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Watch how you approach the topic of match fixing. You can speculate, saying "I'm not so sure about the finals, something doesn't sit right with me," but if you are going to outright accuse players of match fixing you need something more than your word. TL takes match fixing/abuse seriously and as such there is a burden a proof when you are accusing players. - p4NDemik | ||
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RogerChillingworth
2887 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:05 synapse wrote: I think it was more that Nestea/MVP decided to give everyone a show for the final game... It really did look like Nestea could have won at multiple points in the game, or begun making trades a lot earlier. | ||
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Dalguno
United States2446 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:05 synapse wrote: I think it was more that Nestea/MVP decided to give everyone a show for the final game... I agree with this. I didn't really find it very entertaining, but I'm sure others had a good time with it. | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
On October 23 2011 10:30 pPingu wrote: Why so much hate? JP role is more to talk about the game, giving time to his co caster to think about the game, then let him speak Honestly I greatly prefer him as an interviewer. I'm not too sure why they even have him cast in the first place. The play-by-play gets the job done I guess, but there's numerous better options for that like TotalBiscuit, Husky or even DjWheat, in my opinion. It just lacks the fast-pacedness and the excitement that I would associate with a play-by-play commentator. It overall feels quite mechanical to me. Considering the above, I really fail to see the point. The commentary is fairly unmemorable and I'm not sure if I've ever remembered any line he's said after the cast. It also, in my opinion, doesn't have the whole question-asking style that DjWheat asks that's useful for the people new to the scene. The entire time I feel like he's trying to... interview the game, if that makes sense? Honestly, I like his hosting of state of the game and think that his interviews are solid, but the commentary feels very out-of-place. I'm personally not sure what he really adds to the table, and even though that's not really a problem in the small Zotac cups where you just want some kind of coverage, in large events like this, I believe that he's just not up to the task. | ||
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Medrea
10003 Posts
We seem to be allergic to a three person casting team though. The koreans are pretty good at it. Well, sorta, they kinda shout. A lot. Like all the time. On top of eachother. | ||
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babylon
8765 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:14 Oreo7 wrote: Nestea, DRG, Coca, Losira, Curious, Lucky, Zenio, July, Leenock, Yugioh, Jookto, Revival, Boongboong. Pick 5. For ZvT? I'm going to ignore the ones who aren't even in the GSL right now. Gotta go with: DRG, Curious, Leenock, NesTea, CoCa -- not necessarily in that order, but they're the ones who really stand out for me. July maybe when he's done hibernating. CoCa's not really good at ZvT, but ... I can't see anyone else in that list I would pick, lol. | ||
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PikaXchU
Singapore379 Posts
ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED? | ||
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Zarahtra
Iceland4053 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:16 Shikyo wrote: Honestly I greatly prefer him as an interviewer. I'm not too sure why they even have him cast in the first place. The play-by-play gets the job done I guess, but there's numerous better options for that like TotalBiscuit, Husky or even DjWheat, in my opinion. It just lacks the fast-pacedness and the excitement that I would associate with a play-by-play commentator. It overall feels quite mechanical to me. Considering the above, I really fail to see the point. The commentary is fairly unmemorable and I'm not sure if I've ever remembered any line he's said after the cast. It also, in my opinion, doesn't have the whole question-asking style that DjWheat asks that's useful for the people new to the scene. The entire time I feel like he's trying to... interview the game, if that makes sense? Honestly, I like his hosting of state of the game and think that his interviews are solid, but the commentary feels very out-of-place. I'm personally not sure what he really adds to the table, and even though that's not really a problem in the small Zotac cups where you just want some kind of coverage, in large events like this, I believe that he's just not up to the task. That's actually a very good description of the issue imo. He's an awesome guy and has done tons and tons for the community that I'm really thankful for, but he's *sadly* not a very good caster, the reasons why you state pretty well imo. | ||
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ladyumbra
Canada1699 Posts
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Qaatar
1409 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:14 Terranist wrote: i'm not a nestea hater, but people are living in this crazy delusion that he is invincible when in fact he rode to his most recent GSL finals on a terran light path and it created massive hype for something that doesn't exist anymore. Pretty sure as yesterday's GSL finals proved, no one can come close to "invincible." However, it's pretty much safe to assume that MVP and NesTea have the least amount of weaknesses compared to everyone else. This means, if every pro SC2 player in the world gathered to play a round robin tournament, with each series decided by Bo7's, throwing fatigue and other extraneous factors out the window, NesTea and MVP will probably have the highest overall winning percentages when it's all said and done. I think that's what people more or less "assume" - and rightly so. Obviously, no one literally or figuratively believes that NesTea is invincible at SC2. | ||
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Terranist
United States2496 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:18 babylon wrote: For ZvT? I'm going to ignore the ones who aren't even in the GSL right now. Gotta go with: DRG, Curious, Leenock, NesTea, CoCa -- not necessarily in that order, but they're the ones who really stand out for me. July maybe when he's done hibernating. CoCa's not really good at ZvT, but ... I can't see anyone else in that list I would pick, lol. coca and losira are pretty abysmal at zvt as well. losira has serious problems defending early pressure. | ||
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alan25
United States379 Posts
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Medrea
10003 Posts
Crazy good champion attitude. He will go very very far obviously. If Protoss is ever overpowered for any reason. We might as well stop logging into Starcraft 2 because Naniwa will just beat you. Who cares if your bronze, everyones in bronze now compared to naniwa's champion attitude. It's just him in grandmaster, everyone elses MMR is 0. | ||
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zex66
