because right now the ghost is the only way to properly zone a protoss army. | ||
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:35 SeaSwift wrote: What are you saying? That because the games are old they are invalid? That he doesn't play enjoyable games? That people aren't allowed to enjoy his games? Hell, that was the best PvP ever. Go watch it, especially the last two games, and then tell me it wasn't enjoyable. Dismissing it by going "(and one PvP)" is very ignorant. Did you even watch that series? I rephrased this post so much times that I just won't answer. Let's say that for me MC is an exciting player, but not an exciting player to watch play. I don't blame people who like him, I don't blame people because they enjoy him, I don't think that hostility is deserved. | ||
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s3rp
Germany3192 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:41 CosmicSpiral wrote: Too bad thors are going to be gone in HotS. That combo would never be the answer anyway. Too gas-heavy and the transition would necessarily be awkward. Excluding all-ins and 2 base pushes (which is the only real use of a Thor in TvP anyway) the future of TvP will still be bio-based. I still hope the unit that will replace the Thor will be useful. IRC it will get bonus damage to air and mechanical units in general smt like that ? Maybe combine them with the new Battle Helions that hopefully don't die in seconds could work , then you could maybe even throw in some tanks for zoning. I keep my fingers crossed . | ||
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s3rp
Germany3192 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:41 CosmicSpiral wrote: Too bad thors are going to be gone in HotS. That combo would never be the answer anyway. Too gas-heavy and the transition would necessarily be awkward. Excluding all-ins and 2 base pushes (which is the only real use of a Thor in TvP anyway) the future of TvP will still be bio-based. No shit. I know all the problems tanks have against Protoss. But terrans need an answer that's more than marine/marauder/medivac/ghost because right now the ghost is the only way to properly zone a protoss army. Other then BC's / Air there's nothing to transition to from Bio and only if you upgrade your Vikings . Mech Units aren't a valid transition. There's some funky pushes with Mech but transition into Mech doesn't work. | ||
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CosmicSpiral
United States15275 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:44 s3rp wrote: I still hope the units that will replace the Thor will be useful. IRC it will get bonus damage to air and mechanical units in general smt like that ? Maybe combine them with the new Battle Helions that hopefully don't die in seconds could work , then you could maybe even thrown in some tanks for zoning. I keep my fingers crossed . I pray that Battle Hellions never see the light of day. Faux-Goliaths might be good but the range will still be too short to compensate for Colossi and we'll probably get even more chargelot action in response. On February 09 2012 07:46 s3rp wrote: Other then BC's / Air there's nothing to transition to from Bio and only if you upgrade your Vikings . Mech Units aren't a valid transition. There's some funky pushes with Mech but transition into Mech doesn't work. Mech as a playstyle is wholly undesirable in TvP. I don't see how marine/marauder/medivac ---> marine/marauder/medivac/tank is "invalid" (it certainly has weaknesses). Unless HotS completely changes the matchup the army still needs to begin as bio and remain bio-heavy throughout the game. | ||
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brain_
United States812 Posts
On February 09 2012 07:38 SeaSwift wrote: Tanks aren't the solution. They just aren't. Thors, on the other hand... EMP'd Thors which block the true most devastating Protoss lategame unit, Chargelots, from having any decent surround, would be amazing. Basically, Ghost + Thor + Viking is an amazing combination. The problem is getting there, because you would need upgrades for all 3 types of weapon/armour. I really think Terran would benefit in every matchup from having more combined upgrades, allowing for better transitions away from bio in general. Feedback. :/ | ||
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power-overwhelming
Canada306 Posts
MC has played since BW and since early sc2 has been the only successful Protoss. If anyone understands Protoss the most, it would be MC. If he thinks his playstyle is suited for champions then that's what I will think. At the end of the day, we all know (even haters) that MC is damn good at macro (macro game vs bomber in code A). | ||
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