Canada651 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:13 udgnim wrote: Nestea's macro lead http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/1755/macrolead3.png 13,947 minerals & 5,513 gas versus 1,202 minerals & 4,543 gas which is a difference of +12,745 minerals & 970 gas in favor of Nestea Nestea had such a huge macro lead and plenty of gas to spend on whatever tech path he wanted as well as an already built spine crawler line to buy time to remax, yet the only time he ever tried to "trade armies" was his awful drop attempt that was not a trade at all and resulted in tons of banelings, ultralisks, and overlords being lost. He even microed his overlords to the top of MVP's base instead of away while he was supply blocked due to his massive failure of a drop. ![[image loading]](http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/594/overlords.png) guess what might have happened if Nestea decided to unload the banelings inside of those overlords? Nestea isn't a god but he definitely can play better than what he did against MVP on Shakuras. I have no idea how people consider the game to be epic unless they just watch SC2 on a casual basis. Just look at that last screen shot. Could've just taken out the ghosts right there. Especially if you consider that before that screenshot was taken he still had like 10 overlords with about 5 of them full of units. | ||
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The Final Boss
United States1839 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:06 monkeycid wrote: I *hope* this won't warrant a ban. The way I see it, the match was *definitely* not fixed, but the feeling I got was that neither player cared about the outcome in the way they would have in, say, a GSL final. The play was rather silly, to be honest, and from what I read (I am neither willing nor able to pull any sources, so have at me) prize money is often distributed to the team as a whole - meaning that neither player had that much to fight for. My impression (which was indiependently shared by my friends who discussed the match as it happened) was that the players were taking the piss out of each other, with MVP eventually being impolite enough to win. Blizzcon weekend was good (even had me neglecting some RL responsibilities to watch games) but I'm sad to see it end up like this. It kind of adds up with them not casting tons of intriguing matches and using the sub-par map-pool that they did. I suppose it was nice, but it could - easily, and with little investment - have been tons better. I'm just left feeling somewhat disappointed. Yes, it was good, but it could have been so much better. "Impolite" enough? Didn't NesTea attack and then GG? Did you even watch those games? What on earth are you talking about? And as far as the rest of your post goes, I think that that is just what Blizzard has been doing ever since they started with StarCraft: coming so close to having it be great, but settling with good for some reason.... | ||
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dARThraider
3 Posts
I have watched a good number of GSL matches and Nestea's decision making is way better than that. Why sit on 10K minerals when u can just 1a then remax when you have like, what 6 hatches at the time? Why make 24+ brood lords with 2 or 3 infestors to support when you can make just 16 broods (still an outrageous amount) and the rest of your supply cap to infestor? Also, when he did that big drop but left a lot of units still in the ovies and then let them be shot down a minute later, floating where MVP could shoot them down. Another example was letting all his drones die to that first nuke. There was only so many mining bases at that time and I am pretty sure the pro's practice spotting the laser dot. I know the obvious counter-argument is that Nestea was distracted but I can't see a multi-GSL Code S champion make egregious mistakes like that all in ONE match. | ||
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bqm
94 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:13 udgnim wrote: Nestea's macro lead ![[image loading]](http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/1755/macrolead3.png) 13,947 minerals & 5,513 gas versus 1,202 minerals & 4,543 gas which is a difference of +12,745 minerals & 970 gas in favor of Nestea Nestea had such a huge macro lead and plenty of gas to spend on whatever tech path he wanted as well as an already built spine crawler line to buy time to remax, yet the only time he ever tried to "trade armies" was his awful drop attempt that was not a trade at all and resulted in tons of banelings, ultralisks, and overlords being lost. He even microed his overlords to the top of MVP's base instead of away while he was supply blocked due to his massive failure of a drop. guess what might have happened if Nestea decided to unload the banelings inside of those overlords? Nestea isn't a god but he definitely can play better than what he did against MVP on Shakuras. I have no idea how people consider the game to be epic unless they just watch SC2 on a casual basis. what tech are you talking about, do you think Ultralisk stand a chance against ghost with PF tank? he made a decision with broodlords + 5-6 infestors but all of them get emp, even he banked a lot like that, MVP already max as well, and he win the multitask war with mass nuke and drop. | ||
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Zarahtra
Iceland4053 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:21 alan25 wrote: what's the point of broodlord why the fuck do zergs keep getting them, nestea could've won if he kept his hatcheries up with spines to protect and just send wave after wave of ling/bane and maybe roach. I'd be pretty scared of a bling doom drop ontop of my ghosts/units tbh, especially if he used like 2 min before a doom drop with ultras to bait out snipes(since it takes 12 snipes to kill each ultra). | ||
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DisaFear
Australia4074 Posts
Eh, match-fixing? Nope  | ||
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Terranist
United States2496 Posts
On October 23 2011 11:20 Qaatar wrote: Pretty sure as yesterday's GSL finals proved, no one can come close to "invincible." However, it's pretty much safe to assume that MVP and NesTea have the least amount of weaknesses compared to everyone else. This means, if every pro SC2 player in the world gathered to play a round robin tournament, with each series decided by Bo7's, throwing fatigue and other extraneous factors out the window, NesTea and MVP will probably have the highest overall winning percentages when it's all said and done. I think that's what people more or less "assume" - and rightly so. Obviously, no one literally or figuratively believes that NesTea is invincible at SC2. it's possible that in your scenario nestea and MVP would come out on top, but that isn't a real world tournament application. nestea has recently had some pretty bad flaws exposed by terran, especially with protecting his workers from hellions or playing late game situations. this wasn't a lock for him and it certainly wasn't him gifting the game to MVP as people are claiming. | ||
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WArped
United Kingdom4845 Posts
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